Pietta 1851 Navy "YANK"

[49FMarlin]

Ive been having ALOT of fun shooting my Pietta 1858 New Army:-D

so now I'm looking at the 1851 then later on ill go for an 1860

1=Ive read the 1851 in 36 is historically correct,
so is it blasphemy to buy it in .44 ?

2=how does the .36 shoot? compared to the .44 ?

not worried about size as I also LOVE to cast my own,

3= what revolver did colt originally put the larger caliber on the smaller frame making the cylinder fatter and the water table stepped?
I like the look,
and does cabbalas sell it? lol

4= cabbalas has a "Yank" sheriffs model
is it worth buying instead of the full size? is it historically correct? is it more fun to shoot?
balance better? or just a new toy rave from pietta

tell me the Good/Bad/Ugly of the 1851's

[smilie=1:



thanks
john

[bob208]

the 1860 colt army was the first .44 with the small frame.
nothing wrong with a 51 in .36. as for a the short model colt made a pocket navy and a 5shot police model.

[johnson1942]

save your money and buy a uberti.

[49FMarlin]

save your money and buy a uberti.

not being a smart alec-- but why uberti ?

[Omnivore]

I have multiple Pietta and multiple Uberti open top colts. It's currently a toss-up. Go with either one. The Ubertis all have short arbors, meaning that you're adjusting the barrel-to-cylinder gap according to how far in you push the wedge. All of my Piettas have a long arbor, so no matter how hard you tap in the wedge, the cylinder gap is pretty large. Both are easily fixed. Both have their other problems, and both are an extremely good deal considering the price.

Colt made shorter barreled guns, yes, but most of them were the pocket models. In any case, the 7.5" barrel was the standard length for the Navy models (1851 and 1861) and all the Dragoons (1st, 2nd and 3rd models) before the 1860 Army came out with an 8" barrel.

In my opinion a good first Colt would be the '51 Navy with the 7.5" barrel. Colt also offered a 12" model, they referred to as having a "carbine" barrel. A detachable shoulder stock was offered along with it.

They never offered a Navy sized frame 44 caliber with a Navy style barrel; that's something the Italians, for reasons unknown, came up with on their own in the 20th century.

The real 44 on a Navy-sized frame is called an 1860 Army, it has the creeping, Root-designed loading lever, the sleek, round 8" barrel and a longer grip. The '60 Army in the proper 8" barrel configuration would also be an excellent choice, it just depends on which one appeals to you more. The '61 Navy ("Navy" meaning it was produced in 36 caliber) is styled after the '60 Army.

The only model offered as a "Police" model, the 1862 Police in 36 caliber, was built on the 1849 Pocket frame, and stepped up from 31 to 36 caliber in the same way the '60 Army was a 36 stepped up to 44. The little '62 Police came in several barrel lengths, up to 6.5" and was the last percussion model offered by Colt. It is a very nice, handy pistol.

The Italians took a '61 Navy, shortened the barrel, and erroneously called it a "police" model. That is not a Police" model as Colt defined it. The Italians must have been listening to the same people Michelle Obama has been listening to; "...change our history! our traditions and our institutions..."

In short; they all fit together, and function internally, exactly the same, so the choice is entirely one of styling and caliber.

I will say that the creeping loading lever of the 1860 and later models is superior in every way to all other percussion gun loading systems, although most people won't care. Or notice.

The Uberti loading plungers are of the same nose shape (most made for long ogive conicals) as the originals, whereas all of my Piettas were shaped for round ball. Most people will not notice, or care, about this either. It can make a real difference, in that some of the Ubertis, when used to load round ball, will drag the ball right back put of the chamber. That's because the deep nose depression in the loading plunger, shaped for a pointy conical, can bite into a round ball and hold onto it enough to pull it back out. It's VERY easy to fix, however.

[johnson1942]

better made, still need to be tuned and screws tightened but better made.

[Omnivore]

And by the way; the "Yank" designation as applied to a standard 36 caliber, steel framed Colt Navy model appears to be quite new. It came at the same time they raised the price several months ago, to be close to Uberti’s pricing. Before that, the regular and proper 1851 36 cal Navy replica was simply a 36 cal Navy.

So they've invented their own designation system, having departed significantly from the original Colt designations. They call their brass framed "Navy" 44 a "Confederate" model (though Colt never made a brass framed open top, and the Confederates never made a brass copy in 44 caliber) and they recently decided to distinguish the steel 36 as the "Yank". It's all made-up, and rather silly, and stupid, and it distracts the inattentive shopper away from real history.

It’s bad enough that we now see guns that never existed until the 20th Century being depicted in Civil War movies. The brass frame Remington in Ride with the Devil is one example. I don’t believe anyone ever made a brass frame Remington copy until the Italians decided to, what the heck, go with it.

Much about the European Mind has never make a lick of sense.

[Hellgate]

My all time favorite Colt is the 44 cal '51 "Navy". You get the handling/balance of the Navy with the punch of the 44.

[49FMarlin]

went with the 1851 in .36
went through and smoothed it all out inside, having a ball shooting it

saving for the 1860 in .44 next might go with the police model

[Omnivore]

49FMarlin; The '51 in its original 36 calibver is an excellent piece. I think you'll love the Colt '60 Army also. The Pietta '51/44 was my favorite, for overall handling, until I got a '60 Army. They really did get better, overall; as they evolved their designs, the guns got more sensible.

However; the Walker and the later Dragoons are still pretty neat. The '60 Army though, from the overall standpoint of size, weight and performance, is a much more highly developed piece, as is the Remington New Model Army of course. The '62 Colt Police is really nice also, being the close sibling of the '60, but I had to do some tweaking to mine in the way of adding Treso nipples, setting the proper barrel-to-frame fitting by shimming the arbor, adding a taller, dovetailed front sight, and opening up the loading port to accept conicals.

Too bad no one is making a repro of the Remington New Model Police, because I believe that would be an outstanding percussion gun. There are still a few originals out there, but a lot of them have been converted to fire metal cartridges, and of course they cost a lot more.