safe/fast way to fire off primed cases?

[Andy]

Anyone know of a simple way to fire off primers from primed cases that you don't own a firearm for? Or that don't easily chamber unloaded for whatever reason.

I have some oddball primed brass I would like to sell/ship and have enough of it that I might as well figure out a way to do this. The primers prevent you from shipping usps which kills the deal cost-wise so firing them off is more economical.

Was wondering if anyone has come up with a way to safely/easily detonate or remove the primers in an empty case.

My first thought would be to make a mechanism that holds a standard shellholder and strikes through the hole in it to fire the primer, but without anything containing the case so it couldn't be called a firearm. Is this idea valid? Do you think it would be completely safe providing the cases are visually inspected to make sure nothing is in them beforehand? I wouldn't think there is any pressure with the case mouth completely open to the world.

Any thoughts or other workable solutions would be appreciated, maybe I am overthinking this and there is a much easier way. I have deprimed brass on a press with a plywood shield before but never felt great about it and thought there must be a better way.

[Paper Puncher]

Spray them with wd40 let sit overnight and deprime with a lee universal deprimimg tool.

Wear eye protection and ear muffs just in case.

[rancher1913]

you can ship primed brass with no hazmat, its only loaded rounds that are a no no.

[NavyVet1959]

When I first started reloading, it was with .357 mag. To deprime the brass, I used a 1/16" punch. I took a block of wood and drilled a hole slightly smaller than the outer diameter of a nut whose inside threaded opening was large enough for the primer to go through. I might have drilled out the thread, but I don't remember. The hole only needs to be as deep as the thickness of the nut. Place the nut over the hole and with a tap or two of a hammer, the nut will set into the block of wood. Drill a smaller hole through the center of the nut so that the primers can drop through. Then position the cartridge over the hole and drive the primer out. If I was doing it with live primers though, I would probably use something that provided a steady even pressure instead of the impact that would be generated by a hammer and punch.

[farmerjim]

Lee universal depriming tool. Eye and ear protection. I have deprimed thousands of live primers and not a one went off. But it does rarely happen.

[44man]

Loaded or primed brass can be shipped. No hazmat on either.

[Soundguy]

Lee universal depriming tool. Eye and ear protection. I have deprimed thousands of live primers and not a one went off. But it does rarely happen.


Agreed.. I've deprimed plenty.. I go slow.. have yet to have one go off, though I know it does happen from time to time.

[maxreloader]

Rcbs has a "universal" decapper that worksile a regular die with the appropriate shell holder. Also barber makes a hand deprime unit.

[maxreloader]

Works like. Harvey, not barber. Cellphone autocorrect is strong today.

[Speedo66]

As mentioned, no hazmat fee for primed brass, ships the same as deprimed. You'll probably get a better price for it as well.

[M-Tecs]

Shipping primed brass is not a problem and legal with UPS and FedEx. With USPS it is a no go. About a year ago I checked all the references and they were still current.

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/mailing-shipping-primed-brass-the-regs-and-the-law.3812580/

After a ton of confusion, misinformation (on other blogs) and general assumptions regarding the shipment of primed brass, here are the particulars/facts and the regs that back it up. I have confirmed all of this with UPS and FedEx's hazmat shipping folks and they all confirmed.
FOR UPS AND FEDEX ONLY -
Cases, primed (up to and including 50 caliber) are regulated for shipment by ground only through 49CFR § 172.102 SP(special provision) 50 that states:
" Cases, cartridge, empty with primer which are made of metallic or plastic casings and meeting the classification criteria of Division 1.4 are not regulated for domestic transportation"
49CFR § 172.102 (page 312) - http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2010-title49-vol2/pdf/CFR-2010-title49-vol2-sec172-102.pdf
Primed cases meet the classification criteria of Division 1.4c UN0379 - however they are exempted and classified as NON-REGULATED (NOT ORM-D, NOT HAZ-MAT, NOT the new "Y" Limited Quantities classification that will replace ORM-D). Some manufacturers (as per the MSDS) classify their primed cases as UN0055, but the same DOT 1.4c classification applies, as does SP50.
Packaging for primed cases is regulated by 49CFR §173.62 - Packaging instruction #136, which specifies that the primed cases have to be in a bag or box, then packed in a UN 4G standard box - which is defined by 49 CFR §178.601 (g)(2). So - you can't just ship them to your buddy in a shoebox, but most of us out here have received boxes of reloading components from various vendors, and most/all of these shipping boxes meet this criteria. For more mind-bending regulatory details, refer to 178.601.
49CFR §173.62 - http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2011-title49-vol2/pdf/CFR-2011-title49-vol2-sec173-62.pdf
49 CFR §178.601 (g)(2) - http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2010-title49-vol2/pdf/CFR-2010-title49-vol2-sec178-601.pdf

There is no hazmat fee, extra paperwork, no sign-by-adult or other hoops to jump through - BUT - both UPS and FedEX advised me to clearly mark (with a sharpee) "non-regulated as per SP50" on the outside of the box to ensure that no in-transit problems occur..........because I guess their employees can be as confused as I have been on this subject and you don't want your box torn or ripped into.
As per both UPS and FedEx - You CANNOT take packages with primed cases to your local UPS/FedEx store or mom-and-pop drop off service. They must be taken to a UPS/FedEx corporate-run package hub that has walk-in/retail shipping services.
FOR US POSTAL SERVICE -
Prohibited. Period.
See page 160 at: http://pe.usps.com/cpim/ftp/pubs/pub52/pub52.pdf
***USPS Publication 52, Appendix A, "Cases, cartridge, empty with primer"***
They don't have to subscribe to all parts of 49CFR § 172.102's special provisions......because they are special I guess.

[Texas by God]

Lee decapping rod & base. Reuse the primers for plinking loads.

[lightman]

I've deprimed lots of cases with live primers with no problem. Just go slow and easy. Safety glasses and work gloves would be a good idea. If you have a universal depriming die you don't even have to have the correct shell holder. A larger one will work, or even setting the case on top of the ram will work. Oil may or may not kill the primer.

[6bg6ga]

Too many internet experts that simply aren't qualified to comment. Who woulda thunk?

[6bg6ga]

I'm not an expert but I have deprimed a number of cases with a Lee universal decapping die. Note* The only Lee tool I own that I use. :D I do have a 9mm taper crimp die that kicks up a burr on the cases.

I suggest that eye protection be used and you don't try to hammer it/slam it in the act of depriming it.

[Walter Laich]

I run these cases through my dillon sdb slowly while catching the primers for reuse (I'm cheap)

Works for me just fine

[country gent]

Pick up one of the Hand depriming tools or make one I have one thats like a set of pliers I made, theres the pope style and the Harvey(?) a you can set in the easy chair depriming the brass. Ill try and post a pic here shortly

[country gent]

190095Heres the Pic of the one I made with simple hand tools and a drill press.

[mac60]

Like a lot of others, I've deprimed hundreds of live primers over the years - I've actually had 1 detonate inside the depriming die. It was a non event if ever there was one. I have no reservations about doing it anymore. I just go slow as already has been mentioned.

[308Jeff]

Like a lot of others, I've deprimed hundreds of live primers over the years - I've actually had 1 detonate inside the depriming die. It was a non event if ever there was one. I have no reservations about doing it anymore. I just go slow as already has been mentioned.

I've never had one go off while depriming, but I did have one go off while priming with the Lee hand priming tool. Now that was exciting.

Totally my fault. Was a crimped pocket that I must not have swaged well enough. Primer was part way in and stopped. I forced it. It was loud.

[mac60]

I've never had one go off while depriming, but I did have one go off while priming with the Lee hand priming tool. Now that was exciting.

Totally my fault. Was a crimped pocket that I must not have swaged well enough. Primer was part way in and stopped. I forced it. It was loud.

What did it do to the tool?

[M-Tecs]

What did it do to the tool?

My guess is nothing.

[308Jeff]

My guess is nothing.

Correct. Once I got over the shock, I started priming again.

[M-Tecs]

A group of primers has a lot of energy. Singles not so much

I have an Efemes power punch berdan decapper. It uses a standard boxer primer to remove berdan primers. Not very cost effective but other than being loud it works very well.

[mozeppa]

i decapped 40,000 rounds of live primers ....if you are careful (and cheap) you can do it.

[jmorris]

As above primed brass is OK to ship, no Hazmat. Primers not seated into a case require Hazmat.

[44man]

In 63 years I have never had a primer go off, even removing live primers. I do not reuse them since the anvil can crush the compound.
Now a friend had one go off on the bench. He lost a primer and was soldering with a torch, the torch found it and the POP made his shorts a different color but no damage.
Just go to UPS and send the cases.

[funnyjim014]

Just deprime as normal. I did pop a live primer in my rcbs turret. There is a lovely hollow ram that allows spent and missed live primers to get trapped in and work out until the jam the ram, ie get cut in half if u r moving to quickly. I cut a LG pistol in half and it blew the ram out of my hand.... I now keep Trac of missing live primers and keep the ram clear

[DCM]

As others have said primed brass is OK to ship Fed up or oops.

If one insists on de-priming live primers go Slow and keep the live ones far away from the one currently being de-primed.
Like others I have de-primed many without issue, But Bob at the LGS in Waukesha WI was not so lucky!
He was de-priming Many 45LC cases and had a detonation. This caused the primer catcher full of live primers to go off all at once turning a small "oh carp" in to a long visit to the ER & ICU! Be safe out there.
We all make our own choices and have to deal with the consequences.

[Andy]

Thanks for all of the thoughts/replies, interesting to hear the different solutions.

Depriming on the press or a hand tools seems like what everyone is doing. Maybe I'll have to rig up a system that can catch the primers but keep them away from the press (drop tube to jar of water?) in case the one being deprimed goes off.

I know that you can ship primed brass and that it is not HazMat but you can't ship it though USPS so the cost increases accordingly. Flat rate boxes are much cheaper than ups/fedex for this sort of thing, so it makes depriming worth it. Just to be clear this is talking about depriming live primers, not decapping spent primers.

[NavyVet1959]

Thanks for all of the thoughts/replies, interesting to hear the different solutions.

Depriming on the press or a hand tools seems like what everyone is doing. Maybe I'll have to rig up a system that can catch the primers but keep them away from the press (drop tube to jar of water?) in case the one being deprimed goes off.

I know that you can ship primed brass and that it is not HazMat but you can't ship it though USPS so the cost increases accordingly. Flat rate boxes are much cheaper than ups/fedex for this sort of thing, so it makes depriming worth it. Just to be clear this is talking about depriming live primers, not decapping spent primers.

How much brass are you talking about and what calibers? Maybe someone around here is local enough to you that if the price was right, they might drop by and buy it.

[Gazz]

Years ago before I had a reloading press, I tried to deprime a .308 case using one of the Lee kits, the kind you use a mallet to deprime, size and seat a bullet with. The primer may have been inserted upside down, I can't remember now as it was probably 40 years ago but I do remember how much it hurt. I set the case in the depriming base, dropped the punch in and struck it with a mallet. BANG! and the case launched itself up the depriming tool taking the pads of my thumb and forefinger with it. I now deprime in a press when I need to and so far no detonations. I think you could rig up something to hold the case that would allow a place for the removed primer to g and squeeze it out in a vise or with a c-clamp.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Anyone know of a simple way to fire off primers from primed cases that you don't own a firearm for? Or that don't easily chamber unloaded for whatever reason.

...SNIP
I've done this.
I had a pile of berdan primed 8x57 brass, that I had pulled bullets and powder. A member wanted them for swaged jacket material, but didn't want to deal with the live primers. I drilled a dual stepped hole all the way through a 2x4 (the long way), so the case would sit up-side-down in the hole about half way, but the smaller portion of the hole would allow the gases to escape. Using a hammer & center punch, sitting at the patio table on a sunny summer day, I set them all off.

[Drm50]

I have de capped thousands myself. If you are selling brass it is better to deprime, that way it
can go in USPS. You can ship primed brass or loaded small arms ammo by UPS, with no additional
charge. They just have you mark the box with ORD symbols. I do this frequently. I don't know
FEDEX regs.

[Traffer]

I was told by FEDEX that we had to have a hazmat approved shipper to ship 22lr primed cases. They insisted that we do this even when going to the corporate FED EX office to ship them. Those rats were wrong and messed us up. We did manage to ship them but I will not divulge how in public. And they wonder why I am an outlaw. The government never ceases to anger me.


Shipping primed brass is not a problem and legal with UPS and FedEx. With USPS it is a no go. About a year ago I checked all the references and they were still current.

http://forum.accurateshooter.com/threads/mailing-shipping-primed-brass-the-regs-and-the-law.3812580/

After a ton of confusion, misinformation (on other blogs) and general assumptions regarding the shipment of primed brass, here are the particulars/facts and the regs that back it up. I have confirmed all of this with UPS and FedEx's hazmat shipping folks and they all confirmed.
FOR UPS AND FEDEX ONLY -
Cases, primed (up to and including 50 caliber) are regulated for shipment by ground only through 49CFR § 172.102 SP(special provision) 50 that states:
" Cases, cartridge, empty with primer which are made of metallic or plastic casings and meeting the classification criteria of Division 1.4 are not regulated for domestic transportation"
49CFR § 172.102 (page 312) - http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2010-title49-vol2/pdf/CFR-2010-title49-vol2-sec172-102.pdf
Primed cases meet the classification criteria of Division 1.4c UN0379 - however they are exempted and classified as NON-REGULATED (NOT ORM-D, NOT HAZ-MAT, NOT the new "Y" Limited Quantities classification that will replace ORM-D). Some manufacturers (as per the MSDS) classify their primed cases as UN0055, but the same DOT 1.4c classification applies, as does SP50.
Packaging for primed cases is regulated by 49CFR §173.62 - Packaging instruction #136, which specifies that the primed cases have to be in a bag or box, then packed in a UN 4G standard box - which is defined by 49 CFR §178.601 (g)(2). So - you can't just ship them to your buddy in a shoebox, but most of us out here have received boxes of reloading components from various vendors, and most/all of these shipping boxes meet this criteria. For more mind-bending regulatory details, refer to 178.601.
49CFR §173.62 - http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2011-title49-vol2/pdf/CFR-2011-title49-vol2-sec173-62.pdf
49 CFR §178.601 (g)(2) - http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-2010-title49-vol2/pdf/CFR-2010-title49-vol2-sec178-601.pdf

There is no hazmat fee, extra paperwork, no sign-by-adult or other hoops to jump through - BUT - both UPS and FedEX advised me to clearly mark (with a sharpee) "non-regulated as per SP50" on the outside of the box to ensure that no in-transit problems occur..........because I guess their employees can be as confused as I have been on this subject and you don't want your box torn or ripped into.
As per both UPS and FedEx - You CANNOT take packages with primed cases to your local UPS/FedEx store or mom-and-pop drop off service. They must be taken to a UPS/FedEx corporate-run package hub that has walk-in/retail shipping services.
FOR US POSTAL SERVICE -
Prohibited. Period.
See page 160 at: http://pe.usps.com/cpim/ftp/pubs/pub52/pub52.pdf
***USPS Publication 52, Appendix A, "Cases, cartridge, empty with primer"***
They don't have to subscribe to all parts of 49CFR § 172.102's special provisions......because they are special I guess.

[M-Tecs]

I had an issue with shipping primed brass at UPS once. By the time it was over I had a written apology from the UPS cleric and the first line supervisor.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I had an issue with shipping primed brass at UPS once. By the time it was over I had a written apology from the UPS cleric and the first line supervisor.
Normally, the UPS hub in Glencoe is very good about this type of stuff. But one time, when I wanted to ship a Pre-1898 Rifle (Foreign mil surp), I got some guff from the UPS clerk saying I can't ship that. I just left after I told the clerk, "I'll go home and research this". I went back the next day and got a different clerk ...problem solved. Some fights just aren't worth the trouble, if you know the rules.

[Yodogsandman]

While I've slowly deprimed a few live primers, I prefer to shoot them off into a 55 gal barrel in my barn. I'd rather not wince each time I deprime the cases.

[starmac]

Years ago before I had a reloading press, I tried to deprime a .308 case using one of the Lee kits, the kind you use a mallet to deprime, size and seat a bullet with. The primer may have been inserted upside down, I can't remember now as it was probably 40 years ago but I do remember how much it hurt. I set the case in the depriming base, dropped the punch in and struck it with a mallet. BANG! and the case launched itself up the depriming tool taking the pads of my thumb and forefinger with it. I now deprime in a press when I need to and so far no detonations. I think you could rig up something to hold the case that would allow a place for the removed primer to g and squeeze it out in a vise or with a c-clamp.

I got a kick out of this, I am not sure what you expected it to do. lol
I never had one go off when priming with a lee whack a mole, but it is pretty common. From what I have heard it just causes your heart to skip a beat.
I have deprimed a few hundred on a press with a lee universal decapping die, with no issues.

[merlin101]

I had a primer go off while depriming cases and like said earlier it was a non event. It didn't even go bang, it just kinda sizzled and a little smoke came out of the die. That caused me to slow back down to the speed I started at. Deprime them and then reuse the primers.

[jcwit]

If using a die and press what is the need for safety glasses?

My presses dump the Primer's out the bottom and the die prevents anything going elsewhere.

[jcwit]

Years ago before I had a reloading press, I tried to deprime a .308 case using one of the Lee kits, the kind you use a mallet to deprime, size and seat a bullet with. The primer may have been inserted upside down, I can't remember now as it was probably 40 years ago but I do remember how much it hurt. I set the case in the depriming base, dropped the punch in and struck it with a mallet. BANG! and the case launched itself up the depriming tool taking the pads of my thumb and forefinger with it. I now deprime in a press when I need to and so far no detonations. I think you could rig up something to hold the case that would allow a place for the removed primer to g and squeeze it out in a vise or with a c-clamp.

You gotta be kidding!

I've had a few go off in my 50 plus years of using a Lee Loader and have yet to experience anything​leaving my fingers or damaging me in anyway!

[WJP]

Had my fair share go off. Most have been on a 1050 where it knocked the center out and left the ring. Don't ever buy wet tumbled brass with primers intact. Then I've had live primers hit the ground and dropped something on it. No fun either way.

[Andy]

Thanks jon_b that's the first kind of idea along the lines of what I was looking for, I do a lot of woodworking so that setup would be simple for me to make.

When disposing of loose live primers that you don't want to try using in loaded rounds what is regarded as a completely safe way to do so? I have read that water only disables them temporarily, is oil saturated into them the trick? I'm sure i can find a way to get rid of them either way, but would like to know what the correct procedure is to make sure they are 100% incapable of going off in the future, is there one?

[NavyVet1959]

Thanks jon_b that's the first kind of idea along the lines of what I was looking for, I do a lot of woodworking so that setup would be simple for me to make.

When disposing of loose live primers that you don't want to try using in loaded rounds what is regarded as a completely safe way to do so? I have read that water only disables them temporarily, is oil saturated into them the trick? I'm sure i can find a way to get rid of them either way, but would like to know what the correct procedure is to make sure they are 100% incapable of going off in the future, is there one?

Hit them with a small sledgehammer one at a time. Wear safety glasses, just in case...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSUun7iplCU

And you should probably wear a face shield and more than just a t-shirt if you are firing .50 BMG primers on concrete.

[deadeye ruck]

I too have deprimed many live primers. It's probably not the safest but I have never had any trouble. You could always soak them before depriming if you were concerned about that. I always make a point to wear safety glasses while doing it though

[country gent]

I have deprimed some live primers with no issues or detonations but it can happen done in a press with a depriming die that dosnt seal allows for no pressure build up and directs and down onto the ram area. Or is should. Using the hand deprimers is a little different as they may be open to pressure relief at different areas. But this is only an issue IF a primer detonates. Deading them with a solvent or oil working carefully and you should have no detonations. I would be more concerened with the primer dust pellets build up in the spent primer catcher than the one being pushed out. A build up in there could be several to a hundred or better build up of primers.

[EMC45]

Slowly de-prime and re-use them. I have done it many times, and never had a problem.

[Reverend Al]

I deconstruct a lot of old ammunition that is donated to me by others and I've pulled the bullets, dumped the powder, and then deprimed the cases using a Lee or RCBS Universal depriming die. Never had one go off in the die yet and I save the live primers and use them for case reforming duty with a blank charge and cornmeal. (Hey, they are free primers ... why would I use up my perfectly good, new, and expensive primers for case fire-forming?) Just my 2 cents worth ...

[15meter]

If you want hitech get handloaders manual of cartridge conversions by Donnelly, in 4th edition and
Probably earlier versions is an elaborate fireforming rig that would fire off the primers.

[Reverend Al]

Yes, I've read some of the posts on here about "Gloobits", but haven't tried them myself. Unfortunately we're in a high density housing, residential area and we also have a basement suite with a tenant ... so if I started shooting "Gloobits" in my reloading / gun shop I would likely get a SWAT call out!


@Reverend Al,



That is a great use for removed primers. I sometimes use removed primers from miscellaneous donated rounds in "glue bullet" practice rounds. These are similar to wax bullets, but are molded in a regular bullet casting mold using hot glue. Powered by just the primer, they are accurate to ~20 ft and can pass through both sides of a cardboard box. Put a towel inside the box to capture the glue bullets for reuse.

Marshall

[MGySgt]

I would not deprime live primers in Mil Spec cases. I had 100 cases that had the bullets pulled and powder dumped. They had crimped in primers. I thought I would deactivate the primers with WD-40. Put the cases in a coffee can poured in WD-40 (I buy WD-40 by the gallon can).

Next day I thought I would try one in my 30-06 just to see if the primer would go off - while it was still wet I chambered one of the cases and pulled the trigger - BANG.

Ok - I thought I didn't let them soak long enough. 7 days later pulled anouther one out of the WD-40, let it drip a little - chambered it - BANG.

With those cases having a CRIMPED in primer there was no way I was going to deprime them on my press. I just popped the rest of the primer in my rifle.

I do deprime live primers on my press when the need arises - just no MilSpec with crimped in primers.

[Texas by God]

Slowly de-prime and re-use them. I have done it many times, and never had a problem.
Same here. Go slow. Decapped 60 .300 Sav brass to ship and reused the primers in 30-30s I was loading. All worked perfectly.

[retread]

If you do not have a Universal decapping die you can pick a decapping and sizing die that is longer than the body and bigger ID than the cases you want to deprime.

[Kestrel4k]

+1 on the Harvey deprimer; with the mainstream depriming tools failing to deprime some of my crimped-primer USGI cases, I got a Harvey and never want to go back. :)
http://www.harveydeprimer.com/

One advantage of it is that I can keep it close by during normal loading operations; if I get a goobered primer inserted into one of my cases, I don't have to swap out anything in my press / loading hardware / etc; just pick up the Harvey and, 'snap'.

[Soundguy]

I've yet to find something a lee universal decapper won't digest. ;)

[NavyVet1959]

I've yet to find something a lee universal decapper won't digest. ;)

I've got a piece of 30mm "brass"...

[Soundguy]

I've got a piece of 30mm "brass"...


I guess I should have expected at least 1 obtuse answer from the gallery...

[RedJackson]

Get a Lee universial decapping die ..... problem solved.

[Bmi48219]

I use a Lee Classic de-priming punch and base for pistol brass. Leather palm glove, leather mallet & safety glasses. Probably done a couple hundred & never had one go off. Reused the primers for target loads. They all worked.

[higgins]

I don't like the idea of using oil or WD40 to kill primers in cases because then you have to wash the cases with detergent and hope you got all the oil out of them. I've never tried to deprime crimped primers with a size/decap die in a press, but I've deprimed a lot of commercial cases without incident by going slow. Run the decap rod down far enough that you're feeling only the resistance of the primer, and not partially sizing the case. You'll be able to feel the primer slowly backing out.

[psweigle]

Can't believe hydraulics haven't been suggested. It is by far the safest method to remove live primers as far as I know. Just look up how to use water to remove a primer. It works. I wouldn't recommend using a removed primer anyhow. Just my two cents.

[Texas by God]

I just reused 100 decapped Remington primers in my 30-30 bolt gun loads. No problems, fine accuracy. I'm firmly in that camp. Go slow and reuse them.

[BigEyeBob]

I deprimed 200 PPU 30/30 cases just a few days ago ,all live primers , They will be reformed into 25/35 cases. Not one detonated . I made my universal decapper die in my workshop ,will deprime from 22 cal up to my 500 express cases. One of the best and most used tools Ive made.