Need Info On Working Up New Load

[Fiddleharp]

A few weeks ago I found a Lyman Deerstalker .50 percussion rifle in a local pawnshop. The deal was sweetened by the fact that a Lyman 57SML peep sight, leather sling, and a big bag of accessories were included. The previous owner apparently died or gave up on muzzleloading. I literally did not need to buy anymore accessories to use and clean this gun. There was even a brass flask filled with unidentified gunpowder. I was afraid to use this powder, not knowing what it was or its condition, so I went out and found the only stuff that was available locally, Pyrodex P and a can of Goex Pinnacle Replica ff. As far a I can determine, no retailers in Southwest Florida carry real black powder.
Since there were a bunch of saboted bullets included in my bag o' goodies, I started shooting them with 80 grains of the Pyrodex fff. Not bad accuracy, but I feel I can do better. Then I came across some non-saboted 350gr. pre-lubricated hollowpoints from the Buffalo Bullet Company. I'd like to try them next, but am wondering which powder to use, and how much.
The Pyrodex P fff, or the Goex ff?
Also, do I need to put a felt wad between the powder charge and the Buffalo bullet, or just seat the bullet onto the charge?
The Lyman Deerstalker seems to have a rather short barrel for a muzzleloader. Which powder will burn more efficiently in such a barrel, fff or ff?
All advice and opinions will be carefully considered. Thanks.

[Randy C]

Did you check the powder company's website, I order mine on line

[rfd]

what will you use the rifle for, strictly hunting? if so, what critters? that rifle has a 24" barrel with a 1:48 rifling twist, so it can do patched balls or greased bullets. if yer at least somewhat new to a trad ml, i'd suggest trying some patched balls and perhaps a lee REAL or a TC maxi - start off with the suggestions offered by the manufacturer (investarms) and vendor (lyman). in any event, learn as much as you can about yer 'new' rifle - read the manual, which includes ball/bullet types and powder charge volumes for both real black and black sub powders ....

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/muzzle-loaders/deerstalker-rifle.php

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/muzzle-loaders/pdfs/lyc-ml-general.pdf

[curator]

Fiddleharp,

Bass Pro Shop in Ft. Myers has real black powder. They don't display it on their shelves as that is not allowed by law. Ask at the gun counter and they can go and get what you want. Most flat base conicals shoot better with a wad under them. Try your most accurate load with and without the wad to know for sure. The Deerstalker has a 1 in 48 twist and may or may not shoot the "longish" 350 grain buffalo bullet well. They do shoot the Lee 300 grain R.E.A.L. bullet quite well.

[rodwha]

Do you have the blued model with deeper PRB grooves or the stainless model with shallower grooves for sabots?

Mine is the blued model and I found that it shoots the 320 grn Lee REAL exceptionally well at 50 yds with 70 grns of 3F Triple 7 or Olde Eynsford black powder only when I use a felt wad. Otherwise they keyhole and shoot very low and to the left.

You'll have to experiment to find which granulation size your rifle prefers. I chose 3F because it's what I use in my pistols and I don't want to need to buy or carry a bunch of different powders.

[waksupi]

For PRB, I have found in calibers of .45 and over, 65 gr. of 3fff performs quite well.

[Fiddleharp]

Fiddleharp,

Bass Pro Shop in Ft. Myers has real black powder. They don't display it on their shelves as that is not allowed by law. Ask at the gun counter and they can go and get what you want. Most flat base conicals shoot better with a wad under them. Try your most accurate load with and without the wad to know for sure. The Deerstalker has a 1 in 48 twist and may or may not shoot the "longish" 350 grain buffalo bullet well. They do shoot the Lee 300 grain R.E.A.L. bullet quite well.

I just got off the phone with the manager of the Ft. Myers Bass Pro Shop. He said Corporate pulled all the black powder months ago and it's not coming back.

[rfd]

it's *impossible* for me to find local black powder, even 100 miles away "local". bp is fast becoming a seriously endangered species and we *may* hafta resort to either some form of "black market" underground purchasing, or making our own. and after the coming elections, all things firearms could be seriously worse. as it is now, mail ordering black powder is the only way to go and for me, and to avoid both the hazmat and shipping fees means 25# bulk orders. for those needing less, it's time to find other local folks,maybe clubs or by putting up notices at gun stores, and go in on a group order. 25# barely lasts me a year, with 70 grains per shot for both ml's and bpcr that's 100 firings per pound. don't last long ....

[Fiddleharp]

Answering a few questions: Mine is a blued model and it'll be used for hunting our rather puny South Florida deer.

[rfd]

Answering a few questions: Mine is a blued model and it'll be used for hunting our rather puny South Florida deer.

don't need more than a patched ball over 70 grains of 3f or 2f bp for whitetails.

[OnHoPr]

Answering a few questions: Mine is a blued model and it'll be used for hunting our rather puny South Florida deer.

As stated above the PRB will be more than adequate for the FL deer and game animals much bigger. Should do at least 60 gr and above till about 90 gr whichever gives the best accuracy. The only thing you have to contend with is the wind. So, depending on the yardage of your longer shots will determine a consideration. 70 gr of powder with a PRB in 13 mph winds at 100 yd can be rough. On a calm day no problem. That is where the possibility of a conical or maybe even sabot comes in. It may be a bit to slow of twist for a sabot unless you try something like a 180 to 220 gr shorter boolit in the 44 or 45 cals. These depending on cast projectile might be able to subdue the cross wind deflection about 50% of what the PRB does. A little bit smaller deer a little bit smaller target. They sound tasty though.

[fiberoptik]

don't need more than a patched ball over 70 grains of 3f or 2f bp for whitetails.

Don't need more than a .32 squirrel gun for those anemic dogs, I mean deer. My cat weighs more! Maybe we should use slingshots...


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[fiberoptik]

So how do we work up a load in sunny Fl? I can't find anyplace to burn smoke in Jokes, I mean Jax. At least in Michigan I can go shooting outdoors!


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[OverMax]

Goex Pinnacle Replica ff I have never tried. Chuck Hawks has a few words about this powder you may be interested in reading. (link)
If you intend on using Pyrodex substitute powders you have to clean your rifles barrel after every shooting session. Pyrodex RS & 3P both are aggressive corrosive powders. More so than Black Powder.

Efficiency is based on the size of the powder charge. Only difference in a brand of powder? from 2-FF_3-FFF to 4-FFFF? is the size of there kernels which determines how fast it will burn thus governs the amount of (gases) produced in so many inches of barrel..

Some States do not allow Black powder sales purchases do to DOT regulations regarding Black Powder as a Explosive. Substitute powders many are considered a Propellant.

As far as different projectiles. I always promote starting off with Patched Ball first to those having a side lock. Black powder shooting is a progression of learning experiences. As your learn you experiment. Thus become proficient in knowing the limits of the firearm and yourself. i.e. What it likes and dislikes.
Not wanting to do the aforementioned. That's your call.

BTW: Anyone can make shoot-able B/P. Just a matter of improvising needed.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/goex_pinnacle.htm