Wolves again

[starmac]

WELL I finally got to lay eyes on the black wolves my boss has seen on the log road a few times.
I just got a glimpse of the large one, but got a pretty good, but quick look at the smaller of the two.
If the gray was with them I didn't see it, but they had fresh tracks on and off the road where they had worked probably 3 miles of it.
I saw them at 16.5 mile, at 6.5 mile there was a fresh moose kill, that I don't think was there friday.
Just a calf with not much left but head and backbone, no tracks around it from today though.

There were two elderly, as in pretty much antique women at 2 mile that had walked in walking their dogs, I told them that the wolves were quite a ways down the road today, but they would probably think them dogs looked downright tasty. lol

[Idaho45guy]

We're thick with wolves down here. On a moose hunt last year, sign was everywhere and the elk wouldn't bugle during the day. My neighbor spotted one walking down the street in front of my house. My daughter saw one a couple miles out of town running along the ridge last Summer, and I've seen a couple while driving. My brother came upon one in a leg trap last Fall while hunting... Took some good pictures...

190408

[54bore]

These are some harsh critters! They have played hell on our elk population. Idaho use to sell out EVERY single out of state elk tag, now they try and sell the out of state tags to us locals as a second tag. Who would want to pay the HUGE out of state fee to come hunt an area destroyed by wolves? Moose are not far from extinct around here now days, use to see LOTS N LOTS of moose about everywhere i went around here, now i see maybe a dozen a year if that? Been that way for the last few years. With the moose its a combination of over hunting them, and wolves, moose are easier targets for wolves than elk

[Idaho45guy]

These are some harsh critters! They have played hell on our elk population. Idaho use to sell out EVERY single out of state elk tag, now they try and sell the out of state tags to us locals as a second tag. Who would want to pay the HUGE out of state fee to come hunt an area destroyed by wolves? Moose are not far from extinct around here now days, use to see LOTS N LOTS of moose about everywhere i went around here, now i see maybe a dozen a year if that? Been that way for the last few years. With the moose its a combination of over hunting them, and wolves, moose are easier targets for wolves than elk

Yep. I grew up in Idaho and bought a house in Washington a couple of years ago. I buy the Idaho non-resident fishing license, but don't bother with hunting. I go with my dad and brother every year and help them.

We had nearly 1000lbs of meat last year between dad's moose, and my brother's elk and deer. Oh, and a bear.

Local dirty hippies are still in denial and swear that wolves aren't impacting elk populations. Idiots...

[zymguy]

Lots of wolves here too (Ely MN) . They pick a few dogs up outta back yards every year, they are not the ONLY reason our moose are in decline.

[Plate plinker]

Ely sauna house. :2 drunk buddies: Then back to the lake. [smilie=2:

What else happening to da moose? Poachers?

[54bore]

Yep. I grew up in Idaho and bought a house in Washington a couple of years ago. I buy the Idaho non-resident fishing license, but don't bother with hunting. I go with my dad and brother every year and help them.

We had nearly 1000lbs of meat last year between dad's moose, and my brother's elk and deer. Oh, and a bear.

Local dirty hippies are still in denial and swear that wolves aren't impacting elk populations. Idiots...

Really good friend of mine that traps, involved in an organization to help fund trappers etc. He went on a call that some hunters had seen a bull moose in a particular area that was messed up, they couldn't tell what was wrong? But knew something wasn't right with the bull? They seen wolf sign all over the area, my friend showed up and walked out an old abandoned logging grade, the bull was laying down in the grade, my friend thought he was dead? The closer he got, the bull stood up, my friend said there was a good 30-40 pounds of meat eaten from his hind quarters. Wolves are no joke predator! In my opinion the only good one is a dead one!!! I am not the only one that thinks that around here, they are being dealt with to the best of abilities :D

[Hickory]

Local dirty hippies are still in denial and swear that wolves aren't impacting elk populations. Idiots...

Where do these people think the wolves go to eat, Burger King?

[jsizemore]

Ely sauna house. :2 drunk buddies: Then back to the lake. [smilie=2:

What else happening to da moose? Poachers?

http://www.startribune.com/in-saving-minnesota-s-moose-scientific-breakthroughs-and-difficult-choices/365163651/

[starmac]

http://www.startribune.com/in-saving-minnesota-s-moose-scientific-breakthroughs-and-difficult-choices/365163651/

Millions of dollars are spent denying the impact wolves have on game.
3/4's of the collared calves were killed by predators before that part of the study was abandoned, that be a nice word for wolves, don't you know.
I'm not the best at math, but if my calculations, that would be 30 out of 40, so their days are severely numbered if everything else was perfect.

[M-Tecs]

They can claim all the **** they want but the bottom line is that the moose and deer decline is only happening in the area's wolves have been reintroduced. One of the local TV stations tracked a bunch of moose cows. 50% of the calves were killed by wolves in the first week.

[Loudenboomer]

I struggle with wolves on my land too. Our laws are created in the big cities where all I hear is how beautiful and majestic wolves are. Makes me want to export about 50 to one of the parks in the city. Give the wolves a little while to do what wolves do best and we'll se how beautiful and majestic they are!
We would be far better of with liberal federal judges out of the wolf business. States are much more apt to have a finger on the pulse of local wolf populations.

[w5pv]

The old timers had a reason to eradicate the wolves,yotes,and other predators and now the tree huggers and cry babies want to re introduce them to kill off a viable herd of elk,deer and other animals.

[54bore]

The key here is Reintroduced, Our Elk and Moose learned to live with the original true Native Idaho wolf that has lived here forever, been that way forever and worked in harmony! AWESOME elk and Moose numbers, But then they decide to 'Reintroduce' a Hybrid, These things are GIANTS compared to the original Native Idaho wolf, The elk and Moose simply can NOT deal with them! Our elk here in northern Idaho run in Small little bunches, 8-10 is a BIG herd, 4-6 is the normal number. These 'Reintroduced Hybrid wolves' find a little herd of elk and live with them until every single elk is dead, Then off to find another little group of elk to wipe out. Ad in a bad winter of 5-6 ft of snow (like this year) some rain and then lock up and freeze, creates a hard cap on top of the snow that a dog, wolf, coyote can literally RUN WIDE OPEN ON, but deer, elk, and Moose fall through, The wolves, and coyotes have a literal field day with them! The Game Dept knows good and well that the wolves are a HORRIBLE problem here and have costed them a literal FORTUNE in NON sales of non resident elk tags, There is a reason You can get 5 Wolf tags a piece here in Idaho!

[54bore]

Idea of what these 'Reintroduced Hybrid Wolves' look like, how big they are. Hell of a thing to DUMP on our Elk and Moose huh? They Don't stand a chance against these things

190421 190422 190424

[starmac]

The long range plan behind the introduction of wolves is to decimate the game enough to where eventually people stops hunting. The plan is working as intended.

[54bore]

The long range plan behind the introduction of wolves is to decimate the game enough to where eventually people stops hunting. The plan is working as intended.

I couldn't agree more starmac!!

[bedbugbilly]

I'm from lower Michigan so educate me a little. When Michigan was settled in the 1830's, I've read first hand accounts of how people couldn't go out after dark due to the Wolf packs roaming and one in particular that i remember reading, was how a guy didn't get back to his cabin in time so had to spend the night up a tree watching the Wolves circling below.

I can only imagine what these things do to the elk, moose & deer as well as livestock or snatching dogs up for finger food. For those of you in the areas where these things are becoming a nuisance - when you're hunting or hiking or just working on the farm - are they aggressive towards humans or are they skittish? I'm sure a situation could arise and I would think that they would be more aggressive if in a pack rather than a single one but I'm just curious as to whether there have been incidents of messing with people? Of course I'm sure much of it would not be in the media.

I grew up on a large farm in southern Michigan back in the 50's and early 60's. We hunted and "roamed" all the time but we never had coyotes. Now, they are all over the place. We live on the back side of the farm and last summer, my wife took our two little dogs out the first thing in the morning before sunrise. She came running back in with them as where we walk them, a pack of coyotes had bedded down for the night and when she came out, they suddenly raised a ruckus - enough that it scared the begetters out of her as she knew they would go after the dogs. I have spotted single coyotes out in the fields but they remain pretty skittish and unfortunately, they were in spots where I couldn't shoot with a rifle due to houses int he background, etc.

54bore - thanks for the photos. Those are unbelievable! One can only imagine the impact of them on the wildlife herds or domestic livestock. Sort of makes you want to use the 3S method of control . . "shoot, shovel and shut up". There are too many fools make decisions about things they know nothing about.

[shdwlkr]

54 bore
I am of the opinion that the only good wolf or coyote is a dead one. I am in southwest Idaho and when I do draw a tag hunt in south east Idaho as that is where a friend of mine grew up. Yep I am busted up enough I don't hunt alone, life has a way of messing with a guy having a good time out in the woods. Have never cared if I got what I was hunting more enjoyment from being where I can't see, smell or hear others, but nature. We can only hope one day we have the wolf and coyote population down to where we have game animals to hunt, maybe if the wild pigs make it here to Idaho the wolfs and coyotes will find out that it is like to be hunted by another animal.

[54bore]

54 bore
I am of the opinion that the only good wolf or coyote is a dead one. I am in southwest Idaho and when I do draw a tag hunt in south east Idaho as that is where a friend of mine grew up. Yep I am busted up enough I don't hunt alone, life has a way of messing with a guy having a good time out in the woods. Have never cared if I got what I was hunting more enjoyment from being where I can't see, smell or hear others, but nature. We can only hope one day we have the wolf and coyote population down to where we have game animals to hunt, maybe if the wild pigs make it here to Idaho the wolfs and coyotes will find out that it is like to be hunted by another animal.

My dad use to hunt southeast Idaho, the Diamond creek unit I believe its called? He did AMAZING back in the day there, about 20 years ago now. You had to go in from Wyoming, you needed permission from farmers to get in there the way I understood it?

[54bore]

bedbugbilly, i dont hear of problems with people contact and wolves in my immediate area, we have mountain ranges, after mountain ranges that are inaccessible unless you hoof it in, wolves are an incredibly intelligent, reclusive critter. They live amongst the elk and moose picking them off. With a pack of wolves, you shoot or trap one and you just further educated the rest of them, making the chances of getting anymore from that bunch EXTREMELY difficult to nearly impossible. Coyotes are a very intelligent critter as well, but wolves make them look stupid! Coyotes are a major problem around my immediate area on deer, they kill a TON of these deer! Ive witnessed it, there are IDIOTS that think coyotes wont/cant kill deer, they are DEAD WRONG! Rough winters with crusted top snow allows them to run across it like concrete, deer are stuck in it and have to plow their way through, they are already thin and exhaust easily from malnutrition (harsh winters and scarce food) Coyotes have a field day with them!! Then springtime comes and the does are heavy with Fawns, they can't run forever, coyotes kill a ton of deer this way as well.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Here in Michigan up in Lake Superior on Isle Royale park out in the lake DNR officials are planning on `planting` more wolves on the island. Seems they only found 2 wolves left to keep the animals in check (moose, elk and deer) there. Haven`t heard where they plan on relocating wolves from, probably from in the West.Robert

[dualsport]

Maybe it's time for some civil disobidiance. (SP?) There are many examples of very bad laws being forced on us. Get to it, I say. Make SsS a full time job. Hopefully some relief is coming with the new sheriff in town. Together we can help the prey animals out.

[Hickory]

Idea of what these 'Reintroduced Hybrid Wolves' look like, how big they are. Hell of a thing to DUMP on our Elk and Moose huh? They Don't stand a chance against these things

190421 190422 190424

You could fit grandma and a little girl with an basket of goodies inside one of them wolves.

[ghh3rd]

Just checked - I didn’t know they got this big! And they are fast...

Gray wolf - Canis lupus

2.6 – 2.8 ft. (Adult, At Shoulder)
31 – 37 mph (Running)
Male: 66 – 180 lbs (Adult), Female: 51 – 120 lbs (Adult)

Currently in the lower 48 United States, about 2,600 gray wolves exist, with nearly 2,000 in Minnesota (compared to the few hundred living there in the mid-20th century).

[xs11jack]

What I don't understand is if that the wolves are decimating the moose population now, why in the bygone years weren't the moose extinct?
Ole Jack

[ShooterAZ]

Well here in Northern AZ they re-introduced the Mexican Wolves. They started it in eastern AZ, and the ranchers are none too happy about it. I was coyote calling back in December when one came loping in. First time I ever saw one. They are expanding their range I'm told, we'll be seeing more I'm sure.

[bedbugbilly]

54bore - thank you for the info - very interesting. Like many things in government, it seems like there is an overabundance of experts who seem to think they know what is best for those who live with the problem after they create it. I really do feel for you guys. Hopefully the new sheriff will get rid of a lot of the nonsense that goes on - his announcement about all of his departments having to cut 20% is a great announcement as far as I'm concerned. While nobody likes to see anyone loose their job, it's about time the fat was trimmed and who knows, maybe most of them will have to go to the private sector and actually have to work for a change?

My thoughts were, when I started reading this thread, was "more wolves, less game". Maybe we should start cutting more timber and go with the thought of "less trees . . . less treehuggers"? :-)

[starmac]

Actually you cut the trees to benefit wildlife, moose most especially.
Around here they even have a timber sale where you cut it every which a way and leave it lay.
Down trees crisscrossing, It is a bear to try and walk through these sales for years. They call these types of sales grouse sales, as they are great grouse habitat.

[Idaho45guy]

Just checked - I didn’t know they got this big! And they are fast...

Gray wolf - Canis lupus

2.6 – 2.8 ft. (Adult, At Shoulder)
31 – 37 mph (Running)
Male: 66 – 180 lbs (Adult), Female: 51 – 120 lbs (Adult)

Currently in the lower 48 United States, about 2,600 gray wolves exist, with nearly 2,000 in Minnesota (compared to the few hundred living there in the mid-20th century).

The official wolf population numbers being cited by the dirty hippies and the government are so laughably off base that it begs one to believe there is outright fraud going on.

The "official" number of wolves in Idaho is around 700.


Yet some experts believe the number is in excess of 4k.


What makes me believe the higher numbers are the hunting results. Of the dozens of hunters I know in Idaho, only a handful have seen an actual wolf. They have seen a ton of sign and kills, but wolves are very elusive. To have hunters taken 198 wolves and trappers another 104 in 2014 means that they managed to kill around 42% of the supposed population. Yet the big game populations preyed on by the wolves continue to drop...?

[54bore]

What I don't understand is if that the wolves are decimating the moose population now, why in the bygone years weren't the moose extinct?
Ole Jack

These are Hybrid wolves, totally different critter than the native wolf, the native wolf is much smaller. These Hybrids are GIANTS

[country gent]

Ohio reintroduced coyotes a few years ago and they are thriving the pheasant Rabbit and other small game is showing this. Even with the light winters weve had the numbers are way down. I have heard of a few wolf sightings but nothing really documented. Badgers are now protected in Ohio. Next they'll be adding to the woodchuck population

[zymguy]

Here in Michigan up in Lake Superior on Isle Royale park out in the lake DNR officials are planning on `planting` more wolves on the island. Seems they only found 2 wolves left to keep the animals in check (moose, elk and deer) there. Haven`t heard where they plan on relocating wolves from, probably from in the West.Robert
I talked to a bilogist here in ely, 2 of thee forest service airplanes live here.The biologist was waiting for a break in the weather to get flown to isleroyal. at that time MI deemed it unconstitutional to spend the money to intruduce more wolves. Sounded like they wanted to trap the wolves here near ely

[starmac]

Do you have a link to where Ohio introduced coyotes? It is hard to belive that they would be intentionally introduced, when they have travelled all the way to the east coast and up to Alaska all by themselves.

The big wolves that were introduced to Idaho and Mt and probably other states too were Canadian and Alaska wolves, which tend to be much larger than the spanish wolves introduced in some southern states.

They claimed they were endangered, which is one excuse for introducing them, the Canadian and Alaskan wolves have never been endangered, in fact anybody can trap and shoot them in Alaska, I know they are trapped in Canada too.

[zymguy]

Ely sauna house. :2 drunk buddies: Then back to the lake. [smilie=2:

What else happening to da moose? Poachers?

researchers killed more of the moose they collard than the wolves last time they collared a large group. Chase them to exhation with a helicopter . they never really recovered from the stress

[54bore]

The big wolves that were introduced to Idaho and Mt and probably other states too were Canadian and Alaska wolves, which tend to be much larger than the spanish wolves introduced in some southern states.

They claimed they were endangered, which is one excuse for introducing them, the Canadian and Alaskan wolves have never been endangered, in fact anybody can trap and shoot them in Alaska, I know they are trapped in Canada too.

EXACTLY! These BIG ******** are a completely different critter than our 'little Native wolf' Our elk and Moose learned over the years how to fend off and deal with our Native wolves, Sure they killed plenty of calves, adults, etc. but the balance was there, We had thriving herds of Elk, and Moose. Then they introduce this GIANT killing machine, Now days most of our Elk live right down here amongst us, in farmers fields, etc. You head back in the hills in search of Elk, Good luck to ya! I hunted HARD last year during Sept archery (I put an EASY average of 6 miles under my boots a day, and thats being conservative) i heard 1 Bull elk bugle the ENTIRE season!! 5-6 years ago you could hear MULTIPLE Bulls EVERY SINGLE DAY through the month of September, every decent size mountain range you could get a Bull elk to fire off at you with a Bugle, NOT ANYMORE!! I hear folks talk about the Elk going Silent and Not Bugling due to wolves, I dont doubt this, but i can tell you from in the woods daily experience, the Elk and Moose numbers are PATHETICALLY POOR! 5-6 years ago you could take someone out that had never seen a Moose and show them NUMEROUS Moose a day, NOT ANYMORE! You are lucky to see 1 Single Moose all season! I seen a young yearling Moose last fall in the Rd with its tongue hanging out of its mouth, I probably spooked whatever was after him? The little fella stood there til i finally had no choice but to go, i made it around him, I'd bet anything that after i got gone whatever was after him got back after him. THINK ABOUT THIS: Idaho use to sell out EVERY SINGLE out of state Elk Tag, if you were an out of state hunter and wanted to hunt our Elk you had to be by a phone the morning these Non resident elk tags became available so you could call in and secure a tag!! In the last few years they can NOT give these tags away!! The Elk and Moose are in DEEP trouble here

But remember you can buy 5 wolf tags LOL! Houston, i think we have a problem!!

[Idaho45guy]

Plenty of moose in unit 10A where my dad drew a tag... His bull made Boone & Crockett...

190496

[54bore]

Idaho45guy, Not the case in Unit 1, from the Pend Oreille river all the way to Canada.

[Idaho45guy]

Idaho45guy, Not the case in Unit 1, from the Pend Oreille river all the way to Canada.



I believe you. I fish the Couer D'Alene river 27 miles North of the Kingston exit off of 90 up by Prichard Creek. Middle of Unit 4. Dad and brother hunted for elk there last fall and saw exactly 1 elk and 2-3 wolf kills. Talked to guys that have been hunting that area for decades and said it's the worst it's ever been with wolf sign everywhere and no elk.

I have family in Bonners Ferry and Naples but they're too old to hunt anymore.

[birch]

We have two wolf packs in state land near my house in northern lower MI. We can hear them howling sometimes. I have a gun when we hunt mushrooms in the spring.

[Half Dog]

190421 190422 190424

WOW!!! I have never imagined a canine that large.