Heavy 9mm success! 158 grain SWC.

[Thekid]

A couple months ago I decided to see if I could load up some heavy 9mm... so I gathered a bunch of data from articles, forums, and online load data. When I decided it may be possible I took a few lee 158 grain tumble lube semi wadcutters I had powder coated and sized them to .356.... I then seated a few in unprimed cases so I could determine if I could get them to chamber and work in my magazines. I finally settled on an OAL of 1.09. I chose a charge of 3.5 grains of unique. Now fast forward to my latest range trip I tested them in my gen 4 Glock 19 with factory barrel.... and they fed and functioned great!

[corbinace]

Very interesting. I was just searching the forum and web for data last night and today. Pondering a Palmetto AR in 9mm for Glock magazines.

Some were saying no to Unique, how did you arrive there?

How about sound level in your compact?

Details man:kidding:

[Thekid]

As far as choosing Unique I was a little afraid of getting into no actual load data with a faster powder like hp38, and I had hs6 around as well but it always seems to have more recoil then other powders I have. Then I found one load online someone else had posted that their starting load was 3.5 of unique with a 158 grain bullet, that and my main plinking load is a lee 120 tc over 4.5 grains of Unique. As far a sound level I'm half tempted to shoot a couple without ear pro because they where actually really quiet.

[tazman]

If you get a chance, run that load over a chronograph. I would like to know what it was doing speed wise.

[Thekid]

I do need a chronograph! But am on a strict budget as we are trying to buy a house right now... hopefully soon though!

[ioon44]

The Lyman #45 loading manual list 9 mm rifle loads for 158 gr cast bullets.
I use Bullseye for my Hi-Tek coated 158 gr RN in my RRA 9 mm, very quite and soft recoil but I still would not want to shoot it with out hearing protection.
This load works great in my 4" PPQ, sorta like having a 17 shot .38 SPL.

[HATCH]

wonder what the velocity is with your heavy 9mm rounds

[dverna]

There was interesting work done with Blue Dot and I bought some for load development with a Sub-2000. I would up selling the Kel-Tec as my GF could not operate the bolt so I never did any testing. If I find the data I will post it later.

[arlon]

What is the accuracy like with these longer bullets? I have that mold and a few 9mms. Never really considered it for use in the 9mm. One of my 9mm was a 356tsw and only liked 147 grain ammo and I've wanted to try some heavier bullets in it's other 9x19 barrel. I'll try to keep an eye on this post to see how it holds up.

[lotech]

I haven't chronographed a 158 SWC, but chronographed a 157 grain Lyman #356637 (ww alloy) years ago. The bullet was undersize and shot poorly with any load. With 3.5 grains Unique, MV=835 and I considered this a max. load. 3 grains Bullseye, probably max. also = 854.

[reddog81]

I had decent success with a 158 RN Lyman 358311 design but I'd get leading after a little while. I pulled a couple of the bullets that had been sized to .357 and the brass had swaged them down to .354. I've settled on 135 to 147 for heavy 9mm bullets. You can go heavier but the small case just doesn't play well with those large bullets in my experiences.

[KenH]

Running a 9mm load thru QL using LEE C358-158-SWC bullet with a 3" barrel and 3.5 grains Unique with 1.09" OAL gives 862 fps with 32,522 psi pressure. If the standard OAL of 1.169 gives 771 fps with a 20,127 psi. Amazing how much OAL can affect pressure on those small cartridges.

Remember, this is calculated with QL, NOT thru a chrono. On my reloads using 127 grain cast bullet with Unique the chrono'd loads tended to be less than calculated, with 102 grain the calculated was very close to chrono'd loads.

Ken H>

[Bigslug]

My reply to a similar thread from a few weeks back:

From Elmer Keith's Sixguns:

"Many handloaders have used the Keith 160 grain hollow point in all three of these auto pistol cartridges (.38 Colt Auto, .38 Super, & 9mm) and some of the Keith hollow base bullets. They seat all the bands down in the case friction tight and use three grains of Bullseye in the 9mm Luger and claim perfect functioning and excellent small game killing"

From the context, and my own experience with the NOE Keith clones, it's pretty clear he's talking about the hollow point version of the 358429, which does in fact weigh about 160 grains, and makes a dandy stand in for a duplicate of the 158 grain "FBI load". You might look up the blueprint for that and compare the base length to your bullet, then figure out what the difference in case volume between the two would be (I expect the major difference will be the nose) . Probably worth backing that charge off a skosh as creep up from there. In terms of function, I'd guess the feed ramp wouldn't know the difference between a revolver SWC and one of the truncated cone auto bullets.

[tazman]

I haven't chronographed a 158 SWC, but chronographed a 157 grain Lyman #356637 (ww alloy) years ago. The bullet was undersize and shot poorly with any load. With 3.5 grains Unique, MV=835 and I considered this a max. load. 3 grains Bullseye, probably max. also = 854.

I have chronographed 2 heavier boolits from my Beretta 92FS. These were the Lyman 358212(148 grains) and the NOE 258-155-tc(ELCO)(148 grains. Both of these seat out of the case far enough to leave plenty of room for powder. I used 5.7 grains of AA7 and got right at or just under 900 fps with both.
Both shot extremely accurately in that pistol.
OAL around 1.145

[mnewcomb59]

http://www.shootingtimes.com/reloading/reloading-heavy-bullets-in-9mm-luger/

Careful with your OAL and bullet length.

Based off this data above, I have ran 2.9 grains of Titegroup with a Lee 158-rf. 1.07" OAL. Lee 158-rf is shorter than the plated hollow point in their data, and loaded to a longer OAL than the data so I feel safe. Primers look normal.

Should be 820 fps in a 4" and 920-975 fps in a 16". This is 22 quiet in the Camp 9 and still works the action with the 16# spring. I also run up to 4.3gr of Power Pistol for 920/1075 fps.

[tazman]

I just noticed that Fiocchi is making 9mm ammo with a 158 grain FMJ for subsonic use. They are claiming 940 fps. That gives a ballpark number for speed.

[Virginia John]

You all might want to try a .358 125gr LRNFP in your 9mms. I have found this to be a great target boolit over 3.5 gr W-231. It is a bit faster than the 158 LSWC and the .358 chambers well and really hugs the lands and grooves.

[lotech]

Lyman #358212 (.38 Special RN, 150 grs.ww alloy) is the most accurate bullet I've found to date for the 9mm. It shoots very well in three pistols. I size to .358" but .359" might also work. I use only Winchester brass, probably from the late 80s to early 90s and have had no problem with bullets being swaged down when seated.

[arlon]

You all might want to try a .358 125gr LRNFP in your 9mms. I have found this to be a great target boolit over 3.5 gr W-231. It is a bit faster than the 158 LSWC and the .358 chambers well and really hugs the lands and grooves.

Do you have an idea of OAL for this bullet?

[tazman]

Lyman #358212 (.38 Special RN, 150 grs.ww alloy) is the most accurate bullet I've found to date for the 9mm. It shoots very well in three pistols. I size to .358" but .359" might also work. I use only Winchester brass, probably from the late 80s to early 90s and have had no problem with bullets being swaged down when seated.

The 358212 is an excellent boolit for the 9mm. Most of the weight is in the nose and the nose is stepped/bore rider so you can load it as long as you can fit in the magazine and it will chamber. It leaves plenty of room in the case for powder. It doesn't need to be seated deeply and doesn't get swaged down on the base the way some other boolits do.
If I could find that mold in a 4 cavity, I wouldn't be using some of the heavy 9mm molds I have now.

[lotech]

As for overall length, I seat all 9mm bullets to maximum OAL as long as they chamber. I've tried many and found very few that could not be seated to max. These include the SAECO 120 grain FN, RCBS 147 grain FN, and the Lyman #356637 157 grain FN, and a couple of .38 Special SWCs. I wouldn't use a 9mm bullet that couldn't be seated to max. magazine length. Powder capacity is just too limited.

[ioon44]

wonder what the velocity is with your heavy 9mm rounds

With the starting load of Bullseye from the Lyman #45 manual the 16" RRA run 890 fps and the 4" PPQ ran at 788 fps for the 158 gr RN and the 147 gr FP was close to this velocity also.
These were loaded to 1.165" OAL and will not chamber in some other 9 mm's.