Want to set up a double pot system over/ under

[Drew P]

I've seen a couple casting setups where a fellow was feeding one pot with another pot in an over/under arrangement to premelt the lead and get it up to temp. I'd like to set up something like this. I'm currently using my lee 4/20 pot that's been heavily modified and it works great, just don't like the temp fluctuations from sprues and ingots. So, I'm considering a second 4/20 pot, or possibly a 10 lb production pot and feeding it from above with my 4/20. I'd be adding a pid to the lower pot if I go this route, so I'd only benefit from it if the valve is a lot superior to the 4/20 (I modified the valve also on the4/20) The other benefit of this system would be a constant level in the casting pot which regulates the flow rate into the mold. This flow rate can vary by quite a lot depending on the lead height in the pot.

does anyone know of any examples of this I can see? A google search didn't turn much up.

My concerns are that the upper pot will splash when it pours into the lower pot.

Im even thinking about float valves like toilets have to auto-feed the lower pot. Crazy?

[Dusty Bannister]

Unless you are dedicated to tinkering, I would suggest the KISS principle. Use the 4/20 as the primary PID controlled pot. Reverse the base on the 4/10 pot and clamp it to a shelf just above the 4/20 and locate the nozzle over the rear 1/3 of the larger pot. You can get it pretty close to the surface of the lower pot so splash should be minimal. Add your ingots to the upper pot to bring them close to temp and manually refresh the lower pot. The PID and larger capacity of the lower pot will reduce the temp fluctuations due to more mass of alloy.

If your needs change, remove the upper pot, return the base to the normal position and cast on....

[BUCKEYE BANDIT]

Man,I like the idea,sadly my back can only tolerate so much sitting.

[PaulG67]

This how I set up my double pot. For the pot on top you need to turn the base around and screw it down to hold it from toppling over, easy enough and very secure.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/PaulGauthier/Lee%20Double%20pot/IMG_0108.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/PaulGauthier/media/Lee%20Double%20pot/IMG_0108.jpg.html)

[country gent]

I ran 2 Lee 10lb pots for several years. I made a wood stand for the top that put it above the lower one with it reversed on the original base and bolted to the stand. This worked very well I made a light rod to support the handle when filling the lower pot so it didn't have to be held the whole time. Leave enough room for the between the pots to wok the rod with a screw driver. I ran from the bottom pot casting and when I reached the half way point filled it from the upper then added ingots to the upper.Just before refilling I fluxed the upper pot and dumped.

[Mike W1]

Similar to country gent I run 2 10# pots. Lower one slides back and forth but use a small hook and chain to hold valve open while refilling. Recently added a small depth gauge to indicate fill level and also how far to empty before refilling. Seems to help flow control somewhat by only needing 5 ingots to refill. Top spout clears bottom pot by about 1/4" and no issue with splashing of lead.
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u310/Mike4245/HPIM1520_zpsa4ceea64.jpg
http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u310/Mike4245/HPIM1074_zps5c554f8a.jpg

[catskinner]

I used a double pot set up several years ago. Rigged an adjustable linkage from the control handle on the bottom pot to the handle on the top one. Kept the level in the bottom pot at the same level all the time. Just drop ingots in the top pot as needed and the bottom stayed at the same level and with a thermometer in the bottom the temperature stayed the same all the while.

[runfiverun]

I thought about the double pot thing, then just bought a 40 lb pot and stopped thinking about it.

[Bzcraig]

You dirty rotten scoundrels! I didn't know it needed double pots!

[country gent]

The plus to the double pots is done right you never run out of lead and can cast all day. The top pot is the melt pot and the bottom is the cast pot. A lot of our solder pots at work had this same type set up a pre heat melt side and a run side.

[Drew P]

Interesting thanks folks. Yes catskinner the linkage to mirror the pour is a great idea!

Mike W1 do you cast with the lower pot slid back and slide it forward for stirring and maintenance or? Also, are those round things handles on the side of the block? Cool setup.

[Drew P]

Man,I like the idea,sadly my back can only tolerate so much sitting.
Partly my motive. I'm looking to lessen the wait times and fussing about withmold temps. Want to streamline the stream-line. So sessions can be shorter.

[Mike W1]

Interesting thanks folks. Yes catskinner the linkage to mirror the pour is a great idea!

Mike W1 do you cast with the lower pot slid back and slide it forward for stirring and maintenance or? Also, are those round things handles on the side of the block? Cool setup.

Actually I slide it back to refill, forward to cast. Those are little handles to assist and guides on the side. All screwed securely and the rounded front floor lets me slightly move the mold to center the lead flow. Any drips are easily swept into the catch box in front. Have about a 1/4" drop to the sprue hole and another plate made up to keep that same spacing on Lee molds when I use them. It just fits over the permanent one with a slot on front and a retaining screw.

[bullseye67]

Good morning,
I thought about the 2 pot system. My biggest concern is putting cold ingots into a hot pot....don't need a visit from the "Tinsel Fairy"!! I cast year round. At the old house I had a heated space for casting, not at the this house and it can get down to 35F on cold days in the garage. Ingots sweat condensation at that temp.
I have been using a hot plate to pre-heat molds for years. Now I place a layer of ingots on the hot-plate and add hot ingots to the pot. I cast out about 2lbs of lead and add a couple of hot ingots. I haven't noticed any big fluctuations like when I added 5 or 6 ingots and had to wait for things to get back to temp. The boolits are very consistent in weight. I cast a lot of 30 cal 200gr. and weight sorting from a 2 cavity Lyman mold they are less than 1gr apart. Last session I cast 412 30 cal boolits and 7 were outside of the 208-209gr. window. By keeping the pot 3/4's full the flow is the same. I use a 10lb pot for harder alloy and a 20lb pot for my 30WW/70 pure pistol mix. I have had piles of boolits that weighted more than 50lbs in a session and never had to wait for ingots to melt. My way is not the only way, just how I do it and it works!!:drinks:

[Drew P]

Two problems I've had with the hot plate preheat system for ingots is that if the ingot gets too hot on the plate, well, you know. The other problem is that even a hot ingot going into the pot will have to pass through his the phase change state from solid to liquid. This takes a lot of energy to pass through, so the pot temp will fall. Maybe using smaller ingots would help but even my sprue pile drags the pot temp down more than I'd like. This is where the 40lb pot helps, bigger mass of lead to absorb the changes, but, I dunno I kinda like the dual heat zone concept of two pots. I'm not worried about cold ingots into the pot, I keep my ingots climate controlled and I put them in slowly. So far only some mild bubbling has happened.

[country gent]

IWhen I used the 2 pot system I had a system or procedure that worked very well for me. My 3 1/2 lb ingots were roughly 8" long so I filled both 10 lb pots then when melted set 3-4 over the top pot to heat and hold heat in. When the top pot was dropped down these ingots were used to fill it again ( being hot channel locks were used) and then replaced with more. The 2 pot system works well and can make for some long sessions with little time down for new lead.

[Mike W1]

Hot plate is PID controlled and set at 390° F which gets my mold up to about 330° by the time pots are up to temp. Checked some ingots on there the other day and were at 350°. Those little shelves on my pots will get them up to 260° so they also see some use. I don't drain the bottom pot quite as far as I used to as I've found better weight consistency if I don't. Used to take right at 2 minutes to refill when I did drain it further which gave me a little smoke break. Only lose a couple degrees filling and could probably just kick the top PID a bit higher but that little doesn't really bother so have just kept both pots set the same. Ingots are just the regular pound or so ones and use a small channel lock to lower them in too. I put the sprues in when I've finished casting and whatever ingots necessary to top things off. Next session turn everything on and in 20 minutes everything is a go. First bullets out are good ones thanks to the hot plate and the pots have stayed clean since nothing but bees wax ever go in them.

[Loudy13]

Well I was thinking about using my old 10lb pot for this and now I think you have convinced me to do so.

[mjkonopka]

Has anyone used a satans little smelter as a top pot? I was thinking that could feed into a Lee bottom pour pot, you would never run out of molten lead.

[Elmo]

I use a Lyman dip pot on top and a hotplate to warm molds and ingots and a RCBS bottom pour pot for casting all three adjusted to same temperature. I leave the ladle floating in the Lyman so it stays to temp. The last casting was some 500 grain .45 bullets. About 2% rejects due to 2+Or- grain variations.
Elmo

[fredj338]

I thought about the double pot thing, then just bought a 40 lb pot and stopped thinking about it.

^^^THIS^^^ I have a Magma caster & it will take 10# of ingots before it drops temps enough to stop casting. I always keep the pot at least 1/2 full.
I find preheating ingots on the top of the pot works fine for my LEE 4-20, just add them often, never let the pot get below 3/4 full. When I dump sprues pretty often. The time it takes to get back to temp is enough to allow the mold to cool a bit. Too much over thinking.

[D Crockett]

I have been using a Magma master caster for years now I keep it 3/4 full at all times no pre heating I just slide the ingot in the pot and if it starts to sizzle I just pull up on it for a few seconds then go on putting it in the 40 lb pot there is little if any temp difference and I can cast all day if I care to D Crockett

[Master Samwise]

Thanks guys , I just found this thread and found it useful

[Master Samwise]

Funny I have an old 10# production pot and just bought a 4-20 that hasn't even been fired up yet. I'm out of lead!

[Master Samwise]

the 10# pro pot I have is really gunked up at the spout and found that a full replacement pot liner is about $10 but it looks like it has a newer screw type spout. I thought about trying to change it to the 4/20 handle since the 10# diagonal bar drives me crazy.

[MT Chambers]

Great idea, the top one leaks into the bottom one, but what does the bottom one leak into?