Martini Cadet Ideas

[drhall762]

I am now in possession of a Martini Cadet action. Action only, nothing else.


I am in need of some ideas on barreling/chambering, preferably from folks that shoot these in something other than the original form.


I am currently leaning toward something in the .25 or .30 caliber maybe based on the .357 Maximum brass. Kind of concerned about going to .30 WCF size because of the MC's small barrel shank diameter.

I have read several threads on this forum but was wondering if there were any additions since then.


Thanks

[country gent]

I have one that's been rebarreled and chambered in 218 bee. SO " sporter barrel new wood with pistol gripped stock. A very nice accurate light walking rifle for wood chucks and small game. 218 bee. 218 mashhburn bee, 25-20, 32-20, all should be doable. There was a 222 rimmed in Canada that was somewhat popular also. On 30-30 length loading may become a issue due to radious on block and length.

[drhall762]

The .218 Bee in one of its many configurations seems to be maybe the most popular conversion I have seen. Very efficient and can give the .222 Remington a good run for it's money.

[Boz330]

I have one in 357Mag. and 7MM Waters. I would think one of the 22 versions as well as a 25-35 would make an interesting rifle. Cartridge length is something to be aware of or you might have trouble loading it.
The 7mm is a sub MOA rifle with jacketed bullets.

Bob

[Outpost75]

A .357 Max. will not clear the breech block on ejection.

My .357 Mag. drags a little and brass does not eject cleanly, although .38 Specials fly clear.

John Taylor may still have my original pull-off barrel which Chris Helbig rechambered to 8x32R using full-length .32-20 case blown out straight.

I love mine in .357 but actually shoot .38 Special in it most of the time.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Lucky you! Wish I had one. Back "in the day" when imported many were converted to .32 Win. Spec. and .32-20 WCF. I had one of the latter, which eventually proved to be a good shooter. Upon reflection, I think that those were two pretty good choices considering the limitations of the action's length and strength. Were I to barrel up an action today I would certainly consider the .32-20, and the .357 Mag. is another.

[Wayne Smith]

Why not the 327Mag and shoot everything from the 32S&W and longer?

[prsman23]

Now that's a thought. Similar to .357 but would most likely work length-wise. And can shoot a varying amount of cartridges safely. I like it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[cwheel]

I've had one in .357 for about 25 years now. .357 seams to be a good choice for these actions, just clears the breach block loading and unloading. I fire just as many 38 spcl. rounds through mine. One thing to watch with these is as the pressures rise with these ( .357 ) is the hole for the firing pin in the breach block on the centerfires is oversized and primers flow into that hole locking up the action. Several years back I tig welded mine closed, made the firing pin smaller, and re-drilled the hole in the breach block smaller. You may need to do this to yours as well if it has not been done already for higher pressure rounds.
Chris

[Goatwhiskers]

FWIW: I got one a few years back that had the barrel rebored and chambered for the .357Mag. Interestingly someone had barely cracked into the bore when they D&T for the forend screw. I was able to safely repair that, another story. Anyway I opened the chamber for the Max cartridge. To make a long story shorter I did start with jacketed but soon switched to cast. I soon settled on the RD190 using WW and PP. It consistently shoots within 3/4" with a stiff load of 1680. I do have to hold the lever down to load. It doesn't throw the empty clear, but I don't want it to. Surprisingly I also have a RD175 mold and that boolit is harder to load due to the fatter nose. Doesn't matter as that boolit won't give me the accuracy I demand. GW

One other point, guess it's due to the longer chamber but .38's and Mags are only for plinking as the groups are much larger. GW

[John Taylor]

I have only done one in the 357 max. Top of the breach had to be shaped different to get it to load. Best would be to use a case with a slight taper for easy ejection. 22 LR seems to eject OK but the 22 mag will require pulling the empty out with the fingers. Had the same problem with the 357 max dragging on the chamber wall. Have talked to several that had them converted to 32 Special and all complained about the high recoil from such a light rifle. Probably had some problem with trying to run a .321" bullet down a .317 bore.

[gnoahhh]

30 years ago, Wayne Schwartz put a .30 bull barrel (Douglas) on one for me, chambered in .30-30 with a "standard" ball seat, 1-10" twist. With a 20x Unertl mounted on it (what an astonishing looking rig!), it would shoot cloverleafs at 100 yards with a Saeco custom 190 grain bullet. It too didn't eject (ok by me) and the lever had to be held down in order to weasel the loaded round into the chamber.

Sadly, it went away to help finance a Stevens-Pope, which in turn eventually became part of a house down payment...

[Jack Stanley]

I shot one a fella had chambered for the 38 special necked down to thirty caliber . Lots of fun and cheap to shoot and quite accurate as I remember .

Jack

[pietro]

Kind of concerned about going to .30 WCF size because of the MC's small barrel shank diameter.


FWIW, .310 Cadets have been successfully chambered in .32 Winchester Special, but the top of the breechblock needs to be scooped out a bit to allow the round free loading & extraction/ejection.

Here's one that sold recently: http://www.gunbroker.com/item/634433218


BTW - The recoil is stout, due to the light weight of the rifle so chambered.


.

[Bigslug]

I don't see a lot of sense in trying to get the biggest, hottest round that can be crammed in. Remember what these actions were for.

Mine's a .32-20 (sort of) conversion to the original bore. Got it shooting very well, but it was not without effort. If the bore was less than a mirror, and given Outpost's case fit issues with the .357, I'd be inclined to cut a .38 Special chamber for accuracy's sake and load to +P spec to get my .357 jollies on. Darn little you can't cleanly and quickly flatten with Keith's .38-44 HD loadings. If you need more range than that can dish out, there are other rifles.

[Reverend Al]

I have a "project" baby Martini action and some new wood for it (nicely figured too) and it will become a .32-20 WCF. Can't have enough .32-20's in my opinion!

:-D

[Bad Ass Wallace]

I have sporters in 17AH, 17/222Rimmed, 218 Mashburn, 222 Rimmed and my best and most used conversion a 25/35 Winchester.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/BAWallace/23-35_edited-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/BAWallace/media/23-35_edited-1.jpg.html)

[BigEyeBob]

I am building a 25-35 WCF Martini at the moment ,I bought the barrel recently ,it had been removed from another Martini cadet ,so all should be good. I also have others , in 32-20 (BSA factory chambered), 222Rimmed , 300Sherwood , 297 Morris long , 22lr , 380 Rook and 310 Greener.
Other future projects include a Martini in 300 Rook or 255 Jeffery.

222Rimmed is a uniquely Australian cartridge ,my rifle has a heavy Tobler barrel and is a tack driver , more a bench shooter due to the weight ,the Redgum stock and fore end dont help with the weight much . Dont think Ill be able to catch up with BA though on numbers of Martinis owned by one person.

[drhall762]

I seem to be drawn in to two options: first is the .218 Bee in some form, maybe Mashburn; second is a .30/.32 caliber in the size/length of the .357 Max. My daughter is only 7 so I want to keep it relatively mild.

[labradigger1]

I have one that's been rebarreled and chambered in 218 bee. SO " sporter barrel new wood with pistol gripped stock. A very nice accurate light walking rifle for wood chucks and small game. 218 bee. 218 mashhburn bee, 25-20, 32-20, all should be doable. There was a 222 rimmed in Canada that was somewhat popular also. On 30-30 length loading may become a issue due to radious on block and length.

I have a martini henry I'm gearing up for mashburn bee. Could you post some pics?

[drhall762]

A personal observation. Martinis seem to be habit forming. (Maybe both solid and liquid.) I was fortunate enough to land a very nice Greener GP for a 1970s price. Then along came a Victorian era Martini action. While contemplating that build I came across this little gem. They seem to be getting harder to find and very pricey so I jumped on the Cadet. No sooner did I get this one and another large Martini was given to me.

They seem to be following me home.

[Jack Stanley]

Rifles following you home? That's an enviable position to be in ;-)

Jack

[Bad Ass Wallace]

They do follow you home. I bought this BSA thick-walled target rifle for a project last year (5.6x50mm Rimmed) but it still shoots so well at 50m it would be a shame!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/BAWallace/BSA%2012-15A_zpsuq0exhcs.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/BAWallace/media/BSA%2012-15A_zpsuq0exhcs.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/BAWallace/Test%20target_zpsq7mkhhkc.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/BAWallace/media/Test%20target_zpsq7mkhhkc.jpg.html)

[drhall762]

Now I know what that rear sight I have kicking around goes on. Thanks.

[country gent]

Mine is a austrailian martini cadet the small action, that was a 32 caliber rifle for cadets. Its been rebarreled to a 218 bee cartridge as I didn't want to be forming brass or reworking brass for it. Its a standard 218 bee and does everything I ask of it. One draw back is 218 bee brass is getting harder to find ( I have 500 cases here 200 are on 3rd loading and the rest are brands new unfired Winchesters. So I'm good). These rifles were cheap in original condition and the 32 round wasn't readily available but Ive heard the chamber could be reamed to 32-20. to make it a shooter. Or they could be rebarreled. We see quite a few hwere with repurposed Remington and win 22 target barrels on them in 22 hornet and 218 bee

[drhall762]

Availability of brass is a good point. Once I decide I'll lay in brass and such, if I can find it, before I barrel and chamber.

[NoAngel]

Great one for that Cadet would be the .30 Badger

38 cases are cheap and plentiful. Simple to neck down.


http://i1216.photobucket.com/albums/dd371/Reloadingfool/image_zpspoixbvjo.jpg

[Jack Stanley]

And the Badger is sooooo fun to shoot . mine was sending 147 grain Sierra bullets downrange this past week . Everybody who shot it liked it , and the rifle it was in .

Jack

[drhall762]

I have a Lilja 3 groove Palma barrel on the rack. The throat is shot out but that whole end would have to be cut off. Makes me lean more and more to one of the little .30 calibers. Guess I'll start pricing reamers and dies.

[Blackwater]

FWIW, it might be really nice to make up a .22 Hornet or K Hornet. You could load it down for small game to .22 LR levels, or up to its full potential with cast for bigger stuff, and even use those funny looking "red" bullets to get 3000 fps with the lighter versions. The main thing about those sweet little Martinis is they're ... well, small. A neat, light gun made up on that action would be a great companion for a long walk in the woods. And most any caliber ought to do well in it, depending on what kind of critters wander the woods where you live. I've always leaned towards the small calibers, like the Hornet or Bee, but that's just me, of course. The .256 Win. Mag is another neat caliber. Hits very hard for the size ctg. it comes in, and with the right bullets, should even take deer cleanly and reliably with good shot placement. I had a Contender in .256 and loved it. I've often regretted getting rid of that one. It's much easier on the ears than the .22 hot rocks. Again, FWIW???

[NoAngel]

I have a Lilja 3 groove Palma barrel on the rack. The throat is shot out but that whole end would have to be cut off. Makes me lean more and more to one of the little .30 calibers. Guess I'll start pricing reamers and dies.

If you're considering a 'small .30'
Manson has the 30 badger reamer on file.
As far as dies, it's all done with a set of standard 7.62x25 or .30 Mauser dies.
Any 32/20 data will work including the Contender data that's floating around. Working with a chronograph, I have gone a good bit further from that and no ill signs.

[Von Gruff]

Do I see some ateampted enabling going on here?? [smilie=l:

I am looking for a cadet action but will take the 20 cal VarTarg barrel off my X R 100 and convert it to rimmed 20 VT and make myself a very light walkabout varminter for the country I now habitually hunt for rabbits.

I am itching to do a stock in the Hagn falling block style

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u488/vongruff1/A%20rifle%20stock%20album/20%20VarTarg/Hagen%20falling%20block_zps7tvqd0s5.jpg (http://s1070.photobucket.com/user/vongruff1/media/A%20rifle%20stock%20album/20%20VarTarg/Hagen%20falling%20block_zps7tvqd0s5.jpg.html)

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u488/vongruff1/A%20rifle%20stock%20album/20%20VarTarg/Hagen%20buttstock_zps4rduquzq.jpg (http://s1070.photobucket.com/user/vongruff1/media/A%20rifle%20stock%20album/20%20VarTarg/Hagen%20buttstock_zps4rduquzq.jpg.html)

[BigEyeBob]

Do I see some ateampted enabling going on here?? [smilie=l:

I am looking for a cadet action but will take the 20 cal VarTarg barrel off my X R 100 and convert it to rimmed 20 VT and make myself a very light walkabout varminter for the country I now habitually hunt for rabbits.

I am itching to do a stock in the Hagn falling block style

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u488/vongruff1/A%20rifle%20stock%20album/20%20VarTarg/Hagen%20falling%20block_zps7tvqd0s5.jpg (http://s1070.photobucket.com/user/vongruff1/media/A%20rifle%20stock%20album/20%20VarTarg/Hagen%20falling%20block_zps7tvqd0s5.jpg.html)

http://i1070.photobucket.com/albums/u488/vongruff1/A%20rifle%20stock%20album/20%20VarTarg/Hagen%20buttstock_zps4rduquzq.jpg (http://s1070.photobucket.com/user/vongruff1/media/A%20rifle%20stock%20album/20%20VarTarg/Hagen%20buttstock_zps4rduquzq.jpg.html)

Wow nice timber . Not sure that style of stock would suit a cadet action but would be ok for a large frame Martini due to the longer lever.
My metal work is coming along nicely go about 20hours invested in filing , and sanding to 320 grit so far ,will progress through 400 and then 600 and a final polish with simichrome for a high gloss finish , then the blueing .
mmmm tried to upload some pics but cast boolits seems to be uncooperative at the moment

[drhall762]

I think we are all co-dependent. LOL.

Treebone Carving has some nice stocks for the Martinis, both large and small.

On this cadet I have decided to go with a .30 caliber. It will be based on one of three cases: .38 Spl, .357 Mag or .357 Max. I like the .30 Badger idea because I can reload with readily available dies not $90 customs.

Can anyone tell me if there are similar WCs in the .357 Mag/Max brass and what they are named so I can choose the reamer I want.

[BigEyeBob]

I seem to be drawn in to two options: first is the .218 Bee in some form, maybe Mashburn; second is a .30/.32 caliber in the size/length of the .357 Max. My daughter is only 7 so I want to keep it relatively mild.

If you are building this rifle for a 7yr old ,why not stick with the 310 cartridge , its a fun cartridge to shoot and easy to reload . Lee have the die sets , RCBS has a heeled mould or CBE here in OZ makes top quality moulds .310 brass is avalable from Bertram ,or use 32-20 brass trimmed .
I have a martini small frame sporter in 310 , my kids used to love shooting it ,both my kids have grown and moved to larger calibers , I still shoot my 310 on occasion and enjoy it ,and it brings back memories of fun times.

[Boz330]

I think we are all co-dependent. LOL.

Treebone Carving has some nice stocks for the Martinis, both large and small.

On this cadet I have decided to go with a .30 caliber. It will be based on one of three cases: .38 Spl, .357 Mag or .357 Max. I like the .30 Badger idea because I can reload with readily available dies not $90 customs.

Can anyone tell me if there are similar WCs in the .357 Mag/Max brass and what they are named so I can choose the reamer I want.


All three of these stocks came from Treebone Carving. Next winter I might get another for my #15 22 BSA Martini. The stock on that thing is original and has been drilled multiple times in the forearm for slings. And not filled very well. It is so accurate it deserve nicer wood.

Bob

[BigEyeBob]

Thats some very nice timber on those rifles. I ve been looking at his website for some time wondering what the timber would be like .Nice to see some finished . His prices are reasonable ,but postage to Oz adds more cost. Most of the gun dealers here import his semi finished stocks and resell them at a premium. I see he now offers straight hand stocks which are my preference for the small frame martinis .Might have to shell out for a couple .

[Jack Stanley]

I've heard rumors of a "long neck" Badger , I think it's based on the .357 case but I'm not certain . Regular Badger is long enough to cover the grooves for me , I imagine it does have a benefit to it though .

Jack

[Drm50]

I recently traded off a nice Aussie BSA Cadet, chambered for 22 Ackley Jet- off 357 case. Had a
Douglas barrel and Fajen custom wood. 22A-jet was a hot little number and accurate. Ejection
and loading no problem. Shot mostly 40 & 50gr bullets.196678

[Boz330]

Thats some very nice timber on those rifles. I ve been looking at his website for some time wondering what the timber would be like .Nice to see some finished . His prices are reasonable ,but postage to Oz adds more cost. Most of the gun dealers here import his semi finished stocks and resell them at a premium. I see he now offers straight hand stocks which are my preference for the small frame martinis .Might have to shell out for a couple .
Nice guy to deal with, When I got that stock for the roller I was looking for some nice burl walnut and he suggested the curly maple since it was the base price and would look good and the walnut would be another $75. To say that I was tickled when I saw it is an understatement The stocks are inletted and are pretty quick to get them to the final fit.


Bob

[HATCH]

I have cadets in 32-20, 22 Hornet and 38sp/357mag.

I haven't checked to see it it's 357mag or just 38sp.

I also have a larger martini in 45-70!

[Boz330]

I have cadets in 32-20, 22 Hornet and 38sp/357mag.

I haven't checked to see it it's 357mag or just 38sp.

I also have a larger martini in 45-70!

If you put them next to each other in the safe they tend to multiply.

Bob

[HATCH]

LOL, I don't want them to multiply. I don't want the ones I have now. Haha


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ballistics in Scotland]

They do follow you home. I bought this BSA thick-walled target rifle for a project last year (5.6x50mm Rimmed) but it still shoots so well at 50m it would be a shame!

thahttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/BAWallace/BSA%2012-15A_zpsuq0exhcs.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/BAWallace/media/BSA%2012-15A_zpsuq0exhcs.jpg.html)


That is probably the 12/15 model, which had the notch at the rear of the receiver squared to fit a permanently erect rear sight. The straight-gripped 12 also had the thick sides, but a more conventionally shaped rear receiver, to which a tang receiver sight was often fitted.

http://rifleman.org.uk/BSA_Model_12.html

The Martinis are among the easiest of rifles to restock for yourself, especially if you are content with a straight stock. Here is my stock drilling.... thing. As usual with things that have a hole in them, it is easiest to make the inside first, and then the outside around it.

196687

[Sur-shot]

Well, lets see, I have a 218 Bee, a 222R, a 225 Win Mag switch barrel, two 357 Max guns.
The 357 Max is not a real problem on ejection, it can be a problem on loading if you do not use rifle bullets like the 180gr. The 225 is the largest case diameter that you can safely put into the barrel shank / chamber on the Cadet action. The 7.62x39 or a variant, like the 6.5 Grendel would make a fine cambering, the trick is for the cartridge to make the turn into the chamber when loading. Look at the body of the 357 Max for length to figure out a cartridge with a straight wall that will make the turn. The 225 makes the turn with ease. These are some of the rifles I built, the maple is the 357 Max / 225 Win Mag switch barrel.
Ed
196691196692196693196690

[Boz330]

LOL, I don't want them to multiply. I don't want the ones I have now. Haha


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If you want to sell that hornet shoot me a price, I might be interested.

Bob

[Ballistics in Scotland]

The trouble with the 7.62x39, and the convenience of its off-the-peg dies and reamer, is that I don't believe there is any rimmed case that can be used to make it. While rimless extractors can be made for the small Martini, I would prefer not to, and I think it can be avoided for about every calibre they make barrels in.

A good rimless conversion is easiest for the rimfires. At least the late ones have a full-width extractor all the way to the top, with a semicircular cutout for the cartridge, while the true Cadets have two limbs extending on either side of a lump of receiver metal. It would be possible to plane this away, using a home-made chisel bevelled on one side only, and a steel block with a growing succession of shims moving it forward in the receiver mortice.

A cartridge I don't believe anybody has mentioned is the .270REN, which is just what you get by straightening out the .22 Hornet. There must be plenty of takeoff .270 barrels somewhere, nor much worn beyond the throat. In Australia it should neatly bridge a gap we don't really have in the UK, being suitable both for birds and rabbits and for the smaller sizes of those bouncing things.

I don't think we need the thicker sides of the late rimfire for strength, with any cartridge and load within the realms of sanity. But they look better, if the stock isn't to be rather thin. Von Gruff's sublime wood, above, looks very good with its step down from receiver width, and drop points. But I think that style needs more width than the Australian Cadets.

If I ever felt inclined to use extreme pressures in the Cadets which have Francotte's Patent Cocking Indicator, I believe I would dispense with that and weld up or silver solder a filler block into its recess in the side of the breechblock.

[drhall762]

Think I have pretty much settled on the .327 Fed Mag. Already have a Bunny Gun in .32 S&W Long so the dies are in place.

[Sur-shot]

I owned a 270 Ren, in an XL, the case is a Jim Rock invention (RPM, maker of the XL), it suffers from lack of capacity. Better is the 7mm max (357 max necked to 7mm), I also owned one of those in an XL. There was a whole line of these cartridges with the 7mm being about the best of the line. Now I did not mention the 30 Herrett because the 7.62x39 is more common, but the 30 H is or can be loaded to easily duplicate 7.62x39 round and is based on the 30-30 or 225.
I have had in hand the rimless extractor for a Cadet, the one side spring loaded with a brad as a hinge pin, made in the 50s or 60s, it is OK but would be a project to build without a starting full extractor, plus finding or building a plain extractor as a start for a Cadet is like finding or making hens teeth. I understand the little spring often broke. It is the one spare part that is difficult to find in the US. I have welded some up and recut them. Of course with a full up shop, now, I could probably build one or two 2 prong type extractors on my Bridgeport with a bit of time. I am going to retire fairly soon, so perhaps......
Ed

PS: when you switch from the original 310 cartridge block face to a high pressure cartridge like the 357 Max, you need to reduce the diameter of the firing pin and put a step down bushing in the block face, then set up the firing so the pin stops on the interior of the block, not the interior of the bushing, then replace the firing pin spring with a new spring so you eliminate primer blow out. That original BP firing pin setup in the Cadet is very low pressure and oversized and will give you problems, otherwise.

If you are working on one of these by hand, the best way to cut the end of the barrel shank for the extractor is to use a 1911 slide file. That file only cuts on one side or one edge at a time. Screw the barrel in, set to length, mark the cut points and remove the barrel. It is pretty simple once you work on one. Just a word of caution, do not use a live round as a dummy, it will fire when you close the action without a trigger.
Ed

[drhall762]

The guy that had this ahead of me, or somewhere along the line set a bushing. He just didn't drill it. I'll just set it up in the mill with a gauge pin and drill it myself. Back in the day, when I was working on 1911s, I used the trusty surface grinder to make my specialty files. Just ground off the edge(s) or face(s) I didn't want and made the edges parallel at the same time. I kind of miss industry and the tech schools, always such nice CNC equipment that I can't/won't buy. My manual shop is a lot slower but I am not in production and what I do is for me.

[Eddie Southgate]

.218 Bee , .256 Winchester , .22 K Hornet would be my first choices .

Eddie

[M.A.D]

My baby in 256 Winchester, I make a nice 70 grain soft nose from used 22lr cases , 26.5 inch barrel. best little bullpup bunny buster 197035

[barrabruce]

Can't see the 7.62x39 good as a conversion since some of that steel cased stuff runs very high in the pressure department so I have been told.
No-one I have spoken too likes any of the rimless solutions.
If you are going to get the case flicked past the extractor it will be when you are looking at a pig with intentions to sharpen his teeth on your sorry posterior......apparently......any other time no dramas.

Me I'll stick to a 30 something cal as I have moulds already.

I think the 30-30 wesson would be ideal if I could get a several hundred cases cheap.

[drhall762]

Can't see the 7.62x39 good as a conversion since some of that steel cased stuff runs very high in the pressure department so I have been told.
No-one I have spoken too likes any of the rimless solutions.
If you are going to get the case flicked past the extractor it will be when you are looking at a pig with intentions to sharpen his teeth on your sorry posterior......apparently......any other time no dramas.

Me I'll stick to a 30 something cal as I have moulds already.

I think the 30-30 wesson would be ideal if I could get a several hundred cases cheap.

Some of what I was looking at was dollars. When I compare my two primary choices, the .327 Fed Mag and the .30-30 Wesson it works out to be a break-even proposition. Maybe favors the .30-30 Wesson a bit actually.

I have a good .30 caliber barrel and it will stabilize the heavier bullets of the .30-30 Wesson. A two die reloading set from CH4D for the .30-30 Wesson is only $87.36. Brass is easily made by running .357 Maximum brass through the resizing die.

The difference in cost between buying dies and buying a new .32 caliber barrel should cover my new .357 Maximum cases.

I think considering the fine reputation and the other factors I listed the .30-30 Wesson is the winner.

[drhall762]

I love bull-pups. What action is that built on. Care to share some more views of that nifty rifle?

[gunnie]

Certainly some nice looking Martini's in this post.
I currently own two original 310Cadets - one stamped Queensland and the other Victoria. Both shoot very weel with my loads based on Bertram brass, Hawksbury 122gn cast and aa charge of ADI AP70N. I was using AR2205 but found that it left granules of unfired powder in the chamber/barrel. The AP70N burns fully but is a 'dirty' powder.

I also own two customs - one in 22K-Hornet and the other in 17 Ackley Hornet. The 17 was set up for left hander but I still use it either side.

At the momnet I am in the process of buying another Cadet though this one is chambered in 357Mag and is a bit of a frankenstein looking thing. Once I've got it in hnad I'll get some pics up on here.

I've also got an action that I plan on having made up in 20-222Rimmed. It's a simple wildcat that won't require selling off your kidney to pay for dies and brass. My local 'smithy supplies his own barrels, so one in 20cal at a finished length of 24" should be right. Then simply run the 222Rimmed reamer in to cut the chamber. Then he'll shorten a set of FLS/neck & seat dies in 204Ruger, to suit the 222Rimmed length. Job done! Should be able to work with a 32gn pill over a reasonable load for about 3400-3600fps without stressing the case/action or extraction issues.

That 30Badger has also caught my eye and could well be another project when I get my hands on the next Cadet action.

[drhall762]

Gunni, I was reading through your response and was saying "WOW! This guy found the mother load of Cadets." then I realized you were in Queensland. Guess they are a tad easier to find their than in the States. I'd like to get my paws on some .222 Rimmed brass to make into .30-30 Wesson. Does a better job than .357 Maximum. I can get it here for about $2 US a piece but that's a little steep for me. Can't wait to see your 20-222 and hear how it shoots.

[Gunnie63]

Cheers Dave. The Martini Cadets are fairly common over here. Where I'm buying the 357Mag Cadet, from they have two others on the rack - a 22LR & a 7X33Sako. The brass for the 7x33 is a tad hard to get and costly whereas the Bertram 222R is $25 for 20. Bought two bags on the weekend.

The 20cal version is very straightforward. One pass through the shortened 204Ruger fls die & the 222R brass is good to load.

At some stage I'll look at having another one built in 25cal. Just not decided she'd whether I'll go 256Win Mag or 25-35.

I also have one of the Khyber Pass copy large frame Martini Henry actions that I was planning on making up as a 405W. But a lot of folk have advised against it due to the quality of the metal etc. So was thinking maybe a 22 rimfire or 22Mag to keep the pressures low. Would be a bit of a curiosity if anything.

[M.A.D]

Cheers Dave. The Martini Cadets are fairly common over here. Where I'm buying the 357Mag Cadet, from they have two others on the rack - a 22LR & a 7X33Sako. The brass for the 7x33 is a tad hard to get and costly whereas the Bertram 222R is $25 for 20. Bought two bags on the weekend.

The 20cal version is very straightforward. One pass through the shortened 204Ruger fls die & the 222R brass is good to load.

At some stage I'll look at having another one built in 25cal. Just not decided she'd whether I'll go 256Win Mag or 25-35.

I also have one of the Khyber Pass copy large frame Martini Henry actions that I was planning on making up as a 405W. But a lot of folk have advised against it due to the quality of the metal etc. So was thinking maybe a 22 rimfire or 22Mag to keep the pressures low. Would be a bit of a curiosity if anything.

Oh care to share who has the Cadet in 7x33 Sako for sale? If you tell me, I will let you borrow my 256 win reamer....

[gunnie]

MAD, I'll give the guys a call in the morning to see if it's still there. PM me your phone number and I'll text you Dean's number.

[Texas by God]

I'm still staring at Von Gruff's stock........

[M.A.D]

The Aussie Gunsmith Tony Small does a 7.62 x 39 Martini conversion https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZr1HNribp0

[M.A.D]

And how he did the extract/eject https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oaf5ugMw7KM

[Spudgun]

I re-barreled a BSA Australian cadet rifle with a Shilen match grade 30 cal barrel, turned to match the original contour so I could stick with the full length fore-stock, chambered for 30-30 Ackley Improved in 1984 and have shot many thousand rounds through it since. I've loaded it as hot as 303 British ballistics but the recoil in a rifle this light is too brutal. No load that I have tried has shown any excess pressure signs & it's very accurate, especially as an off-hand rifle. It's really handy being able to buy ammo for it anywhere if I run out of hand loads.

[samari46]

Always wanted a 32-20. Gonna send out a BSA model 12 or 12/15 with a center fire trigger group to John Taylor With one of TJ's barrel liners with a faster twist than the original 32-20. Since it's set up for iron sights and my eyes aren't 20 years old anymore, most likely have it drilled and tapped for an old Lyman All American 10x AO scope. There is a member on the ASSRA forum playing around with a reworked BSA setup with faster twist shooting BP. Some of his groups with I believe iron sights are amazing. Also it was once suggested to me regarding a cadet martini be relined to 38 special. Plenty of cheap brass, easy on powder, cast bullets not a bad idea. Frank

[NorthMoccasin]

I am soooo envious of you fellows with your Cadets. I had a original 310 back in the 60's, but no ammo was available and I had no funds to convert it, so it went down the road. I wish I still had it! Now they are scarce and high priced in my area. The TC Contender has to suffice as a small bore single shot for me. Not as classy as a Martini, but the price is right and the barrel interchangeability is a big plus. I have barrels in 22 hornet, 32 H&R, 25-35 Ackley, 375/444, and 30/30 Ackley. All shoot cast of course. I would love to find a small frame CF Martini, but so far no luck.

[Shawlerbrook]

22 K Hornet

[flintlocke]

Don't know if the original poster is going to do his own metal work, or what his budget may be, but in my case, economy and simplicity trumped the other options. So I went with keeping a rimmed cartridge, just cutting the rim depth to accomodate the .32-20 rim. Using a cheap ebay used chucking reamer to open the .310 chamber neck plus about .070" freebore to .348 to .32-20 length. This allowed me to use cast .323 in a barrel with a .321 groove dia. with unaltered .32-20 brass (other than blowing out the neck to accept thumb seated 8mm cast bullets).
So, end result, a Westley Richards 8mm/32-20, capable of 2.2 moa for 22 bucks for the reamer and 25 bucks for the mold. I have shot other Martini's in hotter cartridges....gilding the lily in my opinion.

[shutinlead]

I just picked up a mildly abused little WR, in a 310. I didn't need it but I didn't want it to fall into the wrong hands -:lol: (I use this excuse a lot) - Have an order going in to Manson in the next couple days so thanks for the insight on the 30 Badger! Looks like a great use for 38 special brass.235980 now, on to wood...

[flintlocke]

shutinlead, my WR I believe was stored on the floor of the Atlantic Ocean for several years before I acquired it. Hence, you might keep me in mind if you decide to sell your takeoff barrel. flintlocke

[shutinlead]

I just got this thing, they had the barrel liberated from the action, the bore looks great it's just that someone used an adjustable wrench rather than a barrel wrench to remove it so the flats are rounded. I'm going to dress these up the best I can without losing the WR symbol and modify the chamber slightly and reuse it. I have a Greener that was probably sitting on the ocean floor next to your WR, it cleaned up pretty well so here shortly I'm going to have a martini day or two in my shop.

[drhall762]

My Martini style pile seems to be growing. Came across a couple of the little Trade Mark .22LR target rifles a while back. A little rough but complete and restorable.

[Texas by God]

.32 H&R mag or .38 Special would suit me just fine in a Cadet Martini. I've never seen just an action for sale; just rifles already customized and they cost more than I'll pay.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

[shutinlead]

I know what you mean by pile growth- picked this up a while back - not a true martini but it's not a peabody either... a 22 rf extractor/firing pin 236000 I'm like the scandahoovian that drops the penny into the outhouse :grin: - wasn't going in after that so he dropped a quarter and made it worthwhile. I wasn't going to build a pattern for the duplicator for just one martini - now it's four so... and I hate wood! :D going from a martini day to a martini week!

[samari46]

I wrote to David Petroff up in Alaska about what pistol cartridge would be suitable for the cadet martini.Straight off he told me that I shouldn't go any faster than a 38 special.He said what with all the published loading data and the choice of bullets cast or jakaeted and if with a 38 special no need to have the firing pin bushed like if you were going to use a 357 magnum cartridge.Frank

[MaxJon]

I wrote to David Petroff up in Alaska about what pistol cartridge would be suitable for the cadet martini.Straight off he told me that I shouldn't go any faster than a 38 special.He said what with all the published loading data and the choice of bullets cast or jakaeted and if with a 38 special no need to have the firing pin bushed like if you were going to use a 357 magnum cartridge.Frank
I'm going with the .357 magnum, but a ot seem to be going the .357 Maximum. Magnum will be fine with cast loads I believe.

[Jedman]

I have a all original BSA cadet in 310 and 4 others in calibers based on the 32-20 and 357 case.
If I build another I would probably go with a 25-35 because of the shape of the cartridge it would feed and eject very good. The next step down would be something on the 5.6 X 50 R case or the 38 spl. - 357 max case. I have one chambered in 357 Max and it does need a little help with your fingers to extract the fired case so something tapered would be better.
If you can find a butt stock from a Ruger no. 1 they can be easily fitted to the cadet frame or there are unfinished mostly fitted stocks and forends available thru several replacement stock makers.

Jedman

[MaxJon]

I have a all original BSA cadet in 310 and 4 others in calibers based on the 32-20 and 357 case.
If I build another I would probably go with a 25-35 because of the shape of the cartridge it would feed and eject very good. The next step down would be something on the 5.6 X 50 R case or the 38 spl. - 357 max case. I have one chambered in 357 Max and it does need a little help with your fingers to extract the fired case so something tapered would be better.
If you can find a butt stock from a Ruger no. 1 they can be easily fitted to the cadet frame or there are unfinished mostly fitted stocks and forends available thru several replacement stock makers.

Jedman

Thanks Jedman!!

[GONRA]

BACK in 1960's GONRA rebarreled a friends .310 Cadet for .357 Mag.
Used a Numrich Arms .357 Barrel blank.
Chambered with a boring bar with leade geometry ground on the tip.
Milled extractor groove with my 10 K SB Lathe Milling Attachment.
(Soon after, gotta Clausing Vertical Mill...)

[MaxJon]

BACK in 1960's GONRA rebarreled a friends .310 Cadet for .357 Mag.
Used a Numrich Arms .357 Barrel blank.
Chambered with a boring bar with leade geometry ground on the tip.
Milled extractor groove with my 10 K SB Lathe Milling Attachment.
(Soon after, gotta Clausing Vertical Mill...)

Love it!!

[iomskp]

I just donated one to a friends son he is only 4 so his father has plenty of time to finish the gun, it is being chambered in 38 special.