Source of flush fit SMLE mags?

[dualsport]

Anybody know where a guy can just buy a flush fitting magazine for a SMLE and/or a No. 4? Thanks

[tbx-4]

Never seen a flush fit LE mag but have seen 5 round LE mags... I have seen factory made and homemade 5 round mags.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I have also never seen a flush fitting LE magazine. I own a 5-shot, and it still protrudes below the bottom of the magazine well approx. 1- 1 1/2 inches. I doubt if a truly flush magazine could be made, because the shape of the magazine, angled toward the front, is necessary for proper stacking and feeding of the .303 rimmed cartridge, so if you could make one with the rear flush the front would probably be inside the magazine well. Many years ago in gunsmithing school I was shown an extremely customized LE by an instructor, Bill Spurrier. He had made and installed a flush floor plate like that of a Mauser, but wider, a customized follower that was powered by a coil spring. It's capacity was reduced to 3 shots, which was one in the chamber and two in the magazine. He had also cut off most of the collar, eliminated the stock bolt, and bedded it in a one piece stock. Nice rifle, but somehow it had lost it's mystique. I think a flush magazine could be made for the Indian 7.62mm version. I guess you are dealing with the Calif. hunting regulations (?) or is it the large capacity magazine ban? Would a properly shaped wooden block under the follower spring that limited the number of rounds loaded into the magazine be acceptable?

[Tackleberry41]

Never seen anything but the 10rd. Even those are usually hard to find.

[RustyReel]

Had one once on a sporter. If I can find an old pic I will post it. Basically, homemade, mag cut off at the stockline and a bottom plate installed. Still detachable and held four rounds if I remember correctly. Never seen nor heard of a commercial version.

[leebuilder]

Hi all, have several only one is factory I think it is well made and die formed and came on a Churchill no4 sporter. The rest are homemade and only hold 4 rounds. They were made for carbines and not exactly flush.
180579
An old pic of the carbine
180580
My old no4 with homemade 5 rd mag
180581
The Churchill no4

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Hello again, leebuilder. I posted first on the Longbranch sporter thread, then came here to direct other interested persons to that thread, but I see that you were already here. So....the magazine shown in the top photo is a true flush fit, giving a bottom profile like a Mauser? Or does it stick in or out a little above or below the stock line? The only one I own (5 rounder) is as shown in the top rifle in your photo in the other thread. I've never seen a truly flush fit. :confused:

[leebuilder]

The top one is not exactly flush, flush at the front and aboot 3/8" proud at the rear. I can't remember what model it is, dated 1896 or 1898 and I permently attached with a "toggle link"
180585
Cropped pic
The Churchill is almost flush and has a modified follower, that's why I think it's factory and the fact it is die formed. And my camoed No4Mk2 is aboot 1/4" proud of the mag well, this must be the length in order to use the original follower and spring, if not assembly will not be possible.

[samari46]

I have one 5 rounder made for Santa Fe arms made in Japan. Have it on a Long Branch sporter. Frank

[dualsport]

Thanks for the replies. It appears any hope of a flush fit will involve a fixed magazine. California laws haven't got around to this subject, yet. There's no restrictions particular to hunting and mag capacity. The 10 rounders will now pertain to basically everything. While I have your ears, what's available out there for after market mags? I've had trouble with some, not staying put in a No. 4 but ok in a No. 1.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Dualsport: the most common one was made by Santa Fe and simply looks like a shorter 10 rounder. They are not easy to find, but they do exist and show up from time to time.

There was a guy is South Africa who was supposed to be making 5 and 10 round #1 and #4 magazines and I ordered two 5rounders but never got notified when he had them in stock so I think he flaked out.

A lot of the British Sporting Rifles made on LE actions had mags that were cut off just below the trigger guard with flat or slightly curved bottom plates that were welded in place.

It is not hard to modify an existing magazine by cutting it off and welding a bottom plate onto it.

Do understand that #1 and #4 mags are different so use the appropriate one for whatever gun is being modded.

I personally think the Santa Fe magazine is the best looking one of the bunch, and NO you can't have mine.

Randy

[Der Gebirgsjager]

180631
Click to enlarge.

I do not presently know of a source where you can obtain after market mags, but they have been offered sporadically. I obtained one from a fellow in Canada that was manufactured to fit either rifle. I've included this photo of a No.1 mag and a No. 4 mag, because supposedly it is possible to convert the No.1 mag to fit the No. 4 rifle by removing the rivet and spring on the back. Honestly, I have never done the conversion myself, having a couple of spares of both types from "back in the day." I believe that the last time I looked at the Gun Parts Corp. website they had originals in stock, although they're getting rather expensive. Keeping a sharp eye out on the internet auctions in the gun parts categories and looking at Firearms News (formerly Shotgun News) should eventually yield results also.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Quite a few years back I attended a gunshow that had many big name custom `smiths showing what they can do. I can`t remember if it was Elwood Epps table or someone elses but there was a heavily modified LE. It not only had a 1 piece stock but had a lot of metal work done on the reciever. But the thing I couldn`t stop looking at was a smooth bottomed reciever where a mag would`ve gone. I imagine at best it was a 3 or 4 shot rifle with the welded metal on the floorplate frame. The real disappointment was the tag on it`For display only - not for sale`!Robert

[tbx-4]

You could make your own 4 or 5 round magazine by modifying an old Drill Purpose mag. Liberty Tree has No1 DP mags for $35. A little time and some care with a dermal tool, file and pliers and you could have what you want.
https://www.libertytreecollectors.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=3137&idcategory=62

Here's a DIY flush fit LE mag instructions.
http://www.303british.com/id34.html

Just found Sarco has reproduction No4 mags for $29.95!
http://www.e-sarcoinc.com/4-mk1-rifle-magazine.aspx

[TRX]

The Promag reproductions might be easier to shorten than a factory mag. It's easiest if you just shorten it a little bit first, to get the feel of cutting and bending the magazine body. Then shorten it to where you want it.

[Multigunner]

ibought several DP magazines many years ago, in part to experiment with making five round mags but never got around to it.

All the DP mags I received had damage to the left hand front feed lip.
I managed to correct the damage by drawing the metal by cold hammering then filing to shape, which thins but work hardens the lip.

I have considered using the lower notch of the No.1 style magazine which holds the tension spring as a mag catch notch and cutting the magazine body down from the top instead of from the bottom, cutting the new feed lips by hand to match the originals.

The protrusion of the cut down mag at the rear is not much of a problem when carrying at the balance point of a sporter.

[atr]

when I was in high school....many, many years ago I sporterized two .303 Brits.....
On one I cut down the magazine for a flush fit
On the other I retained the 5 shot magazine....this was a Brit from Golden State Arms.
here is a picture of the flush fit rifle which I still shoot

180673180674180675

the modification turned the magazine into a 4 shot.....and I remember it was a tricky thing to do to cut down and re-weld the magazine for a flush fit....thankfully I had a very helpful metal shot intstructor

ATR

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Nice looking rifle and magazine conversion. First one like it, both actually flush and removable, that I've seen.

[KCSO]

You might want to check out my old post where I gave instructions and photo's of the rare old rusty 303 mag I shortened. I was castigated severly for ruining a mag thet came in a 2 dollar junk box, but it sure looked good on my Parker Hale Sporter.

[dualsport]

What a gold mine of information! Thank you all for all the help. I'll try to post a picture of my project/parts gun with flush fixed magazine. The difficulty arises from no longer being slanted to acamodate the rimmed cartridge. KCSO, a little help finding that post?

[Hardcast416taylor]

Did some checking. Liberty Tree No. 4 reproduction 10 shot mag is $55, Sarco repro No. 4 mag is $30. I ordered the Sarco mag, should have it next Mon. they told me.Robert

[Four Fingers of Death]

For the life of me I can't figure out why anyone would want to reduce the capacity, but I suppose, carrying an SMLE as aa Cadet in the Australian Army Cadet Corps as a teenager makes me feel the the normal mag is just the ticket. Different strokes for different folks I suppose. Shortening the mag is no biggey, just labour intensive. The real issue I feel is that the trigger guard (which is well balanced and looks fine with the standard mag in place), but, big gawky and totally the wrong shape with a short mag.

The nicest short magazine (the modified rifle will no longer be known as an SMLE ie, Short (as in rifle barrel length), Magazine (as in magazine fitted) Lee Enfield, but will now be an SSMLE, Short, Short Magazine Lee Enfield, haha!) but I digress, as I was saying, the nicest set up I have seen is Mick Beliview's deer rifle, a DIY customised No4Mk1 with a mannlicher stock and a very well done short mag and trigger guard. Here is a link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-sG7voPK0k

[Hardcast416taylor]

I got my replacement repro 10 shot mag for a No. 4 LE today. Ordered it last Tuesday and it came just as they said it would today. It looks exactly like a No. 4 mag. should with rounded corners and correct mounting projections. It has a matte black finish and the spring and follower are excellent. Maybe tomorrow I`ll run 10 rounds thru it in my Savage No. 4 *1 for the function test. With shipping and mag cost it came to $36.04. My Frau said I was acting like a 6 year old boy with a new red wagon at X-Mas over this mag.!Robert

[leebuilder]

Lol. Have fun. You have to try a mad minute.
Makes me smile every time.
Be well

[Four Fingers of Death]

That is very cheap for a mag in reasonable condition.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Cold this morning, 32 degrees in fact. Took the mag with 10 rounds of old Federal sp ammo I`ve been meaning to `unload` and my old Savage made No 4 Mk 1* down to my range. I wasn`t going for groups, just to see how the mag fed. Not a mad minute but just the same fairly rapid fire and the mag had no feeding problems and all cases ejected nicely. Guess for once I made a good buy?Robert

[Four Fingers of Death]

Well done that man! As we used to say in the Aussie Army. You were fortunate, usually Lee Enfield mags only work in the rfle they came from and need a bit if tweaking to get them feeding.

Nowwwwwwwwwwwww, if that crowd could make a repro Sterling 7.62 mag for the No4 Cnversions, they would sell like hotcakes. They sell for obscene money in the UK and here (and probably Canada and SA).

[Hardcast416taylor]

Well done that man! As we used to say in the Aussie Army. You were fortunate, usually Lee Enfield mags only work in the rfle they came from and need a bit if tweaking to get them feeding.

Nowwwwwwwwwwwww, if that crowd could make a repro Sterling 7.62 mag for the No4 Cnversions, they would sell like hotcakes. They sell for obscene money in the UK and here (and probably Canada and SA).


To be quite honest, I was expecting a `ride over the round` failure to feed at least once out of the 10 rounds which is why the `almost MAD MINUTE`. Lucky a neighbor didn`t call the local `Mounties` on me for firing an AUTOMATIC weapon as has been done before on me when using a pump shotgun shooting skeet! I love those large city `transplants to the country` that bring their neuroses with them!Robert

[Four Fingers of Death]

We have the same problem here. Modern cars and good roads mean townies can commute long distances and they have bought blocks and farms everywhere.

[tbx-4]

For the life of me I can't figure out why anyone would want to reduce the capacity

It's not a want but a requirement by some states and provinces here in North America if you want to hunt with a rifle. I think most jurisdictions require your rifle mag to hold no more than 5 rounds.

[Four Fingers of Death]

That's reasonable, but most want to convert for the looks, that's what I can't figure.

[tbx-4]

That's reasonable, but most want to convert for the looks, that's what I can't figure.

True, I can't argue with that.

[samari46]

Don't know if the NRA still offers them but they had little booklets on various rifles. The one on the #1MKIII and various marks does tell you how to cut down the 10 round magazine and gives rough dimensions for making the floor plate which effectively turns it into a 5 round magazine. Simple instructions so just about anyone could do it. Maybe check with the NRA and see if they still offer the 303 british one for sale. Once you have made up the floor plate and drilled and tapped it so it will fit on the trigger/magazine housing your half way there.

[leebuilder]

I like the 5 round mag on my hunting rifle, I find it easier to carry as I can grip the rifle at its balence point, nothing to do with looks. And I can still use stripper clips.
Be well