1949 Squirrel Hunt

[Lucky Joe]

Picture of a squirrel hunter, taken from my library 1939 Fur-Fish-Game magazine.http://i22.tinypic.com/2agoq36.jpg

[Buckshot]

..............Yup, those'r fur sure huntin' dud's. Some of those old hunting advertisements sure showed some finely outfitted sports. Riding pants, tall laceup boots with woolen socks rolled down over the top. A double tongue trooper belt, Pendleton, green canvas game coat and a NECKTIE. Topping it all off a Montana Peak hat.

Folks just don't know how to dress anymore :-)

.................Buckshot

[Morgan Astorbilt]

The guy might have been hunting in snake country, where the boots would be a plus. Remember the ads for "Gokey Boot Sauvage" snake proof boots? Don't see that ad any more.
Morgan

[Junior1942]

The place where he killed the squirrels is probably condos now.

[218bee]

Any ideas what his shootin iron is ??

[45 2.1]

Any ideas what his shootin iron is ??

Custom Stevens

[Bent Ramrod]

Looks like a Model 418 Stevens. For a time, they tricked out the 1915 Favorite with a pistol grip and a thicker forend. The 418 was the sport model and the 418-1/2 was the junior target model. Both of them are very seldom found anymore.

[Lucky Joe]

This reply came from another site, I'm going to pilfer it.

Circa 1920s - '30s, UNMARKED Fiala Model 1920 .22rf magazine-fed, single-shot made in CT, original company eventually owned by several buyers at bankruptcies.

Some of these guns were marked Schall & Co.; others were marked Columbia Arms as well as Fiala. And, though I've never seen one, there are purported to be some marked Botwinik Bros..

Since no known factory records exist, this unmarked gun is attributed to Schall, because they made changes to the original Fiala design such as the barrel length is only 6 1/2" rather than 7 1/2", and the barrels were pinned rather than having the takedown bolt. Interesting to note, the ones I own show very poor workmanship in aligning the barrel squarely into the frame! They're off-centered and this can plainly be seen by simply eyeballing the alignment!

They also more usually had the ridged walnut grips rather than the more common smooth walnut grips used by Fiala. Rear sights were also a simple v-block while Fiala furnished their guns with a small leaf type drum which had both the common V and a leaf with a higher peep-hole in it.

[DLCTEX]

Lucky Joe: Do what?

[Lucky Joe]

Dale - Well since you asked here it is, now I guess I'm found out. Gotta head for the Bad Lands.:Fire:



Lucky Joe: Do what?

Verb


to pilfer (third-person singular simple present pilfers, present participle pilfering, simple past and past participle pilfered)

1. To steal in small quantities, or articles of small value; to practice petty theft.


Tain't the first time and probably won't be the last.

[EMC45]

Magazine fed single shot?

[Bent Ramrod]

I thought the Fiala pistol looked like a Colt Woodsman.

[Buckshot]

............I don't see no steenking peestol?

...............Buckshot

[Morgan Astorbilt]

Fialas do look like Woodsmans but are actually single shot pistols, not semi-auto.
Morgan

[FloridaFialaFan]

Since I've already been quoted in this thread, thought I might as well join the fray. BUT, although my FIRST love is the Fiala, (Whatcha wanna know?) I DO collect all OLD, cheapie in their day, 22rf, single-shot firearms made in North America.

First, to EMC45, Yep! MAGAZINE-FED, SINGLE-SHOT... Only one in the world, as far as I know now. Back in the early part of the 20th Century Anthony Fiala, a world-famous soldier, politician, author, adventurer, outdoorsman, etc., etc., owned an outfitting company in New York City - back in the heyday of exploration. He even accompanied Teddy Roosevelt on one of that illustrious gent's Amazon Expedition - he was also the outfitter for it. Fiala Outfits, Inc. of NYC was his home base.

Fiala had Lucias Diehm design his Model 1920 firearm as a survival tool for other outdoorsmen. Many of today's gun writers consider it to be "America's First Survival Weapon." Not trusting the semi-auto system to operate properly in the sub-zero temps he expected his clients to be in, he had it made as a SINGLE-SHOT.

Later, Diehm also designed the Hartford Arms Single-Shot .22rf pistol - NO magazine - which later evolved into their semi-auto Model 1925. At this point Hi-Standard decided to enter the gunmaking business and bought Hartford Arms. The Hartford Model 25 became Hi-Standard's Model B. So, it's an extended family...

Here's a picture of one of my Fiala 3-barrel sets, in fitted case, and YES it does look much like the Colt Woodsman.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v635/mauser/FIALACASEDSETSN1500008_edited.jpg

Best regards ~ ~ ~ FFF

[floodgate]

FialaFan:

That's a lovely set! I hesitate to disagree with the experts, but I wouldn't call the Fiala a "single-shot", since it IS magazine-fed. How about a "Straight-Pull Repeater"? I assume the stocked version is on the BATF "Curios and Relics" list (don't have a copy handy).

Floodgate

[FloridaFialaFan]

Floodgate, I agree. I hate that long-winded explanation of its function. Once fired, you thumb the slide release lever down, the slide pops back and ejects the fired case. You then hand-cycle the slide forward and either fire it again or move the safety catch up into the notch in the slide.

Unfortunately they look SO MUCH like a semi-auto that it's difficult to explain to the average gun nut. I've got several older handguns which resemple semi-autos, but because they DON'T use a magazine, simply are single-shots, the gun guys quickly accept that.

I keep a copy of the ATF online lists in my "Favorites" folders for quick reference.
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/curios/2001index.htm
Sections II through IV are the alphabetic listings you'll find most interesting.

Below is an old photo I had in file showing the single-shots that LOOK LIKE semi-autos.

Best regards ~ ~ ~ FFL

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v635/mauser/SINGLESHOTSLOOKALIKEWITHAUTOS006_ed.jpg

Left to Right, they are: Fiala Model 1920; Hartford Arms single-shot; Sheridan Knocabout; WAMO Powermaster; S-M Sporter; and Stevens #10. All .22rf, all US made, all old.

[floodgate]

FialaFan:

I didn't know about the "pop-open" feature! So, it's really a "straight-push" - not a "straight-pull" - action. Another great photo, and a welcome addition to all the info available on this site. Thanks again!

Fg

[James C. Snodgrass]

Those are some cool looking pistols ! It amazes me at the advancement of modern arms and some of the reasoning for the changes.

[FloridaFialaFan]

Floodgate, when you put it that way - YES. Straight push. Also, remember that the firing of the chambered cartridge does NOT activate the slide. It remains locked forward. You thumb down on the slide release and "pop," she's ready to be fed. Here's the "straight push" part. As you push it closed it strips a fresh cartridge from the magazine and chambers it - AND the hammer is in full-cock position! That's when you slide the safety hook up into the slide...

I know of NO OTHER gun which operates in this manner.

Note, that even the Hartford Arms Single-Shot (designed by Lucius Diehm who designed the Fiala) EVOLVED into a semi-auto, which EVOLVED into the Hi-Standard Model B when H-S bought them. The Colt Woodsman (and others) had proven their satisfactory operation as semi-autos in sub-zero conditions.

Fialas also had economic times against their success and it was the end of the "Explorer Era." The average Joe was asking for INEXPENSIVE guns he could make a living with trapping, hunting, etc.. Fiala tried to accomodate this request with a less expensively produced gun with NO take-down bolt, NO stock attachment, and NO extra barrels. It still didn't pay off. Eventually they all tried and failed.

Best regards ~ ~ ~FFF

[FloridaFialaFan]

James C., you were evidently posting while I was doing all that long-winded typing above. Sorry, I missed your comment. You're right about the changes in firearms over the years. One gun I find MOST fascinating is the Daisy-Heddon VL. Just think about the savings involved had it been successful!

The amount of brass saved alone would have been awesome! Cost would obviously have been reduced and ALL shooters would benefit. Unfortunately it had too many OTHER shortcomings to be acceptable. Maybe someday they'll find the answer - like a Star Wars laser pistol...

It might not have been a real popular little rifle, but I grabbed one of the Presentation grades, with 4,000 original rounds, and brass plate NOT engraved, just to say I have one.

Did you look at those pistols above closely? Even Sid Manson, Pres. of the company, admitted the S-M Sporter began life as a little ***... BUT that's another story.

Best regards ~ ~ ~ FFF

[Lucky Joe]

Thank you for joining. I enjoy learning about different firearms and had never heard of the ones you speak of.

[FloridaFialaFan]

Thanks, Lucky Joe. Sorry, I really didn't mean to usurp your squirrel hunt thread this way, but when someone says Fiala, my ears come to a point! I just cannot talk about these enough. It's great that with the internet more people are becoming aware of these VERY interesting guns.

Lots of history connected with Fiala the man too. Last write up about him of any extent was the 1984 Shooters Bible. Because of the gun's connection with the Hi-Standard family, I got acquainted with John J. Stimson, Jr. and learned a lot more about them from him. John is considered THE authority on this group of guns. He's got a very extensive collection of vintage ads, catalogs, manuals, etc., issued by the various manufacturers of the Fiala.

As for squirrel hunters, I've got a bunch of old .22rf rifles that have probably eradicated their share of tree rats. Back in Indiana I really enjoyed the squirrel season. Excellent eating fare!

I've got a Stevens Crack Shot coming that has the side lever drop-black rather than the pigtail lever. Once in hand I'll get some info and pics of it on these forums.

Best regards ~ ~ ~ FFF

[Lead melter]

Devil's Advocate here. Since we all learned about an interesting new/old weapon that has a unique operating system that I, personally, feel should be brought back to the mainstream, and we have found what type of rifle the hunter in the photo was using, lets move on to the next phase.

What kind of squirrels are those?:twisted::twisted::twisted:

By the way, it's great to see someone other than myself who reads F-F-G. Not the slickest publication, but a great "honest-to-goodness" outdoorsmans publication.

[FloridaFialaFan]

From their dark coloration (in black and white) I'd guess fox squirrels. The greys would come out much lighter. :bigsmyl2:

Best regards ~ ~ ~ FFF

On another subject, we must work together to STOP THIS INHUMANE FOX HUNTING!!!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v635/mauser/FOXHUNTINGbyJimBuchanan.jpg

[Junior1942]

Thanks for reminding me about "Fur Fish & Game" magazine. I just went to http://www.furfishgame.com/ and subscribed. Two years = $26.95

[Bret4207]

For those desiring a trip down nostalgia lane, get a copy of "Hunting with the Twenty-Two" by Charles S. Landis. My dad had an original 1948 edition and I darn near wore the ting out. I've probably read it cover to cover 25 times and selected sections over 100 times! It covers the 22 back in the day when one ordered a 52 Winchester or Stevens 44 1/2 and had a gunsmith fit it properly as you wanted it. Excellent book and it's being reprinted now.

[Nueces]

I love those pre-50s sporting books. Found a nice copy of Landis on ebay. And I also just subscribed to FFG. Thanks to all for the recommendation.

Mark

[Lucky Joe]

FFF, you usurped nothing glad you joined in. Actually you responded to this pic over at RFC. Thought I recognized your style.


I believe my earliest FFG is a 1927 but I haven't stopped digging. This list was posted on the rimfirecentral forum. I copied it, I hope the poster doesn't mind.


If you go on vacation here is a list of books that will keep the .22 rimfire spirit alive while cast away:

The Gun Digest Book of .22 RIMFIRE by James E. House. Gun Digest 2005, 288 pages.

The Complete Book of the .22 A Guide to the World's Most Popular Guns, by Wayne Van Zwoll. The Lyons Press, Guilford Connecticut, 2004, 332 pages.

Complete Book Of The .22 Rimfire. Spring/Summer 1999. Guns & Ammo. Petersen Publishing Company, 98 pages. [Includes an 8-page article entitled Today's Semi-Auto Rifles (nine .22 Rimfires compared)].

Complete Book Of The .22 Rimfire. Fall 1997. Guns & Ammo. Petersen Publishing Company, 98 pages. [Includes a five-page long article on the .22 Quik-Shok LR, titled New High-Performance Frangible Ammo.

Complete Book Of The .22 Rimfire. Summer 1993. Guns & Ammo Series 1. Petersen Publishing Company, 98 pages.

World's Deadliest Rimfire Battleguns by J. M. Ramos, Paladin Press, 1989, 164 pages (soft cover).

The Book Of The Twenty-Two: The All-American Caliber by Sam Fadala. Stoeger Publishing Company, 1989, 272 pages. [Subtitle: Extensive Listings of .22 Centerfires, .22 Rimfires From BB Caps Up To The Powerful .226 Barnes].

.22 Rimfire by Ed Matunas, Volume 2, Number 2. April 1984 by The Guns & Ammo Action Series, 96 pages.

The Complete .22, Harris Publications Inc., 1984, 98 pages.

Popular .22s Magazine, by Simco Media Group. 1984, 98 pages.

.22 Handbook, Harris Publications Inc. 1983, 98 pages.

The Complete .22, Harris Publications Inc.. 1983, 98 pages.

Popular .22s The All-American FUN Caliber!, by RPM Sales Corp. 1983, 98 pages.

The Guns & Ammo Book of .22 Rimfire . 1982, by Bob Milek, G&A Field Editor, 96 pages.

The Complete .22, Harris Publications Inc. 1982, 98 pages.

.22 Handbook, Harris Publications Inc., 1982, 98 pages.

Complete Guide To .22 Rimfires, by The Shooting Times Special editions. 1981, 114 pages.

.22 Rimfire: The World's No.1 Cartridge, by the Guns&Ammo Specialty Books Staff, 1980, Petersen Publishing Co., 96 pages.

Rifles. A PJS Publication of the Shooting Times, 1980, 98 pages. [Not an exclusively 'rimfire' publication, yet it contains several articles on the .22 Rimfire fun guns].

The Gun Digest Book of the .22 RIMFIRE by John Lachuk. DBI Books, Inc., Northfield. Ill., 1978, 224 pages.

Everybody's Fun Gun The .22. 1978, Petersen Publishing Co., 96 pages.

.22 Rimfire, Vol. I, No. 2, Shotgun Journal Special, Summer 1978, 98 pages.

The Mighty .22 Rimfire, from 1976, Petersen Publishing Co., 96 pages.

The 22 Rifle, by Dave Petzal. Winchester Press. 1973, 145 pages plus INDEX, (Hardback).

Wonderful World Of The .22 by John Lachuk. 1972 by Petersen Publishing Co.192 pages.

The Book Of The .22, by Richard Arnold. Kay & Ward (London), 1972, 255 pages (Hardback). This is a revised Second Edition of the 1962-1964 original (below).

The Book Of The .22, by Richard Arnold. A. S. Barnes and Co. (USA), August 1962 & March 1964, 188 pages (Hardback).

Getting The Most Out Of Your .22, by John G. MacKenty. Prentice-Hall, Inc. 1957, 215 pages, plus INDEX (Hardback).

Handbook On Small Bore Rifle Shooting by Colonel Townsend Whelen. Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute New York, Fifteenth Edition July 1956, 80 pages. [Small size, soft cover publication with lots of dated but useful info].

Practical Dope On The .22, by F. C. Ness. The Stackpole Company. 1947-1955 (Four Editions), 313 pages (Hardback) [CFs and RFs are treated].

.22 Caliber Rifle Shooting and Hunting With The .22, in a single edition by C. S. Landis. Small-Arms Technical Publishing Co. 1932, 419 pages (Hardback)

[Bret4207]

The Wonderful World of the 22!!! Wish I still had my copy.

[FloridaFialaFan]

Lucky Joe, yep, I'm on RFC quite often. Have obtained a lot of nice old guns from the gang over there. I go by GGN there. I also enjoy (oops, just realized, I don't think we're supposed to mention other similar forums or not). :confused:

Best regards ~ ~ ~ FFF

[Bret4207]

You can talk about other forums here. We aren't like some of the others that get the heebie-jeebies when another forum is mentioned.