Drilling Brass...

[BCB]

Reckon the guys who frequent this forum might use drill bits etc.!!!

Anyhow, I am looking for a GOOD (very good) set of drill bits especially designed to drill BRASS...

I have done Google searches and I find sets of bits for $9.95 or there about! I am pretty sure those won't fall into the very good category...

I did watch this video and it seems too easy...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAngKHIZgyA

Where might a guy order a good set of brass drill bits or maybe just the specific sizes I am looking for...

Thanks...BCB

[OS OK]

Buy a set of high speed steel bits, for brass don't try to drill/cut too fast...brass grabs because it's soft.

You can modify the cutting edge of the bit...http://handycrowd.com/drilling-brass-the-easy-and-safe-way/

[OldBearHair]

Reckon the guys who frequent this forum might use drill bits etc.!!!

Anyhow, I am looking for a GOOD (very good) set of drill bits especially designed to drill BRASS...

I have done Google searches and I find sets of bits for $9.95 or there about! I am pretty sure those won't fall into the very good category...

I did watch this video and it seems too easy...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAngKHIZgyA

Where might a guy order a good set of brass drill bits or maybe just the specific sizes I am looking for...

Thanks...BCB

Hey BCB, What size drill bits do you need? A guy from New York taught me how to hand grind drill bits in 1960 and have ground bits for every purpose that I needed. send pm.

[Bent Ramrod]

That’s basically what a friend showed me. I was drilling out a barrel for a liner and the drill stuck. After I got it out, he recommended his brass drill modification to reduce the potential for hogging in and sticking, even in steel.

He took a fine diamond hone and rubbed it on the inner lips of the drill until he could just see a line on the edge. He said that reduced the tendency of the drill to lag and then jump forward when drilling brass. It seemed to go a little smoother in steel as well, at least for the deep hole and the volume of material I was taking out.

As for “good” and “bad” drills, I follow the dictum expressed in one of my Shop Practice books, which states, “good drills look good.” I have Quality Import sets of letter and number drills, and Harbor Freight quality inch fraction drills, for metal. I have a set of Brazilian carbon steel drills for routine holes in wood. (I keep these because they look “bad,” and I need a reference. One of them disintegrated while drilling a hole in a board, so they genuinely are Bad.)

But twist-drill technology and metallurgy has mostly reached even into the major industrial areas of the Third World, and for home shop use, I’ve found the black, silver and gold-washed imported drill sets to be fine. I do have a bench grinder, of course.

[country gent]

Cleveland, Morse, OSG are some of the names in shops. For brass it more in the geometry of the grind than the drill. Brass copper aluminum and some other softer materials use less relief and face angles to cut well. We also put a small flat on the cutting face when we thinned the web down. This reduces the angle and helps relieve the wanting to "screw into" the material. Brass normally machines pretty easily with the right tool geometry. Another thing when drilling softer materials is pilot hole no bigger than the web on the drill, Keep it cutting on the full length of the edges. Only cutting aa small amount on each side makes the grabbing more prevalent as the relief surface dosnt hold it back. A good all around set of drill bits in HSS with cobalt is expensive but if you take care of them lasts a lifetime. ( other than the ones you drop and lose LOL). I have t drill indexes in my box from work one sharpened for steel and one brass copper. These are 3 set indexes letter number and fractional. 80-1, A-Z and 1/16- 1/2" bigger was in the tool crib and used as needed but they were also there for Steel or brass copper.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Having been a plumber, and not a machinest, I used everyday high speed steel bits for about any need. I used a variable speed hand drill or slowed down the speed on a drill press, can`t ever remember any problems drill on brass. As far as drill quality went USA made were best for me and you get what you paid for it. When I finally retired I had a complete set of number, letter and inch drills in a homemade drill index then there was a 4"WX4"DX10"L metal drawer 3/4 full of assorted sizes used drills.Robert

[Cap'n Morgan]

Brass drills (and drills for cast iron) should have a slightly negative rake angle to keep it from pulling into the material, especially when breaking through on the back side. It's quite easy to modify an ordinary HSS drill by grinding a flat on both edges.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAngKHIZgyA

[BCB]

I just tried the honing as shown in the video I posted in the original post...

Kind of crude on my part as I really don't have the best work conditions to hold the bit at a proper angle, PLUS the ol' eyes just aren't as good as they used to be!...

On a scrap piece of brass, actually a casing, it did appear to be a bit better drilling in spite of my crude honing...

I'm going to try to post a pic of another problem I am sort of having with my Hair-brain project...

More later...

Thanks...BCB

[BCB]

O.K. Now then, this is what I am attempting to do. This I have done before but with major failures until one end product was achieved…

I am drilling the primer pockets out of fired brass and then threading with a 5/16” x 36 tpi tap. That is the same size as used by the Hornady O.A.L. gauge. You can purchase the cartridge brass already made from Hornady, but they are pricey…

As I mentioned, I have made them, but it took many attempts per casing! Drilling the hole to the proper diameter in the brass was one of the problems. Better drill bits for drilling brass will help with that…

Now then, the pic I included shows how I am attempting to hold the casing in place while drilling. I cut a V-channel in a piece of wood and put the case between two pieces of the wood and tighten it up in my drill press vice. BUT, sometimes the case spins and then it can’t be drilled…

Do the make some type of tool that works the same as my crude blocks of wood to clamp the casing in place in the jaws of my vice?...

It’s tough doing a decent job when you just ain’t got the tools!!!...

Thanks…BCB

208836

[smokeywolf]

Have to add 3 more good brands of drills to country gent's 3; "Chicago Latrobe", "Union" and "Precision Twist Drill" (PTD).

Grinding or stoning a flat on the cutting lips of a drill is called "dubbing". A drill is "dubbed" for drilling brass, copper, lead or plastic.

[smokeywolf]

BCB, wood has a fairly low coefficient of friction. Plastic (not Teflon) would better resist the case spinning. Grey PVC plastic would be best.

[bangerjim]

Standard drills (no matter what the quality/coating/cost) will grab and tear into brass!

I have a $375 set (full set of letters/numbers/fractional) that still grab in brass in the mills and lathes. They are great in any other metal. You can cut your fingers on the flutes!

I have a special 135 degree point set of carbide drills that are especaially made for brass. They will NOT grab and pull the drill into the work. Standard point drills will give you fits! The secret is the angle for the point.

Banger

[country gent]

Here what I did to drill out brass like you want to do. A couple hard wood blocks 3/4" thick X 2" wide X 3" long. Drill 2 holes thru dowel pins to aid alighnment. I used 1/4" dowels 1 1/4 long. Place a index card between blocks and on seam drill a 5/8" hole to depth of shoulder neck junction. Drill a thru hole neck sized for now. This is to hold case in alighnment for a step later. Break edges and roughen sides of 5/8" hole I uses a hacksaw blade with end cut at an angle and cut .030-.060 deep slots around the sides. Wax the blocks faces and a case. Put a couple index cards between the blocks away from the 5/8" hole to space out. Mix some JB weld epoxy and coat each block. Clamp together and coat case insert into hole and let cure. This makes a set of collet blocks that grip the full length of the case regardless of cases taper. This hols very tight and secure on the case with little vise pressure.

Some notes
1) use wood dowels and make 2 sets you will sacrifice one set to the epoxy
2) you will need to cut the blocks apart after the epoxy cures due to the full joint being filled. This is the reason for the index cards between the blocks it gives a groove for the hacksaw to follow.
3) the better you fit the neck to the blocks the better the case will be supported during the curing.
4) when cured and done open the neck hole up .010-.015 so necks arnt damaged.

[Texas by God]

Why not use a Unibit?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[Cap'n Morgan]

If the diameter of the drill allows for it, drill the hole from the front of the case. Much more stable setup and the drill will center in the flash hole.

[BCB]

Thanks all…

I copy and pasted a couple of the posts so I could remember the directions. And, I saved all the names of bits that were recommended…

Printed them out, put them in a Ziploc bag and taped it to my drill press so I won’t lose it…

It will be a project for a cold winter day in the near future…

Thanks…BCB

[55fairlane]

My .02 cents

Take 2 pieces of hard wood, just shorter then the case,clamp to gather with an index card between them, drill (on center,of the clamped halfs) just larger then the case diameter, coat the case with show polish, cut another index to fit close to the case profile, fill the half with epoxy, drop in the case, the index card butted up to the case, clamp to gather, once the epoxy has cured, split the half, diced the index card, and you now have a perfect fit (minus the thickness of the index card) camp up in the vise and drill away

Aaron

[Nueces]

BCB, you might be able to make your pictured setup work, but not holding the case down on the thin tube part, but right up on the head, next to the rim. Seat that case down all the way. And add a bit of paper between wood and brass.

Oh, and where did you locate that special tap?

Ah, I see 'em on Amazon at a good price.

[RCE1]

I know that if you had a lathe, you would probably be using it. A lathe and a set of collets are the best way to drill and tap cases like that for an OAL guage. That being said, you can get collets and collet blocks made in PRC that would be much better than the wood block method. Collets are a much more precise fit, hold firm and don't risk crushing the case.

Just look up collet block on Amazon and it will show you what I mean.

[EDG]

Standard drills work fine if your machine has little slack in the quill.
Brass is no more grabby than aluminum. Even steel will grab if you have Z Axis slack in the quill. Yes you can monkey with the drill. But if you have the right touch you don't need to.

Millions of holes are drilled every day with Standard drills in CNC machines because they have no Z axis slack.

[BCB]

BCB, you might be able to make your pictured setup work, but not holding the case down on the thin tube part, but right up on the head, next to the rim. Seat that case down all the way. And add a bit of paper between wood and brass.

Oh, and where did you locate that special tap?

Ah, I see 'em on Amazon at a good price.


The tap came from a local tool shop. They stock just about everything you might need when it comes to that stuff. Nuts, bolts, specialty stuff, etc. They did have to order the tap...

BCB

[BCB]

O.K.

I did try the method of putting the casing between the 2 blocks of wood that I drilled to allow the brass to fit inbetween. I used CLP oil on the brass and then put the JB Weld around that to form the cavity of the correct size for the brass...

The problem--I can't get the brass out of the JB Weld!!!...

What should I use to allow the brass to not stick to the JB Weld?...

Making progress I think...

Thanks...BCB

[BCB]

CRUDE for the 1st try, but it did work…

I used the bits that were sharpened for brass, given to me by OldBearHair (Thanks again)…

I did pry the brass from between the blocks as I was not too concerned how it looked or if it even would serve the purpose I am attempting to achieve…

The one pic shows the 5/16 x 36 tap that I put into the drill press. I loosened the belts so I could turn the drill easily by hand. I put some light down pressure on the drill handle and tapped the brass…

The other pic shows the Hornady Overall Case Length gauge screwed into the tapped casing…

I think if I try a few of the other suggestions, say combined them a bit, I might be able to do the drilling and tapping and hopefully have the finished product enter a chamber and be used to indicate the length of the cartridge to the rifling/bore…

Thanks…BCB

[largom]

A little bit of rosin in your jig will help prevent the case from spinning. Get the rosin from a store that sells violins or online, crush it into a powder.

[country gent]

I use a couple 3 coats of paste wax or automotive wax. Lee sizing die wax also works good. JB weld is close to industrial ( commercial epoxy) in that it can bond thru light coats of oils and grease. The other is the release agents that come with bedding kits. You want something that's wax like dries and cant be dissolved or pushed out easily. The idea is the glue bonds to the release agent and not the piece, giving a true form and shape. I have used Pam cooking spray with some bedding agents with good results others not so good, With JB weld not good as it seems to bond thru it.

[OldBearHair]

Maybe Saran wrap as it is very thin. Then as Largom said "resin" will take up any space.

[David2011]

When I need good bits that make ROUND holes I buy them from Brownell's. The cutting edge can me modified easily and the bits are not expensive. Brownell's doesn't sell anything that doesn't meet their standards and I have never been disappointed with any of their bits or taps.

[akajun]

Take your resized and decamped case , remove the expander / decamping rod from the die , then jam the case into the die at the top of the presses stroke. Next slide the shell holder out of the ram and remove the die with the case in it from the press
Now go grip the die in the wood blocks and drill out the flash hole.
Return the die to the press, slip the shelholder on the rim and ram and extract the case
Now re install the expander plug and expand the neck. Btw you will now need to drill/ reamthe neck to .001 over bullet diameter.
If you insist on wood blocks, try adding some powdered rosin on the blocks.
You have a work holding problem not a tooling problem

[BCB]

Take your resized and decamped case , remove the expander / decamping rod from the die , then jam the case into the die at the top of the presses stroke. Next slide the shell holder out of the ram and remove the die with the case in it from the press
Now go grip the die in the wood blocks and drill out the flash hole.
Return the die to the press, slip the shelholder on the rim and ram and extract the case
Now re install the expander plug and expand the neck. Btw you will now need to drill/ reamthe neck to .001 over bullet diameter.
If you insist on wood blocks, try adding some powdered rosin on the blocks.
You have a work holding problem not a tooling problem

That's interesting. It appears there may be numerous ways to get this task completed...

I suppose a person could do the sizing and then try to expand the neck with an expander of 0.309" or 0.310" and see if a bullet/boolit will slide in and out of the case easily and still chamber...

This could save reaming the neck as that becomes another operation that I wouldn't have the inside neck reamer to do!!!...

Still a good thought...

Thanks...BCB