110 gr 30 cal

[lead chucker]

Hi. Thought I would share my most recent project. I made swage dies for my 300 Blackout. These are right at 110 gr. I'm getting just over 1 1/2 inch groups at 70 yards. I'm still working on the right load for it. I have 8 pounds of IMR 4227 so I hope that powder works good. I also bought a mini milling machine so now making core molds is a lot easier and better quality. I made three so far. The one in the pic throws a 65 gr core. Let me know what you all think. Took three tries on the point forming die. I am sold on making three flute reamers much better than a d-reamer.
181890181891

[marvelshooter]

Very nice. What are you using for jacket material?

[seppos]

Looking good.
What I see, it looks like a tubing jacket as it is open from both ends.

S

[just bill]

Beautiful dies, I want to learn how to make the tubing round over die.
Bill

[clodhopper]

You have been busy lead chucker.
What a nice pile of bullets for longer, warmer, days ahead.

[seppos]

Beautiful dies, I want to learn how to make the tubing round over die.
Bill
If i see it correctly, the tubing die is on left in the pic. Die, two round headed punches and extractor punch. The cavity it self is propably tapered or rounded from the bottom. The two round headed punches are for two different lenght of jackets.

S

[seppos]

In jacket drawing dies it is common to use radiis instead of tapers. One option would be to pre drill the draw die cavity with a little undersized drill bit and ream the cavity with ball end mill. Result is a radiused bottom cavity without any resisting edges that are common when using tapered drill or reamer. The taper edge should always be radiused to reduce te resistance. For the cup it is the same if the bottom is round or tapered. It will be as flat both ways when you swage the lead in.

S

[just bill]

In jacket drawing dies it is common to use radiis instead of tapers. One option would be to pre drill the draw die cavity with a little undersized drill bit and ream the cavity with ball end mill. Result is a radiused bottom cavity without any resisting edges that are common when using tapered drill or reamer. The taper edge should always be radiused to reduce te resistance. For the cup it is the same if the bottom is round or tapered. It will be as flat both ways when you swage the lead in.

S
Interesting, this is the first time hearing this process, have you tried it or know anybody who has successfully accomplished this. It would be interesting to hear the results.
Bill

[runfiverun]

I would bet Seppos is speaking from experience.

[lead chucker]

I'm using 5/16 copper tubing. I need to made another round over die. I want to be able to close up the hole in the base. The hole in the bottom doesn't seen to be an issue. the longer round over punch is for a heavier bullet. I made a couple165 gr bullets and there seems to be a little taper to the die. I will have to make another point form die for the heavier bullets. The round over punch has a shoulder on it so the tubing cant go up any further and it forces the copper to round over. After cutting and washing the tubing I put them in the over at 200F to dry and when I went to the round over stage the brass was till worm and what a difference that made. Now I preheat my dies and brass and lube with a hair dryer.

[seppos]

I would bet Seppos is speaking from experience.
Earlier on.. some years back i fight with the copper tubing die that i made for . 45 cups. I used .472 tubing that had 0.039 wall thickness. I made the set for regular rcbs rock chucker press, and find out that it tooked exessive force to form the cup when the cavity was made with a drill that had a taper. The piece of tubing got stuck to the edge of taper and did not move without lots of force. When i made a small radius to that edge, it helped, but still the resistance was much. When i opened up the cavity with ball mill, the resistance was lot less. Also.. it is very hard to polish the sharp inner edge, but if there is just smooth radius inside the cavity, the emery cloth or polishing lap smoothly moves thru the whole surface giving much better result.

S

[lead chucker]

I understand what you are saying. I'm going to get a ball end mill and make another one. This is fun stuff. On my draw die punch what should the end of the punch be shaped like. mine is pretty flat with I slight taper on the edges.

[seppos]

As the end should only barely touch the material, i would also go with radiused with that. The punch head could be a bit short even as the possible section of tubing might have some variation with lenght. If the fit is too tight and you have little longer tubing, the exessive material has no place to go. You might then brake the set.
Good is also have a second draw die where to uniform the wall thickness and possibly the lenght. That could have a bit smaller ID to give proper resistance for the trim punch. (Pinch trim type)

S

[lead chucker]

I have heard guys talk a about a pinch trim die but I don't know what that is or looks like. Is it hard to make? A picture says a thousand words. Thanks for the reply, you and every one else here. I have learned a lot from this place. Guys don't post enough pics of there dies and equipment. A lot of times a pic of something brings more clarity than trying to explain it.

[seppos]

It is simple. You just need a push thru type of die where you have a taper in the begining. One simple and cheap is the LEE type set, and a similar punch that you had in your own tubing set. The punch head part should have OD that is proper to fit inside the reduced jacket, lenght to shoulder the lenght of the trimmed jacket, and the OD from shoulder tight fit thru the die. When you push the jacket thru the die, it will go relatively easily until the shoulder part contacts the tight sectionof the trimming die. When you push further, the punch cuts thru the exess jacket material pushing the trimmed cup thru the die.

I will post later some pics.

S

[lead chucker]

I think I understand what your saying. Look forward to the pic's.

[runfiverun]

think of a tapered punch and a sharp edged die.
the case slips over the punch and is run into the die.
when it gets to the point where there is not enough room between the punch and the die the case is pinched and that cuts the case right there.
different case lengths would of course require a different punch so that the taper is in the right place to cut the case.

[garandsrus]

I am pretty sure a pinch trim die works a little differently than you explained. You adjust a stop (or the height of the die) in the die for the length jacket you want. You adjust the pinch die to the correct length to match the bottom die. The taper/flair then trims the exposed portion of the case. You can trim to pretty much any length with the same tools.

[lead chucker]

I would like to see a cross section pic of that. I think I can figure out how to make one but an adjustable one. Inside threading is not one of my finer points.

[runfiverun]

that's why I described the different punch set up.
I know most of the bigger company's make an adjustable die thing.
but for a home type hobby guy another punch would probably be easier to figure out.
and he could re-mill the die as the edge wears down to keep it square and sharp.

[seppos]

In my jacket draw set that makes the cups from copper sheet, the pinch trim system is like this:182050
There is universal die body with a adjustable inner part that could be adjusted freely to proper dept and locked in place with a locking screw (in the side). The part is hollow so that the ejector punch could go thru and eject the cup after trimming. In the set the reducing dies have two purpose: first they reduce the jacket down and second: the other end acts as a trimming die for the pinch trimming punch. Last part is the inner punch for the die.

In this set I have pinch trimming made for 3 calibers.

This is one example for fully adjustable set. I will post later on a pic of a pinch trim punch that is not adjustable.


S

[seppos]

182051 Here is a pic about the set assembled.

S

[lead chucker]

yes I think that would be easier.

[seppos]

Here is a push thru pinch trim punch with regular .22 derimmer punch (pinch trim punch in the middle)
182081
In different cup lenghts one need different punch, but for example with two, one goes long way.

S

[laveritt]

PM sent.

[BlackoutBuilder]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLeJcJUc-BM

[DukeInFlorida]

Just for the sake of suggestion, my local group of swaged bullet shooters, shooting our own 150 grain swaged bullets from 5.7X28 FN brass, are using Lil'Gun powder and getting 1/4 MOA groups (hitting bulletin board push pins) at 100 yards.

So, check out Lil'Gun powder as an alternative.

[BlackoutBuilder]

I will do that.

[kmrra]

Good looking dies you made, Make me wished I had never sold my lathe and mill now , when we moved out here in the country 7 years ago I sold my equipment cause I didn't have a place to put them , , and at that time I had not got back into guns yet , I have regretted that ever since ,

[lead chucker]

I have some 5.7 brass coming so I'm looking forward to working with it. I have a pound of LilGun I have not tried yet. Once I get the brass I will get to work on making what I need to make them into bullets.