Getting started on a budget

[jamesp81]

I'm looking to get started ladle casting on a budget with equipment that will still be useful as I upgrade in the future.

Initial equipment buy:

Cast iron pot
1000 - 1200 watt electric heating element
Lee mold and handle
Lyman ingot mold
Rowell bottom draw ladle
thrift store stainless spatula for skimming dross
welding gloves
fan
Lee bullet sizer
Lsstuff 45/45/10 tumble lube

Once comfortable ladle casting I'll add a Lee bottom pour and use the iron pot to make clean ingots and exclusively use those in the bottom pour.

Does this seem reasonable?

[MUSTANG]

Jamesp81:

I see you joined in 2010; but are just now getting started in casting. Welcome to the active side.

Your list looks for a starter kit. Similar to my start with simple Lee products back in the mid 1970's. I would add a scale to the list. You may have one in your reading kit; but it's not listed so I brought it up. Scale is handy for grouping and culling boolits when you cast.

[mjwcaster]

I got started a little cheaper-
Thrift store ladle, modified (bent) to have more of a spout.

Used steel one piece soup pot(s).

Old muffin pans for ingots.

$10 Coleman 2 burner, use second burner as mold warmer with suitably modified cake pans.

Don't forget eye protection, I wear glasses and use a face mask.


Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

[rancher1913]

you might find it is cheaper to buy lead from venders here and use a lee bottom pour pot to get started then add a smelting set up later.

[RogerDat]

Yes seems pretty good to me. I am somewhat skeptical of the hot plate / heating element. I have found them pretty marginal. With a hot plate running $20 and a Wal-Mart propane fish fryer running $40 and able to do large batches or small ones... I drop in 1/2 x 1/2 angle iron across mine for smaller pots, remove for the larger harbor freight Dutch oven. As a heat source 20# propane is pretty cheap and very effective. I would add a thermometer but I have an alternative approach below.

With drop in cross pieces
179787
Remove cross pieces for big pot. Wood riser was to get work at better height for my back.
179788


I'll toss out an alternative idea. Don't make your own ingots to start with, and don't buy smelting equipment. Buy your lead in swapping and selling part of this forum and put your money into the casting equipment.


Lee Electric Melter - I like the magnum melter due to larger volume http://www.titanreloading.com/melters/lee-magnum-melter-110-volt
Lyman little dipper casting ladle. The Rowell bottom pour is great for making clean ingots but the little dipper is a really good design for casting bullets. https://www.amazon.com/Lyman-Casting-Dipper-Multicolor-Size/dp/B001OPLJUU
Purchase lead from swapping and selling - will be around $1 per pound delivered for COWW lead, in clean ingots ready to cast. Or same price for soft lead. Maybe a bit for some harder printing lead or solder, can also buy range lead, re-melted from what is dug out of the backstop of a shooting range.
A tel-true thermometer https://www.amazon.com/Tel-Tru-LT225R-Replacement-Thermometer-degrees/dp/B0055777EU/ref=pd_sbs_328_6?ie=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B0055777EU&pd_rd_r=EGYH5SC32XNFSM81Y85N&pd_rd_w=fWrkN&pd_rd_wg=HEWhE&psc=1&refRID=EGYH5SC32XNFSM81Y85N
Lighter weight but good quality welding or leather gloves. Protection from lead splatter and you can twist the sprue plate on you mold by hand.
Face shield - Home depot has a nice one but folks don't seem to realize it has a plastic protective film on both sides and complain it is blurry :-)


This way you are going to be able to focus 100% on making bullets and the equipment is stuff that will be of use for as long as you cast. Your original list was split between making ingots and making bullets.

Go ahead and scrounge for lead wherever you can find it, and hit garage sales and thrift stores looking for spatula, slotted spoon, soup ladle (bend the handle at the bowl for a lead ladle), muffin tins or bread loaf pans for ingot molds, fish / turkey fryer and large cast iron pot. Over time you will build up what you need to go ahead and melt the collected lead you scrounged into ingots. I just found the ingot and smelting operation an extra process to work through before making bullets. Having someone provide a good ready to use lead saves a lot of headaches when getting started.

You can get most of this stuff really cheap at garage sales, propane fryer for $10 with a propane tank rather than the $40 of a new one without a tank, Stack of muffin tins or bread loaf pans for $2 at a garage sale for molds. I saw a cast iron pot of $5 at one thrift store and have picked up stainless steel pots for melting pewter or scrap solder.

I also find face shields more comfortable than safety glasses but at the least you want to protect your eyes from the tinsel fairy (steam explosion of molten lead) me I decided whole face protected was desirable and I used to wear the full shields for work, or welding shields so I like them better than safety glasses. While your at it some sweat bands are good. You can start with Harbor Freight for welding gloves but for smelting scrap something such as Home and Hearth insulated fireplace gloves or just better quality welding gloves are worthwhile. The little spot where the seam is coming undone or the leather wears out is right where you will grab the hot pot to tip it up and get that last couple ladles worth or touch the hot ladle, sorry that is just how it goes. Hot metal finds holes.

Rowell bottom pour is a really good ingot ladle but I would buy one of the larger 3 or 4 pound ones and get the smaller bullet casting Lyman little dipper for bullets. Much easier to control and spout designed to fit a mold. A good sized ingot pouring ladle would be a lot heavier and weight matters when casting, you will be holding it up for extended periods and trying to do fine detailed pouring repeatedly. Heavy = tiring to use. Lee ladle = light weight junk, so one can carry that too far.

I think you are smart to ladle cast first. The go on to bottom pour IF you decide you want to. Some of us never did.

[longbow]

I would go with a propane camp stove or Coleman camp stove over an electric hot plate. You should be able to find a cheap new one or even cheaper used one at a second hand store or garage sale.

No reason to think you have to go to a bottom pour pot unless you really want to. I started ladle casting about 50 years ago, went to a bottom pour pot about 45 years ago then back to ladle pouring and have used a ladle ever since. I prefer it. Different strokes.

I use a cast iron pot that my grandfather had as a plumber. I believe it is 25 lbs. capacity full of lead. I also use his old open ladle which I like. It holds about a lb. or better of lead and has a nice pouring spout I made even better with a chainsaw file.

Actually I find a ladle is better for casting large balls and slugs than a bottom pour pot but overall I still prefer a ladle. If you are casting regular boolits of 100 to maybe 300 grs. the bottom pour pots work fine but when I'm casting balls or boolits of 400 to 600 grs. (or sometimes heavier) I find the ladle better.

A scale would certainly be handy but I would say more for weighing powder charges than culling boolits. Careful visual examination should take care of the majority of defective boolits unless you are looking for gilt edge accuracy. If you don't get a scale you should add a Lee powder dipper set to your list... that is if you do not already have a scale or set of powder dippers.

If you have been reloading but not casting you probably have everything else you need.

Basically, you are on the right track there.

Longbow

[Vinne]

I'm looking to get started ladle casting on a budget with equipment that will still be useful as I upgrade in the future.

Does this seem reasonable?

I am sure that many of us here have started into casting and reloading the same way you are starting. I remember many years ago scrounging around for an old truck rim and angle iron to make my first smelting burner. I started casting with a 4# Lee pot and a single Lee mold. Don't rush into anything only to become discouraged. Just take it a step at a time and enjoy each moment as an accomplishment well achieved!!

Vinne

[Walter Laich]

You don't mention where you're located.
a mentor is a great way to start. You can learn the correct way from the beginning and save 'reinventing the wheel' Many will let you use their equipment so you get a feel before spending your hard earned cash

[Bazoo]

I started with a bottom pour lee. Lost it in a house fire. Now I am using a regular lee pot. It works, and is okay. But if I had it to do again, i'd get the lyman kit.

To start, there isnt any reason you cant just do one batch of wheel weights at a time in your pot, skim off the clips, flux and start casting. Thats what I do most of the time, and it works fine unless you're looking for max consistency, or the fastest of bullet making operations.
To this kit, i'd add a hot plate, with a used skilsaw blade over the element for the mold to set on to bring it up to temperature, and keep it there. Mold of your choice, and lee sizing kit in caliber/size you need. I'd Tumble lube with the alox that comes with the kit until I run out, then start pan lubing using beeswax from randyrat to make a simple lube; like 2:1 beeswax/unsalted crisco. Get some 8" pie tins for this operation. Then all you need is a couple extra eat'n spoons for fluxing and you're cool

http://ads.midwayusa.com/product/277310/lyman-big-dipper-furnace-starter-kit?cm_mmc=pf_ci_connexity-_-Reloading+-+Bullet+Casting-_-Lyman-_-277310&gclid=CMX2hcWthtACFUg2gQodAyoDhA

[bajacoop]

I have a couple used 20 lb lee pots i would let go for pretty cheap. They have had a lot of lbs ran through them. The spout and control rods have been replaced but could use s little tlc to lessen the dripping.

[ducati]

Great info here. I will use this info to get started.

[jamesp81]

For those recommending against a hot plate...I wasn't thinking of using a hot plate. I was thinking more along the lines of an exposed electric coil burner, like you'd see on an electric range. In case that changes your assessment.

Otherwise, given the cost of a camp stove, I think I'll be just as well getting the Lee 20lb ladle casting pot and being done with it.

[Strtspdlx]

I started with a recycled stainless steel pot and melted down wheel weights and castes about 3 times with a home made ladle before I got angry and bought a bottom pour. Which consequently didn't solve all of my problems. Come to think of it it didn't solve any problems aside from my perceived heavy wallet. It doesn't take much to cast. If I where to do it again I'd find the molds I wanted. Set myself up to melt the lead and make a ladle again. If you're like me and have an abundance of "useless" stuff out in the shop I'm sure you can put a ladle together to work all your needs just fine. As for melting. I'd go with my grill again on the side burner and do light batches. For me starting out ladle casting if I did anymore then 15 lbs in a session I was being optimistic. Even with my 20lb bottom pour I usually run about a quarter of the pot and call it quits. But everyone does it differently.

[country gent]

Depending on where your located and time availability. A turkey or fish frier stand makes a good base for a pot. If your lucky the burner in it works good and will melt lead. These can be found used reasonably and the propane tank from your grill can be used for fuel also. A better burner thats much faster and not expensive is a Harbor frieght weed burner these can be had for around $30.00 brand new and are in the 500,000 btu range, Think 100 lbs of lead molten in 20-30 mins. With this set up you do need to start "slopw" and warm the cast iron pot close to temp before really putting the coals to it. My set up for casting is similar here the frier stand has been stiffened a little. The weed burner has been modified by removing the "boost handle" a 90* elbow and 5" nipple added with feet to keep it upright. I also added 2 valves a ball valve and lever valve. The lever valve is on and off the ball valve is used to control temps. My pot was a cast iron dutch oven until the bottom cracked one day (I was in a hurry and didnt warm it enough) I now use the bottom of a propane tank cut off 2" above the bottom radious. This gives a nice concave bottom thats easy to dip from holds about 130lbs of lead and with a ring cut from the remaining tank and welded on is very stable. The flat bottomed pots are okay but more is left in the bottom that cant be dipped. I still ladle cast as I feel with the big BPCR bullets we cast here. I do use a rowel #1 ladle but the lyman or rcbs are also very good for casting.

[BCOWANWHEELS]

I ,AM GETTING SETUP TO START ALSO. and fme its about 5-1000$ to get everything you need in quality components and tools

[Echo]

One suggestion from Echo is to forestall the welders gloves, and buy a set of 3 pair leather gloves from Costco for ~$20. Plenty good insulating, and allows some delicate manipulation, like picking up hot sprues, that welders gloves won't.

[No Blue]

Seems to me a Lee 20 bottom pour at $62 is the ticket; you can ladle out of it or use it as intended, your choice. Amazon has a good price and free ship. Maybe no sales tax, depends on your state. I'd start with the aux pots to supplement the Lee if you're pouring cannonballs that really go thru the lead, but 20 pounds of lead makes a lot of pistol bullets or light rifle bullets.

[RogerDat]

Ladle casting out of a bottom pour is sort of a hassle, too much hardware in the way of dipping ladle and pouring into molds above pot. Especially difficult to melt WW's or scrap in. Aside from smelting trash and sawdust/chip flux clogging vales seat and making a drip-o-matic getting clips, debris and sawdust/wax fluxed debris skimmed is also hampered by the valve rod and lifter arm sticking up in the pot.

The exposed coil hot plates are better than the cast iron enclosed ones (those solid ones work great for mold pre-heating) but the real issue is the volume of heat. I can tell you plain lead won't melt properly on an 800 watt coil in a cold garage. The lead loses too much heat, end up with sludge on top from cooling. Propane can pump more heat into the pot. 1000 watt hot plate and warmer ambient temps? Might work ok.

Lot of garbage in melting scrap, personally wouldn't want any of that in my casting pot.

I saw 60+ lbs. of range lead for $73 to your door in S&S that would be clean ready to cast lead. Might want to add a touch of linotype or antimony lead for rifle but probably wouldn't need to for mild loads or with gas check. Hard to beat that for price or convenience.

Bullet casting ladle, skimming spoon for in melter I use a table spoon bent so it is a little deeper and has a front spout, paint stir sticks and an inexpensive lee melter. Add mold and make bullets. The Lee melter will always be a useful piece of equipment.

[Fordcragar]

Some good ideas here. I'm just putting some stuff together for castng too.

[cleonard]

I just completed this step so this seems like a good time for a first post after reading like crazy here. Got my starter setup and just cast my first 500 boolits earlier today.

I've always wanted to cast, but just didn't have the equipment. I started when I found a deal for 60# of ingots and 180# of range scrap for $100. I had a Lyman 429244 mold that I got with a S&W model 29 that I got a couple of years ago. Other than that really nothing.

I took stock of what I already had. I fixed up a old two burner propane camping stove and filled some of my 20# propane cylinders that were in the back yard. It's not my main camping stove. What ever you use for casting should only ever be used for that purpose. I also had safety equipment like leather gloves, eye protection and masks/respirators. I elected to do my work outside and pass on the respirator.

I hit Goodwill and only found some stainless saucepans. For the rest I went to Smart & Final. A big soup ladle for smelting. A big "slotted spoon" that actually has a bunch of little holes. Works OK for skimming the crud off the lead. For casting I drilled a 3/32" hole in a 2 oz serving ladle. About $15 in total.

I have a little angle iron, but it wasn't enough or the right size, so I picked up a 4 foot piece of 1 1/2 x 1 1/2 x 1/8 angle iron and welded up some ingot molds.

It was time to smelt all that range scrap. The propane stove has decent output for casting, but it was slow for smelting all that scrap. There was a lot of waiting around for the lead to melt. A higher output burner would be a good addition, but it may be a while before I smelt again as I now have over 200# of ingots. I tried sawdust and paraffin for fluxing, but ended up using sawdust with a little motor oil mixed in. Seemed to do the best job with the least fuss and mess.

I only have this one pot, so after the smelting was done used abrasives to get it back to shiny stainless steel. It was somewhat crud encrusted from smelting.

In addition to the Lyman mold I bought a two cavity .356 124gr and a two cavity .312 160gr Lee molds. After one casting session I think that the steel Lyman molds are worth every penny of their higher cost. I already have wear on the Aluminum Lee molds. Yes they are inexpensive and will probably cast several thousand boolits before wearing out, but I think that the Lyman mold will last a lot longer.

Before going into production mode, I did some testing. I probably did 100+ boolits before I get the hang of it and started getting good casts. I've read about it a lot, but actually doing it was a learning experience. Mainly keeping the lead and the mold at the right temps. For example I was surprised at how much I needed to turn the burner down to keep the lead from getting too hot. Too hot and the crud floating on the lead builds up a lot faster.

Bottom line is that you don't need to spend a lot and you can make good casts with primitive equipment. Not counting the molds I only spent about $25 to $30. If you have better luck at the thrift store perhaps a lot less. That said I'll be spending more in the future and going with a bottom pour electric casting pot when I have some free cash. Oh and a PID controller or at least a thermometer. I'll use my current setup should I need to smelt again and cast.

Next task powder coating...

Be safe and cast that lead.

[RogerDat]

Those slotted cooking spoons are really cheap at Salvation Army. Holes or slots don't seem to make much difference, now plastic or wood handle? That can matter. Don't ask how I know. Let us just say plastic handle can work for a long time but leaving the spoon end in hot lead will eventually get hot enough to melt the handle. If you have a grinder grind the point of the spoon flat makes scraping bottom of pot work better if that rounded point is a flat point.

You guys just getting started taking the time to post is great! People forget the details of how they started, over time getting set in a particular approach. Your success is also encouraging, as well as your mistakes on the way to success being reassuring. To that I can only add get it right once and you will probably be hooked, or at least hooked enough that the next problem mold will be a challenge not a stone wall.

[bbogue1]

I am beginning to set up my smelting process. Since I am on a fixed income and money is tight I want to make the wisest purchases and this thread has been fantastic. After reading quite a bit I am thinking I need a coil hot plate (1100-1650 watts) a pan to melt the lead in, a stainless steel spoon and a digital thermometer (eBay $12.88) and I have no molds. I have gloves, paraffin wax, a dross tray and a bucket or tray to quench my bullets.

Until I can get the molds I thought I'd ask tire stores for their wheel weights and make ingots, if tire stores are reluctant I'll have to buy lead so I'll look at the Selling and Swapping section.

Being a newbie in this I an wondering am I on the right track? What would you suggest?

[lightman]

My opinion, skip the ladle casting and the equipment that goes with it and get a bottom pour pot. You already have a couple of offers for used ones. Also, a Lee ingot mold is about 1/2 or 1/3 the cost of the Lyman. Other than that your list looks good.

Roger makes a good point to skip the smelting at first, and buy ready to cast lead. Casting and smelting are 2 different things. Start with casting, buy the equipment and learn. Then get some smelting equipment and learn that part of the game. You can start now stockpiling scrap lead and watch for bargains on smelting stuff. A thermometer is nice but many of us have cast without one. Many of us started small and gradually added equipment, most of us did not start where we are at now. Baby steps, ya know.

[bbogue1]

Both Great replies, I was thinking I had to start very basic, but since my goal is to shoot bullets then casting is the midpoint between smelting ingots and loading. Actually skipping the smelting, the process is more direct. I will look into those pots and research buying ingots while I develop contacts for scrap lead. I will store that for later. Thank you so much for your excellent advice.

I have used pointed spoon to try to scrape the last bit of something out of a flat bottomed bowl and it is hard. The thought of a flat at the end of the spoon makes sense. I'm thinking of a commercial kitchen stainless spoon rather than a plastic handle, that way, if needed, I can add some wood handle halves to the top and bottom. Depends on availability and cost.

[PerpetualStudent]

I made a thread about my budget setup that I did my first melting with
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?315925-First-Time-quot-smelting-quot-Success-a-possible-screw-up

Nothing wrong the setup if you're ok with small batches during good weather. I tried it when the temp was...30ish and a decent wind and that little setup just...struggled. The lead kept freezing at the edges and trying to cast .360 roundballs (rather than ingots) was really difficult.

For actually casting projectiles, consider a deeper but smaller container, I found it was difficult to keep the mold warm long enough to pour into. In fair weather, I'm sure it would have been fine and even been able to warm it up by casting.

[lightman]

You will need some type of handle on your spoon. The metal will transfer heat very quickly. You can find something that works ok at Walmart for 5 or 6 dollars. Probably cheaper at yard sales or thrift stores.

[bbogue1]

I am a newbie. Not casted yet. I am assembling the parts. After reading a ton, watching lots of videos and after several members advice I think I have arrived at a plan. I shoot a 9mm and a 38 special.

Yesterday I stopped into a auto repair shop and asked what they did with their wheel weights. They save them and about once a year a Civil War Reenactor claims them to make 4" cannon balls. The owner was generous enough to give me 22.8 pounds of wheel weights of which scrap (zinc, etc.) weighed 2.08 pounds, so I have about 20 pounds to melt, later. I pulled out my one burner white gas camp stove and fired it up to make sure it works and it does. Now I need a pot, a spoon and a ladle to melt the lead and wax to flux. I already have glasses and gloves.
As my budget allows I'll get a mold (Lee 358-158-2R (Round Nose Harder to find) or 358-158-RF (Round Nose Flat Tip) and make r aw, unsized,bullets, then much later will come a press to finish off the project. My immediate task is to continue building up a lead stockpile, so lead will be plentiful. Once I have lead I can convert the lead to ingots or bullets as I need to.

AS far as the press I'm in the beginning stages of researching. I will be reading and planning as I save my money.
This forum has been so helpful in getting started, So .... I thank you all. That's understated, I cannot thank you enough. THANK YOU!!!!

[Vinne]

Roger makes a good point to skip the smelting at first, and buy ready to cast lead. Casting and smelting are 2 different things. Start with casting, buy the equipment and learn. Then get some smelting equipment and learn that part of the game. You can start now stockpiling scrap lead and watch for bargains on smelting stuff. A thermometer is nice but many of us have cast without one. Many of us started small and gradually added equipment, most of us did not start where we are at now. Baby steps, ya know.[/QUOTE]

+1 on that. I started the same way then after a few years I eased into smelting. During that time I checked out yard sales, discount stores and used equipment where ever I could find some. All the while on the lookout for any scrap lead I could get my hands on. When everything was together, I started into bulk smelting and was never the worse for it.

[RogerDat]

Presses are a tough call. You can load a lot of stuff on an inexpensive C style single stage press, And there isn't much you can't load on a good O style single stage press.

But for auto loader pistol a turret will allow for faster production while also allowing one to use as a single stage by slipping out the indexing rod (takes like 10 seconds). I really like my Lee Classic 4 hole turret. Load .32 up through 44 mag in pistol and .223 to 8mm Mauser or 303 British in rifle.

In the end I went directly to the Lee Turret which is the same price as the Classic Cast O press. With the cost of the press I spent about $175 - $200 to get it fully equipped. With powder and primer feed. Lot of folks buy the O press which is also a press one can use for a lifetime and has more power for sizing big rifle. Skipped the small single stage, but those can be had for $35 or so and will certainly let you load pistol and even some rifle.

Eventually I also added a small C press for sizing, or trimming. So even if you start with a little C press you will find a use for it going forward. Will have no problem loading any caliber you mentioned on it.

[MT Chambers]

I'd wait and save some money and get decent equip. , good mold or two, good melting pot, a good bullet luber sizer, decent single stage press for reloading, good dies, most of this stuff is available used, just shop around.

[bbogue1]

Good advice. I will stockpile lead for now. I'll get a mold then buy precast ingots, and a melting pot. Sometime in the future I'll have the stockpile to learn to smelt with. In the meantime I will take advantage of the wealth of knowledge here. Thank you again.