Old old old Pyrodex 4F

[JKH]

Hey guys,

I scored a pound of Pyrodex for pistols in the old heavy cardboard/pasteboard "can" just to have it for display, I checked the powder and other than some minor clumps (which break up easilly) it looks fine. I took about 50 grains out and lit it, seemed to be a little hard starting but the wind was messing with the light flame, when it took off it burned about the same rate as smokeless powder.

So, being frugal, I would like to keep it on hand for just in case. Or for starter blanks, think it's okay or might it be slightly damp? If slightly damp would it help to spread it out on wax paper in the sun for a while?

[bubba.50]

try it in a gun & see what happens. pour a charge down the barrel, stuff a wad of paper or some such on top of it to hold it in place, point in a safe direction & see if it goes bang.

[Hellgate]

AND clean the gun afterward!

[OverMax]

Be a good collectable just because its old. Than again. Not many here can claim they have a full can of Pyrodex 4-FFFFG. ;-)

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Hey guys,

I scored a pound of Pyrodex for pistols in the old heavy cardboard/pasteboard "can" just to have it for display, I checked the powder and other than some minor clumps (which break up easilly) it looks fine. I took about 50 grains out and lit it, seemed to be a little hard starting but the wind was messing with the light flame, when it took off it burned about the same rate as smokeless powder.

So, being frugal, I would like to keep it on hand for just in case. Or for starter blanks, think it's okay or might it be slightly damp? If slightly damp would it help to spread it out on wax paper in the sun for a while?

That last seems a good idea, but don't forget it if the wind gets up. Or use some kind of tray with screen wire or gauze.

I wouldn't expect any trouble with normal gelatinised smokeless, which absorbs water less easily than black and takes less harm if it does. But you have provoked me into putting a few grains of pyrodex under the microscope, and it has an extremely porous structure which does indeed look like it would absorb moisture. It doesn't ignite nearly as easily as black powder when it is in perfect condition, and I believe the worse you could expect, straight out of the canister, is slightly reduced performance, not danger.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Be a good collectable just because its old. Than again. Not many here can claim they have a full can of Pyrodex 4-FFFFG. ;-)

I'm old. I think the mania for collectibles has been encouraged by those selling them. But if that is the way you feel, an empty canister wouldn't be so bad.

I once wanted to advise someone to find a British oval Coleman's mustard can to make a fuel tank for a model aeroplane, like I did in the 70s. But I thought again when I saw what rusty and grubby ones were going for on eBay. If they ever went.

[swathdiver]

Doesn't Pyrodex, like 777 degrade over time? I think it best to use as fertilizer for your flowers.

[rodwha]

My father gave me 3 bottles of Pyrodex and one or two were opened. They were so old the sticker said something like $9.99. It worked just fine despite being stored in his work shop that only has a window A/C turned on when he's in there. He lives in OK.

There is a group of hog hunters who use a lot of T7 and the idea came up to drop desiccant packs into the opened bottles. Don't know if it works, but it can't hurt...

[tomme boy]

As soon as the seal is broken, the powder is starting to go bad. I seemed to be able to have it around about 3-4 years before I would get wild velocity swings. And ignition problems. I just pored it all into the fire pit and burned it off. Had 5 lbs of different grades. One heck of a smoke cloud!

Now I just run real black and have not had ANY problems with it

[slumlord44]

I have similar containers of 3F. Goes bang just fine. Accuracy not so good but it works for casual plinking. As stated clean well after using.

[bubba.50]

years ago I had one of the old cardboard cans rattle around in the back of my old pick-up for a couple years. was kinda clumped up when I found it back there. shook it up good to bust the clumps & shot it. can't say what a chronograph woulda said but, it went bang every time with no noticeable loss of accuracy.

[ironhead7544]

Might work OK. Might come out in flaming chunks. Had that happen with a 1 year old can. Not every time, but looked like a flare gun when it happened. This was with a 54 cal rifle and Maxi-balls.

My BP gunsmith wont use it. Says in a closed can it is good for 1.5 years. Open can, one month.

[Maven]

While Pyrodex is by no means my favorite propellant, at times it has been my only ML (cap lock) propellant since powders of any type are almost impossible to find locally. In fact, if the price was significantly less than 1 lb. BP, I'd seriously consider purchasing it. As for it decaying with age, that's not my experience at all as I'm still using a 20 yr. old bottle of Pyro P and have purchased and successfully used RS in the cardboard "can": Both ignite instantly with no deleterious effects on accuracy that I can attribute to the propellant. Btw, I haven't found Hodgdon's claims that there's no need to swab between shots or that it doesn't promote rust to be true.

[tomme boy]

I think the rust thing is because of it being harder to clean than real black. I always found it leaves a harder layer of crud in the barrel. It seemed to always take multiple cleanings to get really clean.

I keep all of my powder in my basement that is heated and air conditioned. It stays 70* year round. The powder I spoke about above I was having problems when sighting in a new gun. I was having problems with ignition. Sometimes it would take 3 caps for it to go off. It seemed to have a hangfire every time it went off. The year before I missed a deer because of it. I thought I just messed up loading it. Then when I was having problems again I knew it was the powder.

I think it was handloader Mag. that did a article on the Pyro powder. They did a year or two long test and showed that once the bottle was opened, in the first month it had lost about 5% power. They kept taking powder out of the cans to different levels and testing it. They found that the more air in the can the faster the powder would degrade. They recommended to not open or use all of your powder right away

[rodwha]

I wonder if desiccant or O2 eater packs would help...

I've been dropping desiccant packs in my T7 bottles just in case. It certainly can't hurt.

Or maybe vacuum sealing it into portions?

[rmark]

I had several 10 year old cans of Pyrodex from an estate, most went bang just fine, the last I dumped out as there was a noticeable delay in ignition.

[GOPHER SLAYER]

In 1961 I was shooting cap & ball pistols with a Blue & Gray team. At one meeting a fellow shooter shows up with a paper bag of paper cartridges for the 58 cal rifle. We were outside when he shows up and he wanted to see if the powder was still good. He tore the end off of one round and poured the powder on the sidewalk, struck a match and lit the hundred year old powder. The powder ignited so fast he didn't have time to pull his hand back. It burned all the hair off the right hand. Other than the loss of hair, his hand was not harmed. I don't think Pyrodex will last that long.