Good loads for the H&R 45/70

[three50seven]

Looks like I will be adding an H&R Handi in 45/70 to my collection later this week. The previous owner has installed a Williams peep rear and Redfield globe front sight. The rifle comes with ~250 pieces of brass, several pounds of cast/sized/lubed boolits (I don't know the weight yet), and a set of Hornady dies. This will be my first foray into the 45/70. What can you folks tell me about these rifles?

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[curator]

Depending on the rifle's age it could have no throat (older) or a long conical throat (newer) Both make for challenging reloading experiences. The Handi is very light weight for heavy .45-70 loads and will benefit from a lead weight installed inside the butt stock. Cast boolits smaller than .460" rarely shoot accurately in their semi-micro groove rifling. Once you figure it out, you'll have a very serviceable and "handy" rifle. Do some research over at the Graybeard site for more Handi rifle information: http://www.go2gbo.com/forums/hr-centerfire-rifles/?PHPSESSID=0737776f5abf28332e96bf16af427fc1

[wgr]

the rifle will do great with cast boolits. but heavy loads you wont like. a mild loaded 400 grainer works good

[three50seven]

Thanks for the replies. I spoke with the seller again and he said he has both 405 and 500 gr bullets for it, and loads mostly IMR 3031. I can't wait to get my hands on this rifle later this week!

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[Bohica793]

My most accurate load is 36.5 grains of 3031 under an NOE 460-405 lubed and shot as cast. MOA at 200 yards.

[three50seven]

My most accurate load is 36.5 grains of 3031 under an NOE 460-405 lubed and shot as cast. MOA at 200 yards.
The seller told me he had good results with 36grs as well. Hodgdon site shows a starting load of 45.5 grs for a 405 gr bullet though?

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[725]

My favorite is the 460 - 420 (mine cast at 415 grains) w/ 40 grs 3031. Also, same boolit w/ 30 grs. 4198 and a tuft of dacron. Those put you near or over the top of the trap door loads and really is all you will ever need. As always, those are safe in my H&R's but never having seen yours, you will have to determine if they are safe in yours. Start low, work up slowly and look for pressure signs. Stop wherever you find an accurate load.

[Silverboolit]

Marlin level loads with a 500 gr boolit will send you to the dentist to have your fillings re-installed. I NEVER want to do that again!

[three50seven]

Marlin level loads with a 500 gr boolit will send you to the dentist to have your fillings re-installed. I NEVER want to do that again!
[emoji43] Yikes!

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[Boz330]

I had a #3 Ruger which is in the same weight class. I went to the Ruger loads in the lyman manual and started with the lightest in the 405gr class. Shot 2 rounds and pulled the rest. Went to the Trapdoor loads and never looked back. Killed a deer just as good as it did in 1873.

Bob

[Bohica793]

The seller told me he had good results with 36grs as well. Hodgdon site shows a starting load of 45.5 grs for a 405 gr bullet though?

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I saw that in the new Lyman but found it lower for trapdoor loads in a previous edition and worked from that.

[EDG]

If you use a faster power at lower velocity such as 4227 at about 1200 to 1300 FPS you will enjoy shooting a lot more.
With 3031 you need a large powder charge and it will produce a lot of recoil. See post #10 above.


Thanks for the replies. I spoke with the seller again and he said he has both 405 and 500 gr bullets for it, and loads mostly IMR 3031. I can't wait to get my hands on this rifle later this week!

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[rosewood]

My handi shoots the 405gr over 34.0 grains of RL7 which is on the lower end of the data extremely accurately. Recoil is no worse than a 12 gauge with field loads. Rosewood.

[three50seven]

Keep the good info coming y'all! I picked up 2 pounds of 3031 yesterday. I also have RL7 on hand. Looks like my powder consumption is about to take a big jump [emoji15]

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[Motard]

Not that big if you yuse light charges with fastest pistol powers as listed in many discussions here. 9-11 gr charges make for a lot if fun at range. At no expense.

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[Bohica793]

http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

some good reduced load data using pistol powders here.

[dualsport]

http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

some good reduced load data using pistol powders here.
That. You will learn to love that gun but it kicks like a mule! I have one and it'll go from mouse farts to dragon slayer. The heavy loads hurt when you shoot them.

[Hamish]

At *least* a hundred times I have read "Trapdoor loads only" for the H&R,,,,,,,

[John Boy]

What can you folks tell me about these rifles?
* What's the longest distance you plan to shoot the rifle?

[TenTea]

375 Grain Saeco 023 over 25 grains REL-7 is where I found bliss with my Trapdoor.
Mild load with excellent 100 yard accuracy using a peep sight whilst laying prone.

[three50seven]

* What's the longest distance you plan to shoot the rifle?
I have a 100yd range at home, that's where the vast majority of my shooting will take place. Furthest I will probably try would be ~300yds.

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[rfd]

i've had 3 H&R buffalo classics, and they were all good rifles. if you have the handi version, the barrel is just shorter and the overall rifle weight is 1-1/2# lighter than the b/c. if you pull off the butt plate, there could/should be a cavity for ya to fill up with lead shot, and it will help with recoil a big bunch. the trigger pull is super hefty and since the sear is only surface hardened, polishing is about all you can do, along with some powdered graphite and/or do the cock'n'pull while holding the hammer as ya watch the boob tube. i always loaded with lubed cast bullets and originally with aa5744 smokeless, which is very accurate and not case location sensitive ... it's touted to be sorta smokeless sub for black powder. but the cartridge itself was made for black powder and i'd suggest going that route.

for the most amount of tips 'n' tricks for H&R firearms, go to the experts ... GBO (http://www.go2gbo.com/forums/collapse/?c=12;sa=collapse;d39704056ba=342ff0b39dd45c524e37 de6921d70bb6#c12)

[three50seven]

Well, I picked it up this evening. I think I'm I'm love [emoji7]. I put about a dozen rounds through it at 100yds and managed to ring the steel pretty regularly. The seller gave me approx. 130 rounds of loaded ammo of various bullet weights and charges (all well marked), as well as 150+ pieces of empty brass. Other than reblueing the barrel and getting a leather recoil pad/butt cuff, I don't plan on doing anything to it right now. http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161021/9aaadf77cf58c2e91608f6f2dde6ae57.jpg
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161021/26692331ab0075b9b2573636b3b3f817.jpg
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161021/027f748d150cadfd36c47bd549b4e42a.jpg

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[rosewood]

At *least* a hundred times I have read "Trapdoor loads only" for the H&R,,,,,,,

Uh oh.

Not sure who has said that, but apparently they have never held a Handi. That thing is a huge block of steel. Not to mention all of the high pressure rifle calibers that came standard in it on the same frame. The Handi will take more than your shoulder will.

Rosewood

[rfd]

the handi .45-70 breech 'n' barrel has been proven to handle ruger #1 loads ... however, with such a light mass weight to the rifle, the shooter probably can't. :)

all yer H&R handi questions will be answered over at the graybeards forum.

[three50seven]

No worries gentlemen, I have no desire to punish myself seeing just how hot I can load this thing. Right now I'm quite content loading to trap door specs. If I do get a chance to hunt something serious with it at some point, I may warm it up a little then.

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[three50seven]

Uh oh.

Not sure who has said that, but apparently they have never held a Handi. That thing is a huge block of steel. Not to mention all of the high pressure rifle calibers that came standard in it on the same frame. The Handi will take more than your shoulder will.

Rosewood
Maybe he was referring to the H&R trapdoor reproductions that were made some years ago?

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[rfd]

the H&R handi you have sure looks like it was modded, particularly noting that heavy in-the-white barrel - a bit like a cut down H&R buff classic barrel (32"). plus, the added aperture sight system. heavy 'n' slow lead bullets will be best for accuracy, 50 to 1000 yards with that rifle (yep, 1000yds, it's been done here by a cast boolits member and a buff classic). for up to 200 yards, 400 grain lead ... 500 grains for longer. but do consider trying real black powder - easiest loading ever, no press needed, great accuracy, lotsa awesome stinky smoke. :)

aa5744 smokeless and the buff classic ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uPaWzK_Bkw

[Hamish]

Uh oh.

Not sure who has said that, but apparently they have never held a Handi. That thing is a huge block of steel. Not to mention all of the high pressure rifle calibers that came standard in it on the same frame. The Handi will take more than your shoulder will.

Rosewood

I forgot to type "and shoot to your hearts content without rattling your dentures out,,,,". :). I'm sure you could shoot one loose, but I wouldn't want to!

I'm not real surprised to see a factory stainless barrel mated to a blued receiver, matter of fact, I likes it a lot. (my next H&R .30 Badger being built right now is a stainless stubbed into a blued.)

three, I've got to tell you, I'm a little jealous!

[richhodg66]

I have one with synthetic stock. I put a Williams peep sight on it and it shoots pretty well with either the Lee 340 grain or a Saeco 300 grain I have with 31 grains of 5744. This is a mild load, but I don't see me ever hunting anything bigger than deer well within the range capability of the load and rifle.

[three50seven]

the H&R handi you have sure looks like it was modded, particularly noting that heavy in-the-white barrel - a bit like a cut down H&R buff classic barrel (32"). plus, the added aperture sight system. heavy 'n' slow lead bullets will be best for accuracy, 50 to 1000 yards with that rifle (yep, 1000yds, it's been done here by a cast boolits member and a buff classic). for up to 200 yards, 400 grain lead ... 500 grains for longer. but do consider trying real black powder - easiest loading ever, no press needed, great accuracy, lotsa awesome stinky smoke. :)

aa5744 smokeless and the buff classic ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uPaWzK_Bkw
He said he had had a BC and really liked it other than it was so long and awkward, so he sold it and bought a basic Handi and made it his own "buffalo classic carbine" not sure why he polished the bluing off the barrel, he said it had a lot of tooling marks? Anyway, I will either reblue it or maybe try some of that Birchwood Casey Plum Brown. Anyone ever use that?

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[thegatman]

Have a Handi and shoot trailboss in it. Shoots very nice. I don't know if I would hunt with those low power loads. IMR 3031 work great in it.