Would Remington warranty this barrel?

[flybyjohn]

This post might not belong in this thread. But I thought this area would have the expertise to tell me the answer to my question. I purchased this 9 mm Remington RP9 a few months ago and noticed with the naked eye a little flaw in the barrel. After shooting it a bit and cleaning out really good I put a magnifying glass on the barrel and noticed his little flaw was actually a lot of little metal pieces that have been torn out of the barrel when they were machining it. Do you think this would qualify for Remington’s warranty.
207955207956
207956
This goes the full length of the barrel down one groove.

[M-Tecs]

Yes....

[pietro]

.

Those are referred to as "chatter marks", presumably from the rifling cutter.

It should be replaced, but only Remington can answer your question, as to whether it's under their warranty, so I suggest you call the Remington CS manager and arrange to send the pics, so they can tell you whether or not to send it in.

https://www.remington.com/contact-us

Maybe you'll luck out, and only need to send in the barrel.

BTW, don't forget - if you need to send it in, ask for a pre-paid shipping label to be sent to you, so you can send it in on their dime.

(It's legal, under Federal Law, for a private firearm owner to both send & receive their firearm, w/o having to use an FFL, when sending said firearm to an FFL for repair and/or customization)



.

[M-Tecs]

In machining, chatter is the vibration that feeds on itself as the tool moves across the part. What you have appears to be a broach cut barrel using a dull or damaged broach. The damage areas are from the base metal tearing due to the dull or damaged broach. It should have never made it through quality control.

[lefty o]

that should absolutely be warrantied, as its a defect in manufacture. only way to know for sure is to contact them.

[gpidaho]

I had a Remlin 45-70 Cowboy who's barrel had even larger CHUNKS missing. It was sent back to Remington for barrel replacement and all I got back was the same rifle-barrel and a note that said they saw no reason for complaint. They sent back a target with five holes in it, shot somewhere in some gun as proof that their crappy cut barrel shot just fine. I've bought my last Remington product. Everything I've bought from them in the last couple of years has been a giant ***. Gp

[turtlezx]

if it shoots a group ok they will say its fine doing what is suppose to do

[swheeler]

Yes, that should be replaced under warranty, BUT I doubt they will.

[john.k]

Turtle is right,if it shoots within SAAMI. spec for calibre,its OK.At least replacing with a custom is cheap and easy,unlike a rifle.

[runfiverun]

I'm shocked Remington has a warranty?

[lefty o]

I'm shocked Remington has a warranty?

they pretty much have to as they dont have a QC department!!

[ARKLITE881South]

I"m not surprised you found this in your barrel, and many of the responses are right on, as far as remington quality. A friend of mine has sent back 2 different mod 700 remigton's. This is a true story whitnessed by 2 other people. This friend of mine was out hunting with his GF and friend. He spotted a deer, he shot, his GF said ''you got him''. My friend said, no i didn't, there he goes. His GFfriend said, yes you did, he's laying right over there. Not kidding one bit, there was another deer, laying dead 30 ft to his left at the same distance!! Call it a fluke, call it what ever, but, this is an absolute fact. He sent the rifle back to remington, after calling them, they sent him back a totally different rifle. The rifle he had sent them, had a fantastic piece of wood on it. So, he called them and complained about not getting the stock back with the replacement rifle, and, asked what was the problem with the way this rifle had shot. They would not even talk about the way the other rifle shot, but, after 3 phone calls they did send the other stock back to him.

He made an issue about the ''lost'' stock, so much that after about 3 weeks, they all of a sudden found it. He was very lucky to get that particular stock back, i'm sure of that. I would almost bet some one at remington realized this was an exceptional stock and tried to keep it. His dad also bought a 700 that flat out would not do any better than 2.5'' at 100 yds. No matter the load, or ammo he used. Called them, sent it back, they sent it back with a note saying they had shot it with their high quality ammo and it would shoot would shoot what the factory concidered acceptable accuracy. Its a joke, remington's QC is way down, and, its a shame.

[waksupi]

It certainly isn't ideal, however I have had several barrels over the years with very rough grooves. They shot very well, although there was the expected fouling build up.

[LAGS]

I have a S&W 27 that had the same chatter marks in the barrel when I first bought it.
You could only see the marks when the barrel was dirty.
They replaced the barrel with no problem.
All work was done at one of their Warranty Repair Gunsmiths that just happened to be 10 minutes from where I was working at the time.
It made it easier to just carry in the pistol, let them inspect it ,and wait for them to order the barrel
But I did have to wait a bit, because it was the 5" barrel ,which they had just stopped making at the time.

[Multigunner]

A new stainless steel Ruger .357 double action was brought to me to test fire before a purchase.
I loaded up some .38 Special rounds and was surprised to find I could actually see the bullets spinning sideways through the air befor dropping to the ground.

On examining the bore, which I should have done before hand, I found there were cuts across the lands the full length of the barrel. That had to have happened when the barrel was first bored out before rifling. Haven't cared much for the Rugers ever since.

Many years ago I got one of the first Ruger Bearcat revolvers. It spit lead back in my face even held at arms length. I have no idea where any of the bullets went. I could see nothing wrong with the timing and the bore looked good. I returned it.
A few years back I ran across information that might explain this. Apparently some Ruger Bearcats made it through the factory with no forcing cone in the barrel.

[flybyjohn]

Minuteshaver, if I used lead reloads it would not be warranted as written in their warranty��.

However if I did shoot Hitec coated lead bullets, I would have to say that it does not leave any lead in the holes and the bullets that would be caught for inspection don’t show any signs of loosing lead over the bad part of the barrel. The bullets do however show that the lands of the riling are taking off the coating.

[flybyjohn]

I talked to Remington CS a few weeks ago to find out if it would be warrantied and was told they didn’t know for sure until they looked at it. But they were pretty easy to talk to and where very eager to start a return for warranty claim. I told them I needed it for a few more weeks and then I would return it. I just didn’t want to send it off if there was no chance of getting it replaced. They wanted the whole hand gun because they said they tracked it by the serial no.

[flybyjohn]

I agree with M-TECS as this is not chatter marks but I dead torn steal from a bad tool or material build up that was welded to the tooling duing the machining. Chatter looks like waves in the finished surface. This is a smooth surface with pieces missing below the finished surface level.

I think I will get the warranty process started tomorrow and see if they will do anything for me.

[john.k]

It may be a different effect,as i cant see that R would be drilling ,reaming and broaching barrels.I would think either hammerforging or possibly button rifling.The "damage "may be a lamination in the surface of the steel that has torn out under buttoning or flaked out in hammerforging.Its possible that with more rounds the entire surface may flake away.But,its so easy to replace,I couldnt see them refusing,especially if they knew it was publicised on a forum.

[flybyjohn]

John k. Now that you mention that it does look like there is a smooth surface under the torn out pieces. A torn laminated piece is quite feasible.

On another note, my name is John Kunda. I signed my name on all my papers in grade school John k. When I see your user name, just for a second, I think it is mine.

[Hannibal]

Unless I missed it, you never stated how it shoots. Unless you are concerned with high accuracy, which I presume you are not or you'd have sold/discarded the factory barrel without a second glance, then you need too shoot the **** thing and see what it does on the range. Barrels often shoot out of their 'inferred' range when evaluated with a borescope.

If you want a high-end lapped barrel, then you must purchase a high-end lapped barrel. And do not presume such an upgrade will automatically 'fix' your accuracy problems. If you've not spent the necessary time on the range, a barrel 'upgrade' won't fix the problem.

But what the heck do I know?

[M-Tecs]

Expecting a barrel without a manufacturing defect is not to much to ask for.

[dragon813gt]

they pretty much have to as they dont have a QC department!!

Same can be said for Ruger. At least they fix the issues w/ barely a question asked. Remington won't replace this barrel even though it has obvious manufacturing flaws.

[j4l3ppx]

One way to do it is to post a comment about your barrel on one of their advertising videos on you tube. That should get their attention fast. Worked for me with Cimarron on several quality issues with a handgun.


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[6bg6ga]

How does it group?

[M-Tecs]

flybyjohn please keep us posted as to what Remington does. Some of the responses here have really surprised me. If in fact Remington does not correct a obvious manufacturing defect that would be good to know.

[gpidaho]

I'm not flybyjohn but my 45-70 barrel was MUCH worse than the one shown in OP and they wouldn't fix it. You could see the missing CHUNKS of the lands just looking down the bore. Gp

[flybyjohn]

I have just about 1000 rounds through it and have only shot off hand with it. I cant say just how accurate it groups but it can hit a 10 inch gong repeatedly at 20 yards. But I that was not the reason I wanted it replaced. I have heard that with lead, smoother is better. I can see that with craters in the barrel like this, it is going to be a lot harder to get clean and plus if I ever sell it, a nice smooth barrel will be easier to sell then one with craters in it. I am going to send it in and hope for a new barrel.

The gun cost me $238.00 new after clearance price, rebates and military discount. Cant say that I would not ever get a aftermarket barrel for it, but I may send it off to get it throated so it will load lead better. I don't think anybody makes an after market barrel for it anyway. It is only been in production for about a year and this was reviewed as another Remington flop/disaster, but I have been able to make it go bang every time I pull the trigger so for $238.00 I figured it will plink just fine.

[M-Tecs]

Give them a call and send them the pics. See what they say. I am the persistent type and if it was mine it would be replaced even if I had to contact everyone up the chain of command to the CEO.

https://www.remington.com/support/firearm-warranty-information/remington-2-year-limited-warranty

[HP9MM]

Seems like I read in an Alabama newspaper that the barrels are/were made by a contractor in Alexander City, AL. If so, this could explain the quality of the work.

[lefty o]

Same can be said for Ruger. At least they fix the issues w/ barely a question asked. Remington won't replace this barrel even though it has obvious manufacturing flaws.

dont get me started on the garbage ruger shoves out the door.

[M-Tecs]

Rolling over and taking it is part of the problem. It never should happen in the first place but when it does even if you have to go up the chain until you get to the CEO or BOD to get resolution it does need to be resolved or they will keep pushing the same junk.

[dragon813gt]

dont get me started on the garbage ruger shoves out the door.

You and I are on the same page when it comes to them. Hopefully the slowdown means the large companies start having some form of quality control.

[Gtek]

Mr. HP9MM I hope that was an attempt at humor? One should be careful with small caliber jokes!

[flybyjohn]

Went ahead and called them up Monday and they said they had to send me a package to send it to them in and some paperwork. Then they call the UPS man and have him come pick it up from me. He will bring the shipping label. Now I don't know if that is something that I pay him for or if it is prepaid. But anyway, I have to wait for my mailing packaging to come. They didn't take my address or anything, so I wonder how they are going to send me the packaging? Maybe they have it from my registration. But what if I moved? I might have to call them again.

[45-70marlin]

Check this out http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?329568-No-lands-in-new-marlin-1895-barrel

[flybyjohn]

Glad I called them back. They said they had my address on file and had sent out the package. they confirmed my address at this time and find out they only had 4 digits in the zip code. they are missing the 2nd number of my zip code. they went ahead and fixed it in their system and said when I receive the package they sent yesterday then to give them another call. I asked how I how long it would take to get a package with the wrong zip code. It might bounce around for a while before someone figured out exactly where to send it. They put me on hold for about 15 minutes and then came back to say that they were going to resend another package.

[Texas by God]

They should fix it promptly. That barrel's damage wasn't made anywhere except where it was built.

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[Love Life]

I"m not surprised you found this in your barrel, and many of the responses are right on, as far as remington quality. A friend of mine has sent back 2 different mod 700 remigton's. This is a true story whitnessed by 2 other people. This friend of mine was out hunting with his GF and friend. He spotted a deer, he shot, his GF said ''you got him''. My friend said, no i didn't, there he goes. His GFfriend said, yes you did, he's laying right over there. Not kidding one bit, there was another deer, laying dead 30 ft to his left at the same distance!! Call it a fluke, call it what ever, but, this is an absolute fact. He sent the rifle back to remington, after calling them, they sent him back a totally different rifle. The rifle he had sent them, had a fantastic piece of wood on it. So, he called them and complained about not getting the stock back with the replacement rifle, and, asked what was the problem with the way this rifle had shot. They would not even talk about the way the other rifle shot, but, after 3 phone calls they did send the other stock back to him.

He made an issue about the ''lost'' stock, so much that after about 3 weeks, they all of a sudden found it. He was very lucky to get that particular stock back, i'm sure of that. I would almost bet some one at remington realized this was an exceptional stock and tried to keep it. His dad also bought a 700 that flat out would not do any better than 2.5'' at 100 yds. No matter the load, or ammo he used. Called them, sent it back, they sent it back with a note saying they had shot it with their high quality ammo and it would shoot would shoot what the factory concidered acceptable accuracy. Its a joke, remington's QC is way down, and, its a shame.

So the gun never shot 30 feet off target in all the range time zeroing before hunting? I’d suspect the wrong deer was targeted.

Anywho, he got a new rifle out of the deal.


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[flybyjohn]

Well it went to the UPS warehouse on Monday afternoon about 4:55pm and was delivered to Heinricks firearm repair in Huntsville, Alabama the next morning by 11:30 am. That was a quick trip. Now it is a waiting game to see when they will get to it. Remington told me that every remy handgun in the USA goes to this small shop in AL for warranty work. That surprised me a little because the shop is not much bigger than my house and garage. But then I learned that the Remington Arms Company Factory that makes the RP9 is in the same city. That makes me feel a little better, at least the parts will be available if they replace it. I was wondering how one small shop could handle all the warranty work for every Remington handgun in the USA. I am not saying that the man is not capable of doing any kind of work on a gun, just how does he keep up with all that demand with such a small shop.


208669

[Kestrel4k]

[...] I was wondering how one small shop could handle all the warranty work for every Remington handgun in the USA. I am not saying that the man is not capable of doing any kind of work on a gun, just how does he keep up with all that demand with such a small shop.

My first thought was along these lines, earlier in the thread:


I had a Remlin 45-70 Cowboy who's barrel had even larger CHUNKS missing. It was sent back to Remington for barrel replacement and all I got back was the same rifle-barrel and a note that said they saw no reason for complaint. They sent back a target with five holes in it [...]

[LAKEMASTER]

These comments make me really sad to read... I guess I'll start buying old abused Remington rifles and start restoring them.

[john.k]

I have a vision of a guy sitting surrounded by piles of guns,he has a pair of glasses with white lenses,and a white stick."nothing wrong here"...."Nothing wrong here" .....Nothing wrong here"........"nothing wrong here"........(no disrespect to the disabled intended)

[rondog]

I hang out at the Marlin Owners forum, and stories abound about quality problems with Marlin rifles after Remington took them over. Nonetheless, I took a leap of faith and bought a new 1894 rifle in .44 magnum.

It had some minor issues like sharp edges here and there, minimal finishing and polishing of the receiver, the internal parts were rough and gritty feeling, the trigger was terrible, the loading gate spring was very stiff, it was miserable to load, things like that. The barrel bore looked rough, like it wasn't finished smoothly before rifling was done, it looked scratched.

I'm very skeptical about "warranty work", and very hesitant to turn loose of a new purchase once it's in my hands, plus I'd read horror stories from others. I like to tinker on guns, so I went after it myself. Besides, it actually shot quite well, had nice wood, and was fitted good. The barrel slugged right at spec, and the rifling was .004 deep, just right.

Long story short - after all my cleaning, deburring, smoothing, polishing, etc., my rifle is now my friend. It shoots great and operates smoothly. I didn't like the checkering or the fat forearm, or the Marshield finish, so I stripped the wood, sanded the rifling off, reshaped the forearm with a block plane, sanded it all smooth, and put a BLO finish on it. The difference is like night & day now! Looks and works like it should, IMO. I still want to do a little more to the trigger though.

Thankfully, I'm enough of a shadetree gunsmith to do this stuff myself, but the bottom line is that nobody should have to do things like this to a brand new rifle. I can't get any photos to upload.

Good luck to you, I hope they do you right!!!

[flybyjohn]

Well, got back the RP9 Friday evening and to my surprise, they replaced the barrel and to my surprise it looks worse than the one I sent back. I would take the old one back in a heartbeat rather than keep this new one they sent.

The replacement is bad in a different way. It has perpendicular machine marks on the lands all the way down the barrel. There is one step about 3/4" from the muzzle that is the largest of them all. I pushed a cleaning patch down the barrel right after I got it back and it tore the patch and left fur inside the barrel. The original barrel, although it had one bad grove in it, also had 5 good smooth grooves and 6 smooth lands. This new one has 6 bad rough lands and groves.

I called Remington back today just to give them my .02 worth and they want just the barrel back this time to have a look at it. I have already run a lap down the barrel for 20 minutes to try to smooth it out some but in order to get most of the machine marks out, the bore will probably grow larger than I would like. It wont pull the cleaning patch apart any more but it still has some major perpendicular machine marks the full length of the barrel. And the step at the muzzle end cant be very good for accuracy.

Not sure if I should send it back in or not. I guess at this point I have nothing to loose.

[gpidaho]

Sorry to say but that is pretty much what I suspected would be the outcome. Even though folks have been rifling barrels for hundreds of years the process seems to elude Remington. Freedom Group is pretty much King Midas in reverse. Everything they touch turns to **** I'm done buying anything Remington. Gp

[flybyjohn]

Well they just got back to me and instead of just sending the barrel, they want the whole gun again and to have me ship it to their main factory in Huntsville for inspection. Is a rough barrel that grabs patches normal quality for pistol barrels today. I have two 1911's of different makes and a berretta that all have mirror barrels. Why is it so hard to make a 4.25" barrel shinny and smooth from the factory if they were able to do it with Para, Springfield and Berreta.

[Soundguy]

Yikes.

Best of luck, keep us posted.

[flybyjohn]

Heres some pictures of the replacement barrel.

209373209374209375

My camera doesn't focus down the barrel very far but is is like this the entire barrel length.

[nekshot]

I totally understand your frustration and by the integrity of commerce that is not acceptable. BUT, I have seen worse quite a few times and they shot great. If that was my gun I would keep it and shoot the heck out of it. Would possibly better for your blood pressure but that is from my point of view at your predicament.

[flybyjohn]

Look at how different the cone into the rifling is on the two barrels. Both from the same factory and for the same gun. The original barrel had a good smooth cone and the replacement looks like it is missing a lot of the cone into the grooves. The land right at the top of the ramp also has a good edge to catch anything trying to get past it.

209381209382

[Soundguy]

Looks lil the cut the bore with a hand drill and flat file.

[vzerone]

To me accepting a firearm with those little flaws such as the OP has, how many of you would accept a brand new car that had a scratch down the hood and they didn't discount it? I wouldn't.

There seems to be no pride in this country anymore in the craftmanship trades. I imagine myself at wherever Remington makes those barrels and I'm rifling it and I WOULD LOOK THROUGH IT and see those ripped out metal places and say to myself "nope, this one is going in the reject box". I wouldn't want and I wouldn't send it out to a customer. That's the kind of thing used car dealers do more then to often.

[lefty o]

that is truly pathetic. now i get sometimes stuff slips thru when made even though it shouldnt. on something that is in for warranty care should be taken to make sure what is sent back is better than what was recieved. speaks volumes about how little remingturd cares.

[flybyjohn]

That's what I was thinking and I even wrote that into my letter that is in the box for them to read when they open it. "if a warranty came in with a bad barrel, I would **** well make sure it left with a better barrel than it came in with." I also gave them the whole deal about taking pride in a made in America firearm and that I hope this is not the "within spec" that the last gunsmith that put on the barrel stated. I also let them know that my Mosin Nagant that has seen battle in the trenches had a better barrel than what they sent me.

They might not even take the time to read my letter as I got a little long winded but hopefully they take the time to pick out a dandy barrel now that it has been back two times for the same thing.

[john.k]

In the automated factory,there are no "barrel inspectors' or any other kind either. The only workers are maintenance/fault clearers.If a CNC machine malfunctions ,production is moved to another machine.....Small portable robots replace machine tenders,and move slow enough that WHS guarding isnt needed...There is no one to look down a barrel.....QA is inherent in CNC machining,and any further QA is by analysis of enduser feed back.....Returns......if buyers dont reject product,then QA is good.

[Soundguy]

Scarry as that sounds, I have a buddy that worked at a mostly automated amazon sorting/fulfillment center...

[john.k]

i wonder at the term"fulfillment"....what does it mean....I suspect in Amazon speak it means when there are zero human employees being paid to waste time having breaks,talking,getting tired etc. Or using free facilities such as company supplied water and sewerage costs.............All the salesmen for the new gen robots show a little vid of a worker wasting something like one hour of production time just to have a whiz...........robots work 24/7....and so far the state govt hasnt figured how to get all the taxes they load onto human employment back.....but they will.

[Soundguy]

automation is double edged. cut humans, save money.. but now those humans you cut have no money, so they can't buy your product, thus you sell less, and then close.

[flybyjohn]

I wonder if it is a robot fitting these guns together after all the parts are made. I can only imagine that someone has got to pick up a barrel, slide it into the slide place the spring, and install the slide assembly and then test fire the gun. How hard could it be to sight down the barrel and notice smooth from rough.

The Customer Service rep I spoke on the phone with from Remington was shocked that I had looked down the barrel. He boasted that in the 85 sum handguns he owns that he has never looked down the barrel. He just runs a brush through them and shoots them. I find that really hard to believe. I look down every one of my barrels while cleaning, that's how I know when it is clean.

[beemer]

automation is double edged. cut humans, save money.. but now those humans you cut have no money, so they can't buy your product, thus you sell less, and then close.

I worked for the same furniture manufacturer for 35 years, we made good furniture and it was a good place to work. It was sold out and a new management crew arrived. Everything was either automated or outsourced to China and a lot of people lost their job.

I had the same discussion with one of the manage team and was told I knew nothing about business, well maybe I don't but they lost their tail.

[john.k]

When remlin talk about "deep grooved ballard rifling" that is the deep grooves they are talking about.

[Soundguy]

Now that is funny! ;)

[TCLouis]

The first time my Bull dog went back is because every groove looked that when I got it home.

As one of the writers said to a friend, ' the consumer has become the QA/QC department for the gun manufacturers.

I would imagine that barrel and boolits would not play well together.

[1911sw45]

How about an update?

[therealhitman]

I bet Remington sent it back as is. Those are not chatter marks...winds up it's the owner's manual and legal disclaimer printed in a single line on the bottom of the groove. Cheaper than paper or bandwidth/data storage as it turns out.

[BigBore45]

I'm sure Remington didn't fix it any better the suck, anything freedom group sucks. I will not buy any of it after an experience with a 870.

I had a ruger 1911 with a bad barrel with tool marking. Called them, wrote a note to the service guy that was getting the gun.

It went along the lines of: ok this barrel is going to lead up like crazy, they make factory lead rounds so don't pull the reloading bull****. Also the timing lockup was to tight on the link so that I better not have to fix again.

Got the gun back about 10 days later with a types letter. Apologizing to me and went on to say I had a hand picked barrel that was hand lapped and got a new slide hand fitted and all set up. The barrel is like a mirror and it is a very smooth gun. No joke, that guy should be working at nighthawk customs or something. Anyway. Ruger has always been like that for me, I even admit to breaking a vaquero, they sent parts to me free of charge 2 day shipping. Ruger is the best with customer service..

[Smoke4320]

I wonder if it is a robot fitting these guns together after all the parts are made. I can only imagine that someone has got to pick up a barrel, slide it into the slide place the spring, and install the slide assembly and then test fire the gun. How hard could it be to sight down the barrel and notice smooth from rough.

The Customer Service rep I spoke on the phone with from Remington was shocked that I had looked down the barrel. He boasted that in the 85 sum handguns he owns that he has never looked down the barrel. He just runs a brush through them and shoots them. I find that really hard to believe. I look down every one of my barrels while cleaning, that's how I know when it is clean.
My guess would be the " unservice" rep owns zero guns after a statement like that

[mold maker]

Probably hasn't looked down the sights either. Funny how positions are filled after the bean counters get through. It seems as if knowledge is secondary to ability to BS.

[Soundguy]

My guess would be the " unservice" rep owns zero guns after a statement like that

Very much agreed.

[Texas by God]

Nothing wrong with that barrel that 500 bullets coated in valve grinding compound wouldn't fix- then you'd have the only 9.1mm on the block! Seriously they need to replace that carp barrel asap/nc!

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[10-x]

Wow, just looked at the pics of barrels. Sure are not hammer forged, looks like dull broach with feed and speed way off. Junk. remington is a has been since the bean counters took over. In my 35 years of working with equipment, machinery and machine tools , all went down the drain when bean counters got control of manufacturing and maintanence. Sad reflection on our once greatest manufacturing systems in the world, glad dont work anymore.:cry::veryconfu

[john.k]

Venture capitalists is the buzzword.......guaranteed returns to investment funds.....huge bonuses to smarties ....same time trash employee entitlements..... .......and strip all the trusted brands,then sell the name to third world manufacturers.......who are gradually improving their quality........look at all the corporate giants who pay no tax,just so you can pay more......

[TXGunNut]

Seems our OP is among the missing.

[john.k]

Million dollar settlement with non disclosure clause?

[Eddie2002]

Had a problem with a Remington BDL 700 in 30-06 I purchased new way back in the 80's. All the machine work was fine but the plastic end cap on the stock had a large chunk of waste plastic stuck in the barrel channel. It kind of looked like squeezed tooth paste that had hardened in the left side of the channel and was pressing real hard on the side of the barrel. Took a while to figure out why the rifle wouldn't group better than 3 inches at 100yds. Thought it was my shooting style that was the problem. Ended up floating the barrel and replacing the stock pressure points with a small piece of cork which made a big difference.
I wonder how many new gun owners even look down the barrel of their gun or know what to look for. Too bad QC has gone down hill for Remington.

[flybyjohn]

Seems our OP is among the missing.

Sorry guys. I sent the gun in the second time on December 12th and they received it on the 14th in the morning. I had almost forgotten about it after 4 weeks. I started building a new wood stove for the garage. I called them a week or so ago at about 5 weeks time to find out what the status was on the gun. They had to transfer me to a special customer service rep. He told me after a little looking around that the gun was waiting on a barrel and it would be sent out when the barrel was available. I then asked if the gun was at the factory that the barrels are made and he said it was. So I inquired that if it is waiting on the barrel then there must not be any in stock to put in it and they must be waiting on a new run of barrels. I asked if he knew when the next run of barrels for it would be run to get an estimate of when I might get my gun back and he got really short with me and told me that he could give me a date but it would be an outright lie because he would just pull the number out of the air. I asked then if he could transfer me to someone that would know the schedule of when the next batch of barrels would be run and he raised his voice and said that when they run barrels is proprietary information and they cannot give out that information. I then asked that instead of giving me the dates that they will run the barrels, since it is proprietary information, that instead he just find out and tell me the date that a barrel will be available, which may be a day or two after they run the barrels, that way he would not be breaking any rules. I think he got really short with me at this time and just told me it would be done within 2 - 10 weeks, he does not know when. I asked if I should call back at the end of 10 weeks then and he said "You can if you want to." I said thank you and hung up.

A week later I received an email from UPS that I had a delivery scheduled for today from ROC.

I will let you all know how it looks after I get it this afternoon.

PS. I noticed that they just put out the RP45 which looks like an identical gun as the RP9. Must have had the barrel machining set up for running 45 barrels.

[Soundguy]

Sorry guys. I sent the gun in the second time on December 12th and they received it on the 14th in the morning. I had almost forgotten about it after 4 weeks. I started building a new wood stove for the garage. I called them a week or so ago at about 5 weeks time to find out what the status was on the gun. They had to transfer me to a special customer service rep. He told me after a little looking around that the gun was waiting on a barrel and it would be sent out when the barrel was available. I then asked if the gun was at the factory that the barrels are made and he said it was. So I inquired that if it is waiting on the barrel then there must not be any in stock to put in it and they must be waiting on a new run of barrels. I asked if he knew when the next run of barrels for it would be run to get an estimate of when I might get my gun back and he got really short with me and told me that he could give me a date but it would be an outright lie because he would just pull the number out of the air. I asked then if he could transfer me to someone that would know the schedule of when the next batch of barrels would be run and he raised his voice and said that when they run barrels is proprietary information and they cannot give out that information. I then asked that instead of giving me the dates that they will run the barrels, since it is proprietary information, that instead he just find out and tell me the date that a barrel will be available, which may be a day or two after they run the barrels, that way he would not be breaking any rules. I think he got really short with me at this time and just told me it would be done within 2 - 10 weeks, he does not know when. I asked if I should call back at the end of 10 weeks then and he said "You can if you want to." I said thank you and hung up.

A week later I received an email from UPS that I had a delivery scheduled for today from ROC.

I will let you all know how it looks after I get it this afternoon.

PS. I noticed that they just put out the RP45 which looks like an identical gun as the RP9. Must have had the barrel machining set up for running 45 barrels.

and might have been waiting on that specifically too.

[gpidaho]

flybyjohn; You know, I may have been a little short with you also. Can you just imagine having that poor fella's job. You show up in the morning to work and there is a whole bank of flashing lights on the "On hold" board. Each person with the same question, when is the *** your company sold me going to be fixed or even, is it going to be fixed? And how on earth could you find "Your" pistol in the latest heap of pistols that came in that morning for repair? I just wouldn't want the money bad enough to have that guys job. Gp

[flybyjohn]

GP, I am not quite sure if you are being serious or not. There defiantly is some poking being done towards Remington in that post but on the other hand , it is true that the job of dealing with unhappy customers all day long would be one of the worst jobs to have.

The different sections of the complex just must not be able to communicate with each other. I guess that is the problem when a company gets too big. The left arm doesn't know what the right arm is doing.

[Soundguy]

Even worse when the left arm doesn't know what the left at is doing, and doesn't even know a right arm exists...

[gpidaho]

flybyjohn; Sorry. I should not make fun. It truly would be the worst job ever to work at the man's position. It's just that I've had SUCH bad luck with Remington products in the last year. I'm done with Remington and as far as possible the "Freedom Group in general. Apologies. Gp

[flybyjohn]

Ok quiz time. Get out you CSI gear because the following is going to test your skills. First what does the Repair work done document say?

213144

That’s right I read that as replaced barrel.

Now here is a picture of the end of the barrel I just got back.

213145

Ok I think to myself that looks almost as bad as the one I sent in. So I go and have a look at the previous pictures on my phone and low and behold a twin barrel.

213146

Now these pictures are taken over six weeks apart one is before sending it in and the other after getting it back.
So take a good look and zoom in if you need to and tell my if those fingerprints don’t match.

[flybyjohn]

Maybe just some really good consistent tooling?

[Plate plinker]

Lol what a shame.

[lefty o]

same barrel, and one of the many reasons i call it remingturd!

[flybyjohn]

Did you notice that the repair order said F500593 RP - BARREL 4.5 45

Does that mean they might have accidentally ordered a .45 acp barrel for it and when they got it said oh well just stick the old one back on and send it back.

[flybyjohn]

I need to talk to someone higher up there and just have them send me a few barrels and I will send back the ones that are no good.

[gpidaho]

LOL John. At least they are trying to make you think they fixed it. Mine, they just sent back with a five shot target that someone shot with something, somewhere to prove that my barrel shot just fine and they "Saw no reason for complaint" Never again, no more Remington products for me. P'sOS. Gp

[flybyjohn]

I call them this morning to confirm that number, and it is indeed a number for a .45 acp barrel. I don't know why that would be anywhere on a 9 mm work order. The other item of the whole 9mm gun also makes me wonder. Why is that on the order form.

They want me to email some pictures and then they will decide what they want to do. I think they have spent more on overnight shipping back and forth then the whole gun cost.

[Soundguy]

Maybe just some really good consistent tooling?

that was my thought. the tooling for cutting their grooves is consistent. BAD, but consistent.

It would be my guess that the machinework, or broaching, whatever method they are using.. doesn't look like button-swage... is not being done 'here'.

[bosterr]

Dumb question here... besides the exact flaws in the bore, are there any marks on the outside that would definitely prove that it's the same barrel?

[flybyjohn]

There are two dents on the side of the barrel chamber portion on the outside that were there previously that don't look like they are supposed to be there. Almost like it was clamped in something. Seeing them on the barrel I got back, I thought at first "hey maybe that is supposed to be there since it is on this barrel too." Now I am sure that they are not supposed to be there and it was on both barrels. I don't have previous pictures of the outside of the barrel though.

I have compiled the pictures in one photo and rotated them so that it was easier to match up together. Three top pictures from Nov 11, 2017 and three bottom pictures from Jan 31, 2018, before and after sending it in for replacement.


213174

[Soundguy]

Now this begs a question... I wonder about the steel quality, and composition.

Looks lil the parent bore was polished well, prior to cutting, but there are marks on the lands near the muzzle

Lastly... Since all repair so far has netted an identical tooling cut look... Is it possible that is simply what they are considering 'normal' and as such, why it is not being corrected when sent in?

[flybyjohn]

If there is any doubt, then here is a close up of two of the pictures. A tool can cut very similar but to be able to rip metal on two different pieces of metal the same in all 5 spots shown in these pictures is probably impossible.

213175

[flybyjohn]

Now this begs a question... I wonder about the steel quality, and composition.

Looks lil the parent bore was polished well, prior to cutting, but there are marks on the lands near the muzzle

Lastly... Since all repair so far has netted an identical tooling cut look... Is it possible that is simply what they are considering 'normal' and as such, why it is not being corrected when sent in?

The polished lands was from me trying to get rid of the cuts on the lands the first time I got the barrel back. The lands were so rough that it tore my cloth patch the first time I pushed it through the barrel. I took to it with lapping compound and JB bore polish but the marks were just so bad I could not get them to come out.

The handgun has been sent in two times so far. The first time only had deep marks down one groove, the lands and forcing cone were nearly perfect. there was a little grove on the lands after the forcing cone a little ways but still far superior to the barrel they replaced it with. I contacted them and told them the barrel was worse. Sent it in a second time and this time the same barrel came back after they told me it was replaced.

original barrel came with the gun when new. Only one bad groove.
213176

the other pictures just above are what came back after the first and second return.

[Soundguy]

Ouch...

[Soundguy]

I'd ask about the rifling tooling...

[Plate plinker]

ha I would ask for a refund.

[flybyjohn]

I talked to them a few times today. I found four other spots on the barrel in my pictures that show that it is indeed the same barrel they sent me and I emailed them to Remington. I called to make sure they got the pictures and they said they did. I asked the polite lady on the phone if she thought it was the same barrel and she said she didn’t know for sure because that is not her Area of expertise. I asked if I could talk to somebody further up the chain of command they could tell me if there was another barrel in stock before I sent this in again. They said they would walk my order over to a supervisor and have him call me shortly. I said thank you you have been a lot of help and hung up waiting for my call back.

5 hours later I I called again because they had not called me yet. I talk to the same customer service rep and asked if I could talk to her supervisor she said she would take my phone number and have them call me back I said that happened last time and they never called me back so I’ll hold. She said there’s no way for her to transfer me to the supervisor. I said that’s OK I’ll wait on hold you can go and talk to him and come back. She put me on hold for about 15 minutes. She then got back on the line and said she would transfer me to the supervisor. The supervisor got on the line. I explain my whole situation again. He asked me if I just wanted a whole new gun. I said the trigger on this gun is just fine all I need is a barrel, can you guarantee me there will be a barrel for it if I send it in. He said no but I can guarantee you a new gun or a refund. He said this has escalated to a point where there were too many notes on the order form for them to do a barrel replacement at this time.

I asked what the repair parts order numbers stood for and why 45 barrel was ordered for my 9 mm. He stated that the same part number is used for both 9 mm and 45 because the slide is the same between the two. I said how can you have the same part number for both the 45 and 9 mm. Although the 45 barrel may fit in a 9 mm slide, you cannot shoot 9 mm through a 45 barrel, so you must have to be able to differentiate between 45 and 9 mm barrel or how would you know which barrel you are going to get.

I never got admitance of any mistake that they made. They would never agree that they did indeed send out the same barrel. Well, Remington, if your listening. How about “ we are sorry we made a mistake, how can we make it right”. Instead I got “ this repair invoice has got to many notes on it now to have just the barrel replaced so would you like a refund or a new gun.”

Well enough for now. I’ll let you know how it goes later.

[Soundguy]

So did you go for the refund?

[lefty o]

id take the refund, and ask for some extra for your time , trouble, and frustration.

[john.k]

The same part number for a 45 and a 9mm barrel.....now that will make for some interesting conversation down the track..........the barrel is the same one by the same certainty as a dna match....it is not possible to reproduce random scoring even if you wanted to.

[flybyjohn]

I got the whole thing for 289.00 and a 50.00 rebate. Not sure how much they would give me for a refund. I have to wait for a envelope to send it back and let them know what I want to do. I really like how the gun shoots and feels in my hand. I can go up against the guys at our little unofficial steel challenge and smoke them. They have the little more expensive s&w pro 9mm. I shot my friends s&w pro 9 and much more preferred my rp9 over it.

I don’t think I will get any extra for my trouble. Not sure they work like that.

[flybyjohn]

Johnk I don’t think I will ever get them to admit to it being the same. The paper work says they changed it so that is what they did.

[john.k]

I would think if you like the gun,get your refund,and buy another ,if you can find one with a good barrel........the alternative is to buy an aftermarket barrel ......if you accept an exchange,sight unseen ,could be the same all over again.

[flybyjohn]

That’s a good idea johnk. Better than the alternative. The one problem is that the are test fired and it is hard to see roughness without a cleaning first.