Older Colt SAA shoot or not?

[arlon]

I have an older Colt SAA #111516 that I assume was from the late 1800's. Does anyone actually shoot these? I am torn between loosing collector value and fun factor. Also not sure how safe this would be to shoot modern factory 45 ammo in. I have a few boxes of 20 year old 45 and do not reload for it at this point. I doubt I'd invest in the reloading gear unless I find another modern shooter in 45 LC. I assume most factory 45 ammunition would be loaded with BP pressures in mind.

[Silver Jack Hammer]

If you shoot modern ammo in that gun it should blow it up. Your Colt's is not rated for smokeless pressures.

[Outpost75]

I agree with Silver Jack Hammer. Original black powder Colts in nice condition are worth too much to shoot. You could sell it and buy a brace of Rugers and a '92 clone in the same caliber.

[Uncle Jimbo]

I have an older Colt SAA #111516 that I assume was from the late 1800's. Does anyone actually shoot these? I am torn between loosing collector value and fun factor. Also not sure how safe this would be to shoot modern factory 45 ammo in. I have a few boxes of 20 year old 45 and do not reload for it at this point. I doubt I'd invest in the reloading gear unless I find another modern shooter in 45 LC. I assume most factory 45 ammunition would be loaded with BP pressures in mind.

According to http://www.proofhouse.com, your SAA was made in 1884. Definitely a BP revolver. Me, I would shoot it with BP loads and enjoy it.

[hp246]

Go buy yourself an Uberti, Pietta or RUger Sa in .45 and have a blast. Put the Colt away.

[Texas by God]

Unless it's a family gun, sell it to a collector and buy some new guns.
Best, Thomas.

[arlon]

Unless it's a family gun, sell it to a collector and buy some new guns.
Best, Thomas.
Family gun. Was my G Grandfathers. He got in the late 1800's for protection in the grocery store he owned. Seemed that when the railroad came to Cibolo Texas, it also brought some transient traffic he didn't like.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

In the 1920s the most powerful .45LC load on the market was the full case of black powder. They aren't by any means weak. But that isn't to say you can load to the same performance with smokeless powder. That is a very different proposition. Unless you are lucky enough to have one with an exceptionally good finish, I'd say shoot it with light loads, and if they are black, clean where it is out of sight.

[jaguarxk120]

hp246 has the right idea.
Go to Guns International and look under Colt revolvers antique, check the prices for your guns time period, BIG $$$$$.

Should you sell it you could by several Uberti 1873's or at least a couple of new Colt 1873 single actions.

[smkummer]

If it were myself, I would have it checked out by someone who knows what to look for in old colts to make sure it was safe, then fire some black powder loads to see if you like shooting it. A few custom ammunition makes sell black powder loaded cartridges. If you like shooting it, then consider reloading those empty cases or order more ammo. I load a low pressure smokeless load for an original 1875 Remington revolver in 44-40. If you really find that you like shooting it but don't want the mess of black powder, you can have a modern cylinder fitted and feel safer with factory pressure loads in 45 Colt.

i lived in Midland TX, from 1990-96.

[Uncle Jimbo]

Family gun. Was my G Grandfathers. He got in the late 1800's for protection in the grocery store he owned. Seemed that when the railroad came to Cibolo Texas, it also brought some transient traffic he didn't like.

Go shoot this gun. If you sell it, you will hate yourself for ever. It was your g grandfather's gun. When you are shooting it and people see it and ask about it, you have a family heirloom and the story that goes with it. And that is priceless.
If you find you need a 45LC revolver, go buy one, load it to the nuts if you want, show it off to everyone, but it is just another revolver like all the rest in the show case.

Just talking from experience.

uncle jimbo.

[DHDeal]

You don't know me from Adam's house cat and I don't know you or your circumstances, but from what you posted it is a heirloom piece and should remain so. Keep it lightly oiled and clean, and pass it down. As others have stated, with BP it should be safe for another lifetime, but no need to abuse such a valuable (more so to you) firearm.

If you gotta go Colt, buy one or a replica. I prefer Blackhawk's as they are hell for tuff and you can always buy another.

My advice is worth every penny you paid for it......

[Sam Casey]

If you decide to shoot it, be sure to take "before & after" pictures.

[M-Tecs]

Back in the day when smokeless first came onto the scene Colt's policy was that they didn't warranty the blackpowder frames with smokeless. That being said during the 50's through 70's it was common to see people shooting them with smokeless. Worked for some and it didn't go so well for some.

If it was mine I would only shoot real blackpowder with lead bullets in it.

You stated you didn't load for it. You can purchase them here. https://www.buffaloarms.com/45-colt-250-grain-rnfp-black-powder-ammo-box-of-50-amogx45lc

Some interesting discussion here http://dailycaller.com/2015/04/24/the-45-colt-history-and-surprising-facts-about-this-iconic-cartridge/

[arlon]

Thanks for the thoughts. Why I asked was for your opinions. All things considered I think I'll just leave the Colt as is where is. If it was a total non event to shoot factory smokeless I'd shoot it. Since that doesn't really seem to be the case, I think I'll just keep it as a couch piece. The black powder loads linked above might be worth considering not as expensive as I'd have expected. I do have a few S&W 1917s and a Colt 1917 that are easy to load for, still fun to shoot and a lot less collateral damage if I make a mistake. Plus I have everything to cast and reload for the 45 AR/ACP. Not the old Colt SAA, but at the end of the day maybe a better place to focus my attention.

Again, thanks for the thoughts. They were quite useful.

[DHDeal]

Good decision! You would probably be fine with proper loads, but clean up can be a pain if you don't like cleaning guns (some don't). Too valuable to you and yours.......

[Battis]

I'd keep it and I'd shoot it with low powered loads. I have many antiques, mostly cap and ball revolvers, that I shoot, but I also have a few BP cartridge rifles that I shoot - 1868 Trapdoor 50-70, M81 Vetterli.
Whether you shoot it or not, have you stripped it down and cleaned it thoroughly?

[Ballistics in Scotland]

If you decide to shoot it, be sure to take "before & after" pictures.

Guns like this which have failed, mostly failed from things the user should have been wary of. They haven't suffered much from being unphotographed for the last 130 years.

[charlie b]

A friend is in the same boat. Has a family .45. His thinking was this. His great grandfather had it and kept it in the house, rarely fired it. So that's what my friend does. He brings it out about once a year and we put a box of black powder loads through it, it gets cleaned up and put back in the safe.

OTOH, I have an Mauser C96 (Broomhandle) that was made in 1897, carried in the Boer War and WWI. Father-in-law received it from the family of the original owner. His statement was, 'I don't own a gun I won't shoot'. Fired a lot of handloaded cast bullets through it and now it gets fired with factory loads almost every time I go to the range.

If it was my gun I'd shoot it.

[sharps4590]

Sell a family heirloom? Nuts. Not in this home.

[Ithaca Gunner]

True, smokeless has a different pressure curve then Holy Black, but some say they're okay to shoot in a pre-1900 revolver. I say they're not, not that they would blow the gun up, (if in good shape) but look at the differences between a pre-1900 Colt SAA and post-1900 gun. The differences are subtle, but important, even if the materials used are stronger, the design DID change a little to accomidate the new smokeless powders.

First there is a difference in steels used, the older black powder guns had a mild, soft steel. Some would say, "Just replace the cylinder with a smokeless era and shoot!" Two weak points in the SAA black powder era frames scream, "NO, don't do it!" Those points are, (most important) the front lower part of the frame where the cylinder removal screw is, and to a lesser degree, the front inside top strap where the Colt factory "dished out" an area for black powder fouling to accumulate. Either of these points can stretch and crack with repeated use of smokeless powder ammunition.

Secondly, the firing pin hole in the frame bushing is huge on black powder guns compared to a smokeless frame guns, It's quite easy to lock a gun up from primer flow back using smokeless ammo. Also the firing pins are quite different. The black powder guns use a large cone shaped pin to set off any primer, including the old inside primed ammunition, smokeless guns use much smaller hole and a much smaller scalloped firing pin to prevent primer flow back with more modern ammunition.

Other differences really don't impact the use of smokeless ammunition as much, but were important in shooting black powder cartridges such as the scalloped, or beveled cylinder fronts, this was also done to deal with fouling from black powder ammunition, some may say it weakens the cylinder, but probably not as much as some believe. You'll note the progressive elimination of the scalloped cylinder through the first generation SAA to where there is a squared off face. Another is the longer shank of the cylinder bushing to keep the cylinder rotating and clear of fouling.

When Holy Black was the only gun powder anyone knew of, Colt took measures to provide a strong, dependable product. We who never HAD to use black gun powder often just view these little steps taken at Hartford to deal with powder fouling as cosmetic rather than essential to the working of the gun, but those folks knew what it took to make a strong, dependable gun in the day and implemented those subtle, but essential features in the design.

[Texas by God]

Go buy yourself an Uberti, Pietta or RUger Sa in .45 and have a blast. Put the Colt away.


Family gun. Was my G Grandfathers. He got in the late 1800's for protection in the grocery store he owned. Seemed that when the railroad came to Cibolo Texas, it also brought some transient traffic he didn't like.
Make or have made a glass display case with your great grandpa's gun, picture, and other mementos and display it in your home- screwed to the studs of course.
Best, Thomas.

[fjruple]

I would shoot the gun with black powder if you reload. I would made the trip to the range a family affair so all of the kids, grandkids and members get a chance to shoot Great-grandpappy's gun. This get together would seal the bond of traditions within the family and provide the family a sense of their history with the community which your great-grandpappy help establish. Let the family enjoy your piece of family history. I have done this with my son, daughter and my grandkids.

--fjruple

[Ithaca Gunner]

There is something about shooting a genuine Colt SAA that makes others pale in comparison. Nothing at all wrong with shooting some black powder loads in it at all. Cleans up easily with hot soapy water, oil and put it away for next time.

[arlon]

I'd keep it and I'd shoot it with low powered loads. I have many antiques, mostly cap and ball revolvers, that I shoot, but I also have a few BP cartridge rifles that I shoot - 1868 Trapdoor 50-70, M81 Vetterli.
Whether you shoot it or not, have you stripped it down and cleaned it thoroughly?


No I have not taken it apart other than removing cylinder, basic cleaning. More for preservations sake.
I have a 50-70 Trapdoor that is an original "short rifle". Another one I'd like to try shooting a bit but it would cost an arm and leg to get it running again. Have a 45-70 Trapdoor that would be much easier. I already reload/cast for 45-70 (converted Danish Krag). Have not attempted to shoot the trapdoors.