Hello gents, couple .30 cal subsonic boolit ?'s

[Road_Clam]

So i've been lurking over the site for a few month's now and I have done a ton of great reading. I currently have a SA 1884 TD and I am building a R700 308 to shoot subsonic. I have about 50# of lead saved and am getting ready to embark into the 308 subsonic casting. My first question is which mold for casting sub projectiles would you recommend ? I'm reading that the most ideal 308 projectile is a 200 gr RN or RNFP ? Second question is the additional sizing question. Where this will be a 200 yd subsonic gong ring rifle i'm not overly concerned about uber-precision. So many suggest casting to .311 but the LEE molds are pre configured to cast to .309 ? This is where i'm confused... Would like the expert input on how to move foward. Thanks in advance !

Rich K.

[Larry Gibson]

If your "lead" is pure lead I suggest adding tin for a 20-1 or 16-1 (lead to tin). It will cast better and fill out the mould better. The Lee .311 moulds should produce bullets close to .311. My go to for most 30 cals is a .310 or .311 sizing.

While you may or may not get sufficient accuracy w/o GCs they always have given me the best accuracy, even with sub-sonic loads. I use my own made of aluminum (.012) sheeting for my sub-sonic .308W loads and they works very well. A soft lube works best and a light coat of LLA works very well also.

I suggest well fire formed cases with the flash holes drilled out with a #30 - #28 drill. That will avoid shoulder set back of the case shoulder which can lead to misfires especially with push feed actions. The larger flash hole also allows the flash to get into the case covering a larger volume quicker giving more consistent ignition of small amounts of fast burning powders in the larger case.

Bullseye powder has proven to be the best powder for my own .308W sub-sonic loads with cast bullets of 180 gr (311041) and 210 gr (311299). I suggest you start at 5 gr and work up until the bullets start "cracking" which usually happens around 1050 - 1100 fps depending on atmospheric variables. I've found 1050 fps to be a safe average velocity so I don't get caught with a "snap" or "crack" by changing variables. No wad or filler is needed with Bullseye as it is not position sensitive from most shooting positions/angles, especially with the flash hole drilled cases.

Larry Gibson

[nagantguy]

If your "lead" is pure lead I suggest adding tin for a 20-1 or 16-1 (lead to tin). It will cast better and fill out the mould better. The Lee .311 moulds should produce bullets close to .311. My go to for most 30 cals is a .310 or .311 sizing.

While you may or may not get sufficient accuracy w/o GCs they always have given me the best accuracy, even with sub-sonic loads. I use my own made of aluminum (.012) sheeting for my sub-sonic .308W loads and they works very well. A soft lube works best and a light coat of LLA works very well also.

I suggest well fire formed cases with the flash holes drilled out with a #30 - #28 drill. That will avoid shoulder set back of the case shoulder which can lead to misfires especially with push feed actions. The larger flash hole also allows the flash to get into the case covering a larger volume quicker giving more consistent ignition of small amounts of fast burning powders in the larger case.

Bullseye powder has proven to be the best powder for my own .308W sub-sonic loads with cast bullets of 180 gr (311041) and 210 gr (311299). I suggest you start at 5 gr and work up until the bullets start "cracking" which usually happens around 1050 - 1100 fps depending on atmospheric variables. I've found 1050 fps to be a safe average velocity so I don't get caught with a "snap" or "crack" by changing variables. No wad or filler is needed with Bullseye as it is not position sensitive from most shooting positions/angles, especially with the flash hole drilled cases.

Larry Gibsonplus one on everything above! And welcome to the forum and thank you for taking the time/ putti in the effort to read lots of the available info archived here!

[Road_Clam]

Larry,
Thanks for the great info. I've already been prepping my special 45-70 brass by enlarging the flash holes to .094" for loading BPCR. I do CNC machining so I have access to a collet chuck which makes it simple to open up the flash holes without distorting the casings. I'll do the same for my 308 bottlenecks. So this is the LEE mold i'm interested in :

http://www.ebay.com/itm/321637610582?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Is this not a good choice for casting modern bolt rifle 308 subs ? If not could you guys provide a link to the best suited mold ? Thanks

[Boolit_Head]

I just picked up that mold myself. Knowing my previous lee molds I'll lay odds it casts to .308 like the .311 version I have does. Your best bet is to look to one of the premium mold makers like NOE or Miha. After you use one of those the lee molds look like garbage.

[centershot]

The 200 grain boolit is, of course, quite long and will necessitate "seating out" in order to keep your gascheck inside the case neck. If you forego the use of the check you can seat to normal length but may find that your load isn't quite as accurate as it could be, as Larry mentioned. If your only interest is ringing your 200 yd. gong, go for it! It should certainly be accurate enough for that! Don't be surprised if that Lee mold throws boolits @ .310-.311". Bolit Head has it right, NOE molds are state-of-the-art, you can't do better!

[runfiverun]

I wouldn't even bother with a gas check for sub sonic work.
for the 308 this is more like what I would be interested in.
it would do both sub and some work at super with no issues.

http://accuratemolds.com/img/bullets/detail/31-170T-D.png

[rhemcla]

Road Clam, I have the C309-200-R and they shoot OK in my 1:10" rifle at about 1,600 fps (3" groups at 100 yds). They do cast "skinny" with WW (about 0.308") so I would recommend you buy the Lee C312-185-1R and size down to 0.310 or 0.312 (I prefer 0.311).

Sent from my SM-T377P using Tapatalk

[rhemcla]

I meant size to 0.310" or 0.311" as Larry recommends

Sent from my SM-T377P using Tapatalk

[Road_Clam]

Thanks again for all the help, you've answered many of my previously confusing questions. At least now I have a bit of a clearer understanding of "as cast" vs "required" diameters and how molds work. I'm converting my 308 R700 26" Varmint over to a 20" 1-10" twist ACC-SD threaded barrel. So it should be an ideal subsonic gong ringer (especially if the newly proposed "hearing protection act" is made into law) :cool:

[Walstr]

Gotta ask: Your 'name' got me chuckling, so if it ain't tooo personal, where/how did "Road Clam" enter your consciousness?

Also, thread related: "Centershot" reports that the gas check must remain within the neck or it will be lost [my summary]. I didn't think any .30 cal 170+gr boolit base could remain within the neck of a .30-06, .308 cartridge due to their length. I'm a .30-06 novice & that's my observation.

[Wayne Smith]

And, now that all but the oldest Lyman checks are crimp-on, they are unlikely to fall off. Gotta get an oold box of Lyman checks that aren't crimp on.

[Road_Clam]

Gotta ask: Your 'name' got me chuckling, so if it ain't tooo personal, where/how did "Road Clam" enter your consciousness?



I am also an avid motorcyclist. I ride and restore bikes. I am not brand loyal and I own 7 different style bikes. My first "Harley" was a tired beat 1995 Road King. The bike broke down on me like 3 times before I got rid of the ***. My metric biker buddies loved to rag on me for continuing to ride the road king, one trip one of my buddies commented "your new biker nickname is "Road Clam" and the rest is internet history..... LOL

[robg]

Lee 180 gr boolits keeps gas check in neck in my 308 savage.

[Tackleberry41]

I know some will say don't bother with the gas check mold. I bought a .311 196gr NOE mold, just for subsonic. Great for that, but now that I powder coat and have learned they can be driven full power, I really wish that mold was gas check. I have a Lyman 200gr GC mold that shoots good. But I like that pointed 196gr, and its .311, the Lyman is 309, and really wont size any bigger than .311. Would mean laying out the cash for another one in GC. I have used the NOE .311 230gr, provided you have the barrel twist. My 1-9.5in mosins will shoot it. Doubt you could go slower and it be stable. I like that its gas check, as it can be driven to 2500fps out of my 300 win mag.

I had bought 2 lee 30 cal molds the 170gr and the 200gr. Neither would cast 309 out of the box. I leemented them, but once I got better molds, they collect dust on the shelf.

Powder I have been using Solo1000 in my various subsonic. 30-30, 308, 7.62x54r, and 45-70. I just have alot of it to use. Not to far off from bullseye in burn rate. With a jewelers scale going to .01gr, I can tune them down to 5fps spread over a string, they can be really accurate.

[RU shooter]

For just gong ringing about any bullet that fits well will work decently for that be it plain base or Checked or even checkless when I had my 03A3 Springfield I still shot ocassional reduced 200yd HP matches my favorite off hand practice load was the Lee 155 without the check installed and 5.5 gr bullseye . Shot very well and could ring that 12" gong at 200 all day long off hand with open sights , off a bench would do about 4-5" at that same range mostly with vertical spread . not great but it's a cheap and simple load combo that worked good enough

[KenH]

www.amazon.com/dp/B008B3HP8S/