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[Blackwater]

Why Do Atheist Scientists Care about God’s Nonexistence? January 11th, 2017
By Dr. Hugh Ross
http://www.reasons.org/Media/Default/ImageCache/559x400-FitWidth/ImageCache/559x400-FitWidth/Images/488572441-1200x800.jpg
After a speaking event, believers often come up to ask me some variation of the following questions: Why do atheist scientists devote so much energy to refuting the existence of God? If they really believe there is no evidence or rational basis for belief in God, then why waste the time and effort refuting his existence? These are great questions that, for the sake of atheists everywhere, deserve thoughtful consideration by Christians.
Atheist scientists certainly do appear to devote an inordinate amount of effort attempting to disprove God’s existence. For example, while he was alive, particle physicist Victor Stenger wrote nine books on scientific “proofs” of God’s nonexistence and founded a program at the University of Colorado where he taught courses on scientific and philosophical atheism. Richard Dawkins has written eight books in his attempt to show that science disproves God’s existence and has been featured in numerous film documentaries that either attack belief in God or promote atheism. Lawrence Krauss, author of A Universe from Nothing and a participant in several debates on God’s existence, eschews the label atheist, preferring instead to be known as an anti-theist.
In my own personal library, which is far from complete, I have more than 40 full-length books written by scientists devoted to trying to prove God’s nonexistence. Several of them are mega-books. Howard Bloom’s The God Problem, for example, runs 708 pages.
Perhaps the greatest demonstration I have personally experienced of fervor and effort devoted to scientifically disproving God’s existence was the 2008 Origins—The BIG Questions international conference held at the California Institute of Technology and presented by the Skeptics Society and cosponsored by the John Templeton Foundation. More than 700 atheists from around the world gathered to hear renowned scientists Sean Carroll, Christof Koch, Donald Prothero, and Leonard Susskind deliver lectures focused on trying to answer the one big question: “Does science make belief in God obsolete?” The conference ended with my debate with Victor Stenger on the topic, “Does science support belief in a deity?”
I stayed and talked to conference attendees for an additional three hours after the official close of the conference. Every atheist attendee I talked to told me that my debate talk was their first experience hearing a scientific defense for the existence of God. How sad, I thought.
As diplomatically as I could, I explained to these atheists that it is not because of a lack of scientific evidence that Christians are silent, but rather because of internal disputes over young-earth creationism and theistic evolution. Their comments strengthened my resolve to redouble our efforts to produce, distribute, and proclaim new reasons from the book of nature to believe in Christ as Creator, Lord, and Savior.
I told the atheist attendees that during the two-day conference I discovered yet more evidence for God’s existence. My claim aroused their curiosity. How would a conference devoted to disproving God give me more evidence for God?
I told them that I could not help but notice that the lectures and the Q&A sessions all focused on the God of the Bible. The gods of the non-Christian religions were ignored. I also said I could not help noticing the intensity and pervasiveness of the emotions being expressed against the God of the Bible.
I heard speakers and attendees repeatedly claiming that there was no more evidence for the God of the Bible than there was for the Easter bunny, tooth fairy, or Santa Claus. However, I said that I had yet to see an atheist scientist get emotionally distraught over the Easter bunny, write half a dozen books explaining the scientific evidence against the existence of the tooth fairy, or get money from the John Templeton Foundation to sponsor an international conference on the scientific case against the existence of Santa Claus. (Note: I recently saw several hundred different books on the tooth fairy for sale on Amazon’s website, but not even one book focused on addressing the scientific evidence against the tooth fairy’s existence.)
All this emotion directed against the God of the Bible and all the lectures and books focused on the scientific case against God’s existence convinced me that the conference speakers and most of the attendees really are persuaded that the God of the Bible exists. It is just that they do not like him.
I got two responses from the attendees gathered around me. First, they got my point. If the God of the Bible really does not exist and if the scientific evidence against the God of the Bible really is as strong as they assert, then they, and especially the scientists in their midst, should be treating the God of the Bible in the same way as they respond to the Easter bunny and the tooth fairy.
Their second response was especially revealing. They said, “It is not that we dislike the God of the Bible. It’s that we despise his followers.” Then, individually, they began to tell me stories about how they had either been abused, mistreated, cheated, or ridiculed by people who claimed to be Christians.
That same day, in a private conversation, Victor Stenger told me he had been an altar boy in a Roman Catholic church during his youth. Stenger’s experience is not unique. Nearly every atheist scientist I have debated has told me they had a past church experience and less-than-pleasant past encounters with Christians.
Several spiritual lessons emerge from these encounters and all the books, film documentaries, lectures, and conferences devoted to the scientific evidence against the God of the Bible:


All the time, energy, lecturing, and book writing asserting the scientific case against the God of the Bible actually is scientific evidence for the God of the Bible.

Atheism, almost always, is rooted in self-imposed ignorance arising from a dislike of the God of the Bible (Romans 1:18–23 (https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Romans%201:18-23)) and/or a dislike of certain people who claim to be Christians.

We who are true followers of Christ need to consistently model grace, humility, wisdom, compassion, respect, and gentleness when we engage atheists. As much as possible, we need to counter the bad examples of Christian behavior that atheists have experienced in their past.

We need to graciously correct and revise faulty science apologetics that is so prevalent in the church, especially in the American church. Without that gracious correction and revision, churches and Christians will continue to eschew science apologetics and, thus, not so subtly communicate that science favors atheism over Christianity.

We need to be willing to listen to the hurts, abuses, ridicules, discouragements, and offenses that atheists have suffered at the hands of those who call themselves Christians, and we need to be willing to empathize with the pain they have suffered.

We need to help atheists recognize the irrationality of allowing morally fallen human beings get between them and their morally perfect Creator. We need to help them forgive those who have wronged them. We need to help guide and encourage them to ask God to grant them what they presently lack—the desire and the power to forgive. Here, a personal testimony of how God granted us the desire and power to forgive may provide the needed encouragement.

We need to make ourselves available to answer questions and provide sound reasons about our hope and faith in Christ in the spirit of 1 Peter 3:15–16 (https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Peter+3%3A15–16&version=NIV); that is, with an attitude of gentleness, respect, and a clear conscience.

Atheist scientists and their disciples may not be the easiest mission field to tackle. However, I consistently observe that when they do convert to Christianity, they demonstrate even more passion, fervor, and research energy to persuading unbelievers of the truth of the Gospel than they ever devoted to promoting atheism.


The above is copied and pasted from:


http://www.reasons.org/blogs/todays-new-reason-to-believe/why-do-atheist-scientists-care-about-god%E2%80%99s-nonexistence

[tinhorn97062]

I once made an "atheist" really angry, while doing street ministry in Downtown Portland Oregon. I simply made the observation that his extreme denial of a God actually proved his belief that God exists. If he truly did not believe that God even existed, then he wouldn't spend the time and energy to try to prove otherwise.

I offered to pray with him, if he had a need or desire, but he just cussed me and took off down the street.

[dverna]

If God does exist why do Christians need to prove it?

Don Verna

[OutHuntn84]

If God does exist why do Christians need to prove it?

Don Verna

“And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age."”
**Matthew‬ *28:18-20‬ *NASB‬‬

Because Christ has commissioned us to do so.

[1johnlb]

If God does exist why do Christians need to prove it?

Don Verna

To answer your question of " need to prove ", no. We don't need to prove God, He does that all by Himself. To anyone who will whole heartedly seek Him.

Need to preach, would be a better question. Because He instructs us to. For how can one hear unless someone is sent and speaks the message.

Or maybe, what your asking is why we stand up against those who so try to disprove. Because the word says be ready to give account of why you believe and in doing so, we've learned that for every theory that an atheist can try to scientifically prove we can show were science has already disproved their theory. And where their rediculess ideas come from and the reasons they come, which typically boils down to the fact that they don't want to be all alone in their thinking, lost.

[dverna]

I have read arguments on both sides. So far, I have not found scientific proof of God, or that God does not exsist.

Organized religion has done a horrible job accepting science or corrupting it in the past. Look at what happened to Galileo and Copernius.

There have been highly intelligent men on each side.....yet the question remains and we are left with faith to chose our path. That is acceptable....but it is not science.

Where believers fail is accepting pseudoscience as scientific proof. It makes them look foolish. So much better to accept God on faith. The teachings in the Bible are relevant and provide guidance.

Don Verna

[1johnlb]

You've have obviously had the wrong science teacher, or your looking for them to hold up God in front of you and say here He is. I've watched several prove the bible through science which proves God. If your looking to get a blood sample proof from God to believe you'll never believe because your not gonna get it. God is omni present if your wanting something that's not already at your fingertips you'll have to seek Him for it.


It makes them look foolish. So much better to accept God on faith. The teachings in the Bible are relevant and provide guidance.*


I completely agree, faith, pure faith. Unfortunately we don't live in a world where we can just state our faith, we're hard pressed from every side. They want to disprove what we believe and bash us for it and yes we have those "christains" that wants to bash those who don't believe over the head, too. One day they will have to answer for it if they were at fault. It's also sad what's happening to this nation, the U.S. of the offended.

[dverna]

1Johnlb,
Faith does not require justification. It just IS! It is in our attempt to prove it that some get askew.

And no, none of my science teachers attempted to prove to disprove God. We were "indoctrinated" with Darwin's theory of evolution. That could be perceived as an indirect attack on God...no one said "Genesis in wrong" but it could be inferred that if Darwin was correct...the Bible had a flaw...either in how creation occurred or how it was reported. Yet we read the Bible, and I recall receiving a copy from the public school I attended. At our school, we attended church at both Christmas and Easter. So God was present in our schooling...but that was 5-6 decades ago. Now, things have changed and God is no longer in our schools.

I became an atheist while still a boy. In the last year, I have been questioning more. Blackwater has recommended some readings and I have two treasured Christian friends...true Christians...who I have known for a long time. Sometimes I wonder if those two men entered my life for a reason. One has a law degree and he has helped me the most.

I am not "there" yet, but I am not where I was. I have learned to accept there are men who profess to be "Christian" and will commit terrible acts on other men. Many other "Christians" will respect them in spite of the evil they project. The "revelation" for me has been to separate the man(men) from the faith. And hand in hand with that, to separate the "church" from faith.

Don Verna

[1johnlb]

Faith is our justification.

One fact I've found true about faith, faith always finds opposition, in just about every aspect of this life and the very fact that you come out the other side of opposition with faith, proves your faith.

Faith is also more than just a cofession, it's a decision to believe 100% regardless of the opposition, thus being justified.

Faith will cause you to make Him the center of your universe. And as is written: seek Me with all your heart and you will find Me. And when you find Him or I should say He finds you, you'll know it with all your heart

[Blackwater]

If God does exist why do Christians need to prove it?

Don Verna

Because so many deny it, and to show it is NOT just our imaginations that created it. When even science has come right up to the threshold of being able to prove that God must and indeed DOES exist, and that it's necessary that He exist, there can be very little further rational debate about it. Once established, a fact is a fact, and continued debate about it is foolish.

It's not totally conclusive yet, but it's so close that even the most devout atheist or denier, MUST realize that there's so little chance they're right and we believers are wrong, that it's very, very close to being a settled matter. They can still deny, of course, until God "comes down, introduces Himself, and shakes their hand," for denial is a matter of will, not of established fact. Even science now, which many deniers had counted on so heavily to support their disbelief, has been found to favor VERY heavily the side of belief. That ain't no small thing! If it were spoken of more in the media, it'd shock many. But the media avoids the whole issue because of the emotional reactions it stimulates, WITHOUT stimulating anyone to really change their minds, at least historically. And it's not conducive to a simple, quick "sound byte" presentation, so .... it gets neglected. That's why I post these things from time to time. Having the truth, or at least what comes right up to the point of being proven truth, and not spreading it out, would be a travesty. But it's not a "popular" concept, so .... that's yet another reason these things get neglected, and aren't spread any more than they are.

Our human sentiments often mask and hide things that would behoove us to know and pay attention to. I think we all recognize that.

However, your point that Christians have done a horrible job of dealing with the whole issue is very well taken, because in large part, it's true. But that's yet another reason I post these RTB tidbits from time to time. My hope is that it'll stimulate at least a few to check them out, and see if their assumptions are true that all they're putting forth is "pseudo-science" or not. I think any rational and fair minded person will, IF they'll just give them a chance, come to realize the awesome majesty and wonder of what all science has now come to demonstrate to us.

No, they can't bring God to you, introduce you and let you shake hands with Him, but they CAN show you how many arrows in our path point to Him, and that He really IS and must be like the Christian God of the Bible, and NOT like any other entity in any other religion. But they can take you right up to the gate where He lives, and invite you to open that gate. That's how God intended for it to be, I think. Faith will always be necessary to cross over that threshold that stands between us and all that we know, and the real and abiding acceptance of His reality, and all that He gave us and has given us so that we might understand Him more clearly and accurately.

People have believed for millenea now, without the benefit of all we have today to show us that God IS real and MUST exist, so now, with all that we now have, it can only be a determined mind that can resist belief. Even the heavens and the earth and all that are within them indicate that God truly lives and loves and watches over us. How anyone can not be interested in that is beyond my understanding. It HAS to be a determined will that now denies God and Christ and the Holy Spirit, but that too, has existed among some for seemingly forever. It will always be a choice whether we accept our Savior or not, no matter how much evidence can be presented in support of the proposition now. And it'll always stay that way, too, I believe, until this world passes away, and the faithful - those who have accepted redemption - go on to the next realm, where we'll have no need for these frail and fallible bodies, and where we'll commune with God and there's be permanent peace and love and understanding of things we can't now even really imagine.

If you or anyone else wants to at least give these folks a shot at proving themselves, their intent and validity, try two moderate length books: "Why The Universe Is The Way It Is," and "Beyond the Cosmos," both by Ross, with contributions from others. If those two don't get your attention and impress you, or anyone else, then you didn't read them with a truly open mind. And they're written so that you don't have to be an astrophysicist, astronomer or physicist to at least get a basic understanding of how things work. It can even, believe it or not, describe just how it is rationally possible for Christ to have passed through a locked door in the upper room after the crucifixion!

There, if that's not enough bait to get you to at least investigate, I don't have anything more to offer you right now. Since man first walked this earth, he has consistently pursued understanding of this realm we now live in, and how it works, where it all came from, and what it all means. And we'll still be doing that until the last moment of our existence. A few will haughtily deny and refuse to even check out the possibilities, and for those, there's a plan, though it was really created for another entity who simply could not be allowed to continue in Heaven.

What these books cannot explain, is what Heaven will really be like. Christ tried to give us some rough idea, I believe, but whatever it is, it will assuredly be the most wonderful thing we could even know - more wonderful probably, than we even have enough imagination to envision while we're still in this realm.

Science has been discovering SO many really neat and interesting and intriguing things in the past 30-40 years, since all the quarreling and claims of what science "proved" and what it did not, that the old arguments are no longer really valid on EITHER side, and we as Christians would be really missing a great opportunity if we don't familiarize ourselves with all the new stuff. And we don't even have to be scientifically inclined, really! How's that for a minor miracle???

These guys at RTB have some real and very genuine pearls if we'll just investigate them. Go to their website, for starters, and sign up for their weekly digest. They're short and easily and quickly read, and very interesting, intriguing and provocative of much thought and consideration. If you find those make you want to investigate further, get the two books above, and when you've read and digested those, take a look at some of the others they offer that you find interesting enough to investigate. I think you'll find it all very interesting, intriguing and thought provoking, and in the end, very satisfying. Just one man's recommendation, based on his own investigations and experience, at least. And it's really so easy to check out, and the first step is probably to just sign up for their free weekly digest. They solicit donations from time to time, and you can donate or not as pleases you at any given time. One thing they aren't, is long-winded. So it really doesn't take long to at least see if they're intriguing and challenging enough to warrant further consideration and investigating. Why all this info hasn't been spread around more, when all the atheists and agnostics get so much media coverage, is a question I'll have to leave to you to answer, because I have no idea why that should be so. Good luck, whatever you choose to do.