4" S&W Model 15, Lots of questions......

[Potsy]

I recently acquired a 4" Smith 15-3. I like the little pistol awfully well and plan on making it kind of a go-to kind of gun (carry under a jacket, trail gun, delivering the coup de grace to trapped hogs).
I've tried some Lee 158 RF's (I like the profile of this bullet a lot) on top of 4.2 grains of Unique. It seems a little anemic and speeds were sort of erratic over my chrony (from 620-750). I was planning on upping the next batch to 4.5, I don't really want to get into +P territory, but I want all I can get. I know it's a question with a LOT of variables, but how high can I go, either charge-wise OR velocity wise. Also, I have H-Universal and 2400 on hand if anyone has any good loads with either of those two.

Back to the 158 RF's, I love the profile and was thinking about a 6 cavity mold, but I HATE the bevel base, does anyone offer a reasonably priced service of removing the bevel base from Lee Molds?

I also have a Lyman 358129 on hand, been a while since I casted any with it, but I want to think it's a bit undersized (I remember a .358 sizer barely touches the sides) but if anyone has any good loads with the above powders for this bullet, I'd be glad to hear them.

I've never been wild about Smith's Magna grips, but the target models seem a bit too huge for this gun, especially for any kind of CC. Anyone have any opinions of the Tyler T grips? Do they install without drilling or altering the grip frame?

Lastly, leather. Looking for something belt carry, rides pretty high, strap or thumb break, maybe sort of a western look but practical. Thinking El Paso Saddlery 1920 or simply rugged 120? Opinions?

Thanks in advance!

[Outpost75]

Unique is better for full charge loads and does not burn as well when reduced. If you don't want +P a charge of 4.5-4.8 grains will approximate factory 158-grain velocity. A charge of 5.0 is not quite +P with 158 grain lead bullets, but will be with heavier bullets over 160 grains.

[Guesser]

I like 158 gr. over 3.5 gr. of Bullseye in my 15-3. B'eye is more uniform with a partial case fill than Unique; as said above bump Unique up a bit and it will serve well. My gun is 4".

[Mtnfolk75]

For the last 40 or so years, my go-to load for 4" K Frames has been 5.0 grains of Unique under a 158 grain LSWC using CCI-500 P-primers. I bump up to 5.5/5.8 when I want more power, has worked well for me for many 1,000's of rounds :Fire:

[Scharfschuetze]

I've never been wild about Smith's Magna grips, but the target models seem a bit too huge for this gun, especially for any kind of CC. Anyone have any opinions of the Tyler T grips? Do they install without drilling or altering the grip frame?

The Tyler T Grip is great if you can find one for a K Frame and one compliments the Magna grip nicely. I've generally used them on J frame revolvers where the small magna grip was mandatory for concealment purposes.

While in my police career, I often reduced the target grips to manageable size by reducing the diameter and rounding off the base of the grip significantly for double action shooting. I did that for a number of the officers during my tenure as one of the firearms training officers. The S&W target grips are the antithesis of a good double action grip as they were really designed for single action, one handed shooting back when that was popular at both police academies and the NRA bullseye courses of fire.

Here is a set of the modified grips on an older 32/20 3d Model Smith K Frame. I might add though, that unaltered original target grips are getting to be very expensive and a collector item.

[Outpost75]

Tyler Manufacturing is still in business and you can get T-grips configured for the old pre-WW2 S&Ws and Colts as well as the modern stuff. They don't do credit card or Internet sales, you will have to download the order form and mail it with a check the old fashioned way, but the quality is the same as ever, and I like them.

http://www.t-grips.com/

Featuring the full product line of Tyler T-Grip Adaptors Available in Aluminum or Bronze in a variety of finishes
For Smith & Wesson, Colt, Ruger, Rossi, and Taurus
__________________________________________________ __________________
FOR ORDERING, you may send in a personal check, postal money order, cashier's check, or bank money order to:

Tyler MFG
PO BOX 492
NEWALLA, OK 74857

PHONE NUMBER: 405-625-4992
Call, Leave a message, or text phone hours: M-F 1 PM to 5 PM CST
tylermfg@gmail.com

[Scharfschuetze]

Thanks for the info Outpost. I've been looking for a T Grip for my Colt Official Police revolver for quite a while.

[Uncle Jimbo]

The best load and most accurate load I found for my 15-3 is a lee 125 gr RF over 4 grs of Green Dot. But this is just my findings. Your experiences may vary.

[tazman]

I have a S&W 15 like yours and love it. I don't have or use any of the powders you mention. For full power 38 special loads, I use either Bullseye or CFE Pistol.
I get around 800fps with 3.5 of Bullseye and right at 900fps with 5.0 of CFE pistol. Neither of these is rated as +P. I get great accuracy with both loads. Both loads with 150-160 grain boolits.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I'll bet you'd like the Pachmayr Professional Gripper grips.

[Petrol & Powder]

Potsy-I've been loading and shooting 38 Special for many, many years. It's a great cartridge and the S&W model 15 is a great gun.

As for the Tyler "T-grip" adaptor, yes they are available, they work quite well and are easy to install (loosen the grips, slide the tabs under the grip panel and tighten the grips back up - done!).

Here's a model 10 with a Tyler T-grip :

201345

As for a good load with a 158gr bullet - there are dozens but I've always liked a 158gr SWC with somewhere between 4.1 and 4.4 grains of WW231. The 4.4 grain load is getting a little warm but shouldn't be in the +P range.

Most of my K-frames respond well to the 4.1 grain load of WW231 but I have one that likes the slightly hotter 4.4 load.

I'm in the process of working up a couple of loads with Bullseye and several members of this forum have been extremely helpful in that endeavor.



As for your holster question, there are a lot of good possibilities out there. A good pancake style holster will handle most duties. A pancake holster with a thumb break snap is useful if you're engaged in vigorous activity.
I'm a fan of Don Hume holsters. Galco makes some nice gear and there are countless others on the market.

Good Luck and enjoy that Model 15.

[condorjohn]

My favorite load is 140 HBWC and 700X. I found these grips at a gun show, no mfg marking. Fit me perfectly.201348

[Tracy]

I have a 4" M15, target hammer, target trigger, S&W finger groove Goncalo Alves grips. Love it, and have had it for 25+ years. I'll throw in another vote for 5 grains of Unique for a powerful load that is not quite +P.
And, I don't think you're gonna find a more perfect holster for that revolver than an El Paso Saddlery 1920 Tom Threepersons.

[Potsy]

Thanks for all the replies!!!!
Pretty much thinking at this point bumping up a 1/2 grain of Unique would cure what ails things in that department.
Got to thinking how much I like my Galco Pancake holster for my Kimber, so now I'm thinking El Paso Saddlery #77 Tortilla. Maybe get a little nuts and get the basket weave stamping.
I'll probably roll either a set of Altamont Targets or a pretty set of Altamont Magna style with a Tyler T grip.
I've no doubt the Pachmayrs feel wonderful, but I just can't like the look of Pachmayrs on a blued gun (stainless doesn't seem to offend my discriminating senses nearly so bad:)).
Honestly, I was never a .38 Special fan. I've had a Detective Special that my Grandad gave me a long time ago. It shoots very well for a snub. But the feel of this 15 (even with magnas) and a single action pull like a varmint rifle (don't think I've even shot it double action), has me hooked.

[tazman]

That trigger is the reason the K frame Smith has been such a winner at the target range.

[Petrol & Powder]

The El Paso #77 is a fine all-around holster. It is a high ride design, it covers the entire barrel and trigger guard and holds the gun close to the body. The high & tight design makes the gun easy to carry (particularly concealed) but more difficult to draw from (the gun must be pulled higher to clear the holster). For protecting and concealing the gun, it's probably about as good as you can get.
The Tom Threepersons style holster is a more traditional design but not one of my personal favorites. It utilizes a strap over the hammer instead of a thumb break snap, the trigger guard is exposed and it doesn't protect the rear sight as well as some other designs. It is functional and very traditional in appearance.

Some of the Galco pancake style holsters are cut away on the front which assists with the draw but exposes the rear sight.
I've never had a bad Don Hume holster and I think you can still get the "Double-nine" [H721] holster for a K-frame.
Bell Charter Oak made a great speed scabbard that covered the rear sight and hammer spur but dispensed with the thumb break in exchange for higher leather around the hammer/rear sight. It was very fast and secure but unfortunately, it's no longer offered.


There are unlimited variations in holsters and OP will have no problem finding what he wants if he defines his desires first.

I agree with the OP, Pachmayr grips will work fine but just don't look quite right on a blued revolver :-|
The easiest solution is a Tyler T-grip but like holster, but there are plenty of options. The cut down target grips shown in post #5 look VERY practical (nicely done Scharfschuetze !). Altamont or Eagle grips would be another option.

Those model 15's can SHOOT !
The OP has a great gun.

[oldhenry]

My 1st. center fire handgun was a 4" M15 (back then I believe the 4" was the only choice......'61). I paid a whopping $79.00 for it new..........I should have bought a dozen. Also back then I called it the Combat Masterpiece. Probably the slickest handgun I've ever owned. In the '60s (and now) heavy bullets were my favorite. Then 3.0 & 3.5 gr. Bullseye with the Lyman #358156 & #358429 was what I shot. Later I changed to PB but since I can't find a published load for that powder now, I'll not list it here. Now I use 4.0-4.5 of HP-38/231 with the #358429.

I gave that gun to my younger son about 10 years ago...........it's his favorite gun now. I feel good that a special gun went to a fine man who is special in so many ways.

Henry

[Petrol & Powder]

Henry, I'm digging that old vertical twin motorcycle from your avatar !

[Thumbcocker]

In 61 $79 was serious coin.

[bouncer50]

In 61 $79 was serious coin. In 2017 dollars today would be 640.04 dollars. That still a lot of money still today.

[9.3X62AL]

I am very fond of neoprene replacement or OEM grips on my carry guns. They possibly saved my life one fine evening when a client elected to relieve me of my sidearm by grasping and pulling aside the outer half of my issued Bianchi breakfront duty holster. I got my right/strong-side hand around the grip before he could, and my left knee to his solar plexus disincentivized him from further silliness. First day of use of that nice, new holster--and he destroyed it. Sprung the rentention system completely. I had the old former holster still inside my locker, so after lodging my miscreant in the Graybar Hilton I re-fit the old scabbard onto the Sam Browne and kept on using it until we shifted to bottom-feeders from the roller-guns in 1987. And I still have that old scabbard. I still use Hogue and Pachmayr neoprene aftermarket grips, too.

[texasnative46]

oldhenry,

By 1972, when I bought a Model 15, GEORGE F CAKE COMPANY in Dallas charged me 103.oo for a 4" revolver. = That was the price for sworn peace officers only, btw.
(By the time that I bought a Model 15 for duty carry, the stainless steel Model 67 was 133.oo. Also, by that time the Model 15/67 was available in 2" & 4".)

yours, tex

[oldhenry]

Henry, I'm digging that old vertical twin motorcycle from your avatar !

Thanks,
Actually it's a single: 500cc. It's a '79 Yamaha SR500 that I attempted to convert into a Brit style roadster. It's similar to a BSA Gold Star except it's easy to crank & the headlamp works..........Oh!.....it also doesn't leak oil.

I'm addicted to 500 singles (I have 2 more SR500.....they're '78 models). I'm now in the final stages of a Honda GB500 restoration.

Henry
__________________________________________________ ________________________________________
A real sport involves either gasoline or gunpowder.......everything else is just a game

[oldhenry]

In 61 $79 was serious coin.

Especially if you're making $50.00 a week.

[MT Gianni]

There are no flies on a good wadcutter and 3.0 gr of Bullseye either. As far as removing the bevels i would save my money for a NOE or Accurate mold. There is a large difference in quality, IMO.

[Petrol & Powder]

Thanks,
Actually it's a single: 500cc. It's a '79 Yamaha SR500 that I attempted to convert into a Brit style roadster. It's similar to a BSA Gold Star except it's easy to crank & the headlamp works..........Oh!.....it also doesn't leak oil.

I'm addicted to 500 singles (I have 2 more SR500.....they're '78 models). I'm now in the final stages of a Honda GB500 restoration.

Henry
__________________________________________________ ________________________________________
A real sport involves either gasoline or gunpowder.......everything else is just a game

Ah, I could only see one side and assumed it was a twin. Fun ride. Light, nimble and quick.

And - "A real sport involves either gasoline or gunpowder......everything else is just a game" ; Seems like that should be my tagline
signed - Petrol & Powder

[oldhenry]

Ah, I could only see one side and assumed it was a twin. Fun ride. Light, nimble and quick.

And - "A real sport involves either gasoline or gunpowder......everything else is just a game" ; Seems like that should be my tagline
signed - Petrol & Powder

Actually that tag line was originally "stolen' from E. Hemingway: the difference being that E.H. held out bull fighting & auto racing as the only real sport. I borrowed it from my target pulling partner @ Ft. Benning. Like me he shot NRA High Power & rode a bike. He was quite a character (also a Master Class shooter):.......we referred to him as the poet laureate of Easley Range.

Regards,
Henry

[Tim357]

For the last 40 or so years, my go-to load for 4" K Frames has been 5.0 grains of Unique under a 158 grain LSWC using CCI-500 P-primers. I bump up to 5.5/5.8 when I want more power, has worked well for me for many 1,000's of rounds :Fire:
This^^^^^

[9.3X62AL]

Yessir. 5.0 grains of Unique under #358477 or #358429 does some fine work. The heavier "429" bullet might be edging things toward the "+P" scale a bit, but a post-war K-frame or Official Police can absorb them without strain. The 429/5.0 load is the pet load for my 1949 Colt OMT x 6", and it accounts for LOTS of varmints. It does almost as well from an early 60s Model 10 x 5", a service-grade wheelgun with the nicest factory action on a S&W product I have ever run.

[Texas by God]

I've owned 3 Combat Masterpieces- raising kids sent the first two away but I still have one and my wife has the stainless version. You can't convince me that ANY other revolver is better. It's kind of amusing- she has Magna grips on hers and I have old HE grips on mine and we both like what we have. Her hands are 2/3 the size of mine. She prefers 158 swcs at 800 fps and nothing else; I'm flavor of the week guy- 105 swc @1000 fps at present.
Best, Thomas.

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[Petrol & Powder]

For about as long as I've been involved with firearms, I've had some type of S&W K-frame. There's just something incredible about that design. A 3" -4" K-frame chambered in 38 Special is a remarked tool.

[rintinglen]

back when I was transitioning from short to long pants, they used to call that Model 15 the "Combat Masterpiece." I believe they were not lying. I've had three over the years, but am amazed at present to find that my safe is lacking a representative sample, though I do have a pair of M-14"s. You can spend more and you might spend less, but you are hard pressed to buy better. If I was restricted to a single handgun, an M-15 would do me just fine.

[jetinteriorguy]

I have a Model 15, Model 14, and a Model 67 and they are absolutely amazing guns. To me in a .38 sp they are absolute perfection. I shoot all three all the time and all they do is make me smile and look like a much better shot than I really am.

[Drm50]

I've only got one 15, had it for 40yrs, shoot cast 158 RN/ 5.5gr Unique, not +P but juicy. The gun
loves this load or I would back her down some. I have small hands and S&W Targets are two big
for me for one hand shooting. I went T-Grip route which was better, but went to Herret and Sile
grips that aren't as thick a S&W but have about the same contor for filling out behind trigger guard. For K frame S&W there is many grip options as well as holsters. So happens I have a
El Paso - 3person that I like very much when carrying gun on right side. I like to carry pistols hi
on my Left side. It keeps it out of the way and is easy to reach. I like trigger exposed and open
slot for back sight, also thumb break. Nobody sold one so I modified a plain thumb break with a
Exacto knife. Put a wooden dowel in hi speed grinder and burnished the cut edges, cut no stitches
so it looks factory. My finger is on trigger and thumb on snap when I reach for it, no chance of
fumble. It's a DA revolver it's not going off unless you pull the trigger, I never shoot DA anyway.
For CCW the pancake type is probably the best.

[Lloyd Smale]

give the lee 105 a try. its been accurate in all my k frames.

[Texas by God]

give the lee 105 a try. its been accurate in all my k frames.I'm using that bullet now. I bought the mould here on S&S and I'm very happy with it.

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[kungfustyle]

Hello, If I read correctly or Lyman drops to small? Bump up to Lyman #2 or powder coat and you can add .002 to the diameter. Just a thought.