Did I ruin it

[adam_mac84]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170304/0016b97e3803488cf33c0c9f33813f9f.jpg

Looks like these zinkers got through my sort. I had not seen these longer sink ones before. Ended with about 25# of ingots for reference. If this melted in am I out of luck on these bars? I intentionally smelt in smaller lots for this reason.

They must have been at the bottom. I say this because my melt temp is usually just above where things become slushy. I am using Dutch oven with weed torch set up under it. I am really surprised (and bummed) these appear to have made it through


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[rancher1913]

are you sure they are zinc, should have a zn on them. usually when I keep the temp just high enough to melt lead the zinc's never melt.

if it is zinc, it's probably ok, just use those ingots for fun shooting and not benchrest shooting.

[WJP]

Cast a few. I doubt 1 percent or less zinc will mess it up that bad.

[MUSTANG]

You can always work the Zink out with either sulfur or copper sulfate (Root Killer). These will toughen the lead while removing the zink. A couple of threads on the site that describe how to do this.

[mozeppa]

a little zinc , no problem.

a whole lot of zinc...problem.

[lightman]

I agree, a little zinc won't ruin the whole batch. Casting a bullet with it would be the proof. No zinc is preferable, but you can get away with a little.

[adam_mac84]

I have each batch I have smelted labeled. This one will be segregated... I do not have my full casting setup quite yet. Wanted to make sure I would pay it off in bullets before I started buying molds and whatnot. (had to pass the budget committee). I have been able to come up with 13 gallons (2x5g and 1x3g) WW in buckets, and supposedly am picking up 200# of lead used in race car ballast. I think I should be covered.

I will have to wait and see what comes of these when cast. Is about 25# of ingots.

On the bright side. If i come up with 300# of usable lead, I should be able to save enough to justify the bottom pour pot and molds to SWMBO

[scottfire1957]

Yep. It is ruined. Send it all to me for proper disposal.

Seriously, I will dispose of it.

[runfiverun]

nip those weights with your side cutters.
if they cut they ain't zinc.
then you'll know.

then if they are zinc I would run around and quickly mix the ingots with the rest of them then forget about it.

[scottfire1957]

nip those weights with your side cutters.
if they cut they ain't zinc.
then you'll know.



then if they are zinc I would run around and quickly mix the ingots with the rest of them then forget about it.

Nope, it is ruined. He needs to send his alloy to me for disposal.

[leebuilder]

I dont think it is ruined. It happened to me the other day, i just dilluted it with more wheel weight.
Between the zinc coating on some ww and plating/galvinized clips you will have zinc.
i sort as best i can and still stir/float and toss zinc wheel weights out, be aware and dilligent.
You will be fine.

[adam_mac84]

I am thinking of leaving more lead in the bottom of the dutch oven between batches. Instead of piling a bunch of wheel weights in there and waiting to have the melt get high enough to start to actually float things. I hadn't done this prior, but i gues it will need to be done. I do very small batches (20-30# at a time) because that is how much I can do during a nap time haha. I realize I am losing propane in the heat up/cool down time

[rmark]

'I am thinking of leaving more lead in the bottom of the dutch oven between batches.' This what I do, that way I start with molten lead under 700 degrees, the zinc and steel wheel weights float to the top. I feed a few handfuls of weights in, scoop out the clips, scoop out 6-8 ingots of lead, repeat. Kind of slow but works for me.

[Sasquatch-1]

Make sure there is ABSOLUTELY NO moisture on the weights when placed in the molten lead. We do not want a visit from the tinsel fairy. I have had a steam explosion many years ago when I first started out. NOT PLEASANT.


'I am thinking of leaving more lead in the bottom of the dutch oven between batches.' This what I do, that way I start with molten lead under 700 degrees, the zinc and steel wheel weights float to the top. I feed a few handfuls of weights in, scoop out the clips, scoop out 6-8 ingots of lead, repeat. Kind of slow but works for me.

[William Yanda]

Looks like maybe 2-3 ounces max in 25 lbs. Less than 1%. Possibly not enough to matter. Someone else described how they uniform small batches by mixing ingots from different batches when getting ready to use. As advised, try some of the tainted batch. If bullets shatter, or do not mold well, mix that batch of alloy with one or two other batches. Dilution is the solution to pollution.

[dbosman]

Some COWW passed my cut test. Later I retested, you'll see why, and noticed they didn't cut as easily as samples of pure lead. Since they cut, I rendered them down. The problem first showed at 350°F as I was getting slush that looked like corn meal mush - not oatmeal. At 500°F all was liquid. I raised the temp to 700°F and fluxed with pine sawdust. (By the way, too much and the fumes coming off flash) I fluxed twice and made ingots. I put them in my pot and cast for a while. Bullets dropped easily. Later in the day I weighed them and they were light and larger in diameter than I've ever gotten from that mold. On the good side I've got a couple of hundred light Markarov bullets if I ever need them, and a lot of nice sinker alloy. 30-50lbs. Sigh!

Apparently these COWW were conterfeit pot metal something, sold to tire shops.
Not zinc, but also not lead.

[Nose Dive]

No...did not ruin smelt batch.... but.....

I do this from time to time too.... Solution is simple.... take 'cold smelt' batch and clean out pot...empty it... add some saw dust...some
sulphur from the nursery....yes...just what you buy to put on your roses in your garden.... put that in the bottom of the pot...add the old
smelt material and bring up the heat slow and low....mix well when the smelt begins to melt and then mix as it begins to melt out in the
pot. I always add some more sawdust and sulphur mix and mix again... NOW BE AWARE....HEADS UP...it SMOKES and STINKS TO HIGH|
HEAVEN!!! OUTSIDE FOR SURE and be ready for some 'love letters' if you live in an area where you have an HOA.... mix well...pour out
into ingots.... I also always mix in some wax and mix well too,,,,then add some pewter to help my hardness and mold fillout.... You didn't
KILL THE BATCH.... and really... with so little is saw in your pics...and not knowing the size of your smelt batch...it may not really mean a
thing..... but...to take care of 'my mistakes'....I follow the procedure above....

Nose Dive

Cheap, fast, good. Kindly pick two.

[Loudy13]

I had the same issue last week ended up with 2 or 3 WW's that looked like yours....figured I had ruined the whole batch of 30 some ingots. I dug around on here and found some ways to fix it but ended up finding out that I hadn't ruined anything and when I used those ingots to cast everything worked out fine. I did however add one of the "bad" ingots to every 2 "not bad" ingots just to make sure.

[308Jeff]

No...did not ruin smelt batch.... but.....

I do this from time to time too.... Solution is simple.... take 'cold smelt' batch and clean out pot...empty it... add some saw dust...some
sulphur from the nursery....yes...just what you buy to put on your roses in your garden.... put that in the bottom of the pot...add the old
smelt material and bring up the heat slow and low....mix well when the smelt begins to melt and then mix as it begins to melt out in the
pot. I always add some more sawdust and sulphur mix and mix again... NOW BE AWARE....HEADS UP...it SMOKES and STINKS TO HIGH|
HEAVEN!!! OUTSIDE FOR SURE and be ready for some 'love letters' if you live in an area where you have an HOA.... mix well...pour out
into ingots.... I also always mix in some wax and mix well too,,,,then add some pewter to help my hardness and mold fillout.... You didn't
KILL THE BATCH.... and really... with so little is saw in your pics...and not knowing the size of your smelt batch...it may not really mean a
thing..... but...to take care of 'my mistakes'....I follow the procedure above....

Nose Dive

Cheap, fast, good. Kindly pick two.

Forgive what is probably a dumb question, but I'm assuming the Zinc attaches itself to the sulphur and/or flux and is removed during skimming process?

[adam_mac84]

Well, I cooked up another 106# of WW today. I have the ingots in question segregated, and will dilute when casting.

106# of COWW from a full 5g bucket. maybe 15/20# yet to be ingoted of SOWW

In other news, was at the scrap yard today, he had a bucket of WW that weighed in at 160#, which I thought was high (different scale than they buy on haha). Little guy lifted it right up on there. would have cost me better than $50 bucks, so i politely passed. They do have range scrap at $0.70/lb, which I may look into. WW avail there too. I like free better!!

[RogerDat]

There was a member that carefully added zinc to his lead and cast with it to find out at what percentage it became a real issue. His results were about 5% zinc became a problem and below 2% or 3% was not very noticeable at all, weight would be off and final size, might go through a sizer a bit harder.

The advice to nip those left overs with dike side cutters and see if they are soft enough to nip is what I was going to suggest. Only way that I have heard of people getting zinc WW's melted in lead pot they were watching was when they zinc was trapped against the bottom and able to soak up enough heat to melt before the lead stacked on it did. Pretty decent difference between lead melting point and zinc. If I understand correctly and your using a weed burner it may make that trapped melting easier to occur since it puts out a lot of heat in a fairly direct and smaller area than say a turkey burner. That could start to melt the zinc near that point of high heat before the lead ones can get liquid.

I leave a little slab of lead in bottom of pot, let it harden into a thin slab that I can drop back in. Because it makes full contact with bottom it melts faster, and the molten puddle helps the stuff above absorb heat from the greater contact.

Only way I know of to be nearly 100% sure of no zinc WW's is to test each one with a pair of dikes, nip each one, soft enough to put a notch in then it's lead, harder than that? Not lead. Goes pretty fast if you can load some on a tray sitting in your lap. Less bending and hand travel if you can just pick them up from you lap, nip and toss into appropriate sorting bucket.

I am adding a +1 to the never dump WW's into melted lead, too much chance of having some moisture in them and if that gets under the molten lead the explosion will at the least make a mess in your shorts, and at worst can cause serious injury or damage. Moisture under molten lead explodes. The condensation on a ladle going from cold to hot was enough to thump my hand back like a pistol recoil. Seeing pictures of a full visit from the tinsel fairy I think I will work really hard to miss that.