casting for other people

[sandman228]

this isn't something I usually do but I had someone approach me a few days ago while at the shooting range . ive known this guy prob 30+ years he used to run the road with my dad as a helper when dad drove a moving van in the early 80's and has been a friend of the family ever since . so this past Saturday I was at the range and he was there I see him from time to time there and have bumped into him at local gunshops . we ended up bs ing a while and spent the afternoon shooting a couple benches from each other . he knows I'm a reloader and a caster he is pretty hardcore into guns and reloads ammo but don't cast .so he asks me if I were to get you some lead wheel weights would you cast me up some 9mm bullets . I said yea I could prob make him some ,to tell you the truth I didn't think I would ever hear another word about it he has offered to get me lead in the past and never came through . so he calls me up this morning and says you got any buckets I said yea , ok I'm at _______ garage can you meet me hes got wheel weights so I said ok . I get there the guy has an overflowing 5 gal bucket and a bunch on the floor around it he asked us to leave him a few handfuls incase he needed them so I left him approx. a quarter bucket and brought the rest home . so now I picked them up , ive gotta separate and smelt them , ive gotta cast them into 9mm bullets and powder coat them with my materials my time and effort not to mention I have a pesky job I gotta work around lol . I'm not expecting any money but I was thinking of keeping some of the lead for myself does 25-30% of clean ingots seem fair ? or does that sound greedy . me and my big mouth lol , not to mention my son brought me roughly 75 lb of lead flashing last night too I'm gonna have to spend a few hours smelting every morning before work the rest of the week . don't get me wrong I'm not complaining any free lead is good .

[Plate plinker]

What are friends for? You spoke quickly without enough forethought. I think you should have offered to help him cast up the bullets. My guess is he has no idea how much time you will have invested in this operation. (I didn't) Keep track of your time in case it comes up you can explain why you cannot do this over and over.

[Lakehouse2012]

How about invite him over to be an active participant? Teach a man to fish and all that....

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[Calamity Jake]

I do a little casting for friends. Some of them I even size and lube, they do the loading.

[Lakehouse2012]

At a minimum i would hold back 30% of the ingots. Maybe 50%. Even 20 lbs of ingot is gonna make 10,000 9mm boolits...

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[LakeviewBulldog]

I would also keep at least half the ingots as well. That is a ton of work to do. I'd probably give him about 500 ready to load bullets and call it even.

[toallmy]

Possibly invite him over to see how it gets done , if he is a reloader and a shooter he might really get into the real work and enjoy it cleaning up the ww and casting and sizing . If he is not interested it means he just wants some free boollits so you should avoid further such deals . You might find a casting buddy . As far as lead you can buy it for around a 1.00 - 1.50 or so ready to cast , price some cast store bought boollits you get the idea . I would probably go 50-50 on a split for just melting down and clean up the coww that he supplied , but casting and lubed I wouldn't be interested in at all unless he was a friend and a close one at that than I would probably just give them to him any way . Store bought 9s are around $50. A thousand,45 $80. Or so . Good luck .

[edler7]

Get him to do the part you hate most- for me that would be separating. Maybe you can get him interested enough to help with the casting and powder coat, too.

[Soundguy]

Why not get your reloading friend into casting?

He needs a 60$ pot and a 25$ mold, a 35$ thermometer , and can scavenge and ingot pan, smelt pot, etc.

As to your question.. I say you keep HALF the clean ingots..

[dverna]

Your new "customer " will never cast if you do all the work. You need to look at it like a job. What is your time worth? What is the value of the lead you are getting.

Don Verna

[PB234]

If you are keeping some of the lead as payment are you not manufacturing bullets and selling them and doesn't this require an FFL? If the guy happens to have something go very wrong shooting them do you have insurance? You might not be at all at fault and will enjoy explaining that as your pocketbook gets thinner.

[Soundguy]

Split the lead 50/50, dirty. Then teach him how to smelt, ingot, melt, and cast using his molds. The 50% dirty lead is for your time getting him to the point that he is pouring his lead in his molds, making his own boolits, with his hands.

That keeps his hands on the liability.

[DerekP Houston]

I'd consider 50% of the ingots as payment and invite him over to see the process. I don't bulk cast for anyone but I'll cast up a hundred or 2 for samples or similar use if someone legit shows interest.

[KenH]

Just another vote for no more than 50% of ingot lead to your buddy, and some cast bullets. If you mention to him he just might think 500 or so bullets that are ready for loading might be full payment for the 5 gal of WW. Sorting, smelting, casting, powder coating is a LOTS of work! If he wants to help, that's another matter, but you doing all the work....

[TexasGrunt]

I cast lures for a couple of friends. As long as they replace my supplies I'm good to go. That being said sorting wheel weights is work, and if I'm working I expect something for it. I can sort a bucket fo wheel weights in about an hour. That should net me about $25 worth of compensation.

[kmrra]

I haven't read all the post yet , but your time and PC materials is worth at least 50% , If I was you get him to come over and teach him or at least show him how much time it takes just to cast let alone to PC them too. I would think thats all but fair JMO

[bullseye67]

Here is how I handle such questions. Every now and then, I have been asked to convert a bucket of WW or other lead into pistol boolits. I always respond the same way...."No Problem". I can buy a bucket of WW for around $20.00 so I let them know they will get the equivalent of $20.00 worth of boolits ready to shoot. End of story. It seems that most guys think that "MY" time is free and theirs isn't. I have had some really good friends come over and help with sorting WW while I cast a pile of boolits or melt a pile WW into ingots. A shared effort make a big difference!!

[wlkjr]

At a minimum i would hold back 30% of the ingots. Maybe 50%. Even 20 lbs of ingot is gonna make 10,000 9mm boolits...

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By my estimation 20 lbs of clean lead will only do 1217 115 grain bullets. At 61 rounds per pound it would take 164 pounds. Someone correct me if my math is faulty.

[lightman]

I would have said something like I really don't have the extra time but if you want to come over I will help you to learn. Thats my standard reply when someone ask me to load for them. If you have the time and want to do the work I think 50% of the lead is more than fair. Then again, I spent most of my working life putting in around 3500 hrs a year!

[Lakehouse2012]

By my estimation 20 lbs of clean lead will only do 1217 115 grain bullets. At 61 rounds per pound it would take 164 pounds. Someone correct me if my math is faulty.
Yes thats right, i was being sarcastic. 7000*20/115=1217

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[Skunk1]

Casting partners or 50/50 would be my idea. Lot of work for a someone just looking for someone else to do the work.

[JimB..]

Hello friend, if I have some range scrap can you cast me some bullets...

seriously, I'd give him 500 or 1000 of whatever 9mm you usually cast, coated run about $75/1000 so it seems more than fair to him. An alternative would be to make an extra couple hundred every time you're casting and deliver to him in small doses over a year.

of course he may be expecting a 5 gal bucket of bullets, so maybe talk about it asap just to set things straight.

Btw, if I did such a deal with you I'd offer you 1/2 the lead for clean ingots, and then 1/2 of my share of the ingots or more to do the casting, coating and sizing.

[shoot-n-lead]

If they will bring me a bucket of weights...I will cast them 100 bullets.;-)

[NavyVet1959]

Invite him over and show him what it takes to smelt down the lead. Then give him a 2-cavity mold and show him how to cast. Don't tell him about the 6-cavity ones. :)

Show him the easy way (tumble lube) UNLESS you want to scare him off by using powder coating with each bullet dipped into a electrostatic fluid bed one at a time and then placed on the tray going into the toaster oven. :)

Hopefully, he'll bring beer...

[wlkjr]

I've got a friend who has brought me some big chunks of linotype. He's never asked for anything and always giving me brass and stuff. I'm going to cast him a few hundred 9 & 45 and coat them for him. Said he had a 6" barrel for a G20 he's going to give me. Reckon that's the least I can do.

[RogerDat]

Put me down for come on over and we will work through the process together. Sort 1/2 bucket, smelt it, pour nice clean ingots, cast 500 bullets or whatever size batches you typically cast as bullets, PC, size and done. BUT all progress stops when he leaves, until he comes back. If he can't help then his stuff partly done will just sit, acting as insurance that he not bother you unless he is willing to help. I could even see potential for him to work the next operation while you cast he can PC and bake and then move to size when you finish casting and can take over PC and bake.

A half bucket of WW's will make so many 9mm that I doubt he will have any reason to begrudge you some of the lead, just work it out up front. 50/50 split of ingots for the propane, and PC materials plus your time and equipment seem fair? From his end beats the heck out of $22 for 250 Berry's plated for a couple of evenings or weekend afternoons worth of time. If it is too much for him to help, then it darn sure is too much for you to do on your own.

[garandsrus]

At a minimum i would hold back 30% of the ingots. Maybe 50%. Even 20 lbs of ingot is gonna make 10,000 9mm boolits...

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20 lbs makes about 1200 115gr bullets. 7000/115=60 bullets/lb

[KenH]

20 lbs makes about 1200 115gr bullets. 7000/115=60 bullets/lb

And you're figuring 100% with no waste while casting. I usually have a small amout of waste and would figure perhaps 1,000 bullets per 20 lb?

[country gent]

I have a big ladle pot I cast out of. I will offer test bullets to people 50 or so to try before they buy a mould if they arnt within the area. If they are I offer for them to come out and learn, cast the bullets they want to try themselves. Mitch on here has been out for a sundays session. I dont worry so much about the lead. There arenormally 3 of us that cast around my pot together. No radio but friends and good conversation. Ive found if I cast for someone it becomes the norm If I teach them to cast then they seem more likely to start themselves.

[WJP]

I'd just call him up and ask what he expects in return. You said you would cast him some if he brought lead. I doubt he expects you to cast it all for him. I would do as others suggest. Invite him over and get him to work some. Then at the end of sorting and melting negotiate a deal.

[NavyVet1959]

Let's not forget the percentage of steel and zinc in wheelweights these days. I've seen 50% yields on some of my "lead" hauls. And it is just getting worse.

[rockrat]

When my "little brother" would farm someone else's ground, the landowner would get 1/3, but had to pay for 1/3 of the seed and fertilizer.

I would say, keep 75% of the lead, as you have double duty, sorting as well as casting.

[shoot-n-lead]

Even 20 lbs of ingot is gonna make 10,000 9mm boolits...


I want some of THIS^^^ alloy...

[OutHuntn84]

I would see it as another person helping me source lead. If it were me I'd see it as he just saved me $25 for a bucket of mystery wheel weights so I'd make him up a batch of boolits of $25-$35 retail value and explain just what goes into making everyone of em. Hopefully he will be grateful enough that he keeps scrounging you up some more lead

[scotner]

I always forget how much time and WORK is involved in sorting and smelting wheel weights until I bring another bucket or two home. Then there is the mess in the floor and hauling the junk to the recycle center. Your friend needs to be around for the entire process from start to finish at least once so he will appreciate what you are doing for him. This is my second time getting into casting and I did not remember from last time how much was involved. And I am retired this time.

[NavyVet1959]

I always forget how much time and WORK is involved in sorting and smelting wheel weights until I bring another bucket or two home. Then there is the mess in the floor and hauling the junk to the recycle center. Your friend needs to be around for the entire process from start to finish at least once so he will appreciate what you are doing for him. This is my second time getting into casting and I did not remember from last time how much was involved. And I am retired this time.

That's why I just dump everything into the smelting pot and skim off that which does not melt. Mostly it's steel, but sometimes I get some zinc. I just take whatever alloy I get and call it "wheelweight" and ignore the small amount of pure lead that is mixed in with it. It goes into pistol bullet anyway and usually get mixed 50:50 with pure lead. That sorting stuff gets old pretty quick. :)

[sandman228]

well I started smelting some this morning .I'm roughly half way through and have 66 lb of ingots so far . I worked at it for about 2 hours then went and shoveled the sidewalks . after smelting I always like to go back and check on things a bit later to make sure nothing still hot or smoldering ,so while I was checking everything out I went ahead and sorted the rest of the wheel weights while I was out in the shed I started to process the lead my son gave me a couple nights ago . I thought it was lead flashing all folded up it was wide sheets of lead about 16/18 inches and it looks like it has insulation residue on 1 side of it . ive never had any of this before .

[Soundguy]

Very likely xray shielding sheets. Many have glue/insulation backer on one side from being in the wall

[sandman228]

Very likely xray shielding sheets. Many have glue/insulation backer on one side from being in the wall

that's what I was thinking too, I'm not sure how much I have but if I get to guess i'd say 60-70 lb of it .

[Cord]

I did a deal kinda like that...it was a friend from the range who is a reloader.
My terms were 25% of the weight in lead would be returned as boolits, about a break even point.

But instead of inviting him over, I hauled my propane pot rig and ingot moulds to his house;
he cobbled together a dutch oven on a Coleman stove, together we spent a fun day
and (for free) I melted up all the lead he had accumulated: WWs, range, roof and plumber pipe.
So he knows for sure just how much work it is making several hundred pounds of ingots.

Took along my old Lee 20, and a couple of simple moulds to show him how it's done....

Now he mostly casts his own, on the cheap, with a Lee pot and a Lyman 450,
buying another basic mould every now and then, and I'm his advisor.

But he will gladly trade some of those ingots for MP and NOE hollowpoints.
He won't spend that much $$ for a mould (yet) but he sure loves those boolits!
.

[NavyVet1959]

But instead of inviting him over, I hauled my propane pot rig and ingot moulds to his house;
he cobbled together a dutch oven on a Coleman stove, together we spent a fun day
and (for free) I melted up all the lead he had accumulated: WWs, range, roof and plumber pipe.

If you have natural gas service at the house, it's often relatively easy to hook up burner to it using a couple of connectors and a valve and an shop compressed air hose. Around here, every house that I've needed this capability has had a 1/4" NPT plug in one of the elbow fittings off the gas meter and it was a simple matter to add a globe valve and a shop compressed air quick-connect fitting to it. Often you need to increase the diameter of the jet in the burner to 1/16" and it works best with the banjo-style burners instead of the jet-style.

[DerekP Houston]

If you have natural gas service at the house, it's often relatively easy to hook up burner to it using a couple of connectors and a valve and an shop compressed air hose. Around here, every house that I've needed this capability has had a 1/4" NPT plug in one of the elbow fittings off the gas meter and it was a simple matter to add a globe valve and a shop compressed air quick-connect fitting to it. Often you need to increase the diameter of the jet in the burner to 1/16" and it works best with the banjo-style burners instead of the jet-style.

You know that gives me an idea. I just found out my grandfather had a gas line run to the patio so he could use natural gas instead of refilling the propane tank. Its sealed now but just need to remove the plug to turn it back on I believe. I might have to setup a dedicated area for smelting with it...

[Soundguy]

Good idea.

[John Boy]

He won't spend that much $$ for a mould (yet) but he sure loves those boolits!
I have no issue sending a forum member/giving an acquaintance a tray of 50 bullets that they want to try before buying the mold or doing a swap of bullets for something he has that I want
But to cast starting with a bucket of WW's - Naw! Many commercial vendors sell Pb bullets at a reasonable price - so give them the vendor's link if they want 500 or so specific bullets

[scotner]

That's why I just dump everything into the smelting pot and skim off that which does not melt. Mostly it's steel, but sometimes I get some zinc. I just take whatever alloy I get and call it "wheelweight" and ignore the small amount of pure lead that is mixed in with it. It goes into pistol bullet anyway and usually get mixed 50:50 with pure lead. That sorting stuff gets old pretty quick. :)

I am sure that is one way of dealing with it but out of 3 buckets of WW I had about 2/3 of a bucket of scrap and an unusually high amount of just plain trash. I have to deal with it some time so I had just as soon make it up front. It may depend on how large your pot is too. The one I am using is probably about 30 pounds and if I have to wait for a batch to melt down to scoop out the scrap it would be a much longer process for that part. You do not separate stick on weights from clip on? I melt them down separately although I may mix some of the soft lead back in for pistol bullets.

[NavyVet1959]

I am sure that is one way of dealing with it but out of 3 buckets of WW I had about 2/3 of a bucket of scrap and an unusually high amount of just plain trash. I have to deal with it some time so I had just as soon make it up front. It may depend on how large your pot is too. The one I am using is probably about 30 pounds and if I have to wait for a batch to melt down to scoop out the scrap it would be a much longer process for that part. You do not separate stick on weights from clip on? I melt them down separately although I may mix some of the soft lead back in for pistol bullets.

Well, the obvious trash like lug nuts and valve stems, I discard as I'm filling up the pot, but the steel and zinc wheelweights and the stick-on ones, I just toss it together and let it give me whatever alloy it gives me. I got bored with that sorting pretty quickly. :)

[NavyVet1959]

You know that gives me an idea. I just found out my grandfather had a gas line run to the patio so he could use natural gas instead of refilling the propane tank. Its sealed now but just need to remove the plug to turn it back on I believe. I might have to setup a dedicated area for smelting with it...

And put a 1/4 NPT fitting at the end of the line and you can put connectors on it so that you can use a air hose to move the burner even further away if necessary.