Broken Die

[nonferrous]

The carbide sizing ring parted from my Lyman sizing die while loading some .44 mag. It could be a shrink fit or silver soldered, there are no pins, threads or any obvious way to hold it in.
I have never seen this before, is this common, or fixable, or just part of doing business?
Thanks

[EDG]

I have 2 Lyman carbide dies. Both are still intact. It appears they were made by pressing the ring into the die and then the lip of the die was crimped over the carbide ring.

If brazed you should see brazing alloy on the back of the carbide ring.

The easiest fix that I know to try would be to clean out the die and the ring. Reassemble with Loctite and see if it will hold.


The carbide sizing ring parted from my Lyman sizing die while loading some .44 mag. It could be a shrink fit or silver soldered, there are no pins, threads or any obvious way to hold it in.
I have never seen this before, is this common, or fixable, or just part of doing business?
Thanks

[nonferrous]

Thanks,
I noticed a few galling marks on a few casings before it happened, may have gotten some grit in the die somehow.
Thanks, again.

[mdhillbilly1]

The carbide sizing ring parted from my Lyman sizing die while loading some .44 mag. It could be a shrink fit or silver soldered, there are no pins, threads or any obvious way to hold it in.
I have never seen this before, is this common, or fixable, or just part of doing business?
Thanks
Try these if you must replace them.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1165122900/hornady-custom-grade-new-dimension-nitride-3-die-set

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[skeettx]

Call Lyman, tell then the sizing ring released and ask for a new sizing die, offer to send the old one back if needed.

Mike

[ReloaderFred]

Grit doesn't imbed into carbide. What you got was some galling, or rather brass sticking to the carbide and probably causing more friction than usual. You can press that carbide ring back in after putting a dab of Super Glue in the recess.

After it sets up, then polish the carbide ring with a swab mounted in a cordless drill that fits snug, and has a coating of either Flitz Metal Polish, or J-B Bore Cleaner on it. I make them with a piece of rag cut from an old T-shirt.

I've had two carbide sizing rings pull out of die bodies, one Redding and one Lyman. I fixed them both myself.

I also lightly lube large handgun cases with a spritz of case lube, which makes it so much easier to size .44 Magnum and .45 Colt cases. Be careful though, since the first lubed case you run through might throw your shoulder out...........

Hope this helps.

Fred

[mdhillbilly1]

Grit doesn't imbed into carbide. What you got was some galling, or rather brass sticking to the carbide and probably causing more friction than usual. You can press that carbide ring back in after putting a dab of Super Glue in the recess.

After it sets up, then polish the carbide ring with a swab mounted in a cordless drill that fits snug, and has a coating of either Flitz Metal Polish, or J-B Bore Cleaner on it. I make them with a piece of rag cut from an old T-shirt.

I've had two carbide sizing rings pull out of die bodies, one Redding and one Lyman. I fixed them both myself.

I also lightly lube large handgun cases with a spritz of case lube, which makes it so much easier to size .44 Magnum and .45 Colt cases. Be careful though, since the first lubed case you run through might throw your shoulder out...........

Hope this helps.

Fred
I was told that the Hornady Custom Nitride Dies that you do not have to lube the Nitride Dies. I am new to the Hobby. I just obtained the dies and wanted to get others opinions on the matter.

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[William Yanda]

"do not HAVE to" is correct. Many have reported that a minimum of lube makes it easier. Must not or do not lube is an incorrect interpretation of the instructions.

[EDG]

If you have brass galled to the inside of the die it can be polished out with with a fine grit 400 or higher silicon carbide paper which will not touch the carbide ring. Or you can submerge the ring in Hoppe's #9 over night and it will dissolve the brass.
In the future wash your brass to get any grit off. Clean brass goes through the die easier and is less likely to gall. Even better is to put a tiny bit of lube on every 4th or 5th case to keep the friction force and galling minimized.


Thanks,
I noticed a few galling marks on a few casings before it happened, may have gotten some grit in the die somehow.
Thanks, again.

[nonferrous]

Thanks to all, I should have thought of the lube myself, I have loaded 1000's of .38 spl with no problem but the .44 is a different animal I guess. I tumble in walnut and they feel smooth and clean, maybe I should be washing as well.
Thanks again.

[country gent]

The carbides rings can be a press fit, a shrink fit, or crimped in. Brazed or silver solder could be used but would require things to be cleaned up again after soldering and might show as a heat ring on the end. If shrunk or press in place silver solder might not be able to get into the joint as there is no room for it to flow in in the interference fit. I don't recall seeing a crimped in one but could be. I'm leaning towards a shrink fit ( ring cooled die heated and set together) as carbide is very brittle and a straight press would break some of them.

[mdhillbilly1]

"do not HAVE to" is correct. Many have reported that a minimum of lube makes it easier. Must not or do not lube is an incorrect interpretation of the instructions.
Thank you

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[gwpercle]

I repaired some old 45 acp dies by coating the recess with a little epoxy , pressing the ring back in place and crimping the edge back in place.
And a little lube really helps things !
I fixed that die back in the 1970's and it has never pulled out again therefore I'm still using them!
Gary

[David2011]

Green Loctite will do a far better job than "Super Glue" or epoxy. Cyanoacrilates (all super glues) are very brittle. Epoxies will only hold onto carbide if it's roughened. Sounds like the adhered brass is the root of the problem.

[nonferrous]

Thanks,
Tried to open up the die and spread the crimp, but with all the sockets I have to use as a punch, can only come within .005 one way or the other. Chilled the carbide ring in the freezer and it shrunk .003, I have another source for sockets and will find what I need.
Meanwhile I ordered a new Die set, but this is a challenge now. It's almost enough to wish I was still working so I could get at a lathe and make a spreader punch.
Anyway, Thanks for the help and the info on Epoxy.

[country gent]

Freeze the carbide ring and heat the end of the die Your carbide ring shrank .003 ( that sounds like a lot for that size piece of carbide though) and the warmed heated end of the die should expand a couple thousandths also possibly giving you what you need. On small parts we put the inserts in a big cup if crushed ice to keep them cold and stable while heating the outer parts for expansion. Put them in a small plastic bag and into the finely crushed ice then when outer is hot and expanded drop together and allow to cool. Our industrial freezer was at 60 below zero so it got a lot colder than home units did for this work.

[375supermag]

Hi...
I find this all very interesting.
FWIW, I have loaded tens of thousands of handgun rounds using carbide dies and have never lubed a single case.
I am kind of anal about making sure my cases are very clean. I have spent many evenings in front of the TV with a bucket of tumbled brass using a clean rag to wipe any tumbling residue from the brass.

Lately, I have taken to washing tumbled brass in a mixture of Lemi-shine, Dawn dishwashing liquid and boiling hot water. I air dry them under the ceiling fan...in nice weather I spread them out on a towel on the deck to dry.

After all these many years of reloading, I have never damaged any carbide dies. The worst I have ever done was bend one decapping pin a couple of years ago.
I am still using the same RCBS carbide re-sizing die for .357Magnum that I bought 35 years ago or so. It has been used to re-size at least 10K cases with nary a touch of lube ever. I do clean it every so often with GunScrubber and then lightly oil it. No particular schedule or round count or anything like that...just whenever the mood strikes me. I have several .357Mag bullet seating dies set up permanently for various bullet types but the only ones of them that I ever clean are the ones set up for cast bullets. The ones set up for jacketed bullets have never been cleaned...all I ever do to them is wipe them down and lightly oil them.

The rest of my handgun reloading dies are treated much the same and all are still working fine after many thousands of rounds reloaded.

[country gent]

I think a Hard bump or pre load between shell holder ansd die is harder on the ring than no lube or even grit. The constant bump every stroke is working that ring and dies end every time and while not enough to hit it quickly the cumulation of years of this heavy bump may work it loose. The other issue would be a die with the ring slightly proud or a domed shell holder that bears on the ring it self. The ring is a narrow surface and smooth so there is only the press and possibly crimp to hold bumping heavy will slowly loosen this joint.

[troyboy]

Liquid nitrogen or dry ice is far more effective then frozen water. That being said, just call Lyman as I would think this would be a warranty issue.

[nonferrous]

I guess the shrinkage was more like .002. I concur on the .38's, I have been using same set of dies for 30-40 years, no problems with them, probably twice the surface area with the .44's. I am sure that a bump from the shell holder with every stroke would really be an issue and should be avoided. I called Lyman and they offered to replace it for 42.00. Bought a set of Lee Carbide just to compare. Also, they are almost free.
I am going to use a little case lube from now on with the .44's, just to be safe. I did notice the pressure building on the stroke with the last few just before parting.
Thanks again