Least Expensive Way To Get started Casting

[trickg]

Hey folks. I wanted to ask the question of how to get involved in casting without a lot of outlay of cash up front, if in fact that can be done.

I decided after loading up most of the .45 ACP 200 gr lead SWC that I bought that I I would rather cast my own. My dad was a caster, but I didn't wind up with any of his equipment so although I kind of know what I need and how to do it, I don't yet even have a bullet mold.

I looked at the Lyman Master Caster set which includes a small furnace, the luber/sizer, a dipper and the ingot mold, and that seems to be about the best deal going from what I can tell - it's certainly less than if I try to buy those components new.

I was just wondering if there is any way to get going without dumping several hundred dollars up front. I'm pretty sure I can find myself a source or two of WW and if I could, I'd like to stick with Lyman molds - it's what Dad used, I casted with them under his direction, and it's what I would be comfortable with.

Also, if anyone has some stuff lying around that they aren't using because they have upgraded or whatever, send me a PM and maybe we can work something out.

All suggestions are welcome - thanks in advance! :)

[trickg]

Wow - no one has any ideas about how to get started without spending a lot of dough?

[scb]

I would NOT recommend that anyone start with LEE. They are the least expensive but you get what you pay for. Starting with cheap "equipment" that produces less than acceptable results is not the way to start, it only leads to frustration which may turn the beginner off to casting all together. Start with good stuff and if after you get proficient with it you want to take on the "challenge" of Lee's products at least you'll have the knowledge that casting isn't a "black art". All one has to do is look at the "space" dedicated on this forum to fixing these things (ie leeminging as well as countless others) to see what I mean. I will say however that Lee's bullet sizing system works fairly well. I am not however sold on their tumble lube, too messy for me. Steve

[MtGun44]

One hole Lee mold, propane stove or gas camp stove, cut down #10 coffee can
for melting lead and Lee ladle WILL work - I started this way. It is FAR from
optimum but will cost under $40 if you have the stove. You will quickly tire of
this slow system, but you can get good boolits. I started with the Lee cake
cutter lube system (pan to melt Alox lube onto boolits standing on their bases,
cut out with a tube just larger than the boolit) but these aren't sold by Lee any
more. They included a hammer driven sizer, tube with a ram, very simple and
slow, but worked fine. Lee's current sizer uses a std press, but I don't particularly
like their LLA "mule snot" lube, but others love it.

This is pretty much the cheapest possible with new stuff, sometimes finding used
is the best deal, but hard to plan on.

Use a two hole Lee and a better ladle and you'll get much more production. A used
Lyman or RCBS luberisizer can sometimes be had for $50 used, and will
increase lube rate a lot. I was a very poor college student when I started, so
anyone can do this, add new stuff as you can afford if you are still enjoying
the hobby.

Welcome and good luck.
Bill

[trickg]

Thanks guys - I appreciate the feedback.

I cast bullets with my Dad and he had a pretty basic but thorough setup. He ladle casted out of a cast iron pot over a propane stove, and almost all of his molds were lyman - I know he had one RCBS mold, but for most of what he did, he used Lyman 2-cavity molds.

I don't really know what he lubed/sized with - he had one lube setup that he used for years, and then later he got a hot lube setup. I think back to all of that stuff that he had, and I almost want to cry because he had a lot of molds - everything from 38 caliber round ball to 400+ grain .45 caliber bullets for 45-70/90.

I just know that I could shoot even more on my budget if I would invest in a casting setup, and I'd want to get started by spending as little as possible.

[scb]

MtGun44 has a good point. A lot of my equipment is used. As long as you can check it out and it looks ok. Most casting stuff can't be "worn out". The most common malady is rust. I wouldn't buy anything that obviously looks abused (beat on).

[Bret4207]

Pot, ladle, heat source, Mule Snot and shoot. I started out about that way with a Lee 405 gr 45/70 mould, hand lubed, cast with a ladle from an old pot and learned a lot. Start simple and cheap and go from there.

[mooman76]

Get a 1 qt cast iron pot from a thrift store or garage sale. Just a couple bucks. A cheap lee ladle is like $3. I wouldn't mess with a one hole mould if I could help especially when you can get a 2 holer for like 2 dollars more. That will get you started except for the safety gear which I'm sure you have stuff laying around. You cans use a kitchen stove with good ventelation but better of outside with a camp stove.

[longbow]

As said above, you can get started fairly inexpensively and in my case, after about 40 years of casting not much has changed for me. I still cast on a budget and have the same equipment I started with - other than the stove.

I started with an old cast iron plumber's pot my grandfather had along with a ladle that holds about a pound of lead. I used the pot on a natural gas hotplate in my parents basement at the time. When I moved out I got a Coleman stove the after that died I got a propane stove.

I still cast with the same pot and ladle. Mostly I have two cavity moulds except for the big round balls and slugs (12 ga.) which are single cavity. I prefer iron moulds and have Lyman, Ohaus and RCBS. I have used Lee moulds and have no complaint except that you have to be a little more careful with them but you shouldn't be beating up your mould blocks anyway.

At one point I bought an electric bottom pour pot but didn't like it and went back to the ladle.

I don't cast in the volume some here do but this set up suits me fine. It was and is inexpensive and trouble free.

Also, I shoot mostly as cast. I have sized but find if I don't have to why bother. Dip lubing, pan lubing and tumble lube all work reasonably well and again no real cost for equipment. If you need to size a Lee sizer works fine and is inexpensive.

You can certainly spend a pile of money on reloading rquipment if you want to but you don't have too.

Longbow

[725]

Unlike advise from others, don't be afraid of Lee. A $20 Lee mould can make alot of nice boolits.

[trickg]

Some folks have said that I could use a camp stove, but I have a burner on one side of my gas grill that I could probably use as a heat source to start with. That would keep my casting operation outside and ventilated although I would be a tad leery of putting lead near where we cook our other food, although I would certainly keep the main grill lid down if I did decide to do that. But, that would pretty good with a cast iron pot and a ladle, and I could set up my Black & Decker Workmate bench to use as a table off to the side.

[MT Gianni]

Cover your deck with cardboard or plywood under these and any spills will be easier to pick up and not burned into your deck. Don't ask me how I know this. Gianni

[cajun shooter]

A good source for equipment is Mid-South Shooters supply. I've found that some of the bidders on e- bay are nuts. They pay $ 60 for a dble cavity plus shipping that can be purchased from Mid- South new for 46.55. Don't know if you know about Marvelux for fluxing but its great. No smoke, smell or fumes nor do you light it. Just stir in and scoop out the dross. I would also advise that you find, borrow or buy the Lyman Cast Bullet handbook. It's available for 13.00 from you know where and no I don't receive anthing from them.

[trickg]

I'll look into MS - looks to be pretty decent, and I'll also get the Lyman manual.

There are a lot of folks who like and swear by Lee stuff, but again, I want to get started with what I know, and that's dipper casting with Lyman molds.

Keep the suggestions coming!

[Naphtali]

Hey folks. I wanted to ask the question of how to get involved in casting without a lot of outlay of cash up front, if in fact that can be done.

. . .

All suggestions are welcome - thanks in advance! :)Your most teething-pain-free thing to do is to locate one pleasant person within easy driving distance who casts and reloads regularly. One or two sessions with this mentor will be invaluable. Not only can you learn what and how to do what you want to do. You can learn why the mentor does what he does. Once you are no longer completely at sea, you will have a better idea what you need to acquire, and what is strictly overkill for what you want to do.

On these forums, there are probably several such people. All you need do is ask.

Just some thoughts.

[runfiveslittlegirl]

most definately start with a good mold..
handles for it.
get a lee 20# pot.
you really don,t want to smelt with the pot you are gonna cast in but to get ya started
you can do it.
a bit of solder some ww's and a way to get the clips outta the pot.
melt the ww's in the pot pick out the clips ,flux, add a bit of tin and pour some bullets.
in your cleaned mold.
buy a few sticks of lube, melt them in a coffee cup in the microwave.
pan lube and size in a lee push-through.
you can move up as you go, but this equipment will still be with you as you go along.

[KCSO]

Gee am I the only one here who started on a wood stove????

I got a lead pot and dipper for free from a friend and I bought a round ball mould used from a gun shop. I put the pot on Mom's stove and cast balls for a year before I spilled lead on a burner and was banished. The i had to go to Grampa's and cast on his wood stove.

[trickg]

Naphtali - thanks. As weird as this sounds, even though I have no equipment of my own, at one point I was pretty adept at casting thanks to having done it with my late father. I knew how and why to flux, I knew that in order to get good fill out on the mold and to get smooth, flawless bullets, the mold had to be hot, but not too hot, and I know that for many applications, WW by themselves will work as a source for bullet lead. (Dad used to alloy with linotype at times for certain applications.)

But, all of that said, for me to put together a setup like he had would cost me a fair amount of money, even if I only bought one or two molds. As an example, he had:

a propane stove (very similar to this - Double Burner Stove (http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product2_6970_16460_16460))
a good sized propane tank - probably about 100 gallons
Multiple cast iron cauldrons (he had a great big one he used for smelting)
Multiple dippers
Well over a dozen Lyman bullet molds (I would say he had at least 20 molds for all different calibers, everything from round balls to shotgun slugs)
Ingot molds
sizer/luber
etc

It was hundreds, if not thousands of dollars worth of gear. I don't need anything quite that fancy, but even to get started, if I get the equipment I'm familiar with, it will be a fair amount of money - I'm just looking to see if there is a way that I can bypass some of that expense.

[TexasJeff]

I would NOT recommend that anyone start with LEE. They are the least expensive but you get what you pay for. Starting with cheap "equipment" that produces less than acceptable results is not the way to start, it only leads to frustration which may turn the beginner off to casting all together.

Yep, know what you mean.

If I'd used a Lyman mould or RCBS pot or Star sizer, maybe these groups wouldn't have been so crappy and unacceptable for my first foray into casting.

http://usera.imagecave.com/jdkinman/148WCMyCast6shotsLoRes.jpg

Somehow I guess the gods were for me in the black art since I used some Lee equipment. Even loaded the boolits on a Lee press. Maybe I had my eyes closed while I was shooting.

Oh well.

Jeff

[Idaho Sharpshooter]

Go for broke with your melting set up. Cabela's is always having a sale, wait til their turkey fryers come up for $59.95 or so. That cooker comes with an eight quart dutch oven here in Idaho. It will melt down 300lbs of wheel weights at a pop, and you can cast from it if you wish.

Rich

[Christian for Israel]

the disparaging remarks about lee molds are a bunch of crap. i've cast tens of thousands of boolits with lee molds (for more than 20 years for some of them) and they STILL make boolits superior to those from other makers. a double cavith lee mold from midway usa is less than $20. a steel pot and ladle from a thrift store should be a buck or two. an electric hotplate from the same store shouldn't cost more than $5. a slotted spoon or regular fork can be used to remove clips/dross. a simple candle can be a source of flux (a pea sized piece is all that's needed). in short, for around $30 you can begin casting excellent boolits and, if you take care of the mold, it should last a LONG time.

[RustyFN]

Yep, know what you mean.

If I'd used a Lyman mould or RCBS pot or Star sizer, maybe these groups wouldn't have been so crappy and unacceptable for my first foray into casting.

http://usera.imagecave.com/jdkinman/148WCMyCast6shotsLoRes.jpg

Somehow I guess the gods were for me in the black art since I used some Lee equipment. Even loaded the boolits on a Lee press. Maybe I had my eyes closed while I was shooting.

Oh well.

Jeff


How about the hole in the ruler, was that a flyer. :mrgreen::kidding: Great shooting, I think I've seen you post some on other forums also.
Rusty

[TexasJeff]

How about the hole in the ruler, was that a flyer. :mrgreen::kidding:

I shot that hole in the ruler while blindfolded and smoking a cigarette..


Great shooting, I think I've seen you post some on other forums also.
Rusty

Reckon so--THR and TFL. Either TexasSkyhawk (my airplane) or TexasSeaRay (my boat) or TexasJeff (my name).

This place is like a smooth glass of 12-year old malt scotch, and I don't even drink anymore.

Jeff

[missionary5155]

When I started to cast down here (15 years ago) in the real far south all I had was a 150 swc Lee mold I bought for $5 at a U.S. yard sale and a bottle of Lee lube I got at a small gun show for $3 cause it had a crunched bottom. Found an old spoon drilled and bolted a wood handle on it.. A Datsun pickup hub cap center hub to melt lead in on top an old Colman one burner stove I had from backpacking and I was in buisnes. Still have it all... though I am a bit more refined now. :)

[trickg]

I suppose I need to simply get after it. Buying molds are probably going to be my biggest expense getting started because I already have a heat source and I think I've secured a couple of sources for WW. I'd like to get some Lyman ingot molds too, but one thing at a time.

Unfortunately, I have some pretty specific ideas about what I want for bullets, and most of those ideas are mostly classic Lyman molds - duplicates of what my father had and used.

I appreciate all of the feedback - I really liked the posts from guys who made it happen on a shoestring and started up with some pretty unorthodox equipment.

[Marshal Kane]

Yep, know what you mean.

If I'd used a Lyman mould or RCBS pot or Star sizer, maybe these groups wouldn't have been so crappy and unacceptable for my first foray into casting. . . . Jeff
While that certainly is a nice looking group at 50' (feet) shot one handed standing without support(?), it would be positively awesome at 25 yards shot in the same manner. Regardless of what casting equipment is used, groups shot at 50 feet tend to all look good but a 25 to 50 yard group can tell a whole different story. Not trying to be offensive, just noting that 50 feet IMO, is too short a distance to test load accuracy. Other opinions, even those contrary are just as valid.

[samb]

Jeff,
Thanks for the wonderful laugh this morning! Nice Shootin Tex.

[Wayne Smith]

Pat, make sure that grill burner is well supported before you put 20+lbs of lead on it! I'll bet it wasn't designed to take that weight. I use a Coleman 2 burner propane stove and have for years. A piece of 3/4" ply on a resin table on the back porch (screened in) and a cast iron pot from Lyman with a Lyman ladle is what I use. I still melt my pure lead in an old 1qt steel kitchen cook pot but the handle is about to break off! Most of my molds I got off of eBay except the Lee which I bought from Midsouth mainly. Lee 2cavity molds work fine if you are gentle with them, they don't hold up to any abuse at all.

[trickg]

Thanks Wayne - my grill is a pretty nice grill, and I checked out how much weight it would hold by leaning down on it with a good bit of my weight - I weight 205, so I think it's going to work out. That said, at some point I'll want to get a setup dedicated to the task and the two-burner cast iron stove setup (pretty much what my Dad used) can be had for about $40 - I'd still need to get a dedicated propane bottle and regulator setup though and that's going to add to the cost. All in good time. :)

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Another vote for using the Lee stuff. Only molds I own, including a couple customs designed and bought on the group buy section of this forum. Can't beat them for price vs. performance. Every piece of commercial casting equipment I own except my thermometer is a Lee product. Buy with confidence.

Anybody who can't get good results with the Lee six ganger molds isn't trying.

Regards,

Dave

[warf73]

trickg

What bullet are you wanting to cast?
Does Lee make one you like in the caliber you want?

Here is a link to Lee's bullet designs http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi/catalog/browse.cgi?1216973279.540=/html/catalog/bullmol2.html

Tell me what you think.

Warf

[trickg]

Warf, not trying to be a snob, but most of the bullets I want to cast are Lyman designs. The first one I want is the 200 gr SWC, but the others all fall along the lines of SWCs for 38/357 and .44, and I also want the classic Keith designs and a couple of RF designs. I should probably keep a completely open mind about it, but I know what my Dad had and used, and he was pretty picky about that kind of thing so he must have used them for a reason. I wish like heck he was still around to ask.

[warf73]

NO problem at all.
Just askin.



Warf

[trickg]

Warf, the truth is, I might be better off with Lee molds for a couple of reasons:

1.) Price - they appear to be the least expensive molds on the market, and are about 30% of the cost of molds from other makers
2.) Cast and shoot design - many of the bullets don't even need to be sized - simply lube with LLA and you're in business.

But, I also have concerns about casting with Lee molds. One concern I have is that I have read that some people have issues with them - they need quite a bit of TLC before they will drop bullets without problems.

To get started, I may wind up buying a Lee mold or two, but I really do want the Lyman molds.

[Beaverhunter2]

One concern I have is that I have read that some people have issues with them - they need quite a bit of TLC before they will drop bullets without problems.

Use what you like! I like Lee moulds.

I'm no expert. Heck, I don't even have enough experience to qualify as a novice. But I will say that I have 8 Lee molds and those that wouldn't easily drop good boolits (with minimal or no tapping) after being cleaned with brake cleaner and rinsed with water, got "Leemented" with either toothpaste or a little damp Comet (one boolit). A few turns each way, reclean, and we're on our way. It seems like it takes 50 boolits or so to get the mould going the first time. After that, since I warm my moulds pretty good before starting, if the first boolit isn't a good one, #2 is.

The only real problem I had getting good boolits is when I tried using a bottom feeder on 350gr and larger. They came out looking dirty. When I ladle cast them- I haven't seen them any prettier in a store.

I still have lots to learn, I know. But now my focus is on lubes, sizing, and learning the idiosyncracies of loading Cast vs. Jackets.

Have fun!

John

[trickg]

I'll have to give Lee molds some serious consideration then - I plan on dipper casting since that's how I learned to do it way back when, when I was casting with my Dad.

[Ghugly]

I guess we all have our methods for Lee moulds. I've settled on one that has given me perfect boolits, starting from the first one cast from a new mold, for the last 4 moulds.

I scrub the mould with hot water, dawn, and a tooth brush.

I lubricate the pins and sprue plate with a lite film of Permatex anti-seize.

I smoke the whole mould, beyond all reason (black, black, black), with a large wooden match, or 5.

I dip the end of the mould into the molten lead until the lead won't stick to it.

The last 4 Lee 2-gang moulds I did this to did not drop one wrinkled boolit nor did any of them require more than a lite tap with a dowel on the handle hinge to release a bullet.

If I sound like I'm bragging, I am ............sorta. Keep in mind that before I figured this out, I beat the ever-loving crap out of a bunch of moulds. And we don't even want to discuss the interesting and varied words I called them, the guys who sold them to me, and the guy that designed them.

Then I read the instructions.

[trickg]

Fair enough. My own experience is pretty watered down considering I had dear old Dad (bless his soul) to do all of the hard work for me. It may well have been that when he got his Lyman molds they didn't drop perfect bullets cleanly and easily either, but by the time I came around and started casting they did!

Ghugly, I'm going to bookmark this page so that when I get my Lee molds (I'm convinced to try at least one of them, and considering the price, why not?) I'll know what to do to get them set up.

[Marshal Kane]

There are several reasons why bullets don't drop cleanly from a mould and IME, one of them isn't bad. A properly cast bullet completely fills the mould and while it is still plenty hot, may not necessarily drop from a mould. Give it a few seconds more to cool and shrink a bit, and it will. The first bullets cast usually easily drop from the mould. That is because the mould is still coming up to casting temperature and drawing heat from the bullet causing it to cool and shrink quicker. When the mould comes up to casting temperature or greater, the bullet does not shrink as fast and tends to stick to the mould. Temperature plays a big part in casting and when everything is going good, the tendency is to keep the casting rhythm going. It doesn't bother me a bit to tap the hinge pin to drop bullets from the mould. Sticky bullets tend to be good ones. Just my take on this, YMMV.