Has anybody tried...

[nicholst55]

paper patched boolits in a Mosin or an Enfield? I have one of each with groove diameters running .316" or even a bit larger. I've been planning to bite the bullet (pun intended) and order a custom mold that will cast at around .317 or .318", but now I'm wondering. If paper patching would work, it would certainly be less expensive than springing for a custom mold!

Anyone? :confused:

[docone31]

I got a lot of help from Beemer with my Enfield. Mine is tighter than yours, however I am sure paper patching will indeed help.
With your bore, You can size to .311, then patch up using computer paper. At least that is what I would try first.
I believe, I read on here somewhere, someone cast an 8mm bullet, and sized it down.
Someone here has probably done it.
Someone else has done paper patching for a Moisin also. Seemed to do pretty well with it.
I have to step in on this one.
You have to slug the barrel to really know the diameter. In the casting section, there is a pretty simple process that works. Once you know the actual diameter, you can get a mold, sizer, and patch your heart out.
I patch my Enfield #1MkIII by sizing to .308, and wrapping using Meade Tracing Paper. Beemer said he tried it, and it also worked for me. I use two turns of paper and leave it unsized. I get .3135 as finished diameter. Slighter thicker paper would make it thicker still using 2 wraps. I also use a little cigarette roller and it works rather easily.
I wrapped the first ones with gas checks. I am going to not use the gas checks sizing to .308. Also, I use the Lee 185-312 mold reccomended by them for the .303. It is a little rough to size that directly to .308. Next batch I will go .309, then .309. I do not like putting that pressure on the Lee Classic Press.
For my 03-A3, I will be sizing to .308, then wrapping and sizing to .311. Another reccomendation I read on this forum.
Slug your barrel, then you will know exactly. The Enfield has five lands. Really difficult to measure.
I took five measurements, made five circles, then made a circle through the five intersections.
That worked for me.
I am still working on a load. I use the lowest load for 185 jacketed bullets. So far so good.

[longbow]

I have done a little paper patching for an Enfield No. 5 with pretty good success so far - at least in the end.

I had made a mould at 0.301" per the Lyman paper patch moulds for .30 cal. Then patched to a little over groove diameter (about 0.315") in the .303 but got poor accuracy. Same bullets shot well in my .308 even though grossly oversize for it. I tried several different papers and thicknesses but the .303 would have none of it until... I knurled the bullets which increased diameter to 0.304". I then patched to 0.314" using tracing paper and got good accuracy.

I am not sure of whether the increase in diameter did the trick, the knurling for better grip or both. Whatever it was took groups from about 4"+ at 50 yards to about 1 1/2" - maybe not tack driving accuracy but a vast improvement.

I haven't had a chance to do any more paper patching for a while but will be doing some more testing in the future to see if I can shrink groups more.

So the short story is that a 0.301" bullet patched from 0.312" to 0.316" did not work well but a bullet of 0.304" patched to groove diameter of 0.314" did. The advice I have gotten for smokelss loads and paper patching is to use a bullet of bore diameter or a little over and patch to groove diameter or a little over. Seemed to work for my gun.

My gun has 0.303" bore and 0.314" groove.

In your case you would likely get by with a standard 0.308" mould maybe sized down a bit then patched to 0.316" or 0.317".

Longbow

[pdawg_shooter]

I cast a 311466, size it .304, give it two wraps of 16lb printer paper, and lube it with BAC. Shoots way better than my 56 year old eyes can hold with issue sights. This is in a No4 Mk2 using full power loads of AA2495 and a CCI200 primer.

[beemer]

Both my Enfield and my Mosin have about .312-.313 bores. For paper patching I size to .3085and patch back up to almost .314. It is a combination of boolit size,paper thickness and bore size. You can use a 308 boolit with thick paper or a bigger boolit with thin paper. I would try what I had before buying anything. Buckshot suggested lubing the patch with LLA, I haven't found anything that works better.

Both rifles shoot groups comparable to J bullets. The Mosin will do about 2.5 in. for 5 shots at 100 yds at 2450 fps.( if I do my part)

We would be interested in what you try and the results.

beemer

[Buckshot]

..............One of the best groups I'd ever shot from an as issued military rifle was with patched boolits. It was a M91/30 bought for $39 from SOG amongst a bunch of other stuff. They said they had them on sale at that price, so what the heck by all means toss one in :-)

It arrived wearing a Finn massaged (fingerjoined) beech stock in good looking shape. The Finn's also seemed to think it needed counterboring at the muzzle. This was also my very first 7.62x54R. A friend gave me 20 many times fired Norma cases as at the time they were the ONLY source of Boxer brass. I couldn't get it to shoot worth a tinker's dam.

I'd been paper patching for a recently aquired 577-450, and by simple association a 45-70. It was a 'just because' deal for the 45 2.1 :-). After those 45 cal slugs a 30 cal was TINY and taxing. I know it was hard as I had to keep the tip of my tongue stuck out the corner of my mouth to get them right. A sign of extreme concentration on my part!

They were the Lyman 311284's cast of WW metal with an as cast OD of .310". They were patched with some .002" 9# airmail paper for a dry OD of .317". I forget what they were lubed with but run up through a ho-made .316" die, loaded and shot. While the results were great, I told myself if I had to PP 30 cal slugs to get it to shoot I wasn't going to mess with it further.

.................Buckshot

[Bob Krack]

I use two turns of paper and leave it unsized. I get .3135 as finished diameter. Slighter thicker paper would make it thicker still using 2 wraps. I also use a little cigarette roller and it works rather easily.


Sounds fascinating! I have rolled many cigarettes (long ago and far away) but can not quite get my mind around how you would accomplish that task.

I've used the Prince Albert, Bugler, Top, Zig-Zag, and La-Prez(?) rollers. The Prince Albert-Bugler rolling machines come the closest to being able to be useful in my mind.

Could you explain in a little more detail or even better, a picture?

Thanks,
Vic

[docone31]

I am lousey at picture taking. I will try to describe it by type.
I use a cigarette machine similiar to Zig-Zag. The two roller type.
I size the bullet, AND, I do not use gas checks! Sizing a bullet from .313 to .308 makes the gas check act like a razor blade on the base of the bullet.
I did not even make a template. I cut strips of Meade Tracing Paper 1". The grain on that paper is from side to side, rather than length wise. I cut from the bottom to the top.
I by gosh and by golly cut 30* per Beemer, at 2 3/8" from corner to corner length wise.
I opened the cigarette machine, inserted the paper made nicely wet and mostly paralell to the direction of the roll. From there, I placed the bullet on the paper where the paper should stop on the ogive. I closed the machine and rolled. I am left handed, so I had to figuire that out.
I just let the patch drip water off. I did not wring it. The machine acts like a squeege.
On the occasion the beginning of the patch comes out of the machine while rolling, I back out 1/4 turn and just bend the corner into the roll. I then shut the machine and roll.
BadaBing, BadaBoom. Done. I remove the assembly and do another one.
I twist the tail and set the nose of the bullet into a 9mm case in the case holder that comes with a full box of cartridges. They dry over night.
I couldn't believe it was that simple! They come out well, tight, and contract to where you can see the grease grooves.
I sized them with a little Lee Case Lube. After sizing, I run them through very hot water.
The Case Lube is water soluable and floats right off!
Any wrinkles are pressed into the patch. I was amazed at how well they came out.
After cutting off the twist, I wet the bottom of the patch and fold it onto the base.
Done.
No complicated boards, no water mix, just dip in water, set into the machine, drop the bullet, close roll and do another.

[nicholst55]

Thanks for the info and ideas, guys. I'm going to be overseas for quite a while yet, but I'll give it a try when I get back to the States.