Why should I get a 35 Whelen instead of a 358 win?

[Camba]

I had been wanting to get a 358 Win, for some time, for my Encore TC rifle but I have an opportunity to get a 35 Whelen and I am scratching my head. I have read good things about both. I like the 358 win because of the shorter cartridge. I also understand that you can low charge the whelen to do anything. I will be using this barrel for punching paper, looking for very good loads and for deer hunting. I do like to experiment on getting good load recipes for my guns. I do have a 358 Win in a Browning BLR and it is a tack driver with the Lee 358-200-RF boolit but now I want a single shot rifles.

If you were me, what would be your decision and why?
Thank you for all the answers. I will seat back and read responses.
Camba

[Yodogsandman]

Get the 35 Whelen. More case capacity for faster velocities and the possibility of using heavier boolits. It will shoot a very wide variety of powders real good. It will also shoot boolits from 150 gr to 310 gr good. While I haven't yet tried surplus powders in mine, the 35 Whelen is supposed to be able to shoot the cheap, slower surplus powders well.

[sharps4590]

Ain't no fly's on either. Obviously the Whelen is going to have the ability to give higher velocities for the same bullet weight if that is a consideration. For reduced loads they're equal. Neither cartridge has ever much interested me so I have to confess to not having given it much thought. Certainly neither one could be wrong. Interesting choice between two very good cartridges.

I have worked with the 9 X 57 quite a bit and in a modern rifle it will exceed the 358 and be nipping on the heels of the Whelen. As far as reduced loads the 9 X 57 can be loaded to equal either cartridge.

[curator]

Camba,

Both the .358 Win and the .35 Whelen are rimless bottle necked cartridges with a very small shoulder. Both are subject to shoulder set-back and increased cartridge "head-space" when loaded light. I have built several (pre-358 Win.) .35 Whelen bolt rifles and found the shoulder set-back issue to be a problem with cast boolits. I solved it with my last build by chambering for .35 Whelen Ackley-Improved 40. Less taper and sharper shoulder makes all the difference. Generally, single-shot rifles, and break-open actions in particular do better with rimmed cartridges.

I have a T/C Encore with a .308 Win. barrel that shot OK but not great until I had a rim recessed cut so I could use .307 Win brass. .307 is a rimmed version of the .308 Win. Both accuracy improved as well as case life. Unfortunately .307 brass is a once-a-year production run. Were I to want a .35 caliber barrel for my Encore, I would consider the .35/30-30. Brass is cheap and abundant. It will do almost anything the .358 will do, efficiently. A .35 Krag would be my second choice, but brass for this is becoming difficult to find as well.

[Nobade]

Now that Starline is making 444 cases, I would look pretty hard at doing a 358 JDJ on an Encore for the reasons mentioned above. Just like my old 35 Remington Rimmed on the Contender, it gives you a lot more versatility with lighter cast bullet loads.

-Nobade

[kenyerian]

plus one on the 358JDJ

[GARD72977]

I vote 358 win. I like the case capacity better.

[021]

If you like the .35's as I do, you MUST have both!

[tdoyka]

i would vote for the 358 win too. since you are using a cast boolit, the speed of the whelen shouldn't be concern #1.

[Alan in GA]

Well I JUST got my Ruger #1 S in 35 Whelen. My favorite 35 round has been the 358 Win but since looking at a 35 Whelen round I noticed it has a longer neck than the 358 Win so it may be a touch better for hiding lube grooves on a cast bullet.
I still like the .358 but one reason is that using it allows a short action bolt rifle, and the .358 Win loaded to full loads is about all the recoil I care to have.
The .350 Rem Mag Ruger 77 MII I had beat the snot out of me off the bench [29 full power loads]. I wish I still had it but I say that about a lot of rifles/guns I've had.
I AM looking forward to shooting and reloading for this Ruger 35 Whelen! BTW, I made many .358 Win cases easily with a tapered expander in a LEE FL die. May try the same with '06 cases IF I even get to shoot and load for it much.

[Nrut]

The Whelen is more versatile if you are going to shoot heavier (longer) bullets due to its longer neck length, generally longer throat and more boiler room for slower powders..

If you are only going to be shooting your LEE 358-200 and other shorter bullets then I would get a .358 Win. as you already have good loads worked up for your BLR and you have .358 dies...
Shouldn't take much tweaking to get your BLR loads to shoot well in your new .358 Encore..

Having said that you will always want a 35 Whelen, so you might as well get it now..

A nice little Rossi 92 in .357 is great fun also, something else to consider to add to your .35 caliber battery if you haven't done so already..[smilie=1:

>G<

[Camba]

Very good! Every response is so good that I am flip-flopping big time between the two. One thing that makes me think about the 35 Whelen is that I have a 444 Marling in an H&R single shot rifle and I have found pleasant loads with good accuracy for hunting and paper punching. The good loads I get with my 358 Win (BLR) is within the 1850 to 2000 fps. This 35 Whelen will be used mostly the same way as the 358 Win loads.
I had just bought an H&R 308 Win barrel and I have a 308 Win Encore barrel that is a tack driver. I was thinking on getting either of the 308 Win bored by JES to 358 Win but the trading possibility with a 35 Whelen seems attractive.
If the H&R 308 bbl is a good shooter, I will keep that (H&R bbl) as 308 Win and modify (to 358 Win) or trade the Encore 308 Win bbl (for a 35 Whelen).
How about that for more clarification.
More advice needed.
Thanks.
Camba

[sharps4590]

Interesting posts and takes on your question Camba! Of them all, including mine, I like curator's take on the 35/30-30 for break action firearms.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Both good. Can make .35 Whelen from .30-06 brass. Sounds like you've already got a .358. So you really need a .35 Whelen! :-D

[JWT]

Get the Whelen, you already have the Winchester.

[Bigslug]

Whelan. To my way of thinking, the whole POINT of necking a .30 caliber cartridge up to .35 is to throw a heavier payload, which the '06 case will do better. If all you want to do is throw 200 grains and less, the unaltered .308 and '06 will do that for you already.

Oh yeah. . .Ruger's doing No. 1's in the Whelan this year. Just sayin'. . .

[35 shooter]

Economy would say stay with the 358 since you already have the dies. If you want shoot the true heavy weight boolits, the whelen keeps the gc in the neck for me.

I have a TC Encore in 35 whelen and love it. It's a tack driver with 200 to 310 gr. boolits...i haven't tried anything lighter weight than the 200 gr.
Twist is 1/14 on mine and was a stock TC bbl.
It's a pretty easy process to convert once fired 06 range brass to the whelen.

You won't go wrong either one you choose.

[atr]

I like my .35 Whelen very much (1:14 twist).....it is easy to load for either cast or jacket. I never had a problem with the shoulder set-back and head-space. IMR or Accurate 4064 seems to be the best powder for J's, and 4895 works well with cast. I have also used 2400 successfully with cast. For J's you can shoot 275 grain bullets.
atr
183040

[Idaho Sharpshooter]

well, you already have 358 Win dies. How much are dies for the Whelen?

[Camba]

I am tilting towards the Whelen because it will come as a trade. That will null getting one rebored by Jes in 358 Win.

[MT Gianni]

I looked at a Whelen bbl last week on gbroker for $199. A 358 is a custom bbl proposition, that is the only reason to prefer the whelen. In a pinch you can buy a Whelen size die and crimp/seat with the 358 die.

[ulav8r]

The Whelen will allow you to use heavier bullets at a range increase of 50-75 yards. The Winchester with 225 to 250 grain bullets is a good 250 yard cartridge for any game on the North American continent.

[Camba]

I've got cold feet going for a trade for 35 Whelen and I decided to call Jes Reboring to do the job of converting my 308 Win barrel to 358 Win.
My barrel is 28". What should be a good length for a 358 Win in an Encore configuration?
Camba

[Alan in GA]

I would cut it to 22" or 24", or leave it longer for muzzle blast reduction when hunting. My Ruger 77R .358 was 22" which is plenty long enough for the round.

[hicard]

I have both and enjoy both but I would suggest the 358 over the whelen.

[ANick57]

Pardon the late addition, but if you are looking for something somewhat obscure, or don't mind it much anyway, a rimmed .35 does exist in the form of the .35 WCF. No clue yet on how much a tack driver they are or are not first hand. Waiting for dies to show up (tomorrow?) via Fed Ex. Patiently.

A single shot could well give some options that the 1895 Winchester's magazine length won't??

[Camba]

I ended up buying a 35 Whelen Encore barrel and I had just began to develop some loads. So far, the barrel likes the Lee c309-200-RF (200 gr, GC) boolit over 27gr of 2400 powder with S&B LR primers. The other load is the same boolit over 22gr of Blue Dot and WLP primers.
I don't have a chronometer (anymore) so I don't know what velocities I am getting.
The pictures below are from my best groups so far, using 2400 and Blue Dot powder with the Lee C358-200-RF mold and S&B LR primers and also WLP primers.
Camba
196680196681

[Camba]

The picture in the left is a 5-shot group and the one in the right is a 10 shot group. Seems that I always get a flier or two in every group I test.
I would say it is the shooter's error.
Camba

[Texas by God]

I've had .35 Rem, .358 Win, .35 Whelen Imp, and .358 Norma rifles. All excellent rounds but my favorite is the Rem700/JES .358 Win that I'm shooting now.
IMR 3031 & the RCBS version of your bullet is stellar in my rifle- you might give it a try in your Whelen.
Best, Thomas.