Question on Lee dies

[tranders]

Just ordered 7.62x39 and 7.62x54R die sets from Lee. Both of which are the three die Pacesetter dies. Please explain to me why Lee gives two different expander balls(.308 and .310) with the 7.62x39 dies and only a .308 expander ball with the 7.62x54R dies? If anything I would think they would give the larger expander for the 54R with all the over bore Mosins.

Thanks for the help!

[rondog]

You'd have to ask Lee. Seems I've read that most folks buy the expander ball for .303 British for their 7.62x54R dies. I have that die set but have never used it yet, because I haven't gotten around to getting that .303 expander. I have .303 dies, just don't want to swap that thing back and forth, although it's doable. I also rarely shoot my Mosins, and have tons of surplus ammo anyway.

[jimkim]

Just ordered 7.62x39 and 7.62x54R die sets from Lee. Both of which are the three die Pacesetter dies. Please explain to me why Lee gives two different expander balls(.308 and .310) with the 7.62x39 dies and only a .308 expander ball with the 7.62x54R dies? If anything I would think they would give the larger expander for the 54R with all the over bore Mosins.

Thanks for the help!I don't know. I did order a 303 Brit expander for my 30-30 though. If your seater is built like mine, you can use the same top punch you size with as a seating plug.

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[tranders]

I ordered the Universal Expander die from Lee. Hopefully that will do the trick.

[MOA]

Depending on what firearm you are loading for the bore/groove diameter can be different. Most military rifles like the Russian SKS will have a groove of .311 where a Ruger ranch rifle chambered in the same cailber will most likely have a diameter of .308. As far as the 7.62x54R I do not know of any manufactures that make a bore diameter different that what the Russian round was initially spec'd at.

[tranders]

I am loading for a Russian SKS and a 1942 Tula Mosin. I didn't think about the Ranch Rifles being a different bore diameter.

[MT Chambers]

I ordered the Universal Expander die from Lee. Hopefully that will do the trick.

No, it only flares the case mouth.

[tranders]

Would I be better off getting the expander for the 303 or does Lyman make an M die for this Caliber?


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[Grmps]

You would need to slug your barrel to know which expander ball to use with each firearm.

[MOA]

Would I be better off getting the expander for the 303 or does Lyman make an M die for this Caliber?


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Wiki shows bullet dia .312

Parent case 8×52mmR Mannlicher
Case type Rimmed, Bottleneck
Bullet diameter 7.92 mm (0.312 in)
Neck diameter 8.53 mm (0.336 in)
Shoulder diameter 11.61 mm (0.457 in)
Base diameter 12.37 mm (0.487 in)
Rim diameter 14.40 mm (0.567 in)
Rim thickness 1.6 mm (0.063 in)
Case length 53.72 mm (2.115 in)
Overall length 77.16 mm (3.038 in)
Case capacity 4.16 cm3 (64.2 gr H2O)
Rifling twist 240 mm (1 in 9.45 in)
Primer type Berdan or Boxer Large Rifle
Maximum pressure 390.00 MPa (56,565 psi)

[MOA]

Would I be better off getting the expander for the 303 or does Lyman make an M die for this Caliber?


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Contact Lyman to see if their M die is still available for this caliber. I cannot locate it on their website as a order online item, but that does not mean that it is not available anymore. I use their M 1 C 91 for my SKS, but I got mine years ago, and their M die for most all of my other boolit handloads too. I like their M die.

I see no reason why this M die will not work for your rifle application as well if you can get it from Lyman, and I would ask them about it while you have them on the phone as you inquire about the SKS M die.

Here is a link to a very good article written about loading SKS with cast boolits and I think it is one that should be read by anyone who is thinking about casting and loading for this fine carbine.

This is also another great cast forum I joined years ago and read almost on a daily basis also.

http://castbulletassoc.org/blog/article/2017/2/44/cast-bullet-use-in-the-sks





https://s19.postimg.org/498m079j7/Lyman_M_dies.png (https://postimages.org/)

[tranders]

Fantastic information! Thank you MOA

[HeavyMetal]

Lee provides both expanders because some rifle makers, like Ruger, chambered there 7.62x39 rifles in a .308 barrel instead of .311.

Many smiths have rebarreled rifles to 7.62x39 and used .308 blanks as well mostly because finding .311 blanks is tough.

As far as the 7.62 x 54R is concerned I have no ideas as I've never had a rifle in that caliber! I suspect there was enough surplus ammo at one time that most shooters didn't reload or didn't cast for the caliber so Lee had no need to add a second expander bad to the die set.

HM

[mdi]

Lee provides both expanders because some rifle makers, like Ruger, chambered there 7.62x39 rifles in a .308 barrel instead of .311.

Many smiths have rebarreled rifles to 7.62x39 and used .308 blanks as well mostly because finding .311 blanks is tough.

As far as the 7.62 x 54R is concerned I have no ideas as I've never had a rifle in that caliber! I suspect there was enough surplus ammo at one time that most shooters didn't reload or didn't cast for the caliber so Lee had no need to add a second expander bad to the die set.

HM

I was going to add the same thought. My SKS slugs out at .312" and my Mosin is right around .309"... But it's been a while and I haven't done any casting for the SKS. I have cast and PCed for my Garand and Mosin and used the same bullet in both.

[tranders]

Is your rifle a Finnish Mosin?


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[Pressman]

Fire a military surplus 7.62x39 in a .308 barrel and you will have to beat the bolt open with a hammer.
Ken

[MOA]

Fire a military surplus 7.62x39 in a .308 barrel and you will have to beat the bolt open with a hammer.
Ken

Yes, you can get away with a .308 down the tube of the .311 but not the other way around.

[MOA]

As an aside, the second most important thing about handloading a sks is the importance of using a military spec primer on military arms to avoid slam fires. Lots of reloaders for this round unless they read lots of manuals might miss the importance of the primer in this specific cartridge when used in a military firearm.

[myg30]

MOA, thank you for the SKS info and link. Reloading for my Russian is in the near future. I also enjoy the reading and history.

Tranders, I'm following your experience with this so I can avoid the same problems. Good luck with yours and be safe.

Mike

[44magLeo]

When I bought my 7.62x54R dies It didn't come with both expanders. I ordered the 303 expander to go with it.
Most 7.62x54r's use the larger bore. The Finnish rebuilt rifles used the 308 bore.
For jacketed bullets I suppose you can get away with the 308 expander but for cast the bigger expander is needed to help prevent bullet damage.
I like the larger expander when loading the .311 or .312 jacketed bullets I have.
I suppose the 7.62x39 being a more popular cartridge they include both expanders.
A lot more rifles are x39 then x54r.
Leo