New to me Charter Arms Undercover

[FergusonTO35]

I've always been a fan of Charter Arms revolvers and have had a few of them over the years. Apparently a lot of other people do too as prices on them both new and used have crept up a lot over the years. Was cruising Gunbroker and found this Undercover .38 for only $125.00. It looks to be in good shape other than a little surface rust on the frame so I went ahead and bought it. An extra snub is always good to have!


http://www.gunbroker.com/item/641507936

[Lefty Red]

Found this one at a local gun shop cheap! Granted, it took me four CAs before I got one that was timed well and locked up and didn't have that cylinder wobble. But I like the one I got.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170429/31545e2ecfa8ca3cace4055d6f848367.jpg

Have shot about 100 rounds out of it. Had to clean it around every 50 rounds to keep it smooth. SA trigger is light! Very accurate. It's my pocket pistol until the SW 642 comes out of layaway.

It's not perfect, but for $175 I can't complain.

Lefty


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[WebMonkey]

Looks right for the condition. I would've bought it.
The free shipping offsets the ffl transfer fee so it'd be a pretty good buy.

[gpidaho]

I've got to pick up a 38spl. I have hundreds of pieces of 38 brass and it gets shot in one or the other of my 357s Not all bad, but it would be nice to have a gun that fit my brass. lol I'd say you got a bargain. Gp

[FergusonTO35]

All the Charters I've had seemed to function at least as well as my Rugers and S&W's, save for one that was a basket case when I got it. I sold them plus a bunch of other guns a few years ago to pay off debts. I still have some grips and small parts for them in my gun junkyard.

Lefty, that is a really nice Undercover you have there. If you ever want to let it go give me a holler.

[Lefty Red]

All the Charters I've had seemed to function at least as well as my Rugers and S&W's, save for one that was a basket case when I got it. I sold them plus a bunch of other guns a few years ago to pay off debts. I still have some grips and small parts for them in my gun junkyard.

Lefty, that is a really nice Undercover you have there. If you ever want to let it go give me a holler.

I will, but it's starting to grow on me! Ordered some Faux Stag grips to replace the bulky stocks with it came with.

Funny, I have a $750 snub on my hip and a $175 one in my pocket!!!! LOL

BTW, ever heard of a Taurus 405? Five shot 40SW.

Lefty


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[FergusonTO35]

I think a Glock 27 is hard to shoot, can't imagine what that 405 would be like! Heck I don't even enjoy shooting my Glock 22 with factory ammo.

[Lefty Red]

I think a Glock 27 is hard to shoot, can't imagine what that 405 would be like! Heck I don't even enjoy shooting my Glock 22 with factory ammo.

True! One reason I haven't gotten it. All the reviews I heard about it was summed up with, "ouch!"

Lefty


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[Lefty Red]

Grips came today! Looks like it came out of the '30s!

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170501/ff2950dc97b0af56a3179b5cbb5c3dd8.jpg

I'm thinking it could use a T Grip or Pachmayer Adapter to fill in for a more comfortable grip while shooting.

Lefty


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[FergusonTO35]

Sweet! Those grips really give it a classy look.

[35remington]

For a 175 dollar revolver that Charter looks pretty clean. No ring scratch either.

[Lefty Red]

For a 175 dollar revolver that Charter looks pretty clean. No ring scratch either.

Nope! I think it was shot five times by the previous owner. The gun shop owner shot it ten times. I have put about 100 rounds through it. The finish is nitrite something other. Holding up very well.

Is it as smooth as a SW or Ruger? Nope, but I can't tell any stacking of the trigger and it's constant. It's got one of the best SA triggers o have used on a snubbie. I'm really happy with it. Will shot it now and then. I have more durable snubbies to use at the range, and let's be honest, they all shoot about the same. Just some have a few more refinements than others.

Lefty


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[FergusonTO35]

The seller contacted me and said he noticed the cylinder release on the revolver wasn't working properly. He ordered the part and will have his gunsmith install it. He will then refund the shipping when the revolver ships. Good service, I have to give them props! Majestic Jewelry and Loan in Fresno, CA. Gunbroker username Pawnmania.

[Lefty Red]

The seller contacted me and said he noticed the cylinder release on the revolver wasn't working properly. He ordered the part and will have his gunsmith install it. He will then refund the shipping when the revolver ships. Good service, I have to give them props! Majestic Jewelry and Loan in Fresno, CA. Gunbroker username Pawnmania.

Awesome! Although Charter Arms would more than likely fix it too.

Lefty


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[Lefty Red]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170506/9c185b9657fe3f84946da32ba22639e9.jpg

I fitted the BK Grip Adapter on the UC today. Not completely done, needs minor shaping, but holds good for now. REALLY helps with gripping and shooting with the faux stag grips.

All in all, it's a very functional pistol. I have no regrets and it's found a home in my pocket!

Lefty


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[monge]

Keep us posted on reliablity i always wanted one in 44sp yours looks sweet!

[Forrest r]

Bought 1 for the misses several years ago @ a gunshow, she wanted something small/light for ccw. It's been a very impressive revolver for the $$$ ($150). It shoots to the point of aim with these 158gr/950fps loads @ 7 to 10yds.
http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t242/forrestr-photo/undercover_zpsdbyc4p2b.jpg (http://s162.photobucket.com/user/forrestr-photo/media/undercover_zpsdbyc4p2b.jpg.html)

Awhile back I was pressed for time and did a test with p+ loads using 10 different hp's & 5 different powders. Loaded 10 rounds of each test load & went to the range with targets/chronograph/ca undercover & tested the 500 test rounds I made. 500 rounds of p+ ammo was pretty brutal with that light weight revolver. At the end of the day the ca undercover was still running strong, myself on the other hand. Not so much.

Whatever load you plan on using you should do some testing, snubnosed revolvers/ammo combo's are a real eye opener.

[FergusonTO35]

Yes, indeed they are. I've settled on 3.1 grains Bullseye/Lyman 35891 as my standard snub load. It clocks 712 fps out of my S&W 637 and is very accurate and easy to shoot. Hopefully the Undercover will like it too.

[Lefty Red]

If you have those stock factory rubber grips on yours like mine had, they handle the recoil very well! I have some DEWCs pushing +p velocities that my UC Handed very well. In fact all the loads handled well in it.

Now the slim grips, well it's doable. :)

Lefty


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[FergusonTO35]

I don't know why Charter keeps shipping the Undercover with those giant grips. Surely they are aware that most people buy them for concealed carry? The old wooden Bulldog grip was an excellent compromise between comfort and concealment, I have a pair somewhere. They fetch surprisingly high prices on Fleabay.

[Lefty Red]

I don't know why Charter keeps shipping the Undercover with those giant grips. Surely they are aware that most people buy them for concealed carry? The old wooden Bulldog grip was an excellent compromise between comfort and concealment, I have a pair somewhere. They fetch surprisingly high prices on Fleabay.

Yes they do!!!
For $10 more you get a cool set from Altamount!


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[Texas by God]

I'd love to have a 70's vintage .44 Bulldog. They were well built and accurate enough.

[FergusonTO35]

Update on the Undercover. The seller contacted me and said that even with the new part it still wasn't working well. He offered to instead sell me another Undercover he had in stock for $100.00 free shipping. So yeah, bring it on I told him. He sent me some pics of it. Overall it looks about the same except it has Stratford instead of Bridgeport on the barrel and the serial number is 3491xx so it is a lot newer than the first one which was 160xx. The delay sucks but the seller seems to be really trying to make me happy so it's all good.

[FergusonTO35]

The Undercover showed up at the fun store yesterday and I picked it up. I'm glad that he didn't sell me the first one. This Undercover must have been fired very little, the action is quite tight and there is only a ghost of a turn ring on the cylinder. The finish has a fair amount of wear and surface rust, I would surmise this Undercover was somebody's glove box or fishing gun for a long time. Very happy with it for $125.00 total, pics and range report coming soon.

[35remington]

Interested in how it turns out. Low budget but serviceable guns have always attracted me.

[FergusonTO35]

I have put around 100 rounds through the Undercover so far. Elevation seems dead on with 146 and 154 grain wadcutters. My groups are impacting to the left about two inches at five yards. Not sure if that's me or the gun right now. It fires Federal primers 100% no big surprise there, however I had a lot of light strikes with CCI from a lot that my other revolvers eat just fine. Not sure if it is a weak mainspring or even just how tight the action is, as mentioned before I really don't think it was fired more than a couple of times before I got it. I subbed in a different hammer spring from my gun junkyard, we shall see if that changes anything. Anybody know if a coil hammer spring for an S&W J frame will work in the Charter?

[Lefty Red]

I do not have good luck with CCI small pistol primers. Ever since the scare and hoarding era, I have kept away from them.

My UC liked the heavier bullets too. The 110gr +p loads I carry on it shoot about an inch low at 5 yards.


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[35remington]

Remington 1 1/2s are your friend if you have light hammer strikes failing spring replacement needs.

[FergusonTO35]

Interesting, I have always found R-P to be the hardest of SP primers. I fired the Undercover some more today with the new/used hammer spring and same CCI primed load. This time, it fired in single action 100%, still had a few light strikes double action. My Rossi 461 set the hard rounds off no problem. I do think the shooting to left is the gun, not me. Switching to the Rossi, my groups immediately returned to center. Examining the Undercover, I do believe the front sight is canted slightly to the right, which would certainly cause it to shoot left. It is so slight that I think turning the barrel in slightly will correct it.

Still not bad for a $100.00 gun, if I wanted a new gun with a warranty I would have bought one. I'm going to see if I can fix the light strikes problem, then probably send it to Charter for the barrel issue.

[Lefty Red]

CA will fix it! The weapon is covered [emoji817] percent!


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[rintinglen]

A washer under the Main spring will clear up your light hammer strike issue at the cost of an increase in trigger pull.

[35remington]

Not the 1 1/2. It is the softest small primer extant. You may be thinking of another Remington primer.

In any event a spring is probably the best fix.

[Tom W.]

My hunting buddy had the .44 and wouldn't part with it for any reason. I bought an UC way back in the '70's for my first wife. It was accurate and easy to shoot. One night she left it in her car and someone tried to steal the car. The car wasn't working, so he rooted around and found the revolver. The police caught him that night about two miles from the house. They kept the revolver for a long time after the trial. When we finally got it back there was something wrong with it. I sent it back to Charter but something still felt amiss. A boy offered me a very decent price for it and even knowing about reason I wasn't happy with it he bought it. Another with a low price would put one in my glovebox. Someone mentioned a Glock 27. That happened to be the first Glock I ever fired. Five shots from that and I dropped the magazine, emptied the chamber and gave it back to the man that owned it. He laughed and said that's what it did to him, too. It was worse than full power .44mag loads. A week later and he sold it.

[Thin Man]

I have fired several of the Undercover revolvers with standard grips and have found the Tyler T-grip inserts to be the most satisfactory solution to making the grip easier to hold and manage without increasing their bulk. The T-grips are still in production my the inventor's (Melvin Tyler) son, can be found on the net.

I have enjoyed owning and shooting the Charter Arms revolvers for quite a few years. In the early Fall of 1973 SWMBO and I were on an extended vacation through the New England area and found ourselves at the Charter Arms factory. The staff welcomed us in for a visit and introduced us to their new product chambered in 44 Special, 3 inch barrel and oversize wooden grips. I fell in love with the size and caliber and talked about it for the rest of the trip. About 3 months passed before Christmas when I found one of these under the tree from SWMBO. That happened almost 44 years ago and both she and the Charter are still with me!

While at the CA factory they told us about their development of this firearm. Their original test model was chambered in 357 Magnum. Before they will consider mass production of any firearm they test fire their prototype in a strong "safety" box. This box is reinforced so if the product detonates it will generate injuries only to the shooter's hand. Their shooter shoved his hand with the loaded revolver in the box and fired one shot. The recoil was so pronounced it struck his forearm sharply on the top of the box's window opening where he inserted the firearm. He withdrew the revolver and flatly refused to fire any more rounds through it in the box. Then the engineers came forward with the 44 Special chambering. The recoil from this caliber was more manageable (with routine factory RN loads) and the rest is history.

[OBXPilgrim]

Thin Man, thanks for sharing your story. Very interesting.

[FergusonTO35]

A washer under the Main spring will clear up your light hammer strike issue at the cost of an increase in trigger pull.

Cool, thanks for the tip! I'm thinking there may be some debris or minor corrosion inside the mechanism that is causing the light strikes. Shooting should cause it to work it's way out.

[HATCH]

I picked up a CA PITBULL. Its a 40 cal 5 shot revolvers. Its snappy.
I had to send it back to CA twice for them to get it right though....
When I got it, it would shoot my cast reloads fine but had a issue with the cylinder/yoke.
They replaced the parts and sent it back. I couldn't fit my reloads in 3 of the 5 cylinders. So back it went.
This time they kept it longer and when I got it back everything was right.

Its not a bad pistol but it does have some MAJOR recoil. I own a glock 27 and its worst then it.
I like it though because you don't need moon clips and it is 40 cal. I have over 25K pieces of 40 cal once fired so its gonna be around a while.
I got so much 40 cal that its on the FIRE AND FORGET status. I don't load the cases I shoot.

[FergusonTO35]

What loads are you shooting in your Pit Bull? I would think that you could load something like a 180 grain slug at 750 fps and it wouldn't be bad at all.

[HATCH]

I shoot the standard loads.
172 cast HP or 180 standard
5.2 unique

its what I shoot in my Glocks, my UMP 40 rifle, and my Ruger P pistol

I don't do low power options.

I do do a 105 grain WC 38sp load that is ZERO recoil and same POI as standard 38 sp loads

[FergusonTO35]

I like to squirt the Lee 401-175-TC at 900 fps out of my Glock 22. The .40 is totally not enjoyable with most factory ammo, I wouldn't own one if I didn't reload.

[Leadmelter]

The Charter Arms 38 undercover was the pistol my beloved owner used to kill an armed robber in Detroit, 1972.
Next day, the news reported that the robber was the MOH Dwight Johnson of Vietnam.
Chuck shoot him four times during the struggle and he shot him once in the shoulder. The robber said he was going to kill him, and Chuck put his last shoot through his cheek that went through the back of brain. DOA.
Leadmelter

[Lefty Red]

Any more updates?
Still liking the UC?


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[Tom W.]

Today my wife took me to the gun shop to browse for a bit. I haven't been in the last six months, and today I felt well enough to go. I wanted to see the new Charter Arms revolver. I was rather surprised that they had one in not only .38 special and .44 special, but 9mm, .40 cal and .45 acp..... that looked like a great snake gun...... now to figure out what I'm going to part with to obtain one.......I have an ammo box of cleaned and sized brass that needs something to be fired in....

[Lefty Red]

My local fun place has a 3" 327 Mag and I was interested in. Too much play in the cylinder for me. But very interested enough to call CA and asked it I bought it if they would fix that. Was told to get ahold of the owner and have it sent in now!

So still interested! And the shop has loads of 32 H&R ammo and loads. Almost like they are teasing me!

Lefty


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[beemer]

A lot of people put them down, I've had four of the older ones with nothing but good service. I especially like the front lock up, its a solid and simple solution.

All of then shot close to where they looked but the best and last was a stainless Undercover with a bobbed hammer. At 15 feet you could shoot one for a aiming point and the other 4 only made the hole a little bigger, of course that was after I worked with the loads. That one was stolen and it had to be the one that my Father gave me.

Dave

[FergusonTO35]

I fired it some last weekend and all rounds went bang no problem. Unfortunately it is shooting quite a bit to the left. I'll shoot it some more and then maybe send it to Charter.

[Woodman]

Where did you get the stag grips.

[Woodman]

Lefty,where did you get the stag grips?

[Petrol & Powder]

A lot of people put them down, I've had four of the older ones with nothing but good service. ............

Dave

Charter Arms has been through several iterations, not always moving in the right direction. Even under their original ownership, which lasted the longest time span, they didn't always turn out the same quality. Most, but not all, of the early model Undercover's were good guns.

The Undercover was a very popular snubnose 38 due to its lower cost *. It has been my experience that people that had good ones held onto them and people that had less than good ones sold them off. This tended to taint the reputation of the Charter Arms UC on the used market. Most of the early ones were solid guns but I would be very reluctant to purchase one that I couldn't shoot before buying.

* A lot of young (low paid) police officers and sheriff's deputies purchased the Charter Arms UC as a back-up / off-duty gun. The UC was particularly popular in the northeast U.S. I've seen several UC's that had hard lives in ankle holsters and jacket pockets that were still functional and beloved by their owners. When the Taurus Model 85 became the inexpensive snubnose "du jour", it largely replaced the UC as the new cop's back-up gun. Competition from Taurus may have been one of the factors that lead to Charter's first of many bankruptcies.

[Virginia John]

The weakest part on the Charter Arms revolvers is the cylinder catch. The cylinder design itself makes it a bear to take apart and reassemble. But other than that they are well worth what you pay for them.

[Lefty Red]

Lefty,where did you get the stag grips?

I found them on FleaBay I think.

One problem with CA is that the frame size has changed sizes and angles and whatnot over the years and there is no standard through out the years. Had to sand them down for a smooth fit, but was worth it.

I ended up selling this UC to a local young LEO for his wife. She could use the grips as is. They made the pistol "awkward" feeling to me. I went with the CA small grip I ordered for pocket carry when I got a 327 Mag Undercovette. I have only shot 32 H&R Mags out of it but like it.

Lefty


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[pietro]

.

I like Charter's.......... Except for an early .44BD I bought in the 1970's, I've had excellent service from them - and find them more comfortable to shoot than a J-frame S&W (even my Y2K .44 stainless BD).


https://i.imgur.com/1Oot8Bsl.jpg https://i.imgur.com/xnfx58Ul.jpg https://i.imgur.com/DMrQMdym.jpg

.

[texasnative46]

To All,

WISHING that I could find a CA .38SPL "snubbie" with the "splinter" grips for my petite lady to CC. = Her hands are equally petite & most all my handguns are TOO BIG for her handle well.
(I've found NONE at the last 3 local gun-shows.)

yours, tex

[pietro]

To All,

WISHING that I could find a CA .38SPL "snubbie" with the "splinter" grips for my petite lady to CC. = Her hands are equally petite & most all my handguns are TOO BIG for her handle well.
(I've found NONE at the last 3 local gun-shows.)

yours, tex


Tex, with all due respect, you're wasting your time. ;)

Since ALL Charter revolvers have had the same round butt gripframe since day one, you can buy ANY .38 snubbie (model 85 ?) and then swap in a set of small grips - many of which are available online (google).

For instance, my stainless Pathfinder Dual Cylinder model,pictured above, was issued with a set of rubber bumpers, so I bought a set of walnut CA square butt target grips ($25), as I like the Trail Gun config (YMMV).

.

[texasnative46]

pietro,

THANKS for the correction. = I presumed that under the bigger Charter Arms grips was a larger frame.
(Just as S&W & Colt's grip frames come in different sizes.- I've NOT removed the grips to compare.)

yours, tex

[cabezaverde]

I just picked up a very nice stainless Stratford .44 Bulldog for $199.00

[texasnative46]

cabezaverde,

CONGRADS. = NICE deal.

yours, tex

[FergusonTO35]

I haven't messed with the Undercover for awhile but I'm planning to put some wadcutters through it this week. I have filed the front sight a wee bit to correct the shooting to the left problem, hopefully that will do it. If not I'll probably send it back to CA when I get a chance. My S&W 637 scratches the snubnose itch for me pretty well so the Charter is just one of many ongoing projects.

[Lefty Red]

637s seem to be hard to come by in my area. Always on the lol out for one.

I still have my CA, best SA Trigger on any revolver I have right now.

The CA is taking a back seat to my Taurus 405, five shot 40SW. Not the 44Spec or 41mag snubbie I want, but a fine weapon in its own right.

If I have to order me a 637, I might just get a 638. I like hammers on my snubbies!

Lefty


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[FergusonTO35]

My local guy always has the 637 in stock and will ship for actual cost. I can give you his contact info if you are interested. His prices on guns are better than most big retailers too.

[Lefty Red]

My local guy always has the 637 in stock and will ship for actual cost. I can give you his contact info if you are interested. His prices on guns are better than most big retailers too.

Yes, please PM with it!


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