Hi All,

[Groat]

Just a few words to say hi to you guys over the pond.
I'm a Gamekeeper on a large scottish estate and have recently purchased an old Lee hand loader for 12 gauge shot guns with a view to loading a few special heavy load cartridges and perhaps try a few 1oz slugs to see how they go.
My question to you folks is, in my instructions that came with the hand loader it tells me that plastic shells need a starting die to reform the case? and it also says that i need a Star Crimp Starter to initially fold the crimp after which the the shell is crimped as usual in the lee loader!
My question is....... Can these items still be purchased and if so from where and how much ?
Regards for now,
Groat

[montana_charlie]

Hello Groat,
Welcome to the schoolyard, where those with the most to say are often the ones with the most to learn. I am about to say a lot...

A very long time ago, I had a "Lee Loader" which was intended for reloading shotgun shells.
It included a 'die body' for resizing the case...mainly the brass portion at the bottom...and several other loose items. For instance, I recall having a punch for driving out primers while the case sat on an 'anvil' with a hole in the middle. A different anvil and rod combination was used for seating new primers.
Then, there was a fat ram which fit through the top of the die body, and it was used to close the crimp.
I give you this description as a first step in getting on the same page with you.

A guy can be shooting ammunition he 'reconstituted' himself, and he might call it 'reloads' or 'handloads'.
If it is his habit to use "handloads" to describe the fodder, then any tool used to make it shootable again might be called a "hand loader"...even if it was a full-blown shotshell press with all of the goodies.
This brings me to your use of "Lee hand loader".

Lee has made many differing tools over the years...and used many names for them...but, I can't recall Lee ever using "Lee hand loader" as a name for one of their tools.

Since you have the original instructions for your outfit, what is the 'official' name of that Lee tool? With that knowledge, we (all) have a better chance of answering your question with some precision.
CM

[Groat]

I understand what your saying Charlie so perhaps this pici may help?

[leftiye]

Mine (whatever you call it) has a plastic star shaped punch that you use to "start" the crimp. Then another flat nosed punch to push the crimp down inside the case and finish it. Your set doesn't have the star shaped starter (for some reason). FWIW, if you can work the crimp that is left in your shells into the case the star shaped thing can be done without.

[testhop]

hi welcome it looks like a lot of work to use
what kind of 12 gage shells do you have on hand
the die set looks like one that came long ago and i dont think spare parts are readly avable
of coursei could be wrong (as useal )

[floodgate]

Groat:

That is an interesting early packaging of the basic 12-ga. Lee Loader - if you were here in the US, I'd try to trade you out of it. But it is perfectly serviceable and, though Lee made a little white nylon crimp starter in both six- and eight-point form, this is really required only for new, unfired cases - you don't need it if you are using fired shells; they will re-fold on the original lines without any problem.

If you want to see how Lee intended this to work, you can look up his original patent #3,053,132 on the US Patent Office site at <www.uspto.gov/>; go to Patent Search, and enter the number exactly as above (with commas): the patent describes the entire process of seating wads and shot and reforming the crimp, in considerable detail.

Floodgate

[Groat]

Thanks guys, the things older than me! Testhop, i don't think it will be too much work once i know exactly what i'm doing with the thing, but thats why im here to quiz you guys the masters of the reload! I'm new to all this and a bit wet behind the ears but keen to learn but think it best to find someone over here who knows what there talking about just to keep an eye on me and make sure i'm doing things right.

[runfiverun]

get a scale as i would bet those dippers are for powders no longer made.

[Groat]

get a scale as i would bet those dippers are for powders no longer made.

Good thinking runfiverun, i already have a set of Lyman scales.

[dromia]

Hi Groat and a big welcome to these boards. :drinks:

A Keeper eh? Well somebodies got to do it. :kidding:

I hail from Sutherland, still got land and a hoose up there. Done my time Ghillieing and Stalking as well as the ubiquitous alternative stalking. :-D

But that was all 30 plus years ago.

I've got one of those Lee loaders for 12 bore and just love it, load mainly BP with it. It isn't quick but you are engaged with the process

I wouldn't bother with a star crimp I use a roll crimp and an over shot wad. You can pick up old bench roll crimpers no problem at gunshows. Failing that you can get roll crimpers for a drill press from here:

http://www.claygame.co.uk/

Failing that you could just seal the card over shot wad in place with water glass, thats what I use for brass shotgun cartridges. I've used silicon sealant to good effect in the past, its just not in the spirit of the original.

Are you dropping your own swan shot? :-D

[floodgate]

rusfiverun:

Ackshully, Lee DOES still sell dipper sets for powder; the current set has 15 yellow dippers, calibrated in cc's, with a "slide-rule" powder charge table for translation. The original ones were marked for powder and charge, then shotshell gauge (both in wood-handled versions), then in cubic inches (black or red plastic), and now in yellow (plastic, cc's).

[DLCTEX]

Just use it without the starter. As has been stated the plastic has a memory and willl fold in the proper places. My first reloading was with one of those, 40+ years ago. DALE

[woody1]

My question is....... Can these items still be purchased and if so from where and how much ?
Regards for now,
Groat

Available here
http://www.e-gunparts.com/product.asp?chrProductSKU=874850
Regards, Woody

[Cherokee]

Groat - Welcome....!!!

[Groat]

Thanks for the advice and kind welcome guys, i'm gettin wiser all the time!
Dromia,,,, Thanks for the info i may just get myself one of them roll crimpers if i can't find an oldy second hand one somewhere, and no i don't think i'll be dropping my own swan shot just yet, don't want to run before i can walk!!!