Lyman 45 Sizer Not Sizing Concentric

[tjshooter]

I have an old 45 lube sizer that I am trying to size and lube .225 boolits with, the problem that I am having is that it will not size these little boolits evenly it sizes one side more than the other.
The sizing die and top punch are new, can any one help me diagnose the problem and offer a fix?
I am using a Lyman 225438 mould for a 22 hornet, with the boolits sized the way they are now its shooting 41/2"- 5" groups at 100 yards.
I also use it to size 45 cal 452460 boolits and don't have this problem, those boolits are concentric.
thanks
Bob

[Dale53]

I suspect your nose punch is pushing the bullet off center. If you were using an old die, I would blame that. However, the new dies are tapered to self center. If the nose punch is off center, they will NOT self center.

If it is off by just a little, loosen the nose punch set screw until it no longer touches the nose punch. Put a bit of sticky grease on the nose punch where it contacts the sizer and that will hold it there and allow it to self center. I NEVER use the set screw on the nose punch.

Dale53

[dragonrider]

The problem could be in the bushing that supports the ram, check to see if it is a sloppy fit, mine is and I have the problem you describe.

[Bullshop]

When your doin 22's you gotta keep um clean and square. To keep um that way I generally add a cupla steps to the process. One of um is that I pre-size nose first before lubeing.
There is two ways you can do that. The simplest was is to just get ya a Lee or a Buckshot push through press mounted sizer die of the desired diameter. Size um nose first with that then lube um in your 45 press in a die thats about .001" over the pre-sized diameter.
The other way is to temporarily simply convert your 45 to a nose first push through.
You can do that by removing the depth adjuster and ejector pin from the die. You will need a flat nose/base punch to push the boolit in the die. Then on the next boolit just catch the sized one when it falls out the bottom. You should also have another die .001" over the sized diameter for lubeing.
Another step that I add when doing 22's is to seat gas checks sepperatly with a check seater. For me these extra steps have made a big differance in the average accuracy of my 22 boolits. Right or wrong thats the way I does it.
Blessings
BIC/BS

[tjshooter]

Thanks Guys, For the suggestions, I'll try them when I get home.
where would I find a separate check seat-er or how would I go about seating them separate.

[rmb721]

On a Lyman 45, you might have to put a shim on the back side of the die to keep it centered when you tighten the set screw. I had to do that on one I had.

[Bullshop]

You should be able to find an unwanted check seater from somwone here. New presses come with one and most folks dont use them. Some folks here have made them. Its just a chunk a pipe with a cut in it that slips over the depth adjusting gizmo to limit the down travel of the ejector pin in the die. Sumthin hard for the check to push against before anything gets sized. Sure helps get the check on square.
I betcha someone will pop up here right quick and offer ya one.
Blessings
BIC/BS

[Ben]

Most everyone's Lyman 45 is off a little ( some more than a little ).

For $13 and one fired .22 center fire cartridge case, you can resolve the problem of sizing " off center." Some of the most accurate cast bullet groups that I've ever fired was using this sizing and lube method.

IT WORKS ! ! !

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=34058

[357maximum]

Most lyman 45 issues I have seen (with my own eyes) were due to the top punch.


Do not used the setscrew for the top punch..ever, never, ever....instead put a glob of boolit lube on the stem of the puch and push her home, and it will be alot mo betta. The tackiness of the lube will hold it there right nicely, and it will help bigtime.

[PatMarlin]

One thing I've noticed is my 45's are concentric and square, but you can tell they did not have much use and one of the reaons I bought them. Some I passed on over the years were beat. Probably a good thing to check. Great little presses though.

[PatMarlin]

Never saw that thread Ben. That is a clever method of making a cutter.

Bob almost got ripped off the other night and stopped some theives in his shop. He should be done with our dies today.

[Morgan Astorbilt]

The other way is to temporarily simply convert your 45 to a nose first push through.
You can do that by removing the depth adjuster and ejector pin from the die. You will need a flat nose/base punch to push the boolit in the die. Then on the next boolit just catch the sized one when it falls out the bottom. BIC/BS

Sorry to disagree, Bullshop, but right off the bat I can see two problems with trying that. The first, since th 45 is not an injector pump style sizer like a Star or Phelps, is keeping the lube from oozing into the die as the bullet is pushed through. The second, is possible damage to the nose of the following bullet, if it's other than a blunt round or flat nose. I would be using a more pointed bullet in a .22 Hornet.
Morgan

[tjshooter]

OK, so I get home last night and start messing with my lubrisizer, tying everyone’s suggestions, still no go. I take it apart, look at how every thing goes together, trying to determine the eccentric sizing thing, nothing.
It turns out that I’m not having a problem with the lubrisizer sizing off center, the problem I am having is my 225439 mold was casting bullets that where miss aligned ever so slightly by .002 .223x.227.

After scrutinizing everything I was able to determine that the mould it self was OK it’s the handles to the mould that somehow cause it to miss align when they are closed,
I changed the mould handles from the Lyman, that came with it to a RCBS that I have and the problem is fixed.

So you say, you should have noticed that from the start, well I have been loosing my close vision over the last couple of years and just recently got a pair of reading glasses,
with out them I could not see the miss alignment of the mould or the slightly miss cast boolit . I had been mainly relying on the quality of Lyman moulds and weighing the boolits to cull out the imperfections in them.

Now I have to start from scratch to work up a new load, I had virtually spent weeks over the last two years trying to get my CZ 527 22 hornet to shoot cast accurately, changing every variable, sized, un-sized, seating depth, crimped, un-crimped, pistol primers, rifle primers, lubes, powder charges, powders etc. I really kick myself in the ass for not picking up on the misalignment thing much much earlier.

The good news is now I stand a chance of getting it to shoot cast boolits in the 1” to 1-1/2” groups that I would find acceptable instead of the 2-1/2” to 4-1/2” groups that have been all I could do.

Thanks for your help and suggestions

[Bullshop]

Morgan Sir
You must have misunderstood what I said or I said it so poorly no one could understand it. Yes this method works fine for sizing, not lubeing. As I said you are pre-sizing, then lubeing in two sepperate operations. I have done many thousands of boolits this way in both the RCBS and Lyman presses. When sizing there is no lube pressure being used.
As for the noses being damaged I have never had any problem with that. That is why I mentioned having a flat top/base punch made. The punch should be long enough that it pushes the boolit past the sizing portion of the die so there is little to no resistance for the next boolit to push it out.
Yes Sir this does work well and is a systam that has been used by more members here than just myself. If you were to inquire ferther I am sure you will find agreement here.
Give it a try for yourself and you will see just how simple and quick it is to swap a press back and fourth from base first sizing to nose first sizing and back.
Believe me I know this well. If you go back to the begining of CB you will se that on one of my very first posts I was trying to explain the benifits of nose first sizing, and this method of doing so with a former member that I came to know and love in spite of his lacking in debating an issue.
Any old timers here will remember just how hard it was to convince Star metal Joe of anything, but he was eventually convinced. No slam Joe, I still love ya.
Blessings
BIC/BS

[Morgan Astorbilt]

You're right, I slipped past your first sentance. Just getting too old for this, I guess.:-?
Morgan