Does it matter which 225-230 round nose boolit for 45 ACP?

[tazman]

I got to try out a Springfield Armory Range Officer in 45 ACP today. Excellent gun. My last experience shooting a 1911 style handgun was a complete disaster. This was as good as it could get.
This pistol shot as well for me as I can do with my revolvers.
Using Blazer Brass 230 fmj ball loads, I was shooting 80% in the X ring on a B27 silhouette at 10 yards.
At this point I am thinking of just loading 225/230 grain round nose boolits to keep things simple. I will need to get a mold, boolit sizer, and loading dies. The sizer I will need to slug the barrel to find what I need. The loading dies are a simple choice. The boolit is where I need input. I have my 9mm down to a science but not this cartridge.
My question is, does it really matter which 225/230 grain round nose boolit mold I get? Is somebodies design better than others(more reliable feeding or better accuracy)?
All you shooters with a Range Officer, what diameter boolit works the best in your pistol?
Opinions and suggestions are welcome as I have no experience with casting for a 45ACP.

[bob208]

I have a rcbs and a lyman 230 rn mold I am going to thin the herd. both work good in my 1911's both are double cav.

[jim147]

I know you asked round nose but the lee 230tc is my best shooting and most versatile. It runs in the 1911's, xd's and I even load it in my 45 colts.

[Bill*B]

With a round nose cast bullet, there is no real visual evidence of seating depth. Seat it out just a little too far, and you will have a good time indeed with your semi-automatic. The round didn't fully chamber, but as the heavy slide slammed forward it drove the bullet hard into the rifling - so now it is STUCK, and won't extract either. You have a solid, out of battery jam with a live cartridge. Beautiful. That's why I shoot SWC. Semi-wadcutters give you a visual reference for seating depth.

[Bigslug]

Taz,

Two threads of mine - the making of which taught me a lot, and that you might find educational:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?237958-Reliably-Feeding-the-452423-A-Science-Project

This covers my adventures with attempting to run Elmer Keith's .45 Auto Rim SWC with its ridiculous .34" meplat in the 1911. I was successful at doing so, but determined it wasn't really the thing. That led me to the adventures chronicled in this one:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?255216-Feeding-Big-Meplats-in-1911-s-Continued-The-LBT-LFN

Ecstatically happy with the feeding of that one (as I say, "like greased eel boogers"), but have started moving over to the similarly-profiled, but tumble lube Ranch Dog bevel base. The LBT at shoots at least as well as Winchester hardball - the shooter more likely being the limiting factor.

You'll find a lot of good info in both threads on how the 1911 feeds from its magazines, magazine design, seating depth, bullet shape, throat interaction, crimping, etc..., and that you absolutely DO NOT need a tradiitional round nose to make a 1911 happy - especially not a gun with opened ramps like all 5" Springfields. There are slugs you will find a lot more fun against kinetic targets than plain RN that have no issues in 1911's big or small once you understand the quirks.

[tazman]

I read through the links you provided. Interesting material. I may need to work with some lighter or different shaped boolits later. For now at the start, I want easy and simple. Also to pretty much match hardball feeding and accuracy.

[wv109323]

I have the RCBS RN and it works fine. I don't think it would make any difference in brand.
I would consider a 200 gn. SWC as it is more accurate and is 15% less lead. The Range Officer should cycle the SWC.

[35remington]

BillB, there is every visual evidence of seating depth with a roundnose bullet. Try it with the barrel out of the gun before loading a bunch. Look to see the case has entered the chamber fully.

Record that overall length for future reference. Problem solved.

taz, decide whether you want a 2 radius or 1 radius bullet, or whether you want a bullet with a shoulder or not. Then choose accordingly. The 2 radius shoulderless bullet is the closest duplicate to ball but nobody has to go that way. I prefer to have the 2 radius. Overall length is therefore correct in terms of duplicating feeding characteristics of ball.

[LakeviewBulldog]

I second the Lee 452-230TC design. That was the easiest casting boolit and I had many thousand rounds downrange with no problems. I've heard a lot of people have a hard time with rounds nose 45ACP getting them to feed properly. Not saying that it can't be done, just a little trickier.

[35remington]

Given the 1911 was originally intended to function with a roundnose bullet, if said bullets mimic the original ball shape in any substantial way "feeding problems" have more to do with the guy assembling the ammo than the bullet.

It is only "tricky" if one does not have any idea of what they are doing.

[GhostHawk]

I have the Lee .452 230 gr round nose and love it in my SA 1911.

I agree with the poster who said pull the barrel. Play with a dummy cartridge until you find a setting where they audibly plunk into place. Then load and test some.

Titewad with 230gr lead bullet, 2.8 to 3.3 grains titewad, 3.3 + MAX, do not exceed!
My normal load is 3.5 to 4 grains of Red Dot/promo under the 230 gr boolit.

If you get sooty cases go up half a grain. Happened to me at 3, cleaned right up at 3.5 with light recoil and not much muzzle flip.

I lube with 2 light coats of BLL and have never noticed smoke. As to smell, well the smell of burned Red Dot in the morning is growing on me. :)

[tazman]

After a bit of research, I am looking at the Lyman 452374 and the Lee TL452-230-2R. These two look like they will closely duplicate the feed characteristics of hardball.
I like the Lee molds I currently own so I am leaning toward the Lee in a six cavity. Also the TL has a slight ledge at the front of the drive band which should make chambering easier.
I have had excellent results from Lee TL style boolits in my 38 special revolvers. Poor results in my 9mm.
How do they work in the 45 ACP?

[Greg S]

I haven't started casting 230 RN but anything I load picked up commercially I run with 5.9 gr Unique +/- to stay in an 830 to 850 window. If you were going for abit slower, I'd look at TG. I haven't tried it but was looking at it hard about two years ago but haven't had the time to shoot up my reserves. The reasoning is that I think it'll burn alittle cleaner than Unique and 231 which is also another good powder.

[ShooterAZ]

I use this RCBS 230RN in the 45ACP, but mostly in my S&W 625 because they feed better from moon clips . I use mainly 200 gr SWC's in my auto's.


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[DougGuy]

Taz, if you size the round nose boolit to .451" the Range Officer will run right out of the box without having to seat deeper than stated COA. If you size to .452" for a better boolit-to-barrel fit, you will need the barrel throated because the RO is notorious for no freebore and no throat. It's a simple one-time operation that will make the RO run like a well oiled Singer sewing machine. Simple as that. It will also group very well after throating and you won't see any leading in the barrel.

Bigslug: Myself and Char-Gar both run the 452423, I seat mine out about .080" proud of the case mouth, well as long as I can seat it and the magazine still cycle it, and I have ZERO stoppages after throating the barrel. Char-Gar sent a barrel for the same throating treatment and his experience mirrors mine. Had you sent one during your quest to run the 452423 boolit, you would have a 1911 that would happily gobble up your load, seated out as long as the magazine will allow, and your threads would definitely have went in a different direction..

[DerekP Houston]

lee 230gr RN TL design worked great for me. I added some MP molds (#68 clone and 200gr HP) later but the RN design worked.

[samari46]

Years ago when I was much younger I and a bunch of buddies shot steel plate matches. Almost to a man all shot the 230 grain hard cast round nosed bullet. Never a failure to feed and accuracy was great. Frank

[Groo]

Groo here
I would search the web for commercial casters and get some different types to try.
I really like the SWC 200gr type.
Ps the gun will set the bullet length.
Make a round without crimp just short enough to fit in the mag.
Then remove barrel and drop the round in, it will be too long to fit.
Seat the bullet deeper until the case head is even with the barrel hood.[ that thingy that sticks out from the chamber end of the barrel]
This is the Max oal for your gun "WITH THAT BULLET".
If it has feeding problems, seat deeper.

[gwpercle]

Do not get the Lee 452-228-1R design. Something about the 1R nose that isn't right. The tumble lube version has a 2R nose and might be better.
My choice would be a Truncated Cone design , either the 230 or (my favorite ) the 200 grain design, in standard lube groove , I don't tumble lube my boolits.
The Lyman mould design 452374 follows the original hardball profile and is also a good one.
Gary

[Wasalmonslayer]

If you want a good all around mold that casts like a dream and shoots to the point of aim in every 45 I have tried it in take a look at this mold.

Arsenal 452 230 RF http://arsenalmolds.com/image/cache/catalog/45%20cal%20-230%20gr-500x500.JPG

[CASTER OF LEAD]

I have the Lee .452 230 gr round nose and love it in my SA 1911.

I agree with the poster who said pull the barrel. Play with a dummy cartridge until you find a setting where they audibly plunk into place. Then load and test some.

Titewad with 230gr lead bullet, 2.8 to 3.3 grains titewad, 3.3 + MAX, do not exceed!
My normal load is 3.5 to 4 grains of Red Dot/promo under the 230 gr boolit.

If you get sooty cases go up half a grain. Happened to me at 3, cleaned right up at 3.5 with light recoil and not much muzzle flip.

I lube with 2 light coats of BLL and have never noticed smoke. As to smell, well the smell of burned Red Dot in the morning is growing on me. :)

+1 on your Red dot load, aND the 2 coats of BLL. I also concur with the smell of burnt Red dot, be it morning, noon , or evening. Even smells good after dark. I guess I am just weird that way. �� - CASTER

[sghart3578]

Tazman,

A lot of really good info in this thread.

I cast the Lee TL452-230-2R, sized to .451" and 2 X BLL. Over 5.0 gr of Bullseye it runs in my Auto Ordnance, my Kimber and my son's HK USP. It is accurate as heck. I do dial the taper crimp down a little to ensure a good plunk test. I seat the bullet at 1.23" OAL if I remember right. The top of the tumble lube bands are right at the rim of the case mouth.

I also like the Lee 452-200-SWC. It may be a touch more accurate but they are both good.


Steve in N CA

[TexasGrunt]

I shoot 90% 200 gr SWC in all my .45 ACP 1911 pistols. The other 10% is now my NOE hollow point.

The 200 gr gets 4.5 gr of WST and the NOE gets 5 gr Bullseye.

[35remington]

The 230-2R is correctly seated at near 1.265." Much shorter and the first band is below the case mouth. Since the nose shape mimics ball, so should the overall length, which approximates pretty closely to 1.265" in factory/military ball ammo.

[tazman]

Well, I went a little crazy today and started the waiting period for a Springfield Armory Mil Spec 45 ACP(parkerized). I found a new one with a great trigger and fitted tight.
I ordered the Lee TL452-230-2R and the Lee 452-200-SWC both in 6 cavity along with a .452 sizing kit.
I picked up a brick of primers at a gun show today and a small bag of brass. When it all gets here I will be set to go.
The crazy part was I started the waiting period for a Range officer in 9mm(stainless) as well.
I get to put in for the extra mags and holster on the Springfield Armory site while the special is still running.