Old gun lead removal

[handloder]

Revisiting lead removal...
There are a gazillion suggestions devoted to lead removal in gun barrels after shooting cast boolits. I have a different twist on this ancient problem: lead removal that was deposited 100+ years ago.
Specifics: A S&W Hand Ejector in .38 Special made before WWI. No known history of the barrel other than nobody remembers when it was last fired or with what ammo. Barrel heavily 'leaded' with a tough, smooth, black deposit (I'm pretty sure it's lead, but could it be something else?). Simple Hoppe's plus brass brush scrubs, multiple repeats, not making progress. All of the current lead removal suggestions are dealing with lead that has been recently deposited and therefore 'fresh'. In these cases, the 'pure' lead has not had time to chemically change into refractory oxides or sulfides or 'other compounds' that may frustrate removal without using very harsh chemical treatments.
Has anyone dealt with very old lead fouling successfully? I would like some real life stories specifically addressing this need. Suggestions abound in other threads for 'fresh' leading removal. I did notice that after the Hoppe's scrub work that there were some small clusters of very shallow pits randomly scattered through the bore. Did the Hoppe's remove some lead that had covered some rust development?
I would like some guidance for the next step in cleaning this bore.
Since the deposits are 'splotchy', and look like modern 'streaking', what else could it be? Many very old rifles and handguns (not fired in the last 50 years or more) are described as having 'dark' bores with shallow rifling. Is this another way of saying the barrel is heavily leaded?


If this topic should be in another forum, would somebody suggest which one?

[triggerhappy243]

have you tried the lewis lead remover device?

[marlin39a]

I still have an Outers Foul Out. That would suck that lead out of there.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Many very old rifles and handguns (not fired in the last 50 years or more) are described as having 'dark' bores with shallow rifling. Is this another way of saying the barrel is heavily leaded?



We should be so lucky. It is more often rust.

It is a pity we are now protected from getting mercury, for that would shift it. Steel is one of very
few metals with which it won't form an amalgam. A phosphor bronze brush might stay sharp at the tips longer than brass, and I am sure a stainless steel tubing brush, available on eBay, would. That would probably make fine scratches in the bore, but if it is already imperfect that might be acceptable.

I don't believe there is such a thing as old lead, but I would start with it under running water, which is going down the drain. It might include a lot of oxide by this time, which could be dangerous if it is breathed. Try heating it about as hot as you can hold too, or using one or two solvents. It might be that it isn't lead at all, and some creatively chosen bullet lube or preservative has congealed into a hardened form.

[Toymaker]

Run a brass brush through the bore to score the lead. Plug one end of the bore with a waxed cork, rubber stopper, waxed shaped wood dowel, etc. and drip more wax around the seam between the plug and metal. Fill the bore with mercury. Set it upright in a bowl in a corner and come back a week later. Pour out the mercury, save it. Remove the plug. Clean the bore. Repeat as necessary. If it's lead it will come out.

[R. Dupraz]

Copper wool and solvent on a bronze bore brush. If it's lead, it will come out.

[Nueces]

I recommend a long soak with Ed's Red. Get some soft aluminum screening and cut bore patches of it. Using a jag, put a patch stack on it, soft cloth first, screen on the outside, and push through the bore. As the crud is removed, you may have to increase the jag size, or use more cloth patch layers. Keep dousing with the solvent and finish with a bore brush. The copper wool (Chore Boy) wrapped around a bore brush is also a good method.

I have used this means to clean 30 year old lead deposits.

[dondiego]

Soak with Kroil for a while and use some of the above scrubbing methods.

[Outpost75]

Either Ed's Red or Kroil work equally well. If shot long ago with corrosive primers you will have pitting under the lead and as the lead deposits are removed to reveal the pits underneath, the bore will look darker the more you clean! I use JB and Kroil or Ed's Red to be sure you get all active and old residue out. Then tou can start shooting mild loads with soft lead bullets to start filling in the pits in the cleaned bore with lead. Clean with JB and Kroil or Ed's Red only to remove rhe heavy, patchy lead deposits, but allowing the pits to gradually fill and smooth out. After a few hundred rounds of this the bore will look better and foul less, leaving only smooth lead deposits in the cleaned and conditioned bore.

[hunter12]

Years ago I purchased an electrical device that I stuck in the barrel, added some liquid that came with the kit, turned it on and after an hour or so (its been over 20 years) it removed everything via electrolysis. They had one chem for lead and another for copper and I worked great for both

[GhostHawk]

For my milsurps I alternated patch's of Hoppes #9, dry patch, then ATF then a really TIGHT dry patch. Leave it wet, walk away for an hour or 4 and repeat.

Then shoot it.

Mine eventually came clean. Shiny steel in the bottom's of the grooves.
If it shot corrosive primers often it is probably rust.

Still you don't have much to lose by trying it.

[JBinMN]

It could cause "bore etching" but folks have used 50/50 hydrogen peroxide & white vinegar for 5-10 minutes before to remove the lead, old or new. Need to block the muzzle with a cork or something & it should not take too much since you seem to be describing a pistol. It also removes rust as I understand it, if that is a side concern. My understanding is that that 50/50 formula creates a weak peracetic acid solution. The main concern would be that ya leave it in too long & it can possibly "etch" the bore after removing the lead & other residues you are trying to get out.

Perhaps trying this to get the majority removed & /or loosened up , then rinse & try some regular solvents & other means to remove the lead will help... I do not have the experience to know...
:???:

I am NOT advocating this, but just offering it as a suggestion if you were to want to try it. You can use a search engine if ya want to know more...

Your call, and G'Luck!
:)

Please let us know what ya eventually decide to do, or what works best. Thanks!, if ya do!
:)

[Springfield]

Outers Foul Out.I have only used it 4-5 times but all those times it was really needed and it worked great every time.

[Bent Ramrod]

I use the regular solvents with one of those Tornado brushes. If it doesn’t come out with that treatment, it probably isn’t lead, and will need some kind of lapping or abrasive treatment.

[jem102]

Gunzilla is the best I have found for this purpose.

[runfiverun]

copper strands around a brush will cut most any lead out of a barrel.
a little soaking in a mix of atf and acetone will work the atf down under anything that kroil will get under.
but once you cut the lead out you'll probably still have a dark bore.
usually a dozen bright white printer paper wrapped boolits will scrub anything else out and put an acceptable finish on the bore.
you can inspect it from there, you will know if it is rust pitting, a little more lead, or whatever after that.

[Traffer]

I don't know if you want to try this but I tried not copper but copper plated steel pot scrubber strands on a brass brush and it eventually got the lead out of a 22 that had been used for rat shot for 30 years. The first few passes even showed that it had started working. To my surprise it didn't "seem" to lap the rifling out. I don't think it would hurt to try a couple passes with it. I tried the copper pot scrubbers, they just weren't sharp enough. The cheap copper plated steel worked though (also, this is much sharper than stainless steel pot scrubber. It has noticeably sharp edges on each strand.

[M-Tecs]

Wipe out lead remover has worked well for me.
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2013/07/new-no-lead-lead-remover-this-stuff-really-works/

[Walter Laich]

It could cause "bore etching" but folks have used 50/50 hydrogen peroxide & white vinegar for 5-10 minutes before to remove the lead, old or new. :)

My brother has had good luck with straight vinegar for 10 minutes or so. Had some fouling from APP (BP substitute) and lead deposits. Took them right out.

Do be careful about vinegar and bluing, though

[Bullwolf]

Since no one else has yet, I'll also mention Big 45 Frontier cleaning pads.

Nice mechanical cleaning method, especially if you can't find Copper Chore-boy pads in your area.

https://www.big45metalcleaner.com/

https://www.allguntalk.com/Content/listingImages/20150217/5b865938-2585-4e98-97a4-c4104f401c6a_fullsize.jpg


https://www.big45metalcleaner.com/Images/deleadsbores.gif



Big 45 Frontier Gun Cleaner Pad

Remove rust and dirt from guns without damaging the blued surface

Will not harm the finest blued surfaces - scientifically alloyed
Frontier Metal Cleaner looks a lot like a steel scrubbing sponge made up of thin coiled ribbons of metal. The coils are composed of a proprietary alloy containing stainless steel, nickel silver, monel (a corrosion resistant nickel based alloy), and zinc. The alloy is effectively "harder than rust but softer than bluing." As a result it can be used to scrape the rust, dirt, and dried greases and oils off blued steel without harming the finish.
Frontier Metal Cleaner is significantly more effective than other "sponge" cleaners like bronze wool due to the shape of the individual strands. Since each strand is a thin, ribbon of metal with sharp leading and trailing edges, the "sponge" has the effect of hundreds, if not thousands of small razor blades scraping away at surface build up. Steel or bronze wool, which is round in cross section does not have this advantage.
Also extremely effective at removing lead deposits from the bore, and goes a long way toward cleaning copper buildup as well. To use the cleaner on the bore, cut a small piece off the pad with a scissors. Wrap the strands around and through a bore brush, and then run the brush through the bore as usual.





- Bullwolf

[Traffer]

Since no one else has yet, I'll also mention Big 45 Frontier cleaning pads.

Nice mechanical cleaning method, especially if you can't find Copper Chore-boy pads in your area.

https://www.big45metalcleaner.com/

https://www.allguntalk.com/Content/listingImages/20150217/5b865938-2585-4e98-97a4-c4104f401c6a_fullsize.jpg


https://www.big45metalcleaner.com/Images/deleadsbores.gif







- Bullwolf

This stuff looks like it would be a lot better than chore boy. As I previously posted I bought the "cheap" copper plated steel scouring pads and used those. The PROBLEM I FOUND with chore boy (pure copper) is that they do not seem to have sharp edges, and don't seem to cut into the lead, rather just rubs on top of it. They work but take a long time to remove large amounts of copper. The copper plated steel ones ( got em at dollar tree ) are really sharp edged. We use stainless scouring pads to clean pots and pans and the copper plated steel ones work much much better at cleaning pots and pans also because of this apparent sharp-edgedness. My guess is that these "Big 45" cleaners are sharp also.