Pin Gage set

[JudgeBAC]

I just received an Enco economy - pin gage set to measure the throats of my wheelguns so that I can accurately match bullet diameter to throat diameter.

Some of the measurements were enlightening to say the least. A colt official police .38 had not shot as well as I had hoped. Now I think I know why. The throats measured .3585. Obviously I need a .359 bullet. I need to go back and cast some from my molds and see if I have one that will cast this large.

A .45 Colt blackhawk measured a respectable .4505 with the .45 colt cylinder but a whopping .4545 with the .45 ACP cylinder.

A .44 mag Ruger Bisley measured .4305

All of my S&Ws were more of what you would expect:
29-10 .44 mag .4285
57 .41 mag .4095
65 .357 .3565
624 .4335 This was the one aberration of the S&Ws.

Now comes the fun part. Loading up some ammo with the appropriate size bullets and see what a difference if any in accuracy.

[lathesmith]

I picked up a Pin gage set recently to help make Star sizer dies. These are extremely useful, they are the only way to get the needed speed and consistent accuracy for making dies. As you point out, they will also work great for checking revolver throats. Very useful items!
lathesmith

[garandsrus]

Judge,

I recently used pin gauges on my Ruger Redhawk in .44 Mag and found that the cylinders were .430 also. My .44 sizing die was marked .429 but was dropping closer to .428.

I opened up the die and sized some boolits to .430. They shot much better than the .428.

I had always been disappointed in the accuracy of the pistol. I need to some more tests, but accuracy is definitely better with the larger boolits and may now even be good.

John

[44man]

It won't help you a bit to shoot larger boolits from a few of those guns. Some are showing throats much smaller then the bore size will be. You need to slug the barrels also and lap or ream the tighter throats to .0005 to .001" over the groove to groove size.
You fight a losing battle just fitting a boolit to an undersize throat.

[cbrick]

What 44man said . . . Yep, absolutely. While consistent throat dimensions are critical in wheel gun accuracy the throats MUST also match groove diameter properly or it is an uphill, no win battle. If your happy with 2 or 3 inch groups at 25 yards its not nearly as important but if your looking for MOA with top end loads at 100 yards or more having these dimensions match is critical. When groove diameter and throat dimensions are a "good match" is when bullet fit in the throats is very important.

Rick

[buckbeans]

where did you get the pin gauges?

[JudgeBAC]

I got the pin gages directly from Enco.

[theperfessor]

Pin gauges are quick and handy, but I use a .2 - 1.2 inside mike from Enco. Real handy for all sorts of purposes in machine/gun shop. Can measure shotgun chokes, etc. plus other non-gun work. (Also have a 1-2 inside mike but no guns that big! sigh....)

[alamogunr]

I got my set on ebay. It had about 5 missing pins so I had to take a chance that they wouldn't be needed. Luckily they were sizes I probably won't ever have a use for. I got it cheap.

John
W.TN

[Boomer Mikey]

http://www.cdcotools.com/picture/79

http://www.cdcotools.com/index.php


http://www.use-enco.com/ProductImages/0646300A-11.jpg

http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PARTPG=INLMKD&PMPXNO=22486126&PMAKA=SA616-8131


ENCO Free Shipping Code - July 2008

Here ya go, guys - Happy Independence Day!
------------
Happy Independence Day! Join us for our July Holiday Celebration with Free UPS Shipping* on your Enco order of $50 or more. Just enter WB8JUP in the promo code box on the shopping cart page at use-enco.com or mention the code to your friendly sales associate when you order by phone at
800-USE-ENCO.
Hurry, the Free UPS Shipping* offer above expires at midnight EDT, July 31, 2008!

Boomer :Fire:

[alamogunr]

Those are decent prices, especially with free shipping and the assurance that there are no missing pins. You have to be very observant on ebay. Those guys will stick it to you on shipping.

[Ricochet]

I've got that onscreen now.

I have a Walker replica with .442" chamber throats and .447" groove diameter, best I can measure with my calipers. Leads terribly. I remember reading some discussion on here a while back about reaming or honing cylinders. What's Enco got that would be best for opening these up to .450" or so? (Or at least to .447" to match the grooves?) I wondered about a reamer something like this: http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PARTPG=INSRAR2&PMAKA=334-1106&PMPXNO=2611062

Unfortunately, that gives only a maximum diameter and doesn't indicate what it will adjust down to to get inside the undersized holes.

Don't see any hone on Enco that would get inside the holes; maybe I'm not looking the right way.

[Meatco1]

What is the difference between the PLUS, and MINUS pin gage sets?

Thank you,

Richard

[floodgate]

Meatco:

The "Plus" pins will be no smaller than the marked diameter, and can be up to 0.0002" (two ten-thousandths) larger; the "Minus" pins will be undersized by as much as 0.0002". For our purposes, the "Minus" sets are what we want.

floodgate

[lathesmith]

Ricochet, the only way I would know to get that cylinder bored out accurately .005-.007 would be a four-jaw chuck and a boring bar. Yea, it's slow, but the only reasonable alternative I can think of is you would have to have a custom chucking reamer made to your specs. This would involve taking a 29/64 chucking reamer, and having it "resharpened" to a .005 or so smaller diameter. Believe it or not, I have seen resharpened, under-size reamers on ebay. These occasionally pop up, with some diligent searching,you might get lucky. In fact, check this one out:
http://tinyurl.com/647syk

Good luck,
lathesmith

[Meatco1]

Thank you Floodgate! I didn't have a clue.

Just blind luck, I did place an order for the Minus pin gage set.

And, Boomer Mikey, I appreciate you posting the "free shipping" code also.

Thanks guys,

Richard

[Ricochet]

Thank you, Lathesmith!

[Buckshot]

...............Ricochet, here ya go:


Chucking - Reamers Size: 0.4500 In. Flute Type: Straight Material: HSS Shank Type: Straight
MSC # 02034502 | Big Book Page 217 | View similar items
Price: $28.12 ea http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/GSDRVSM?PACACHE=000000060385511

or..............

.0450 Y19 HSS CHUCKING REAMER TTC PRODUCTION
Product: 06-000-450
Usually Ships: today
Minimum Order Qty.: 1
Unit of Measure: EA
Base Price: $ 13.67
Your Price: $ 13.67 at: https://www.travers.com/

For just a couple instances. You REALLY don't want to use an adjustable reamer unless you have to. The word I got several years back from my gunsmith. Also, good reamers are not cheap.

I just lucked out on a brand new 29 piece set of L&I reamers from 1/16 to 1/2" on E-bay. I had been high bidder on a new set of L&I number reamers a couple years back, but dispaired of ever seeing a fractional set, so I bought an import set. I'll have to be honest and say that the few reamers out of that set have done what they're supposed to. It's just that the flutes and clearance grinding will bring a tear to your eye they're so wretched looking.

Here's what Travers had the L&I set listed at:

1/16" To 1/2" by 64ths: 8-M 04-008-900 $521.61

At MSC:

MSC #: 02295293
Description: Sets - Reamers Style: Straight Flute Reamer Type: Chucking Size Range: 1/16 - 1/2 Number of Pieces: 29 Material: HSS Your Price: $532.26 ea

What I got them for on E-Bay:

L&I Reamer index set 8-M 1/16 to 1/2 by 1/64 NEW View Similar Items $241.00, shipping $12.00

While $241 isn't cheap, it's cheap for what they are and will do. At less then half price it's a deal. I researched what they sold for and then entered a max bid of $338.

So now I have a Chinese set for sale if anyone is interested :-)

....................Buckshot

[Ricochet]

Thanks for the tips, Buckshot!

[lmcollins]

I have bought much Enco stuff, and some of it was junk! Before I took anything that they (the pin gauges) told me as being correct I'd mike the pin gage with a good domestic mic like a Sterret. A lot of their stuff that is supposed to be something turns out off dimensionally. When they had an outlet in the Greater Cleveland, Ohio, area I'd buy things that I could take back if they turned out to be crap. Now that they are only mail order from somewhere out west - I stopped buying from them. Be Advised!