Pewter? Help me learn

[Scorpius]

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[Yodogsandman]

I've been burned too many times by decorative motif. Now I only buy food service items that are hallmarked to be pewter. The US standard is at least 92% tin. They will also have antimony and copper. Normally 6% antimony and 2% copper.

[runfiverun]

no and more than likely no.
if it says china on it double no.

[Scorpius]

Ya I passed on them. I did however pick this up for $4 and my hi tek should be here before weekend :-)
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161222/d4c7cc4d5ff5a1b414cdcd6d2a23a717.jpg


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[jsizemore]

If stuff is pewter it will say "pewter" INTO the surface called a touchmark. When you see a name or inscription cast as part of the original, like the SK of the second picture frame, put it down and back away cuz it ain't pewter.

[OS OK]

183295Scorpius...add this to that oven and you'll be good to go...

[Scorpius]

Amazing you guys finding pewter anywhere. I've hit 3-4 different thrift shops no less than twice each and no food service type items popping out at me. Nor anything marked pewter.


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[Grmps]

my last pewter score was heavy candlesticks / hollow base, no fillers and a dinged up coffeepot

[CastingFool]

My last pewter score was a Stieff bowl that weighs 19.5 oz. Haven't melted it yet, cuz I have been trying to find out if it's worth more as a collector's item. Haven't had much luck with that either. I paid something like $2 plus tax at a thrift shop.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Scorpius,

I understand your possible need to learn about pewter, but I wonder if you possibly have access to or already a supply of clip on Wheel Weights.

If so, the nominal percentage of tin in lead alloy WW is about .5% and even with that small percentage of tin, there have been millions and millions of bullets successfully cast and shot from that alloy.

My point being that if you have a supply of WW, the need to add tin to the mix is questionable at best and a waste of good metal at worse.

My 465gr - 45/70 bullets are cast of an alloy of 50/50 - WW/lead which would decrease that .5% percentage of tin by about half. These bullets still cast very well even at this low tin percentage.

If you are needing to make an alloy due to a lack of WW, you might be better off to buy known alloys from a company like Roto Metals and go from there.

Just an Ol'Coot's thoughts here, but I have never gained anything by adding tin to the mix.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[OS OK]

Enough talk...let's see some results already!

[Scorpius]

Scorpius,

I understand your possible need to learn about pewter, but I wonder if you possibly have access to or already a supply of clip on Wheel Weights.

If so, the nominal percentage of tin in lead alloy WW is about .5% and even with that small percentage of tin, there have been millions and millions of bullets successfully cast and shot from that alloy.

My point being that if you have a supply of WW, the need to add tin to the mix is questionable at best and a waste of good metal at worse.

My 465gr - 45/70 bullets are cast of an alloy of 50/50 - WW/lead which would decrease that .5% percentage of tin by about half. These bullets still cast very well even at this low tin percentage.

If you are needing to make an alloy due to a lack of WW, you might be better off to buy known alloys from a company like Roto Metals and go from there.

Just an Ol'Coot's thoughts here, but I have never gained anything by adding tin to the mix.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

I actually have about 100 lbs of weight I put into ingots. As for casting I air cooled my first batch, I may try to do the water drop next time.
I'm looking to make them hard as I can then do my first hi tek coating. Some for pistol but mostly for my rifles.
7.62x54r, 8mm, 30 carbine and my .32 acp.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161223/c6e2a13220973990b3a5950193db3cc8.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161223/ba4213344cb614c74f21584ef1280c0d.jpg


These were my first casts about 2 months back.


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[OS OK]

Gorgeous! The sprue cuts look perfect, everything looks filled out perfectly they even shine like a diamond in a goats butt!
You oughta be teaching the rest of us to do so well!

[Yodogsandman]

I find most of my pewter at yard sales and flea markets. Always haggle the price down or walk away.

[Scorpius]

Well perhaps beginners luck, but lots of info from people here and I made sure to smelt clean ingots and start with clean molds.


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[runfiverun]

hmm looks like the 311359 and the NOE 323-160gr.

looks like a good buy on the toaster oven.

[308Jeff]

I actually have about 100 lbs of weight I put into ingots. As for casting I air cooled my first batch, I may try to do the water drop next time.
I'm looking to make them hard as I can then do my first hi tek coating. Some for pistol but mostly for my rifles.
7.62x54r, 8mm, 30 carbine and my .32 acp.


What are you planning on casting for your 30 carbine? Very interested.

[runfiverun]

those pointy ones above are for the 30 carbine.

[Scorpius]

What are you planning on casting for your 30 carbine? Very interested.

Yup. They worked just fine, even though all I used was lee alox and i didn't gas check them. But at 40 yards I don't think it matters much.


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[MyFlatline]

Dang Bart, didn't know you were casting already. Looking good. We'll have to compare Hy Tec to powder coat and see how they do. You gonna try em in your MX ?

[Retumbo]

At the right price it buy items like that. I do however melt each piece individuals and go from there.

[Scorpius]

How about this? Pewter?

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161228/af646dc319c37848ee483360c6bb530b.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161228/c81d7daaf2aa1f6c57fa40d92d98a0bf.jpg


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[Scorpius]

How about this? Pewter?

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Or this

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161228/d2a22d680de63cc06075a16f091f6974.jpg


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[jsizemore]

The top one looks pretty good. The green corrosion in the bottom of the top is a little troublesome. If it bends easily I'd buy it. If it doesn't then it may have a brass base metal that's making it's way to the surface as the green corrosion you see in the inside bottom. Different stuff gets stacked together and it could be from another item stacked inside.

The Arthur Court piece looks to be silverplate.

[Scorpius]

The top one looks pretty good. The green corrosion in the bottom of the top is a little troublesome. If it bends easily I'd buy it. If it doesn't then it may have a brass base metal that's making it's way to the surface as the green corrosion you see in the inside bottom. Different stuff gets stacked together and it could be from another item stacked inside.

The Arthur Court piece looks to be silverplate.

Well $4 down the drain. It doesn't bend easily at all. Guess I'm giving up on goodwill and waiting for yard sales in the spring.
Goodwill seems to cherry pick everything and sets out the junk (since the word cr--ap gets censored


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[Scorpius]

So think i found some today.
A little round box like thing for dispensing stamps. I couldn't bend it, but scraped it against a piece of shelf steel edge and it left a mark like on lead.
Melted it down and it has a gold hue to it.
Next was a Christmas ornament for a picture, it wasn't stamped anywhere but the package touted pewter and had the health warning. It looked as though it was casted.
Melted it and it looked like lead.
Both I melted with my small propane torch from Home Depot, they melted within 15 seconds of torch hitting it. I melted them in my ingot mold tray which took a lot of direct flame to keep them from solidifying so I could spoon off everything.
Total weight 12oz, spent total of $2.09 for it.
I have a lee tester if those would tell me anything further.


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[6mm win lee]

So think i found some today.
A little round box like thing for dispensing stamps. I couldn't bend it, but scraped it against a piece of shelf steel edge and it left a mark like on lead.
Melted it down and it has a gold hue to it.
Next was a Christmas ornament for a picture, it wasn't stamped anywhere but the package touted pewter and had the health warning. It looked as though it was casted.
Melted it and it looked like lead.
Both I melted with my small propane torch from Home Depot, they melted within 15 seconds of torch hitting it. I melted them in my ingot mold tray which took a lot of direct flame to keep them from solidifying so I could spoon off everything.
Total weight 12oz, spent total of $2.09 for it.
I have a lee tester if those would tell me anything further.

I melted down a bent up known pewter candle holder with a propane torch and the pewter lump has a golden tint to it.

Could your second item be zinc? I learned from reading the pewter sticky up above that anything that looks like it was cast in all likihood is not pewter or tin. Saved me from a couple of mistakes.

[Scorpius]

I melted down a bent up known pewter candle holder with a propane torch and the pewter lump has a golden tint to it.

Could your second item be zinc? I learned from reading the pewter sticky up above that anything that looks like it was cast in all likihood is not pewter or tin. Saved me from a couple of mistakes.

What does zinc and pewter test out at on the hardness scale ?


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[TexasGrunt]

After reading the pewter threads here I grabbed my wife and headed out today. Hit a small local thrift store and found about a pound for $5. Hit two Goodwill stores and I have to say that the Goodwill stores in Dallas don't hold a candle to the Goodwill stores in Portland. Didn't find a single thing at either one. Headed to another local thrift store and found another pound for $10.

Two pounds will hold me right now. I've got bids in on another 7 lbs. If I win the auctions my delivered cost will be under $40 shipped.

[Scorpius]

So my lee tester shows the following.
For the stamp thing 12.5
For the xmas ornament 10.4.
Yes I need to flux and clean them up more. But first time with what I thought might be pewter so it was quick and in the ingot mold with torch :-).
I'm thinking the yellow tent is whatever was on the surface of the stamp holder. Note I scratched the hardness numbers with the point of a pair of small scissors, so I'm doubtful any of this is zinc as zinc would be rather hard I'd suspect.
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[Retumbo]

Over heated pewter will show yellow and has a tendency to be real grainy when it solidifies

[308Jeff]

Tagging on to this... I've been dropping by the local Goodwills fairly frequently. Mostly for cast iron, mini-muffin molds, etc. I've been finding a fair amount of serving items that I have no idea what they are. Tarnished silver like finish, non-magnetic, no maker's stamps, too heavy to be aluminum, not easily bendable. What the heck is this stuff?

[minmax]

Cr@p, more than likely.

[jsizemore]

Tagging on to this... I've been dropping by the local Goodwills fairly frequently. Mostly for cast iron, mini-muffin molds, etc. I've been finding a fair amount of serving items that I have no idea what they are. Tarnished silver like finish, non-magnetic, no maker's stamps, too heavy to be aluminum, not easily bendable. What the heck is this stuff?

Electroplated silverware. Real silver will say Sterling.

The other things I see at the thrift stores are cast aluminum and stainless steel.

[imashooter2]

With well over 700 pounds under my belt, I've never had ingots that look like those.

http://imashooter2.com/sell/pew6s.jpg

[Scorpius]

With well over 700 pounds under my belt, I've never had ingots that look like those.

http://imashooter2.com/sell/pew6s.jpg

Do you smelt yours in an ingot mold? Once I get larger quantities I'll try that.
Another option I'm thinking is set my convection oven for 450 and throw these and my ingot molds there. If it melts then that'll tell me for sure.
Torching in an ingot mold isn't simple cause one side wants to harden until you get the mold really warmed up well.




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[imashooter2]

I use a Lyman "big dipper" electric pot and use a Lyman ladle to cast small ~2 ounce ingots in a Potter mold.

[Highway41]

I use a Lyman "big dipper" electric pot and use a Lyman ladle to cast small ~2 ounce ingots in a Potter mold.
Got a picture of the mold you use? I've got about 12 pounds to melt and want to get them to a useful size.

Thought about using a 240gr Lee mold but if there's something that I could use to get 2oz ingots that would be even better.

[imashooter2]

It's a Potter 107 ingot mold. The key to ingot size is the Lyman dipper. Filling the cavities would give ~6 ounce ingots.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=88680&d=1385511792

ETA: one of our members uses the curved bottom of beverage cans to cast "coins." Useing a Lyman dipper, you could easily make them about 2 ounces as well.

[Scorpius]

Ok quick remelt in a small pot I picked up at goodwill tonight. (Figured it was a sign to remelt :-) )

Anyhow this is what they look like with a quick cleaning. My rcbs thermometer showed 280 when they began melting and by 350 they were completely melted. Keep in mind my torch was hitting at the side, so takes awhile for that heat to travel to other side. I kept thermometer at the heat source side.

I need to fashion a smaller burn contraption to heat from bottom in the future.
Also note that the hardness after air cool shows about 19.5-20 with the Lee tester.

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Oh. These were a four pack :-) will trade for some pewter :-) got three I don't need since they sold them as a set. Perfect for probably up to 3-5 pounds would be my guess.

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170104/5076f7b62eb12ae35440795330df94e7.jpg



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[imashooter2]

Those look much better. Your melt temperatures sound low though. With the electric pot, my melt temperatures are closer to 450, and I take it to 550 before fluxing with sawdust and pouring.

[Drm50]

I've got several Lyman & RCBS ingot molds that cast a regular size ingot, I have a Lee that I dont
use very often that cavities are a combo, regular and 1/4 size. I use it for tin, casting the small
ones.

[jsizemore]

Melt temp is a bit low for pewter or the thermometer needs calibrating. Could have some bismuth mixed in.

[Hardcast416taylor]

As far as finding pewter I look for estate auctions or on line auctions. I must warn you about hitting the jackpot on a box of hall market pewter items and making a notation about it here on the site. Beware, you must post a picture of the find as well as your Hawaiian birth certificate and your High School year book picture. There are `doubting Thomas`s` aplenty here abouts that will doubt what you have, and no I still can`t post photos.Robert

[imashooter2]

Let it go man. It was all good natured ribbing. No one questioned your integrity.

[jsizemore]

Speak for yourself. That rascal bears watchin'.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Following this topic along and watching/reading about the effort and yes expense that many go to trying to find pewter, seems it would just be time and money better spent with an order to Rotometal for some pure tin.

Then that along with the fact that providing your casting from typical Clip on Wheel Weights alloy adding even small percentages of tin or pewter is simply wasted money. Not needed for quality bullets or casting.

Yep, been there and done that and there was little to nothing to be gained.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[6mm win lee]

Following this topic along and watching/reading about the effort and yes expense that many go to trying to find pewter, seems it would just be time and money better spent with an order to Rotometal for some pure tin.

Then that along with the fact that providing your casting from typical Clip on Wheel Weights alloy adding even small percentages of tin or pewter is simply wasted money. Not needed for quality bullets or casting.

Yep, been there and done that and there was little to nothing to be gained.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

I think you are correct that sometimes it would be easier to just buy it. Buying from Rotometals or Zip Metals would have been my option until the guys here got me to looking for pewter. I have picked up around twenty-five pounds of pewterware with an average cost of just under six bucks a pound over the last year.

Could it be the availibility of old pewter is a regional thing? Stieff and Woodbury are east coast houses. There might not have been a big customer base west of the Great Plains.

[imashooter2]

Following this topic along and watching/reading about the effort and yes expense that many go to trying to find pewter, seems it would just be time and money better spent with an order to Rotometal for some pure tin.

Then that along with the fact that providing your casting from typical Clip on Wheel Weights alloy adding even small percentages of tin or pewter is simply wasted money. Not needed for quality bullets or casting.

Yep, been there and done that and there was little to nothing to be gained.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

I gained a pretty decent return on investment from folks that disagree with your assessment. :)

[dbosman]

In years past I didn't see much, but I've picked up about twenty pounds in the last quarter. Here's last weeks score. 6.8 lbs for $20. After weighing it up, I actually felt I'd over paid.

184479

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

imashooter2,

Can you explain your comment, you lost me.

Thanks

CDOC

[jsizemore]

He's saying lots of people buy pewter from him to enrich their alloy.

[Scorpius]

Ok here is another.....had to look this up since a minute under a torch didn't start any melting I'm thinking its not pewter. Unless the whole thing has to get uber hot first to melt.

https://www.etsy.com/listing/486493152/old-mill-ent-lancaster-pa-us-coat-of?ref=market

This is exactly what I have but I have the entire set of 4.

The stamp on the inside reads "Old Mill Ent. Lancaster PA"


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[308Jeff]

Looks like aluminum to me.

[Scorpius]

Looks like aluminum to me.

Well...guess they will make good mugs for mule kickers with the neighbors :-)


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[imashooter2]

Yes, aluminum. Study some of the pictures in the thread I have linked in my signature. You'll soon be able to eliminate stuff like that from across the room.

[308Jeff]

I'm still very novel and identifying and buying pewter, but here's what I've learned.

-Pewter has a very distinct, dull and darkish grey patina.
-If you can't bend it with your hands/fingers, it's not pewter. No matter how thick it is.

I purchased a couple of items recently that I thought MIGHT be pewter based on the maker/markings, but I should have trusted the above qualifications. Both turned out to be aluminum.

Fortunately, I've also ventured into some aluminum/brass/copper ingot making so it wasn't a total loss. But I obviously way over-payed for what I got.

[CastingFool]

FWIW, I have found that some of the markings on some pewter pieces I find are very small and hard to read, so I have taken to carrying a magnifying glass on my pewter hunting trips.

[dbosman]

I should take a magnifier, but my son is young enough. Even so, we had to take a picture of one hallmark and blow it up to full computer screen to read it.

[Scorpius]

Actually this might help some of us older guys :-) but I found an awesome app for my iPhone. Called super vision+
Open it up and look at the details, zoom even if needed and you can take pics. Good for checking out guns I'm thinking on for import marks or simply all matching serials you can't quiet tell.
You can thank me through a 1 bar shipment of pewter to me ;-)
Any weight will do I'm not picky lol


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[dbosman]

Great for people who have smart phones. My phone has a cord. We actually live in a cell dead zone, too.


Actually this might help some of us older guys :-) but I found an awesome app for my iPhone. Called super vision+
Open it up and look at the details, zoom even if needed and you can take pics. Good for checking out guns I'm thinking on for import marks or simply all matching serials you can't quiet tell.
You can thank me through a 1 bar shipment of pewter to me ;-)
Any weight will do I'm not picky lol


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[Scorpius]

Great for people who have smart phones. My phone has a cord. We actually live in a cell dead zone, too.

I'd trade ya since I bet you can walk out your door and shoot all you want :-)


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[dbosman]

Actually the only thing we can shoot in the back yard is BBs and sling shots.
Growing up, we could shoot a .30-06 from the garage. We had our own trap setup with a partially buried trap house to throw from. Some how dad never did his share of tossing clays.



I'd trade ya since I bet you can walk out your door and shoot all you want :-)
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[dbosman]

This weeks pewter score was 1.2 lbs for $2.02. I'm no longer buying every pewter piece I see as I can look at and feel the difference between $2/lb and $5./lb.

[frankenfab]

I found a bunch of plates that I believe say "York Metalcraft" in a thrift store. I think it's around ten pounds for $38.50.

I searched for that name here, and got nothing. But I found references to it on eBay.

Anyone here have experience with York Metalcraft? I'm going to take my magnifier and look at the hallmark again.

[jsizemore]

I've seen their commemorative plates. It's all aluminum alloy like Wilton. Do these look familiar;

https://www.etsy.com/market/york_metalcrafters

[frankenfab]

The plates are plain, like the second one down on the right, and the hallmark is cast in, not stamped.

I was afraid they might be aluminum.

Thanks for your reply.

[308Jeff]

This weeks pewter score was 1.2 lbs for $2.02. I'm no longer buying every pewter piece I see as I can look at and feel the difference between $2/lb and $5./lb.

I need to slow down a little, too. Bought 2 pieces at Goodwill today. One worked out to $4.18/lb, the other $6.63.

[Caster1977]

A friend gave me about 65 pounds in two pieces. The slightly smaller one was a lot lighter than the other one by a whole bunch. I used the cutoff saw to pull a couple of pieces. I ran them through my Lee tester and the heavier came out about an 8 BHN, close to pure lead. The other one came out to 33 BHN! Not sure what it is, but I'm going to see if it will alloy and mix. Should prove interesting.


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[Nose Dive]

Booolits loookin' GOOD bro! I do as CRUSTY above says...50/50 lead and WW's. I pump in some pewter too... bit here and there...

My smelts are 'nasty' stuff so have to flux heavy with saw dust...some sulphur...end with wax and pour into ingots. When I cast...
I water drop into COLD icy water and hope for the best.... I let the 'set and get happy' for a few months....then lube and relaod.

YOUR BOOLITS LOOK GREAT!!

Nose Dive
Cheap, Fast, Good. Kindly pick two.

[308Jeff]

Bought 3 items at Goodwill the other night that I was convinced were pewter. A Japanese basket, and two picture frames. All 3 bent and melted easily, with one of the frames leaving behind a lot of "crust?". After I skimmed off all the dross and poured it into ingots, I ended up with something that looks and feels a lot more like lead than pewter. Luckily I have access to an XRF, so I'll find out what I really have.

Bottom line for me, I need to be SURE that what I'm buying is pewter. IE, sticking to only things clearly labeled or hallmarked. Along those lines, there is a product out there by the Boone Company called "Polished Pewter". It ain't pewter. :x