Casting for 9mm Browning Hi-Power

[Chris C]

I'm interested in casting a bullet for my Hi-Power. I'm wanting it for general shooting, i.e. plinking and light target work. First off, is this a good bullet choice for my end use? I finally decided the Lyman #356402 looks like something I'd like to try.................but there seems to be a problem. Figured it would be smart to purchase some bullets commercially before buying the mold. The only picture of the bullet from Lyman I can find is this one:

196631




But even though Matt's Bullets "claims" they cast one from that mold, it doesn't look like this picture. I'm wanting the sharp shoulder to cut a clean hole in targets, much like a SWC does.

Does anyone on the forum have this particular mold.............and does the cast bullet actually look like the picture, or has Lyman changed their mold. (I ask here because I wrote Lyman last Friday and still haven't heard back from them)

[Lagamor]

Can't speak for Lyman, but I have a similar MP mold and it doesn't cut clean wadcutter type holes.
It's not bad, but it rips paper somewhat.

[beagle]

It has been my experience that the original Lyman design had a small driving band that cut clean holes. Several newer ones I have examined have the body tapering to and blending in with the ogive with no shoulder. Look for an older mould and you'll find what you want. They're common. Shouldn't be hard to find. BTW, that's an excellent bullet for the HP. I have two HPs that I feed and it feeds and shoots them really well./beagle

[Chris C]

Thanks, beagle..............your entire post is exactly my problem. But believe me, the actual bullet IS hard to find. Most every commercial caster has the TC that blends into the outer diameter of the bullet with no shoulder. I can't tell from any of the pictures on the internet if the molds have the shoulder like the one in the picture. And, like I said, Lyman hasn't answered my query.

[Chris C]

Okay, Lyman just got back with me and their mould no longer has the sharp shoulder like the picture in their catalog. ????? You'd think they'd change the picture. The new one looks like everyone elses TC bullet.

196632

So I'm still looking for the older mould, I guess. Wish me luck!

[gwpercle]

NOE makes moulds with the sharp shoulder you are looking for. The #358-124-TC is the one I have (except mine is a gas checked mould) works well in several 9 mm's. 124 grain truncated cone. It does cut nice clean holes and I like it .

They sell two others that are sharp shouldered. #358-128-SWC-BB and #358-128-SWC-PB .
Both of these are based on the H&G #275 , one is a bevel base , the other a plain base. Both have the sharp shoulders and the nose looks like a truncated cone to me but it's listed as SWC ?

I don't have a Hi-Power but my Walther P-38 and three other 9 mm's feed, fire and eject them just fine.

For the price Lyman sell moulds for and considering their quality of late....just order an NOE....they are so sweet to use . Noe's will spoil you.

Gary

[Gee_Wizz01]

I have a Lyman that is almost 40 years old and it does not have the shoulder. The meplat cuts a nice round hole. I also bought the Lee 6 cavity 120gr TC simply to increase production rate. The Lee mould casts boolits that is shoots just as well as the Lyman. Both shoot very accurate in my Hi Power, Ruger P89, Wather P-38, Luger P-08 and 9mm AR15.
Also, you can't go wrong with NOE' S molds. They are first class and JOE's service is the best.

Sent from my SM-J700T using Tapatalk

[EMC45]

I shoot a Lee TC bullet that looks like the above photo sized to .358 in my Belg./Port. Mk3 BHP. They do very well.

[Ed_Shot]

The Lyman 356402 as shown in your picture is a superb 9MM boolit and it has been in production for a very long time for that simple reason. Mine is an outstanding performer in BHP, CZ 75B, and several Glocks (w/LW barrels). That said, mine is an older mold and casts .359. You will be disappointed if you buy a new mold "from anybody" and it casts undersized boolits. I agree that you will not be disappointed with either an NOE or Accurate mold.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

SNIP...
I'm wanting the sharp shoulder to cut a clean hole in targets, much like a SWC does.


I have the NOE 358-128-SWC
To be honest, I haven't paid attention to see if the holes in paper are cleaner than the Lee 356-120-TC boolits that I cast. but there certainly is a shoulder on the NOE, be it a small one.

I don't have any unloaded examples handy, but here are some NOE SWC loaded in 9mm cases.

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/NOE%20358%20128%20SWC%20loaded%20in%209mm%20cases_ zpsznz8a25f.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/NOE%20358%20128%20SWC%20loaded%20in%209mm%20cases_ zpsznz8a25f.jpg.html)

These drop about .359 or so, I size them to .357 for 9mm.
The driving band is surely sized and square, even though the optical illusion of the photo makes it look like the driving band is tapered.

[Gamsek]

I have two MP Molds, first is 132grs SWC, copy of H&G #275https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170531/efd1757a4977de16d2d41b64f9110897.jpg
Makes holes like this...https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170531/0a152cf71dc131f82966960aca71a4b4.jpg
Second is very interesting 135grs RNSWC, I get 142grs with pure leadhttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170531/48b09eb2e4b0a0c4fefd0dbe990b5129.jpg
makes holes like this
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170531/455ad4b19535d2ff7f2c7bcf6a0fd8af.jpg

Hope it can help a bit, since first is similar to what you look for...

[wbrco]

Can't tell you what works from a TC/SWC perspective, but I can tell you 2 other items that may be of interest.

1. The Lee 124 RN TL will not shoot worth a darn. You can't get it big enough and with enough bearing surface, even after leementing and beagling (thanks @beagle!). My HP slugs at .3572.

2. The Lee 358 125 RF shoots quite well. Seat to the crimp groove. I used 6.3gr of HS-6. Please use your own judgment on powder selection and charge.

Fwiw I tumble lube with 45/45/10.

[Guesser]

I use the 356402, no shoulder and an old Ohaus 115 gr. design in my early 1990's High power. Accuracy is good and I don't worry about clean holes in paper; after all neither the 9MM or the High Power are know as target/competition items. if I want clean holes I shoot HBWC in 38 Special.

[Beerd]

you could try the Lee 358-105 SWC.
196674
it's the one on the left.
..

[RoadBike]

For a commercially cast bullet, try Dardas. dardascastbullets.com.

He produces a 126gr lead semi wadcutter and you choose the size you want, 0.356, 0.357, or 0.358. I ordered some in 0.357, and they worked in my two 9mm pistols.

Based on the results, I ordered the NOE 358-128-SWC plain base. I have not yet cast with this mold.

[Bullwolf]

I've shot the Lyman 356402 some in the 9mm. My 356402 mould is from the late 1980's to early 90's. I never really warmed up to it in 9mm, as much as the Lee TL356-124-2R 124 grain tumble lube mould. I prefer to tumble lubing rather than lube-size, and I just never felt right about the truncated cone boolit in smaller 9mm cases.

I was using Lyman Orange Magic lube with the 356402, and lube sizing it to .358 diameter. My 356402 mould will also cast larger than .356 diameter, using my Mono mix alloy. (.358-.359)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52370&d=1304738207

The majority of my 9mm Lyman Truncated Cone boolits have been fired from my Beretta 92FS. I don't believe I've tried more than a hand full of them in my old Hi-Power.

I actually liked the Lyman 356402 better in 38 Special, than in the 9mm, as a 120-125 grain lead saving plinker cast boolit. (Rather than the 160grain Lyman 358311)

I tumble lubed both in 38 Special, using 45-45-10.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=121601&d=1415769058

Until I somewhat recently discovered the Lee 358-125-RF boolit, and BLL, Both of which have somewhat replaced the Lyman 356302 for me in 125 grain 38 Special practice loads.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=122187&d=1416370345

Wish I'd purchased a 6 cavity version of the Lee 358-125-RF now.






Guess I must be the odd man out, because my older Belgian Browning Hi-Power is extremely accurate with the Lee TL356-124-2R boolit. The 124 grain 2R boolit has been my go to selection for the Hi-Power, with a simple tumble lube in Alox and a published charge of Unique.

My Lee TL356-124-2R mould will cast as large as .359 from my Mono-type & wheel weight alloy mix. I size the 9mm to .358 for my Browning Hi-Power. My Hi-Power is disturbingly accurate with that boolit combination, especially when fired from a rest.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52362&d=1304661284

My CZ-75 clone also shoots the same Lee TL356-124-2R boolit and Unique combination extremely well, either tumble lubed, or coated.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52572&d=1311909465

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52610&d=1313305073

Unlike the others, I've not yet tried the 38 caliber Lee 358-125-RF revolver boolit in 9mm.

http://www.titanreloading.com/image/cache/data/Products/90574-250x250.jpg

Figure what I'm doing is working well, so why should I "fix" it.


- Bullwolf

[David2011]

Bullwolf, that Lee RF is a nice boolit. I had to work on the mold to get it to give up the boolits. It's better but still needs some tweaking. Love to shoot it, though. I have a pair of the Lyman 356402 two cavity molds that are 30 years or more old but have never used one of them and only a few hundred out of the other. Gotta try them in my Belgian HP.

[hermans]

I use the 130gr SWC from MP Molds, a copy of the H&G #275, as in Gamsek's first photo. It cuts perfectly round holes with amazing sharp edges, and because of the nice long bearing surface, it is super accurate.

[wbrco]

I've shot the Lyman 356402 some in the 9mm. My 356402 mould is from the late 1980's to early 90's. I never really warmed up to it in 9mm, as much as the Lee TL356-124-2R 124 grain tumble lube mould. I prefer to tumble lubing rather than lube-size, and I just never felt right about the truncated cone boolit in smaller 9mm cases.

I was using Lyman Orange Magic lube with the 356402, and lube sizing it to .358 diameter. My 356402 mould will also cast larger than .356 diameter, using my Mono mix alloy. (.358-.359)

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52370&d=1304738207

The majority of my 9mm Lyman Truncated Cone boolits have been fired from my Beretta 92FS. I don't believe I've tried more than a hand full of them in my old Hi-Power.

I actually liked the Lyman 356402 better in 38 Special, than in the 9mm, as a 120-125 grain lead saving plinker cast boolit. (Rather than the 160grain Lyman 358311)

I tumble lubed both in 38 Special, using 45-45-10.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=121601&d=1415769058

Until I somewhat recently discovered the Lee 358-125-RF boolit, and BLL, Both of which have somewhat replaced the Lyman 356302 for me in 125 grain 38 Special practice loads.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=122187&d=1416370345

Wish I'd purchased a 6 cavity version of the Lee 358-125-RF now.






Guess I must be the odd man out, because my older Belgian Browning Hi-Power is extremely accurate with the Lee TL356-124-2R boolit. The 124 grain 2R boolit has been my go to selection for the Hi-Power, with a simple tumble lube in Alox and a published charge of Unique.

My Lee TL356-124-2R mould will cast as large as .359 from my Mono-type & wheel weight alloy mix. I size the 9mm to .358 for my Browning Hi-Power. My Hi-Power is disturbingly accurate with that boolit combination, especially when fired from a rest.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52362&d=1304661284

My CZ-75 clone also shoots the same Lee TL356-124-2R boolit and Unique combination extremely well, either tumble lubed, or coated.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52572&d=1311909465

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52610&d=1313305073

Unlike the others, I've not yet tried the 38 caliber Lee 358-125-RF revolver boolit in 9mm.

http://www.titanreloading.com/image/cache/data/Products/90574-250x250.jpg

Figure what I'm doing is working well, so why should I "fix" it.


- Bullwolf
Bullwolf - what does your HP slug out at? As I indicated, my Belgian MKIII slugs big and the Lee TL is just all over the place for me. I use COWW with some tin added.

[EMC45]

Great posts and pics!

[wbrco]

I
Guess I must be the odd man out, because my older Belgian Browning Hi-Power is extremely accurate with the Lee TL356-124-2R boolit. The 124 grain 2R boolit has been my go to selection for the Hi-Power, with a simple tumble lube in Alox and a published charge of Unique.

My Lee TL356-124-2R mould will cast as large as .359 from my Mono-type & wheel weight alloy mix. I size the 9mm to .358 for my Browning Hi-Power. My Hi-Power is disturbingly accurate with that boolit combination, especially when fired from a rest.


- Bullwolf

Ahh, harder alloy = larger bullet. Hardest I have is COWW.

Don't need anything harder, and the couple of loads that could go harder is on a 358156, so I just GC.

Maybe when I start loading my 358429 towards the upper end I'll have to get some harder alloy.

[wbrco]

Lee 125 RF in 9mm.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170602/cf6124899b31cb75c4e023b218bf1738.jpg

[Bullwolf]

Bullwolf - what does your HP slug out at? As I indicated, my Belgian MKIII slugs big and the Lee TL is just all over the place for me. I use COWW with some tin added.

I have never slugged my Hi-Power barrel.

My Hi-Power was one of the first 9mm's that I started casting for. At the time I was originally tumble lubing 9mm boolits in Alox at the "as cast" diameter, and then loading them when they dried.

My Hi-power will readily accept 9mm boolits as large as .359 (but not .360+)

Unfortunately every once in a while a too fat boolit would slip past me, and be a nuisance - Likely the result from me holding and squeezing the mould handles and the sprue cutter at the same time on the Lee 6 cavity mould.

Somewhere around there, I started sizing all of my cast boolits at .358 (and using a case gauge) for consistency sake. It's embarrassing to tie up a pistol while shooting, when you unexpectedly encounter an oversize boolit that won't reliably chamber.

I originally went with .358 sizing mainly because I had a Lyman .358 sizer die already for 38 Caliber, so I went with it. I had previously loaded 38 caliber jacketed boolits in the 9mm Luger with great success, so I wasn't worried about a few thousandths over .355 causing me any problems.

This was before the Internet existed, and all of this wasn't really spelled out in the somewhat dated Speer reloading manual that came with my RCBS reloading press, or the RCBS cast bullet manual #1 (which shows loads tested at .356) that I'd also purchased separately, and worked my loads up using.

I had not yet encountered one of the excellent Lyman cast load manuals at the local gun store. I did run into Dean A. Grennell's most excellent ABC's of reloading (5th edition) which I immediately purchased after spotting it at the store. Back then the majority of my reloading information came from books, manuals, or gun magazines.

After checking a few of my 9mm "as cast" boolits with a micrometer, .358 seemed like a good all around size to go with since they both fit in my Hi-Power and shot well.

I believe now that starting off at .358 had a LOT to do with my early success when it came to casting for the 9mm. Using an overly hard Tin rich alloy (my recycled print shop mono-type letters) that also cast on the larger side of things probably contributed to the rest of my success shooting the somewhat delicate Lee microband TL boolits.



- Bullwolf

[Bullwolf]

The Lee 125 RF really looks sharp in a 9mm case. One more thing I'm going to have to try now.


Lee 125 RF in 9mm.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170602/cf6124899b31cb75c4e023b218bf1738.jpg



- Bullwolf

[EMC45]

I have the 125RF Lee. I don't think I've ever even heated it up yet....I need to try it.

[Chris C]

Much appreciated. Lots of really good information, links and comments. Helping me a lot in my decision.

[Beerd]

The Lee 125 RF really looks sharp in a 9mm case. One more thing I'm going to have to try now.
- Bullwolf

Yes,

but............I............don't..............nee d...............another...............mould.
..

[georgewxxx]

That 356402 was first cataloged in 1929 by Ideal, the forerunner of Lyman, in their #29 handbook. The picture on page 81 of the 1929 catalog looks like the current mould pictures. I've got a 1950's vintage hollow point and a 1960's solid and identical on the shoulder. I've fired both in 9mm Luger, .38 Super guns without a hitch of any kind. They also do well in .38 specials.

[MaryB]

I have had good results with the Lee 120 TC others have mentioned. Shoot as cast in my HiPoint(quit laughing, it is my most reliable pistol) tumble lubed.

[winelover]

My HP gets fed, either the RCBS 125 RNGC or the Lyman 120TC.......with the higher end book loadings of either Unique or Bullseye.

Recently purchased NOE's 359-115-RF (PB)(RG4) for use in 9mm and 357 magnum. When I made some 9mm dummy cartridges (COAL of 1.1") they wouldn't pass the "plunk test", for either my HP or Beretta Nano. I really didn't want to seat the bullet, any deeper due to increased pressures and the fact that I had feeding issues with COAl's under 1.1" in the Browning. I'd like to load my ammo so it can be used in both nines, interchangeably.

Winelover