1,000 Yards with a .45-70

[Silver Jack Hammer]

Got to go to a 1,000 yard range last weekend. What was interesting was my sight setting for 1,000 yards is only 1.4" above my 200 yard zero. Shooting a 30" bbl. Shiloh with a 550 gr. boolit over 65 gr. of Swiss 1 1/2, I'd expected to use my 3" sight staff. It wasn't necessary.

Fortunately the winds were calm, it was 100 degrees.

[Don McDowell]

Depending on bullet shape, front sight height , wind mirage etc, most 45-70 rifles will be set any where from 175-205 on the sight staff.

[Silver Jack Hammer]

201994
I'm using a mold made for me by Steve Brooks. Shown here next to a 405 gr. Lyman.

[Don McDowell]

That original style postel of Brooks' is a good bullet.

[sharps4590]

At 100 degrees I never would have found out!! You are a tougher shooter than me!!

[Chill Wills]

Amen !
( O T ) sorry.
We got the BPTR Nationals moved from July-August summer heat, to September for a few years. Ah! It was livable!
They got moved back to August again! Not me! That heat is a health hazard for some people.

For something back on topic; Those wanting to shoot Creedmoor W/ their Silhouette rifle and have Silhouette sight settings;
A good rule of thumb is a 1/2 inch which is the same as, 50 minutes above your Ram setting will start you on the 800y target.

[Don McDowell]

Sounds like the weather has been pretty decent down there so far. Chip Mate is said to have set a new national record in position. Of all the years to miss the nationals...
But at least the range is ready for the End of the World 22bpcr championship on Sunday :)

[gunseller]

With the change in Iowa gun season allowable firearms I was thinking about trying to shoot a deer at 1000yards with my 45-70. I was going to use a 405 Lyman over 67 grains of FF Goex. I know 62 grains of FF under a 500 postel style will work but I want a flat nose. I am surprised at the small sight change. Good shooting.
Steve

[Chill Wills]

With the change in Iowa gun season allowable firearms I was thinking about trying to shoot a deer at 1000yards with my 45-70. I was going to use a 405 Lyman over 67 grains of FF Goex. I know 62 grains of FF under a 500 postel style will work but I want a flat nose. I am surprised at the small sight change. Good shooting.
Steve
Really? I doubt on your first shot you would get near enough to even break a deer's leg, but if you did, would it be Okay?
You might want to take up Creedmoor for a few years while you consider this.
No disrespect intended. Just an honest reply to your idea.

[Chill Wills]

Sounds like the weather has been pretty decent down there so far. Chip Mate is said to have set a new national record in position. Of all the years to miss the nationals...
But at least the range is ready for the End of the World 22bpcr championship on Sunday :)

Yes, I was watching the weather, as that is one of two reasons I did not even consider going this year. I am glad they are having great, cool weather! Ironic! O' well. Family business is trumping all this year.

Don, I hope you all have a GREAT eclipse and 22bpcr event! We wish we were there!

[Don McDowell]

Wish you guys could of made it. But it sounds like we may be clouded up on Monday anyway.

[Don McDowell]

With the change in Iowa gun season allowable firearms I was thinking about trying to shoot a deer at 1000yards with my 45-70. I was going to use a 405 Lyman over 67 grains of FF Goex. I know 62 grains of FF under a 500 postel style will work but I want a flat nose. I am surprised at the small sight change. Good shooting.
Steve

Seriously? In the first place it's doubtful you could get a 405 gr bullet to shoot to 1000 yds, with any sort of accuracy. Second the chance of being able to place a shot into the kill zone at 1000 yards on a deer without range flags etc is slim to none.
Use some common sense and keep your shots to 200 or considerably less, and you'll leave less deer for the coyotes to feed on.

[country gent]

Another big issue in the field will be range estimation. With these rifles 15-20 yards off on the actual range will make a miss or wounding shot also. On the range you know the range and work to it. On a home range you have your notes and or previous sight settings to work from also. Another issue is keeping the deer still and not moving for the time of flight. Your looking at 3-4 seconds maybe a little longer from when the trigger is pulled until the bullet gets there. Along with wind and light this is a daunting task.

[BRUCE MOULDS]

1 moa drop difference from 990 yds to 1000 yds,
that is 10", close to the depth of a deer's chest.
better get the range estimation pretty accurate.
keep safe,
bruce.

[BrentD]

I am sure he is just jerking our chains.

Certainly one of the dumber and most unnessecary laws in IA this year. But no one will kill a deer in IA at 500, much less 1000 yards. Won't happen.

[Tom Myers]

The sound of the shot takes roughly 2.67 seconds to travel 1,000 yards .
The bullet, depending on MV and BC will take about 3.75 seconds to travel 1,000 yards.
Any self respecting deer, upon hearing the sound of a shot, would be long gone before the bullet got there.

[BrentD]

I know an awful lot of deer that are not self respecting. Often have to shoo them off the range in midmatch. :)

[Rattlesnake Charlie]

gunseller never said he was going to shoot at a deer at 1,000 yards. He merely stated that he was going to use his .45-70 for deer hunting. I took my first deer with a .45-70 just three months after getting my Shiloh Sharps. As long as you adhere to the long established practice of not shooting at a distance you cannot reliably keep your shots on a paper plate, you are pretty much good to go. The snobbery oozing from this thread is unbelievable. Don't run people off. Coach and encourage them.

gunseller, I use a 350 gr RFN GC designed by Ranch Dog for my hunting bullet in .45-70. It is deadly. I never expect to take a shot beyond 125 yards with my .45-70 because in the field I usually don't have time to accurately determine range and adjust sight or determine holdover. BTW, a good portion of deer are taken inside of 100 yards. Start asking around. And, I don't hunt in swamps or heavy woods. I hunt in western Kansas. (I have hunted in South Carolina swamps too, BTW). Take you time, place your shot.

[BrentD]

RC, read it again.

[country gent]

In post number 8, Gunsellers says with the change in Iowa laws I'm thinking of trying to shoot a deer at 1000yds with a 405 grn bullet. I haven't seen any real snobbery but post explaining the difficulty of doing so. In field conditions even with wind flags, range markers, known sight settings and a very good load with known wind drift and very good optics for spotting this is a very daunting task. The 45-70 is a fine big game rifle no one has said otherwise. I would be hard pressed and dang hungry to attempt a true 1000yd shot on a deer with my 300 in mag under field conditions. Not because the rifle and I arnt capable of it but the other issues involved.

[Randy Bohannon]

The snobbery oozing from this thread is unbelievable. [/QUOTE[QUOTE]I was thinking about trying to shoot a deer at 1000yards with my 45-70. How's that crow ?

[rfd]

With the change in Iowa gun season allowable firearms I was thinking about trying to shoot a deer at 1000yards with my 45-70. I was going to use a 405 Lyman over 67 grains of FF Goex. I know 62 grains of FF under a 500 postel style will work but I want a flat nose. I am surprised at the small sight change. Good shooting.
Steve

IMHO, sir, unless yer chain yanking, that is unethically insane.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Got to go to a 1,000 yard range last weekend. What was interesting was my sight setting for 1,000 yards is only 1.4" above my 200 yard zero. ght Shooting a 30" bbl. Shiloh with a 550 gr. boolit over 65 gr. of Swiss 1 1/2, I'd expected to use my 3" sight staff. It wasn't necessary.

Fortunately the winds were calm, it was 100 degrees.

It is a truism of black powder rifle design that you don't much increase the velocity by using a heavier powder charge. It lets you get the velocity with a heavier and hence better shaped bullet. Black powder match shooting in the UK was frequently at a range of 1000 to 1200 yards, usually with cases which, while of greater capacity than .45-70, were smaller than some used for dangerous game. Bullet weight and shape were the real key to long-range success.

Good quality black powder, carefully loaded, is an exceptionally consistent propellant. It can't get any less consistent as the range lengthens.

[BrentD]

BiS
Yes it is consistent. But it is NOT a 1000 yd deer rifle. Period. I shoot 1000 matches with bp and a 45-70 as much as anyone, maybe more, and even fairly well at times. It's a joke to even consider such hunting.

Someone here may remember the even more ridiculous attempt by David Higginbottam to kill an antelope at 1 mile with a BPCR. What an embarrasment that was!

[Gunlaker]

When you consider that the best in this game will sometimes struggle to keep all shots for score in the black (44") at 1000 yards at a surveyed distance from a stable prone position, it's pretty clear that shooting for the kill zone of a deer at that distance is crazy. It has nothing to do with skill, a hit would be luck. The kill zone on the deer will be something like the size of the x-ring on the Creedmoor target. How many of even the best BPTR shooters hit the x-ring on command? :-)

Chris.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

When you consider that the best in this game will sometimes struggle to keep all shots for score in the black (44") at 1000 yards at a surveyed distance from a stable prone position, it's pretty clear that shooting for the kill zone of a deer at that distance is crazy. It has nothing to do with skill, a hit would be luck. The kill zone on the deer will be something like the size of the x-ring on the Creedmoor target. How many of even the best BPTR shooters hit the x-ring on command? :-)
s
Chris.

Yes, and that is when you know it isn't 950 or 1050. A person is entitled to be crazy, and sticking cardboard deer out there at approximately known ranges is no more than eccentric. But trying to do that to a living animal is barbarous.

[Hannibal]

I Googled 'Iowa deer hunting rifle' and according to what I read, straight wall pistol cartridges are now allowed in rifles for deer hunting in Iowa.
I think the 45-70 is not going to be allowed in either case.

So it would seem the Iowa Deer Hunting @1000 yds post was intended to stir the pot.

[Lumpy grits]

OP-What alloy and bullet lube did you use?
What did you do for fouling control?
LG

[Silver Jack Hammer]

20/1 alloy, SPG lube, and a blow tube to moisten the fouling. Normally three (3) puffs with a blow tube does the trick but in the 100 degree climate I had to take a drink of water and blow 4 or 5 puffs.

[Lumpy grits]

I run 30:1, w/DGL and BT.
X2 on drinking plenty of water.
LG

[Silver Jack Hammer]

LG, Does 30:1 lead your bore? We shoot about 50 rounds per match, 30/1 was discussed as offerering greater accuracy but that accuracy would diminish by lead deposits during a match.

[Lumpy grits]

I get a small touch of lead from the .45-90(85gn of 'E' 2F with 540 gn PJ C'moor@1350fps)after shooting 50 rnds or so.
Nut'n a brass brush can't remove with ease.
LG

[Ballistics in Scotland]

What I replied was in response to the opening post, about the potential of the .45-70 for target shooting at long ranges. It doesn't have the ideal black powder capacity for driving the heavy, well-shaped bullet that is important for such applications. But the problems of fouling should be less than with those that do.

[BrentD]

Personally, I think the 70 is ideal for long range, but I shoot paper patches.

In most any match, fouling is rendered irrelevant by wiping between shots, which is pretty much required to be competitive today.

[Don McDowell]

There are a number of folks that run 45-70's in long range matches, and do quite well with it. Loaded properly it will get the job done on paper. There are also more than a few of dedicated bpcr/bptr shooters now moving to 16-1 alloy, and likeing the accuracy improvement. The original specs for the 45-70 was for a 16-1 alloy bullet.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I would suspect that some people who try a cartridge like the .45-70 at extreme ranges on game find their insight and sense of purpose running out at the 1886 Winchester bullet they conveniently have.

I say "game", but I don't much like the way some people think it is better when you do it to coyotes etc. At low velocities nothing is too small to get away when clipped at the edges by any size of bullet. I keep thinking of a friend's wild desert dog in Oman, who decided to be a house dog and learned the procedure as fast as any pet ever bred. They don't answer job ads to be a varmint.

[mac266]

I am sure he is just jerking our chains.

Certainly one of the dumber and most unnessecary laws in IA this year. But no one will kill a deer in IA at 500, much less 1000 yards. Won't happen.

I grew up there, and you're right. I never took a shot beyond 75 yards because of the terrain and thick timber!

[ascast]

pretty amusing thread -- I think there are 2 or3 pistols that come in 45-70. One was a revolver, 5 or 6 shots. Shoot and hold over. Whats the problem?

[Knarley]

pretty amusing thread -- I think there are 2 or3 pistols that come in 45-70. One was a revolver, 5 or 6 shots. Shoot and hold over. Whats the problem?

I talked to a guy a few years back, and he showed me a 45-70 Derringer............I saw it! Shook my head and walked away.

[woodbutcher]

:) Hi Knarly.Did the manufacturer supply a crowbar to extract it from you palm after firing?
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo