BP in 35 Rem

[jjamna]

I went back 20 pages in this forum looking for threads on this. I did find out that the 30-30 fouled quicker than most because of the fast twist rate.

So my question now is what about the 35 Rem. Will the rimless cartridge seal ok?
Marlin's website said it is 1 in 16 twist so that should be ok. It is also almost a strait cartridge so it should be better than most bottlenecks.

I guess the only thing I see right now is the sealing issue.

For those who ask WHY. I started loading BP in my 45-70 and 38--55 about a year ago (thanks to this forum) and I just plain ol like shootin it.

It is not a must to shoot BP in the 35, I just got the thought in my head and had to ask.

[Boz330]

Go for it. I would think that the 35 would be better than the 30-30 just from the bore size. You might try a duplex load to keep the fowling down.

Bob

[jlchucker]

Let us know how you make out. The two molds that I have (Lyman 204 gr) and RCBS 200 Gr) are both Gascheckers. I would think that a plain-base mold something like one of those, fired with some Unique, might be a place to start. The 35 has been a great round with smokeless powder. You may be on to something here.

[jjamna]

All I have is 357 Pistol Molds. I am on the list for the 35 Cal Ranch Dog mold but with the health problems they are having I don't know when I will be able to get it. I will go ahead and load some of the smaller ones and see what happens. I guess I can just fill the case and measure it that way like a strait wall case can't I?

[Don McDowell]

The only 35 I have is a TC super 14 contender so using black in it hasn't really crossed my mind, but I can offer a few tips I have picked up from loading other necked cartridges.
Its best to keep the bullet base above the junction of the neck and shoulder of the case. So drop the powder charge in, so that when the bullet and wad are fully seated the base of the bullet is above the bottom of the neck, and here compressing the powder can be a henderance to accuracy , so just make sure the wad/bullet is in firm contact with the powder. As you already shoot bp you're surely clued in to using a good soft bp lube and not smokeless lubed bullets in the load.
I'ld also recommend going with 3f.
I have got the 3030 to shoot decently with bp, but it's really not something I do on a regular basis.
Looking forwards to reading your results.

[Don McDowell]

I forgot to add to make sure what ever bullet you pick carries plenty of lube. The biggest problem with fouling in the 30-30 really didn't have much to do with the twist but is more of a function of not enough lube. Adding a grease cookie solved many problems, as the neck on the 35 is so short, using a lubed felt wad intended for cap and ball revolvers in place of any other wads may go quite aways towards making things work good.

[jjamna]

One problem I have encountered so far is I don't think I will get good powder compression with a pistol Boolit. May need to wait on a bigger boolit. 45 grains fills case. 40 grains droped thru a tube is below the bottle neck- will this be a problem- not much bottleneck on the 35.

[Don McDowell]

Pistol bullets might just be the best in this deal, because the one thing you really don't want is any part of the base or side of that bullet to get gnawed on by that bp charge going off, so filling with 42 grs seating your wad and bullet will likely be a real good place to start.

[powderburnerr]

It might help to crimp the bullets in the case when using light bullets as they may not resist enough to build pressure enough to burn clean...Dean

[jjamna]

I crimp all my black powder loads. I don't know if it is needed or not I just thought it would be better.

[jjamna]

After reading Don McDowell's post on the pistol boolits I loaded-- 5 with American Pioneer
5 with Pyrodex and 5 with Goex Black Powder.
Will shoot tomorrow at 50 yds and post results.
As long as what is left of Fay lets me.

[Don McDowell]

Looking forward to hearing how it comes out.

[Kuato]

Theres a GB on a Lyman 358430 plain base copy thats about to end this week. its a 195 gr roundnose boolit with 2 lube grooves. I got in on it so I could load em in various 38 cal revolvers & a couple of 35 Rems. It should be a good candidate for Black in the 35.. I might even have to load a few to see for myself now.

[GabbyM]

jjamna

I've a new bullet I just cast up yesterday for the first time.
Didn't have BP in mind when I drew it up but it does have a large .143” wide lube grove plus about an .030” gap above the gas check for some more.
It's a 230 grain that drops at .360” with a .110” long .352” bore ride in front of a .100” L front band.
It's supposed to stabilize in a 1-16” twist barrel. At BP velocity that may be iffy.

According to my measurements it will fit a 35 Rem. Nose is .570” long measured from the bottom of the front band. So crimped in the middle of that band you'll have about .050” under the 2.525” maximum published O.L. For the 35 Rem. I don't have that cartridge here to try so this is an estimate.

I could send you a couple hundred in the white to try out if you'd like.

I purchased this mold from Mountain Mold. Where you design your own. Being my first attempt at drawing up a bullet. I failed to realize the nose length includes the front band. So this bullet has a .100” shorter in the nose than I'd intended for use in a 358 Win. But that makes it fit in the 35 Rem too.

One thing for sure is it has enough lube capacity. I think it needs a longer front band to allow seating out farther before exposing the lube grove. Ah hindsight.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/picture.php?albumid=32&pictureid=138

[jjamna]

I got to shoot the 35 Rem with 3 different BP loads.
Rem Brass- Winchester Large Rifle Primers ------Lubed Felt wad, 36 cal 5 shots each, Cleaning between each group. All at 50 yds Rifle Marlin 336 35 Rem 1 in 16 twist Microgroove

45 gr American Pioneer fff Best Group 2 1/2 inch Worst speed
1: 895 fps
2: 679
3: 715
4: 642
5: 740

45 Gr Pyrodex RS Worst Group 2 on the target 3 off Farthest was 3 inches off
Best speed
1557
1414
1329
1327
1375


45 Gr fff Goex Black
Not real bad nor real good on either 4 inch group
speed
1358 FPS
1337
1369
1386
1368

The AP sure acted like it wasn't sealing good. lost of smoke even for a little while after the shot.
Pyrodex was good and loud with some recoil but not bad
Same with Goex Just by the sound they sounded like they would be good.
I think the problem is the undersize pistol bullets. Maybe if I get a bigger boolit they will shoot better.
I have got one good thing out of this though. I had been using AP in my 45-70 and 38-55 because it was supposed to be cleaner. Really it is not any better than either of the other. Fouling was not a problem and clean up was easy. Now because of the speed difference alone I will be trying the others in my 45-70.
Sorry for the long post.
Jeff

[jjamna]

Gabby I would love to give them a try. Might want to go with them instead of Ranchdog's. It is going to be hard to beat Ranchdogs though. I got 2 of his for my Marlin Cowboy 45-70 and they shoot how I thought the gun should shoot. When he gets the 35 in, I will be getting one of them and one for the 30-30

[Don McDowell]

How do these loads compare with your smokeless cast loads , as far as accuracy goes?

[jjamna]

A lot worse. I had 3 almost in one hole, then one about an inch away and one flyer about 2 inches away. Forgot to set up the chrony with the smokeless. I do know that the pistol boolets do not shoot near as good as a 200 grain round nose smokeless or Hornady Leverlutions. They shoot that good at 100 yds (less than 2 inches 100 yds)

[Don McDowell]

It'll be interesting to see what happens with the bp, and heavier bullets , if you decide to go on with the experiment.
Old West bullet molds has a flatbase 225 gr mold I've been really thinking about getting for the contender.

[jjamna]

Yes I am going to go on. Don't know what the boolet will be yet. I will post or send you a PM when I do. Will that boolet you are talking about work in a Marlin?

[Don McDowell]

Yes that bullet is flat nosed. Bernies brass mold blocks cast real nice bullets.www.oldwestmoulds.com
Keep us posted on your trials and tribulations.