LoadMaster and .44-40

[dikman]

Some time ago I asked here if the LM would reload .44-40, given the fragility of the cases. General consensus was yes, so I bought all the relevant bits. It took a lot of tweaking but I got it working, although I always had issues of some sort every session. Yesterday I needed to load about 130 cases. After the first 53 I had 3 crushed cases, 1 upside down primer, 2 crushed primers and 11 cases that missed getting a primer. The last issue is because the large pistol primers don't feed from the primer holder unless I shake it vigorously (very vigorously!), they appear to bridge across the opening of the feeder. (Oh, mustn't forget the chipped shellplate that Lee kindly replaced).

So I shifted the dies back to my Lee 4-hole turret press for the remaining cases - result, one crushed case, my fault entirely as I saw a "blemish" on the case but figured the seating would take care of it. Wrong. The rest were perfect.

I had already been decapping/sizing on a different press first, to try and eliminate some issues, so between the time involved in separate decapping and stopping every time I have a problem with the LM I figure that it's quicker overall using the turret press (and less frustrating!). I'll use the LM purely for .38, which it handles with no problems. A bit disappointing, but we live and learn.

[JohnH]

I know that it adds a step, but try priming off press. I bought my Load Master about two years ago now and love it. I prime off press because I use a stainless pin tumbler and decap before cleaning. I use 1 table spoon of Mothers Car Wash and Wax and 1/4 table spoon of Jet Dry. The cases come out clean and slick inside and out and run through the dies with far less effort than cases than have been cleaned in a vibratory tumbler. I just wonder if you are experiencing crushed cases because the primer feed is screwing with the indexing of the shell plate

[No Blue]

The entire priming assembly rubs on cast in bumps on the frame; if you have it correctly assembled, you don't have to touch the primer trays to shake them down. 2 tits about an inch apart, look for them, on the back of the frame....if the primer trays aren't shaking, you got it wrong!

[1bluehorse]

The entire priming assembly rubs on cast in bumps on the frame; if you have it correctly assembled, you don't have to touch the primer trays to shake them down. 2 tits about an inch apart, look for them, on the back of the frame....if the primer trays aren't shaking, you got it wrong!

Also if you haven't "relieved" the edges of the tray a bit with a razor knife so the primers DON'T stack up at the mouth, then you haven't really learned how to "tweak" a LM press. ;)..another critical piece of the puzzle for the priming is the primer pin MUST be the same height as the primer tray. Take a primer, put it in the "priming slot" and slide it back and forth to the pin and back with the primer slider. Do this by hand. If it ain't smooth as butter with no movement, you got a problem...easy fix though. I got rid of my Classic Cast Turret press long ago. [smilie=6:

[No Blue]

Also if you haven't "relieved" the edges of the tray a bit with a razor knife so the primers DON'T stack up at the mouth, then you haven't really learned how to "tweak" a LM press. ;)..another critical piece of the puzzle for the priming is the primer pin MUST be the same height as the primer tray. Take a primer, put it in the "priming slot" and slide it back and forth to the pin and back with the primer slider. Do this by hand. If it ain't smooth as butter with no movement, you got a problem...easy fix though. I got rid of my Classic Cast Turret press long ago. [smilie=6:

I've never had to do ANY farting around with the plastic bits; they just work as delivered. But there seems to be a lot of 'enthusiasm' for cutting, grinding, dremeling, and every other way to jack around with the parts. I just pull the handle and it works. Wish I knew WTH the rest of you are doing to have sooo many problems....

This is with a 22 year old LM, a 4 year old one, and accessories from that entire era.

If I have a shell plate, I do all my priming on the LM; it's lots faster than the other 3 methods I could use. Pour the brass into the collator, put 100 primers in the tray, and start priming.

I like having sized, primed brass ready for powder and bullets. I don't like making up 1000 assembled rounds and then find out they have an 'issue' and I get to pull all of them down.

[dikman]

Yep, I know all about the bumps and how they jog the primer assembly as it goes up and down. As I said, it works fine for .38 (small primers). One thing I did notice is that the extra weight of the large primers appears to move the primer holder away from the frame, which reduces the bumping of the primer attachment.
When I first got it I checked the primer feed, smoothed it all down, rubbed graphite into the plastic parts and made sure the primers slid smoothly onto the priming pin. No problems there.
The crushing is due to the amount of flaring of the case mouth. I've kept it to the minimum needed to work, due to the thinness of the brass, unfortunately that means that if the boolit happens to catch just a fraction while seating it crunches the case. I'm using exactly the same settings on the turret and it works fine because I'm manually seating the boolit first.

I'm not knocking the LM itself, I understand exactly how it works and have spent a bit of time sorting it out and am happy enough with it, it just doesn't like the thin .44-40 cases. With the high cost of cases here I just can't afford to keep crunching them.

[No Blue]

20 something years ago I read 44-40 was a real problem to reload; for exactly the reasons you've mentioned. So when I had the option of 44-40 or 45 Colt guns, I took the 45 Colt.

Sorry you went with 44-40....But Chuck Conners used a 44-40, if that makes any difference; you know, The Rifleman!

[1bluehorse]

I've never had to do ANY farting around with the plastic bits; they just work as delivered. But there seems to be a lot of 'enthusiasm' for cutting, grinding, dremeling, and every other way to jack around with the parts. I just pull the handle and it works. Wish I knew WTH the rest of you are doing to have sooo many problems....

This is with a 22 year old LM, a 4 year old one, and accessories from that entire era.

If I have a shell plate, I do all my priming on the LM; it's lots faster than the other 3 methods I could use. Pour the brass into the collator, put 100 primers in the tray, and start priming.

I like having sized, primed brass ready for powder and bullets. I don't like making up 1000 assembled rounds and then find out they have an 'issue' and I get to pull all of them down.


I guess we just don't know how to work them correctly. I know I've never seen or read about anyone else having problems with a LM either.

[dikman]

No Blue, I had tried loading them using my Pro 1000, but that was more trouble than it was worth. I had high hopes for the LM but I guess it's just not meant to be (at least for .44-40). I do like shooting the .44-40, it just feels right, and I have three Winchester rifles in that calibre (including one made in 1897). :bigsmyl2:

[No Blue]

I guess we just don't know how to work them correctly. I know I've never seen or read about anyone else having problems with a LM either.

You hit the nail on the head; you really need to have above average mechanical reasoning and ability. It's not a press for peeps that wear loafers or use Velcro straps instead of shoe laces because they never figured out how to tie a knot....Lee's marginal instructions compound the problem....

Jmorris got a LM from one of the loafer wearers, he's above average in mechanical ability, and he's got a video of the LM cranking out 100 rounds in 4-5 minutes with no problems.

Same machine the loafer wearer couldn't make work...makes a big difference who is operating it...

[Kitika]

When are the cases crushing? I load the 44/40 on there and haven't crushed one yet. I have over crimped the 44/40s on old stretched cases so they won't chamber but a quick adjustment fixes that.
I have removed the priming system altogether and do it with a bench prime now I just couldn't get it reliable enough for my likings on the machine.

[dikman]

They crush during the boolit seating. The problem is possibly being exacerbated by using the boolit feeder. If I overflare the mouth it's better, but I don't like doing that on these thin cases. Yeah, the priming system is a bit flaky with these large primers.

I just loaded about 150 .38's on the press. I had two cases that were split and I missed seeing so they didn't work too well, and a couple that missed primers (my fault for not watching the primer feed). I have an LED under the powder station, after priming, so if I see a light in the case I know there's no primer. Other than that it worked well (including the boolit feed).

For now I'll stick to the turret press, as I can do all operations on that (only downside is I have to pull the handle more often :roll:). Maybe one day, if I ever get really bored, I might come back to it and have another go. Maybe.

[jetinteriorguy]

I'm going to guess that you have the newer style folding primer trays. They suck so bad, biggest mistake Lee has made with the LM. Mine is the newer designed improved priming system but still has the older style round primer tray and in loading upwards of 20000 rounds in the last couple years I've maybe had four or five primers flipped sideways when letting the feed trough get too low. I tried the newer style folding trays when they first came out and have had nothing but trouble with them. I will not buy any Lee priming product as long as they use these trays. As long as I load five more rounds after the tray looks empty, then refill with primers it has been flawless. Just yesterday morning I loaded up 500 9mm rounds in a couple hours and had one issue with a piece of brass feeding in upside down, other than that it ran like a clock like it always does.

[dikman]

Nope, I've got the older round tray. I need to have a closer look as I think a bit of tweaking may be in order. I have one of the folding trays on the primer feed thingy for the turret and that works well enough, although the tray doesn't hold as many primers. I think I prefer the round one, though.