The cost of reloading [Archive]

fatelk

09-19-2016, 11:29 PM

I think I talked an acquaintance out of reloading. He had been asking about reloading for a while, wanting to save all that money on his ammo.

Turns out he uses maybe a couple boxes of 30-06 per year sighting in and hunting, and maybe some 9mm once in a while. He's happy with the $14/box Remington hunting rounds that Bi-Mart has on sale every year, and the cheapest bulk 9mm, so the issue is cost not quality.

We looked at the cost of components: $30 for a box of jacketed .30 cal hunting bullets, $4 for a box of primers, $27 for a pound of powder. When he saw that he would be saving maybe $3 per box, or at most $20 per year (not including brass), and compared that to the cost of the "Supreme Reloading Kit" on the shelf, he lost interest. He seemed surprised because he though it was supposed to be cheap to reload. No, I didn't offer to load for him. He really is better off buying some factory rounds.

Of course I know why we all do it, casting bullets and all that. What I wonder about is the guy who spends $300 on the gear only to rarely use it.

country gent

09-19-2016, 11:45 PM

I know several that have bought full reloading set ups. Presses scales dies (sometimes several diffrent sets) and all the odds and ends back in the early 80s and it has yet to come out of the packages. Like alot of high power ( centerfire) rifles they are bought and looked at or used very little.Ive seen several used reloading presses with no rubs on ram or where shell holders snap in. Ive seen guys in local gun store that buy the complete set up in one shot brand new and you just know its not going to be used.

Mauser48

09-19-2016, 11:47 PM

You can buy a box of ammo for $20 and components will cost $20 for powder, $10 for bullets, and $3 for primers. Let's say it's .38 ammo. That is about the smallest quantity of stuff you can buy to load. The $20 a box doesn't sound too bad if you only shoot a few boxes a year. You have to load a good amount to make it worth while. Basically, you will shoot more for the same amount of money. If all you do is go try to blast stuff for cheap then don't reload. I like the idea of making whatever kind of ammo I want, and making excellent quality ammo for cheaper. I'm going to start casting soon. I think it will be really satisfying. By reloading, I simply know exactly what's going on in my ammo. By starting to cast, I will gain more knowledge about the bullet itself. I also like the idea of buying 50 pounds of lead and turning it into whatever I want to. I don't have to choose what I want for $50.

Butchman205

09-19-2016, 11:47 PM

Some folks pay a therapist $250 per hour to listen to their problems, some folks smack a little white ball around a golf course, some folks knit, and some folks cast bullets to load and shoot.

One day while depriming a mess of brass, it hit me that my mom always enjoyed crocheting...she called it her knitting. When I'm casting bullets or prepping brass, it's the repetitive sort of hobby that my mom enjoyed, and found much relaxation of the noggin while doing it.

My wife calls my bullet casting/loading/shooting my knitting.

It relaxes my mind, to spend a little time each week making bullets...then I get to shoot said ammo (which is very relaxing), and start all over.

-Butchman

Kskybroom

09-20-2016, 12:02 AM

I reload,cast, ect because i enjoy doing it
Last time i got shot gun supplies it would be cheaper to buy ammo.
But still do it. Though the years i been reloading the guys that start to save money dont make it to long. The guys that enjoy it are still around.....
Give a new bee 5 5 gal buckets of pistol brass. The one that sorts it out will make the other one well.........

flyingmonkey35

09-20-2016, 12:15 AM

Reloading, = you shoot more for less.
But 1st and foremost it's a hobby.
I reload for fun. Not to save money that's a bonus.

Sent from my LGLS991 using Tapatalk

M-Tecs

09-20-2016, 12:26 AM

Most people that start reloading also start shooting more.

MaryB

09-20-2016, 01:16 AM

Range twice a month in spring/summer/fall, call it 8 months of the year I shoot... so 200 rounds of 9mm a month, probably 500 5.56x45, maybe 200 .380acp... 900x8 months... I save money reloading!

NavyVet1959

09-20-2016, 03:01 AM

It's not just the cost of it. It's the independence. I have enough of an assortment of powders and primers that I can last for a long time even if we have another ammo and reloading components shortage. Maybe I only have enough components to reload 40K rounds, but I can choose which of the calibers to reload for on an as-needed basis.

dh2

09-20-2016, 03:18 AM

over the years my casting and reloading as went in waves but not stopped since it started , as my time gets more in demand I have thought about going to factory ammo for 9mm and .223 Rem. for plinking at the range, Now days most of my casting is rifle boolits from .366 (9.3 mm) to .458 dia. Last time I looked locally I seen .375 H&H Mag. ammo was $80.00 for a box of 20 so it may not be as much about how much I cast and reload as it is about what I reload, So I will keep doing it ,

DrCaveman

09-20-2016, 03:22 AM

After committing money to some reloading presses, a bunch of die sets, a bunch of bullet moulds, and casting equipment, one may feel they have the capacity to make as much ammo as They want. Once one accumulates a variety and quantity of brass, primers, powder, and lead, then, with frugal shooting for utility only, they would have a lifetime supply of ammunition. That is a priceless possession.

I mostly like to just shoot more, but i still don't think I've recovered my money in 7 years of reloading/casting, meaning that I could have bought factory this whole time and probably spent less. I guess I count the loading and casting time as almost equally enjoyable to the shooting. If you don't have some inkling that direction then reloading is probably not for you.

shoot-n-lead

09-20-2016, 04:16 AM

Apparently, a lot of y'all use different math than I do, in regards to figuring your cost of reloading. And, apparently, y'all must overwhelmingly shoot 9mm ammo.

A lot of the savings in reloading is directly dependent on what type ammo you shoot...and what you shoot the most of. I have always shot more bigbore revolver ammo than any other ammo. I will use 44 special as an example as I shoot it more than any other cartridge.

About the best price that I have seen online for 44 special ammo, is about $580 per thousand shipped. Okay, normally I shoot at least 1500rds per year of 44 special...at a cost of $90 per thousand for my reloads. So, if I purchased my ammo, I would have no use for the brass and it could be sold for about $225...to help recoup some of the cost. That would make purchasing my 1500rds of ammo cost me $870 minus $225...for a cost of $645 for the years worth of ammo. But, since I cast and reload during what would otherwise be my TV watching time...that same quantity of ammo cost's me $135... Now, $645 minus $135 leaves a savings of $510 per year on one cartridge.

Now, that may not be your definition of saving money...but it works for me.

And, as for equipment costs...I have some pretty good equipment...including some Dillon presses and powder measures and scales...but I also have some RCBS and Lee stuff...but all together, after shopping wisely and buying packages from folks that bought stuff and didn't use it...I would be willing to bet that I don't have $200 dollars invested in reloading equipment on my bench. As an example, when I bought the Dillon stuff...I bought everything that an Army Doctor had...it was all new...and I sold off the stuff that I had no use for and it sold for $65 dollars less than I paid him for everything...matter of fact there is still a little of that stuff that I don't use, still boxed up out there. The other stuff that I have came in buy out deals like that and I have almost nothing in it, either.

Anyone, that has reloaded for years and says they have not saved money over buying ammo...has really made some bad decisions in purchasing equipment and components or shoots a VERY small amount of ammo.

toallmy

09-20-2016, 04:25 AM

Customizing your ammo is priceless .

Beagle333

09-20-2016, 04:28 AM

If it were purely about the cost, I'd just work more hours and buy my bullets. I make more per hour than I save per hour by reloading. Casting/reloading is my hobby and I enjoy it.

Hickory

09-20-2016, 05:56 AM

I take a somewhat different approach when someone I know and trust wants to get into reloading. I have in the past offered to let individuals use my equipment (under my supervision) load ammo to get the feel & knowledge of reloading. Teaching them what I know and have learned over the years.
Most times they are not high volume reloaders, (prairie dog shooters) but, like the person in the OP just wants a 100 rounds or less for deer hunting every 2-3 years.

Idaho45guy

09-20-2016, 06:23 AM

I had to get into reloading when I lived in AZ because I got hooked on BPCR competition; silhouette and 1000yd matches. There are very few sources for black powder loaded cartridges for .45-70 and there is no way you can be competitive without handloading your own rounds and finding what works in your particular rifle. Plus, at $2 a round, and needing about 60 rounds per match, it was very cost prohibitive.

I got all set up and reloaded my own cartridges for matches when my wife decided she wanted a divorce and I moved back to Idaho. No longer was there a 600yd range off my back porch and a world-class range and competition 5 minutes from my work in Phoenix.

All my stuff has been in storage for over 4 years and it wasn't until I purchased my .45 Colt Ruger Blackhawk Bisley that I became interested in reloading again.

My dad is a major reloader and casts around 40k boolits a year for a retailer. When I moved back to this area, I bought a house about 15 minutes from him and his outdoor range and shop. I started casting bullets out at his place and discovered that I found it very relaxing and enjoyable, so I decided to start doing it for myself. I'm still waiting for my lee pot and other stuff to get here this week.

I rarely shoot my guns, but have a carry pistol in .40 S&W near me at all times. I also have four hunting rifles, an AR, my 1885 Winchester competition rifle, a couple of shotguns, and six pistols; two in .45 Colt, two in .40 S&W, a .22 and a 9mm. Hoping to get a sniper rifle soon to round out my collection.

Reloading for me is not about economics at all but is about relaxation and self-reliance.

RogerDat

09-20-2016, 06:32 AM

Reloading on it's own might not be as frugal as casting and reloading. The casting part is where a whole lot of savings are to be found. Take 200 grain 45 RNL so 500 bullets costs $80 in laser cast or $15 worth of lead and Lee Alox or White Label Xalox. So save $65 per 500 projectiles which pretty much covers the dies (which lose little if any value). Next 500 cast and reloaded and with the savings JUST over buying the projectile you have covered the primers for the whole 1000. Another 500 cast and reloaded and the powder for all 1500 have been covered by savings over buying the 1500 laser cast. So at this point your total running cost for 1500 rounds is $45 worth of lead and tumble lube plus a box of primers. In other words for just about the same as the non caster paid for the first 500 laser cast bullets you have 1500 rounds of shooting.

That same 1500 rounds would have you spending around $570 for reman 45 ACP ammo less whatever you can get for the used brass from reloaders ;-)

Brass gets multiple and variable number of reloads. Also some buy new, some used, and some smaller quantity that sees frequent cycles of reloading, others buy 500 cases and reload big batches. Just too many variables to come up with cost BUT reloading or casting and reloading brass cost is the same.

Bottom line of course you don't save money, you spent the savings on a new hollow point mold, big batch of primers to make the hazmat less painful and then spent even more on some lead that was a good deal. :-D But you may as someone pointed out end up in a place where you will have a lifetime supply of ammo available.

OnHoPr

09-20-2016, 06:46 AM

Ah the cost of reloading, that only comes with the true psychy or persona of the shooter. It also depends on the intent of the shooter. Many to most hunters or shooters come from different backgrounds where they have been just weekend warriors educated from the deer camp or cable tv and such. Actual bullet/boolit construction is so important for duty at hand. Most all general weapons should harvest a deer within a 100 yds. But, that is not the case always depending on caliber, ammo, hit, and actual range. Then the tracking starts if they really know how and then the deer camp stories start. What does most gunfire sound like in the first two days of season.lol There are a few one shot reports, but most are 3, 4, 5, 6, and 7 shot reports. An old indian proverb I heard once was "one shot probably deer, two shots maybe deer, three shots no deer". A lot of hunters say its good enough when they can hit a 6 or 9" paper plate @ 100 yd. A most of them will never be reloaders unless they find that they can shoot pistola pretty cheap for basically little headache and a pretty decent return on investment for pleasure.

I started reloading in '75 (circa) with a 700 versa mec. It definitely was a cost savings. I got to where I could load 12 boxes an hour and made good huntin loads. My first couple of deer seasons were with Rem 220 gr SPs for that MI brush HUNTIN. Then I had a doe permit and a deer walked out on the road, Oh maybe 350 yds away about the same time I walked out on the county fire trail. I took a shot and seen that 220 gr hit about 50 or so yds in front of it. The bullet must of skipped under the doe's legs and it just looked at me. So, I aimed a little higher and hit a little closer, but the deer just looked at me. lol Then I said I need to fix this scenario before next season. So, I bought a Lee Loader and copied a load out of a Outdoor Life story. That 51.5 gr of IMR 4895 and a Sierra 150 gr Spitzer was accurate and a lot flatter shootin in the 06. This was still my teenage years. Then in my 20s I started killing deer and that load is like Zues within a couple of hundred yds. Then about mid 20s I shot a big doe at 347 paces and dropped on the spot, but she got up and ran with the group. Didn't find and started investigating actual bullet construction instead of the Whoa that's a cool looking bullet/cartridge combination, man. Even started at 2900 to 3000 fps with that bullets BC it slows down way to much after a couple of hundred yards for its stoutness and hitting deer effectively. Just the opposite a Nosler BT at those speeds at 50 yds and hitting bone and meat is pretty destructive. I am not an expert, but a lot of hunters don't even really realize bullet construction and in the scenarios where they might take a shot. I moved up to a old CH press and when reloading for the rifle my concern is accuracy for the individual rifle beyond what most commercial ammo can provide. It's always good to load up 5 or 10 boxes of plinking ammo before gun season. So, there is an improvement in performance and cost if someone wants to add a little weight to those ideals.

When it comes to reloading for the pistola there is a big savings as well as performance in accuracy if the shooter can shoot well enough to notice. The savings per round is there. The performance is undetermined. At our local DNR range a couple of years ago the pistola shooters complained all the time because the range was 25 yds. So, they made a temporary 10 yd range and then just this year I seen where they made a permanent 10 yd pistola range. I watched a few of the pistola shooters the last I time I was there. They are still having difficulties hitting targets printed on regular printer paper on that range. I did see a young asian lady that was keeping a whole clip in about 3", though. Back in the '70s before they had range officers, tower, cement shooting tables, flush toilets, and the whole kittin kabuddle I use to hit a cig pack 4 out of 5 shells at the 100 yd range with my SBH. Though, a bud and me use to load 1000 cast 357's a week on a RCBS press and shoot them which was very cost effective.

6bg6ga

09-20-2016, 06:46 AM

Well, I don't know if I agree with the saving money part. I looked thru a notebook that I keep in which I have written down the costs of my bullet caster, magma and ballisti-cast bullet molds, star dies and punches(custom made) reloading die sets, reloading presses Dillon 650, Lyman T-mag, OAL length gauges not to mention powder scales and powder droppers, bullet droppers, and bullet and brass collators. Add up the cost and its in the 5K range for me. What this does for me..... IF I have primers and powder on hand I can avoid the component runs of a few years back. I can reload .223's for about .23-.24 cents each and 300 blackout for .28 cent each. I can reload a box of 38's, 357's, 9mm, or 45 acp for somewhere in the $5-6 dollar box range. Savings? Not really when you consider the investment of money in the necessary equipment and the time involved in the actual reloading of the ammunition. Oh, I forgot to mention the biggest Dillon tumbler that sits in the garage that is needed to clean the dirty brass and or to remove the lube that is necassary to re-size the rifle brass once its been shot. Saving money? Probably not when you consider how much it takes in time and money to purchase the necessary equipment to reload. Call it an obsession or a calling or something along that line.

OnHoPr

09-20-2016, 07:03 AM

@ 6bg6ga Your the type of guy that shouldn't be talking a newbie into reloading from many angles. After a few years to see if the newb likes it or not then they could go BONZI on their own accord.

Sasquatch-1

09-20-2016, 07:05 AM

Check these out. All you do is plug in the information and it calculates the cost.

http://www.trapshooters.com/pages/rlcalcadv/
http://ultimatereloader.com/tools/reloading-costs-calculator/
http://www.handloads.com/calc/loadingCosts.asp

762 shooter

09-20-2016, 07:20 AM

+1 for NavyVet on independence.

Unless shooting becomes illegal, I can make ammunition for a long time and I don't have to ask anyone's permission or jump through hoops.

Priceless.

762

6bg6ga

09-20-2016, 07:22 AM

FISH4BUGS

09-20-2016, 07:39 AM

dilly

09-20-2016, 08:47 AM

I was going to say that I think there are some competition shooters who reload and save money that way. I think a lot of them reload while they are shooting 3000 rounds a month then when they stop competing they stop reloading and mostly go back to factory.

44man

09-20-2016, 09:07 AM

Age has the advantage. I would order a gun and have all the dies, powder, etc before the gun arrived. You gather up what you need so a new gun needs almost nothing to load for. Time takes the cost way down. To start new is expensive for sure.
Most everyone I know shoots my loads and I have them over to load and get taught how. They can use my tools and molds with instruction.
Maybe you would help a man to show him and let him load his own with your stuff, your stuff will never wear out. It all pays for itself in the end. The most I have done is to have a friend buy dies I don't have, get powder and primers and a mold. Pain is reduced. They make very precise ammo without a big outlay.
However a man that hunts should shoot a lot more all year. With aid he can do it cheaper and get better.
I shoot the .44 for a dime a shot and the .500 JRH is close to 13 cents, more powder. My rifles, 30-30 and 6.5 Swede are cheap.
I was never cheap when working, just took overtime but retired on SS I got poor so made my own tools to make my own molds out of scrap metal. Time is nothing now. I have hundreds of molds that cost a little time.
Why not help a friend? What is more important in life then friends?

sundog

09-20-2016, 09:18 AM

Casting + hand loading + shooting = mental hygiene

Three44s

09-20-2016, 09:42 AM

I always encourage shooters to take up handloading.

I also don't think much about what I spend on my craft. The way I look at it ....... I could have a bunch of beer or whisky bottles laying out back empty and my health compromised or hang out in smoke filled bars or ............ I could take up handloading ......... I did the later ......... when I was 19 years old in 1975!

I don't have kids to pass it on to but do have two fine nephews ... my brothers boys and they will get my itch if they care to and the equipment to feed it.

The oldest is 18 now and he's gonna take the bait ...... I found him a 300 RUM Rem 700 for a song and we are working up his hunting craft with it through handloads.

The bonding alone is priceless ...... once he saw his groups shrink ......... he started thinking about a 6.5 Creedmore and really long range .......

I'd say he's hooked!

He told me upon his epiphany at the target stand that he NOW understood why I handloaded instead of going store bought like his parents were to feed his guns.

In fact when I first offered to help him with that RUM ...... he commented on how much the cartridges cost and was leery of going that route ... he was thinking about going 300 Win Mag just on that basis ........ astute of course but I reminded him that he belonged to a "Handloading Family"! He brightened right up!

The rest is history ....... after some training I switched places at the press and he took over ...... towards the end I left the Man Cave and he finnished his business himself.

His younger brother is more reserved and drawn in but he also enjoys shooting and if anything, he may well be a better revolver shot right out of the box than his big brother.

I got to work on him next ......... the older one is away for now at Montana State so it's time to switch to the younger one!

I see many benefits from handloading ........ a box of shells or two per year won't cut it but that's not the point.

Three 44s

Driver33

09-20-2016, 10:12 AM

If I didn't reload an cast my own my 41mag would be a paper weight. Factory ammo locally is 50-65 dollars for 50 rounds for that gun. An 22 hornet ain't much cheaper. So I have enjoyed both an had something to do at night just by buying equipment and learning how to use it.

kmw1954

09-20-2016, 11:05 AM

In these discussions there are always those that equate the cost of time spent reloading to what they earn working. Wrong perspective and doing it for the wrong reasons in my line of thinking. If that being the case then they ought to give up hobbies and just stay working. Doesn't make a difference if it reloading, gardening, woodworking or model building. Not everything can be quantified in dollars and cents. If one equates a hobby with work then it is no longer a hobby.

Or in this sense, how much earned money was just wasted writing these posts?

I had worked from the time I was 13 until a year ago when I was forced to quit because of health issues. During that time I was so busy working/earing that I missed out on a lot of life's simpler pleasures and even just enjoying my family. Today I spend more time with my grandchildren than I did with my own children and it is making me realize what I missed and passed up.

When I'm asked about reloading I explain that I do it because I enjoy it. The saving money or being able to shoot more has no bearing on my hobby as I could just as easily be planting a garden or building bird houses.

mold maker

09-20-2016, 11:23 AM

If you need a calculator and an internet program to decide to reload or not, based on saving money, sell your guns and take up knitting.
Although some do actually save, it's rare.
Being independent, having all the rounds you want, and enjoying shooting when the shelves are bare, is the key.
How many of us are complaining about the lack of or the price of 22LR? How many of us have multiple 22s gathering dust because of it? How many lament that they can load CF ammo cheaper than buying 22s?
If it's just about saving money,forget it.
Granted I have a different perspective since I've collected tools and supplies for over 50 years. I have also bought new guns along the way that necessitated buying more dies, brass, and molds. Some have had little use and others have been constantly producing.
If I never bought another component or tool, I could make all the ammo I need, in a little more than caliber setup time. If needed I could cast any boolit needed in a couple hours.
Nope, I haven't saved a lot of money, but I have all the tools and supplies I will ever need, and they're all paid for.
Would I do it again? Ya betcha ya I would, in a half a heartbeat. The time I've spent and the joy it brought me was worth a thousand times more than the coins I've spent, and I still have it all, for all the tomorrows I have left.

fatelk

09-20-2016, 11:35 AM

You all make some great points. If I didn't cast and reload I could not afford to shoot calibers like 45-70, 8x56R, .45 Colt, .44 Mag, etc..

I also earn a lot more now than when I started reloading. If I could get overtime on a regular basis I couldn't afford to reload. The problem is that all the OT I do get has to go towards the family budget. If I placed a value on my time spent casting or loading that might be a problem, but I don't, of course, any more than a golfer does his time golfing. My current problem with time spent loading is just that there are so many more important demands on my time at this point in life.

As to my original post about it not being worth it for some people; that was only regarding those who don't shoot much and buy off the shelf components. Over a decade ago I helped a friend get set up for reloading. I found him some really inexpensive used gear to get set up well for his purposes. Several years later I bought a small estate lot of reloading tools and he talked me out of some much nicer single stage tools for cheap. Now, years later he still hasn't done anything with them. He's a good guy and a friend, but after that I'm a little leery about spending much time or effort helping someone get set up if they don't seem the type that will appreciate it as a hobby.

FISH4BUGS

09-20-2016, 12:09 PM

In these discussions there are always those that equate the cost of time spent reloading to what they earn working. Wrong perspective and doing it for the wrong reasons in my line of thinking. If that being the case then they ought to give up hobbies and just stay working. Doesn't make a difference if it reloading, gardening, woodworking or model building. Not everything can be quantified in dollars and cents. If one equates a hobby with work then it is no longer a hobby.

DING! DING! DING! We have a winner!
That hits is right on the head. Your time is the time spent doing something enjoyable. I garden, do yard work, play the Hammond B3 and do my casting/reloading/shooting thing. As a consultant to lawyers, I bill my time at $145 per hour. There is no way I could justify my hobbies if I attached a dollar value to my time. Hey....it is cheap therapy!

kmw1954

09-20-2016, 12:22 PM

My current problem with time spent loading is just that there are so many more important demands on my time at this point in life.

As to my original post about it not being worth it for some people; that was only regarding those who don't shoot much and buy off the shelf components. .

Take it from someone that's learned it the hard way. The most important time we have on this earth is the time that we can give to ourselves. Even if it is only an hr. a day. There is nothing more important or pressing than your own well being. If that means spending time with children, wife, or alone. It could even be as little as an hr. reading a forum, reloading some shells or watching a sunset. One day you too will ask yourself where did the last 30 years go.

Seems there is always time for work but never enough time for ourselves.

Agreed that those that only shoot a box or two a year are better off buying factory. In my case I would reload even if only 1k a year because I enjoy the process.

dverna

09-20-2016, 12:35 PM

My cost for 9mm using commercial cast bullets, and buying cases for $25/1000 (assume 4 loads per case) is under $5.50 per box

My cost for .223 using jacketed bullets, cases at $70/1000 (reloaded 3 times) is under $5/ box.

These are the least expensive rounds one can purchase and I am still saving money. On my other calibers, I save even more.

Heck, I even reload 12 ga and save money over the cheap stuff

Reloading may not be for the 6 box a year consumer unless he needs something special.

As others have said.....things can change quickly. Being independent is never a bad thing.

shoot-n-lead

09-20-2016, 12:44 PM

As others have said.....things can change quickly. Being independent is never a bad thing.

You are right...hard to put a price on that. Anytime I want to go shoot...I just go shoot...SOOO fortunate to be blessed with this reality.

fatelk

09-20-2016, 12:53 PM

I'm already wondering where the years have gone. My oldest is 12 and it seems like just yesterday we were bringing her home from the hospital as a tiny baby.

Last night I was on the couch reading "Notebook of Doom" to my four little ones piled on and around me. I had this weird realization that I was going to blink my eyes and they would be all grown and moved away. Raising my family and spending time with my kids is priority one at this point.

flyingmonkey35

09-20-2016, 12:59 PM

I do save a ton o cash reloading my 45 colt.

Sent from my LGLS991 using Tapatalk

44man

09-20-2016, 01:03 PM

Mine was never about money but that I could make better. I still load shotgun shells but it is far cheaper to buy them with the cost of shot. I used to get 25# bags for $5, not today. I will load the 410 still because that one is too expensive to buy. Why they cost 3X more then 12's is crazy.
.22's, out of sight! I hate to shoot my .22's now.
But being a varmint hunter back then, you could not get the accuracy from factory stuff. A revolver was a sad hunk of metal with factory. I have never been a loader, I have been a HAND LOADER and am darn proud of it.

OnHoPr

09-20-2016, 01:08 PM

My problem is if I'm going to do it I need to be efficient at it when I do it. The way my mind works is I need to automate things or change the way things are done in order to make it more efficient. Almost to the jmorris level but not quite. My attitude is the result of 20+ years in a factory where part of my job was to make things efficient.

I didn't mean to refer to your style of reloading or reloading equipment in whatever way. If your set up looks like a Camp Perry reloading operation, GREAT. When someone is really starting to ponder about getting into reloading simple tools can do the job when the ponderer only shoots 10 boxes a year of combined pistola/rifle.

When first reloading for his deer rifle after the chosen bullet types for the applications that might be addressed 3 or 4 powders or maybe a powder at a time could be gathered. "After finding the LOAD" for his rifle that load should last the rest of he ponderer's/rifle life. No more going to the store and Rems 180s aren't in stock, well I will pick up 3 boxes of Wins, and next year the only thing is available is 150 gr Feds. Along with different lots from year to year not being able to dial into that at least less than 2 MOA for the season.

With the pistola with a few different pounds of powder he/she will get in a little more trigger time and find a load that might make the pistola shine a bit more like keeping them in a 6" group a 25 yds instead of spraying a sheet of printer paper a 10 yd. This might bring the shooters box count up to 20 boxes for the year instead of a box for each of the 6 or 7 range trips for the year. Obviously it makes a difference if it is a hunting, target, or SD pistola.

After these types of scenarios are met it would be up to the shooter to really enjoy the hobby/sport of shooting and reloading or just stay in tuned with it, because of interest, economics, life time, etc. Or, really want to get competitive and proficient in shooting and reloading.

dtknowles

09-20-2016, 01:10 PM

gwpercle

09-20-2016, 01:25 PM

"I save money casting my own boolits and reloading my own ammo".....I also tell this to my wife when I buy more "stuff" ....she just smiles and tells me to enjoy myself. I don't think she believes my little lie .
I heard her telling my sister in law , " I don't mind, his little hobby keeps him off the street, away from bars and out of trouble. He goes to the shooting range, comes home and starts reloading the empties all over again. " Actually casting and reloading has been a most enjoyable hobby for 50 years. I can't stand golf so I do this.
Gary

44man

09-20-2016, 01:31 PM

The thing with factory is you need to sight in with any change so you use from the box. If done right you have some left for hunting but next year you start again. I have seen 6 different bullets and powders in factory loads listed as the same.

flyingrhino

09-20-2016, 02:15 PM

Reloading doesn't save money.....just let's me shoot a LOT more for the same amount. (my wife still thinks I do it to save money. Shhhhhhh..)

daloper

09-20-2016, 02:24 PM

Every time a box shows up it shoots a hole in my reloading to save money thing with my wife. I find it very relaxing. Recently my uncle gave me the stuff needed to get started casting my own bullets. Problem now is I really shoot a lot more. I started to reload because of the cost of factory loads for my Ruger 480. Now you cannot hardly fine them. I used to buy my bullets at the gun shows but they are hard to come by also. My second mold purchased was a Lee 400gr .476. Have some cast but no empty cases to load yet. Something I have to work on.

shoot-n-lead

09-20-2016, 03:12 PM

Reloading doesn't save money.....just let's me shoot a LOT more for the same amount. (my wife still thinks I do it to save money. Shhhhhhh..)

This makes no sense...if you shoot more for the same amount of money...reloading HAS to save money over buying ammo...otherwise, if you shot more...it would cost more.

This thing about reloading saving money is...the ammo that you produce costs less than the ammo that you buy....that is where the saving is, it is nothing to do with how much you spend shooting.

robg

09-20-2016, 04:35 PM

dtknowles

09-20-2016, 04:39 PM

This makes no sense...if you shoot more for the same amount of money...reloading HAS to save money over buying ammo...otherwise, if you shot more...it would cost more.

This thing about reloading saving money is...the ammo that you produce costs less than the ammo that you buy....that is where the saving is, it is nothing to do with how much you spend shooting.

It is all about how you manage your money or look at your cash flow. If you get to shoot more for the same amount of money you did not save any money you still spent the same amount, you just got to shoot more.

If you shoot a constant number of shots per month then reloading could save you money but if you spend a fixed amount of money on ammo each month then reloading lets you shoot more.

I suspect that most of us are not that controlled or consistent.

Tim

lightman

09-20-2016, 04:43 PM

Its not for everybody. A guy that shoots that little would never see any savings. A guy shooting competition and practicing every week nearly has to reload.

Competition is just one way that hand loading will pay for itself. Loading 700 to 1000 rounds for a Prairie Dog hunt will quickly help offset the cost of equipment. So will loading for a lot of the Magnum calibers, a box of 7STW of 300 Weatherby shells are over $80. Most of the big African rounds are expensive too. If you shoot anything obsolete reloading may be the only option that you have. Always having ammo is a good thing about hand loading too!

I agree with those that talk about the enjoyment or satisfaction that they get from reloading or casting. Its not all about saving money, although thats possible. I've never had a factory load where I could not beat the accuracy with my hand loads. Some were very good, but usually mine easily beats them.

dtknowles

09-20-2016, 04:50 PM

I started reloading to save money ,I would have gone broke years ago shooting factory stuff.wife bought me a mold for my birthday years ago ,that saved me even more money so I could shoot as much as I wanted almost .if you only shoot a few rounds a year there is no point in reloading unless you want the ability to get really accurate ammunition for your guns and enjoy the process of hand loading.

You can't buy factory ammo for 5 of my rifles and for three others I mostly shoot cast bullets that the factory does not load. I started hand loading as an educational and hobby activity as a teen. It let me then buy guns that only a handloader could shoot and shoot cast as an exercise in independence. I think of hand loading as an expression of an attitude the money thing is just a side benefit. You know, someone at the range asks you if you load your own ammo and you tell them you cast your own bullets too :-) If you shoot a quarter moa group, it goes without saying you loaded your own ammo.

Tim

higgins

09-20-2016, 04:56 PM

Whenever I've been asked about reloading by someone who identifies himself as a casual shooter, deer hunter, etc., I haven't encouraged them to consider reloading unless they're willing to start slow with a single stage press and basic equipment to learn the process. Better than going overboard with equipment and then finding out you don't like reloading. I've also stressed that a reloader must have the right mentality - the willingness to go slow, study the manuals, and understand every step of the process before they attempt to load the first round. If they have the patience, OK, but if they're the impulsive, hurried sort then reloading is not for them. Enjoying the process is more important than financial considerations.

With pistol ammo, the same principles regarding attitude and learning the process apply, but a progressive press may be in order later if they shoot a lot. In summary, I see reloading as an activity that enriches the shooting hobby, sort of like building fishing rods and lures, tying flies, etc. adds to fishing enjoyment. It's very seldom a financial decision.

mozeppa

09-20-2016, 05:14 PM

not me baby!!

i reload to stock up for the zombie apocalypse!

RogerDat

09-20-2016, 10:42 PM

On the equipment a lot of it is going to hold value well, keep it long enough and it might even increase in value as new items cost more. At the extremes it won't hold value as well. Too inexpensive won't be worth buying used except for cheap, think used $20 Lee molds. On the other end the top of the line equipment is a specialty market with fewer buyers. Good Chevy pickup lot easier to find a buyer for than a loaded Range Rover. Some of the Dillon progressive equipment or magna melters and molds might be slipping toward the Range Rover end of the market. Lot of folks will buy a 20# Lee or Lyman pot. Same for a single stage or turret press, dies vary a bit but won't lose much value. If you call the use you got rental and subtract the resale I would say a lot of the equipment will be used for years for just a few bucks a year.

Not sure if my widow or kids will be the ones to decide what to keep and what goes in the estate sale, or maybe age or health will cause me to sell off the surplus stuff. Bench might remain after I'm gone with a reduced inventory and equipment. Doesn't matter there will be a return that goes a long way toward offsetting the original cost of equipment.

You figure a used 4 hole turret press is going to go for less than $75 - $80 even after I use it for years? New one works the same and costs $100 so I get to use for cost of $20 - $25 for how ever many years. Maybe I throw in an extra disk.

NavyVet1959

09-20-2016, 11:56 PM

You figure a used 4 hole turret press is going to go for less than $75 - $80 even after I use it for years? New one works the same and costs $100 so I get to use for cost of $20 - $25 for how ever many years. Maybe I throw in an extra disk.

If you're going to figure it that way, then you need to also figure in the loss return on investment for the money you might get if you invested it in stocks or whatever and the decreased value of the dollar in the future.

I would just as well not calculate it to that detail though since it might give me a number I didn't like and then I would have to add more to the "convenience factor" portion of the equation to get the value that I want to get out of the equation. :)

Blackwater

09-21-2016, 12:45 AM

Butchman, Navy Vet and some others have great points. There's nothing quite as therapeutic as doing something useful and productive when we're "down." Even the dullest among us can't miss the value of real usefulness! And Vet has it right about the situations we face in an uncertain future. And those who are prepared will .... well, they'll be prepared. Those who haven't put up some stores against real eventualities these days will very possibly wind up ruing their failure to be prepared. The Boy Scouts had it right long ago - "Be prepared!" But many take the "easy way out," even if it winds up being the hardest in the end. It's just a plain and simple choice we all have to make. All else is just window dressing on that.

kmw1954

09-21-2016, 12:50 AM

If you ask me you guys are way over analyzing this. Think I'll just go to the bench and enjoy myself.

Butchman205

09-21-2016, 01:02 AM

"I can't stand golf so I do this.
Gary

The only golf I've ever seriously enjoyed, is our "Nowhere, Bama" brand of golf...which is played in old abandoned strip coal mines in our area. Most of the abandoned coal strip mines in our area are now leased for deer hunting and/ shooting. (We don't just go to a place that looks good and start blasting)

Step 1-Hit a golf ball as far as you want...then shoot same golf ball (when it stops) with a rifle, shotgun, pistol, etc-you get one point.
Everyone gets a "turn" then you start over. The farther you hit a ball, the harder it is to shoot.

Step 2-hit a ball farther than the last time you successfully hit then shot it-get another point.

Whoever has the most points at the end of the game wins.

-Butchman

NavyVet1959

09-21-2016, 01:29 AM

The only golf I've ever seriously enjoyed, is our "Nowhere, Bama" brand of golf...which is played in old abandoned strip coal mines in our area. Most of the abandoned coal strip mines in our area are now leased for deer hunting and/ shooting. (We don't just go to a place that looks good and start blasting)

Step 1-Hit a golf ball as far as you want...then shoot same golf ball (when it stops) with a rifle, shotgun, pistol, etc-you get one point.
Everyone gets a "turn" then you start over. The farther you hit a ball, the harder it is to shoot.

Step 2-hit a ball farther than the last time you successfully hit then shot it-get another point.

Whoever has the most points at the end of the game wins.

Surely there are some rules that include beer consumption for missed shots...

Here's one that could make that a bit more interesting:

http://www.losapos.com/pics/06/openpit07.jpg

6bg6ga

09-21-2016, 06:49 AM

Its an investment for sure. Reloading to cut the cost of shooting? You'll be able to pay it back when? These are questions you may ask yourself before purchasing the base essentials for reloading. The truth is its going to take a lot of time to re-coup the cost involved in reloading. You can buy some cheap Lee stuff as mentioned in a post above. You can buy cheap used stuff for example the used and abused Lee stuff. Bottom line here and something I learned after watching my father who is no longer with us anymore is you can justify buying the bottom feeder type equipment when you actually wanted the top of the line. You buy the bottom feeder piece you have it 6 months to a year and then you step up and buy the middle end piece and your satisfied for a while and then you finally purchase the top of the line piece that you wanted in the first place. In the mean time you have spent $$$$$ number of dollars purchasing pieces you really didn't want. Don't do this!!! Buy the equipment that you really want the first go around and you will end up spending less in the long run. No sense in purchasing a Lee when you really had your heart set on a Dillon or a Hornady piece. Reloading is an investment and while I complain about spending $$$$ for the Ballisti-cast Mark IV bullet caster it is head and shoulders above the Lee 20lb melting drip o matic or even the Magma bullet caster that uses the single mold in my opinion. The caster cost a lot of money and ask me some day after I have cast 10K bullets in one setting how I really feel about that purchase. My shelves are full of one and three lb coffee containers containing bullets ready to be sized and lubed. Next lets talk sizers..you can purchase the ebay used 450 units that have you doing a set the bullet and up and down stroke and then lift the bullet back out or you can purchase a Star/Magma sizer lubricator and make one simple movement having added the bullet feeder assembly. So, you can buy cheap or buy more expensive pieces and the trade off is time spent making and reloading bullets. You can crank out 16-20 a minute with a Dillon 650 with a bullet dropper and a case collator or you can reload on a RCBS rock chucker or a primitive Lee press. I don't think a person ever breaks even with the costs but its more of a "I can make my own and have them ready to use when there are ammo shortages.

FISH4BUGS

09-21-2016, 07:17 AM

There's nothing quite as therapeutic as doing something useful and productive when we're "down." Even the dullest among us can't miss the value of real usefulness!

My significant other calls my casting and reloading "man knitting". She does have a point - we sit in our casting/reloading area and produce something of usefulness and value.
Just like a knitter - they make blankets, sweaters, etc. We make ammo.
2 manic casting sessions (this past Saturday night and all day rainy Sunday) produced some 1100 44 250 swc bullets from a 2 cavity RCBS mould. I sized and lubed all of them last night in about 2 hours on the Star sizer. They are ready to reload into light 44 mag loads - 8gr 231.
I will bump a few up to test 9gr and see how a few shoot.
The point is that we enjoy the time, relax and make something productive.
I used to have small 16' Amesury Skiff rigged out as a lobster boat in Portsmouth Harbor. I fished about 25 traps by hand - no hauler.
By the end of a summer lobster cost me probably $40 a lb what with bait, fuel, lost gear, a blown outboard motor, etc. I could have BOUGHT lobster for $6 a lb off the boats but that was not the point. But there was never a shortage of lobster around my house.
It was the relaxation time and the pleasure of the task at hand. Maintaining the gear, cooking up the lobsters, hauling, baiting and setting the traps and simply going out on the water and the whole process.....THAT is what casting and reloading is all about for me.
A pleasurable activity that produces something of value.

NavyVet1959

09-21-2016, 07:21 AM

It's always nice to have a single stage press around even if you eventually move up to a progressive press.

Besides, it gives you better fundamentals staring with a single stage press instead of a progressive where multiple things are all happening at once.

I have an RCBS single stage, a Lee turret, and a Dillon progressive. Each serve a different purpose for reloading. For low volume calibers (e.g. .300 WinMag, .45-70, .45 SUPER +P+, 10mm max loads, etc), I'm more likely to use the Lee turret than the Dillon. For high volume calibers (e.g. 9x19, .45 ACP, etc), then the Dillon progressive is a better choice.

toallmy

09-21-2016, 07:32 AM

I quickly recovered my start up cost in the mid 80s by loading my own rifle ammo on a single stage , and have been reinvesting it every since . So I'm just spending what I have saved . That is what I tell myself , so I let my wife handle the house budget .

NavyVet1959

09-21-2016, 07:35 AM

Ole Joe Clarke

09-21-2016, 07:44 AM

I hope I have recovered the cost of equipment, if not, that's ok. I sure have enjoyed shooting over the last 40 years or so. I quit for a while, if I hadn't saved my tooling I would never be able to get back into it now since the prices have soared. Shot several thousand pistol rounds and had tons of fun shooting with friends. I quit counting at 12k.

Have a blessed day,

Leon

trapper9260

09-21-2016, 07:46 AM

+1 for NavyVet on independence.

Unless shooting becomes illegal, I can make ammunition for a long time and I don't have to ask anyone's permission or jump through hoops.

Priceless.

762I am with the both of you on this also. Also I look at it like trapping, with the fur price being down I know I will not make much on it but for the traps I know i got them paid for and what I do get helps some but it is a hobby for me like reloading and not have someone tell me I can not get the ammo I want or have to pay the high price for it when they want to jack up the price of ammo when they feel like to. Also I can make up my own rounds to suite me like reduce rounds and casting open that door more for me.

toallmy

09-21-2016, 08:29 AM

I'll tell her to put all my stuff on cast boolits cheap to pass it on ,

acoop101

09-21-2016, 12:08 PM

I have always told people you do not save one dime reloading, you just shoot a whole lot more with the money you have budgeted.

Sent from my XT1565 using Tapatalk

kmw1954

09-21-2016, 02:45 PM

My question still is why is it that some people insist on quantifying everything they do? Why can't they just enjoy their pass-times and life in general?

High end equipment, low end equipment, used equipment. One press, 9 presses. Does it really make a difference if you are enjoying yourself? Why should we care what or how much equipment someone is using if it fills their needs. Are we really equipment snobs? If someone is having difficulties with a pc. of equipment we should offer help not criticism because we think their stuff is junk, cheap, inferior garbage.

I stated earlier that I would reload for myself even if it was only 1k rounds a year because I enjoy it. I don't do it because I have to! I could easily spend the same amount of money sitting in the bar looking at pretty women or drunk old men. How many here have gone to a Casino and left broke telling themselves "that was fun"?

OnHoPr

09-21-2016, 02:56 PM

not me baby!!

i reload to stock up for the zombie apocalypse!

Not to many reasons better than that.

I guess it is like sitting around the table at deer camp. One has a 742, one has 700, one has a 336, one has a 1300, one has a sporterized milsurp, they must all have different opinions on weaponry and personalized hunting tactics.

I can't fathom the concept of trying to talk a casual shooter that is pondering reloading with top of the line stuff when there is so much knowledge to try to comprehend starting out. It's like wanting your Masters after your first semester in your Freshman year. I went to a gun show a few years back. I seen a single stage RCBS for $45. I picked up a Kg jug of AC 2460 for $5. I bought a two die set of 270 win for $2 that had a slight burr that needed a little red scotchbrite. There were a few boxes of vintage Sierra 270 130 spitzers for like $12. If you didn't have brass of your own for you own gun, strange, you could have picked up a bag of 50 once fired 270 brass for $10,. Then pick up a 100 pack of primers for $3 or so. Let's add that up. 45, 5, 2, 12, 10, and 3 comes up to $77, add a primer pocket scrape, a neck brush, lee case trimmer, bottle of lube and for about $90 you got five boxes of shells. That is savings and your preliminary start up for your first steps in reloading. The price per box goes down from there for the casual shooter that is looking for good consistent loads for the life of the shooter/rifle combo. Afterwards if more interest is gained then go to the next step.

I don't know about you, but it takes me 6 to 8 hrs to shoot 100 rounds long gun at the DNR range. CBA shoots with the 200 yd range included takes over 4 to 6 hrs, how many rounds is that? How many do you need to make for a range trip or how many range trips do you make being a casual shooter pondering on getting into to it more.

As for Lee, well I suppose that depends on your concepts of shooting like my opening statement suggest. Does the question of accuracy, convenience, chest pounding, production of, economics, or what comes into question. As for the molds I have experienced 1/2 MOA, the boolits have killed deer, their dies seem satisfactory, the factory crimp die works good, now the case prep is nothing like a RCBS or better case prep station, I still use the Wilson punch system for the single stage press duties, their primer systems aren't to bad for the intermediate loader. Though, if I knew back in the '70s what I know now I would have picked up a 222 rem mag, 243, 7 x 57, 280, 06, 300 win mag, and maybe a few more cals of the Lee Target Loader. That simple little inexpensive loading tool has shot a few world records, so that is saying something. I would have used it for just hunting loads.

I read a hunting story in a book back in the '70s that a man and his son got invited to a more up scale deer camp. They needed to borrow a couple of bolt action shotguns and bought some slugs for the trip. The setting of the camp was leather patched elbow shirts, Crown Royal, Borkum Riff, Griffin & Howe, 54's, BLR, BAR, and higher end custom mausers, bridge card playing, etc. etc. After the week at camp the only ones to get their bucks were the son and the father with the borrowed bolt shotguns. I guess you can read whatever the story was trying to say or any undetermined concepts.

toallmy

09-21-2016, 03:02 PM

I would load my own , if I only had one gun and shot 20 rounds a year . I did that is what I did when I started , but it grows if you like it . A lot of people enjoy loading on a single stage hand weighting powder charge , I do all my rifle loading like that , and until I started casting it worked for the handguns to . It was just last year I thought the little dandy would be able to keep up with my handgun loading .

castalott

09-21-2016, 03:51 PM

hmmm... We are all here for a short while.... We don't take any of this stuff with us when we go. Your life is actually the sum of your experiences. If you are not hurting anything else...have fun. I don't want to sit in a bar, drinking beer, watching football... Nothing wrong with it but it's just not me. This hobby keeps me thinking.... YMMV

Lead pot

09-21-2016, 04:17 PM

To reload or not reload depends on how or what you shoot.
for me it is a necessity for the calibers I shoot. I cant go to the local sporting goods shop and buy my ammunition, hech most have never heard of the calibers I shoot at matches or just busting bowling pins. Till just a few years ago I could not even buy cases for my .44-90 Sharps (.44-2-5/8 Bn) and a few others, like the .44-75 Ballard. A few places you can buy some of the old calibers like Buffalo Arms but the shells will run from $84. to $140. a box of 20 for some I shoot.
In June when I take off for a couple matches, (three) I take a bunch of rounds, 1500 plus and I still run out and have to get out the Lyman 310 tool or drag out the trailer hitch bench and reload.
These two buckets of empty brass is just from three matches. I have to reload to compete in what I enjoy.

Back in the 60's the bench rest game bit me. Well I could not buy the quality bullets I wanted to use in .22 and .30 calibers so I swaged them. You do for what your needs are.
But for reloading or not, well if you only shoot occasionally it would be cost efficient to but factory ammo. I still have boxes of 100 bullets with a $3.60 price tag stuck on them. Those days are gone. :)

http://i704.photobucket.com/albums/ww43/Kurtalt/c079706d-58f3-425c-82a9-aa92af1b4518_zpswgl7zh3u.jpg (http://s704.photobucket.com/user/Kurtalt/media/c079706d-58f3-425c-82a9-aa92af1b4518_zpswgl7zh3u.jpg.html)http://i704.photobucket.com/albums/ww43/Kurtalt/IMG_2409_zpsguk6uk5d.jpg (http://s704.photobucket.com/user/Kurtalt/media/IMG_2409_zpsguk6uk5d.jpg.html)

B. Lumpkin

09-21-2016, 05:52 PM

It will cost me $251 worth of components to load my batch of 500 308 Winchester this weekend.

3.16 lbs BL-C(2)
500 Hornady 168 BTHP match bullets
500 LC LR 1X fired brass same headstamp
500 Primers

I can buy 500 rds of WPA steel case 140 gr ammo for less than that, BUT my loads are tuned to my gun through much development. It is match grade.

SO comparing apples to apples I would have to buy 500 rds of Hornady Match 168 gr BTHP ammo at $26.99 per 20.

$26.99*25= $674.75

$674.75
-$251.00
$423.75 savings.

THAT is why I reload. I can reload match quality ammunition for a little more than the cost of bargain basement plinking fodder.

09-21-2016, 05:54 PM

If it will make anyone feel better break down the cost of a deer.

fatelk

09-21-2016, 06:14 PM

If it will make anyone feel better break down the cost of a deer.

:) For me venison stopped being affordable long ago, why I haven't hunted in over 15 years. I didn't particularly enjoy hunting, myself (I know- Heresy!) and the cost of licenses and tags, time and fuel, etc. just made it unfeasible for me. For those that enjoy it, more power to them! Do something you enjoy AND fill the freezer, how can you go wrong?

6bg6ga

09-21-2016, 06:49 PM

B. Lumpkin

09-21-2016, 06:52 PM

6bg6ga

09-21-2016, 06:53 PM

If it will make anyone feel better break down the cost of a deer.

That is why I buy cheap hamburger from Fareway. Breaking it down....costs of the firearm, ammunition, hunting gear, transportation to and from the site and last but not least your time. Probably about $25-30 a Lb.

6bg6ga

09-21-2016, 06:55 PM

It amortized long ago. I reckon if you take the initial cost of the equipment and divide it by the many rds it has loaded (over 100,000), then I reckon you can add a nickel to my final total, lol.

You must not have much equipment or what you have is rather Spartan.

kmw1954

09-21-2016, 07:02 PM

It paid for itself long ago. I reckon if you take the initial cost of the equipment and divide it by the many rds it has loaded (over 100,000), then I reckon you can add a nickel to my final total, lol.

Don't forget to add in the cost of the lights in the room, the AC or heat, cost to run the tumbler, vibrator, media, lubes and cleaning supplies and the radio if you have one. Let's not forget the internet connection to look up load data.

B. I believe you'd be hand loading no matter what the cost!

B. Lumpkin

09-21-2016, 07:03 PM

You must not have much equipment or what you have is rather Spartan.

Not the case at all. I bought good equipment with hard cash, no credit. It loads quality ammo. The Dillon 550 and Redding T-7 are all I have ever needed in presses. Add in dies, shell plates, this and that, etc. Even with all that, with the amount of ammo I have loaded, the presses have paid for themselves...over and over again.

Let say I have loaded 15,000 rds of 308 ammo with a cost savings of $847.56 per 1,000 rds over factory ammo. $847.56*15= $12,713.00 saved. My equipment outlay over these years is less than $2,000.00.

B. Lumpkin

09-21-2016, 07:04 PM

Don't forget to add in the cost of the lights in the room, the AC or heat, cost to run the tumbler, vibrator, media, lubes and cleaning supplies and the radio if you have one. Let's not forget the internet connection to look up load data.

B. I believe you'd be hand loading no matter what the cost!

True story!! Heck, I believe I may just sell off all my stuff and get 2,000 rds of 168 gr FGMM with the proceeds, lol.

fatelk

09-21-2016, 08:28 PM

My question still is why is it that some people insist on quantifying everything they do? Why can't they just enjoy their pass-times and life in general?
Human nature, I guess. Some folks do and some don't. Some people keep meticulous detailed records of how many rounds they fire through each gun, how many times each case has been fired, etc., and think people are crazy that don't (I don't). I have a friend who keeps detailed records of every gallon of fuel, every mile driven, and any and all maintenance on his 1980 Volkswagen Rabbit. I guess he just likes to.

My philosophy for this kind of thing is: If you enjoy it, do it. Don't worry about the time and/or savings. If you at least don't mind it, do it if you figure it's worth your time. If you don't like it, it's a chore and you have better uses for your time, you're better off buying bullets or factory ammo.

I quit calculating to the penny what it costs me to load anything a long time ago. Actually I did calculate it for 9mm recently to show a friend what it was like. He then proceeded to ask me if I could load up a thousand rounds for him for $37.

I then had to explain that that price didn't include the time it took me to scrounge all that brass out of the gravel at the range after they'd had a match the day before, the time it took me to sort and process it, the time it took to pick 18lbs of lead off the berm, sort and process it, cast, lube and size the bullets, and then finally load up the rounds! Heck, figuring any reasonable hourly rate, I guess I can't afford to load 9mm for myself! The cost really becomes irrelevant after a point.

JWFilips

09-21-2016, 08:36 PM

The cost of reloading is very inexpensive ....The cost of the "I want / I need" factor is astronomical!

GhostHawk

09-21-2016, 09:43 PM

Well I can't speak for his equipment costs but I can for mine.

I don't have a dillion, my main press is a 70$ Lee Hand press. It paid for itself long ago. I do have 2 other presses that I bought for a song here, both lee.

My Molds are about 2/3rds Lee 2 cavity that IMO pay for themselves with the first 100 boolits made. The rest are Lee 6 cavity that would take more to repay, but they rain boolits. Call it somewhere between 3-500 boolits.
I do have a RCBS powder measure but it was bought in a kit back in the 80's. Same for my scale. That money is long since forgotten.

Compared to many of you I reload on a shoestring. But it works. I do not need volumes of loaded ammo. When I reload 9mm I try to do 3-400 rounds and I figure that will last me 2-3 years.

The game as I see it is not how many you can shoot. It is crafting and designing your own loads to fit your firearms and get reasonably good accuracy out of them. When I see cloverleafs I figure I am doing something right.

I have shot my .45acp and 9mm pistols enough to have decent skills. I will continue to shoot them a couple of times a year to keep those skills fresh. But I find I enjoy shooting .22lr in semi auto pistols much more than the bigger noisier stuff. This was shot at 20 feet. 5 shots just below center, adjusted Red Dot, 6 rounds dead center. Ok that looks good.
Then placed 3 colored dots at 12, 4 and 8. Game was to keep it fast, go around the clock. Started at 8 and 4 got 1 more round, 10 total in about 10 seconds. Challenge was to pick up the target, shoot, adjust shoot as fast as I could.

For me when I start doing stuff like this and it looks like this, well that is major fun kicking in right there. That is chits and giggles all the way home. That is call up the shooting buddy and watch him turn green when he see's it. That works for me, YMMV

It is just more fun.177179

NavyVet1959

09-21-2016, 10:34 PM

Don't forget to add in the cost of the lights in the room, the AC or heat, cost to run the tumbler, vibrator, media, lubes and cleaning supplies and the radio if you have one. Let's not forget the internet connection to look up load data.

B. I believe you'd be hand loading no matter what the cost!

And more importantly, don't forget to add the cost of the beer you drink while reloading or casting... :)

Life's too short to drink crappy beer, so my ammo costs are a bit high...

starmac

09-21-2016, 11:47 PM

I am one of them guys that will never save the first penny casting or reloading. I have bought waaaaay more stuff to think I will ever shoot enough to make it pay for itself.
When I started waaaay back in high school I was in it to save money and did, I think my lee whack a mole cost me a whole 10 bucks, add powder and primers and my own spent brass. I don't remember the total cost to get started but it was probably under 23 bucks or so, and was a nessaccity at the time to shoot my rifle as much as I did.
Now it is mainly the idea, that if I need it, I have it at my finger tips.

NavyVet1959

09-22-2016, 12:17 AM

As hobbies go, reloading and collecting firearms is comparatively inexpensive. Probably the most expensive hobby is collecting EX-wives... That is a pretty quick way to lose 50% on your investment... :)

NoZombies

09-22-2016, 12:33 AM

I cast and reload for several reasons, cost savings over factory ammo is one of them, but self sufficiency is a big one.

I like being able to do things myself. I work on my own cars (mostly), I grow some of my own food, do my own home repairs, and load my own ammo. If I buy the tools I need to do something right the first time, I have them the next time it needs done as well.

Idaho45guy

09-22-2016, 12:45 AM

:) For me venison stopped being affordable long ago, why I haven't hunted in over 15 years. I didn't particularly enjoy hunting, myself (I know- Heresy!) and the cost of licenses and tags, time and fuel, etc. just made it unfeasible for me. For those that enjoy it, more power to them! Do something you enjoy AND fill the freezer, how can you go wrong?

My dad shot a moose last year that yielded 425lbs of packaged meat. Tag and license $50. Weeks worth of food and liquor for camp $150. Gas to camp and back $50. processing cost was about $2.00 per pound(depending on sausage vs. burger) so $850 in processing. Not counting cost of gear which includes ATVs, generator, etc, etc...

So, for a cost of $1050 for $425 pounds of meat, that is about $2.50 a lb for premium moose meat, which is a bargain. Memories are priceless.

However, for me to go over and hunt deer and elk in Idaho, I have to pay outrageous prices for non-resident license and tags. For me to buy a tag and license is $571.50. Add into that the cost of processing and expenses, and it is insane to try and justify the expense vs. commercial meat.

NavyVet1959

09-22-2016, 01:01 AM

I like being able to do things myself. I work on my own cars (mostly), I grow some of my own food, do my own home repairs, and load my own ammo. If I buy the tools I need to do something right the first time, I have them the next time it needs done as well.

Assuming you can *find* them... :)

That's the reason that many of have multiple hammers that are all basically alike... Can't find it when you need it, so go buy another one.

I'm currently in the process of replacing the hot water heater that is in my attic. My old one apparently has a small leak since the pan underneath it gets a small amount of water in it. It's not a major leak, otherwise I would be a lot more aggressive getting the hot water heater replaced. It's not that difficult to do, so I don't want to pay someone to do it. Especially since some of these people charge $300-500 just for the labor of replacing it. I moved the new water heater up into the attic the other day. That's a bit of a pain to do since it's just bulky and the balance is not right to try to carry it up the ladder. It's still a bit warm up there since we have 9 months of summer around her, so I'll probably wait until it cools down a bit. We supposedly have a storm coming down in a few days, so that should keep it a bit cooler up there since the rain will keep the roof from heating up so much.

Hick

09-22-2016, 01:27 AM

I have a spreadsheet in which I put all my records of reloads (so I know how many times each set of brass has been used). As a sideline, for each cartridge, I put in the cost of factory ammo of each type (I use Walmart prices). I also records the cost of the bullets and lead I buy, powder, primers, reloading equipment, casting equipment, etc. My spreadsheet gives me a running total of how much the shooting I have done would have cost me if I only used factory ammo, and how much it actually cost me by casting/reloading. Since I started keeping records, I have spent $13,200 keeping my five rifles and one pistol in ammo. If I had bought the ammo at Walmart and never bought any reloading or casting equipment I would have spent $19,100. Of course, without this great hobby I probably would have shot less ammo-- and had lots less fun.

OS OK

09-22-2016, 01:41 AM

Boys I'll tellya...I save so much money by reloading and casting...well, I have to use a 55 gallon drum for a Piggy Bank!

When they get full I stack them out in the Barn!

:bigsmyl2:

flyingmonkey35

09-22-2016, 10:24 AM

In my mind handloading is a hobby, reloading is a financial enterprise. I don't see how filling the bins and pulling the handle on a progressive press would be considered a hobby. Casting bullets with a one or two cavity mold would be a hobby but a 6 cavity mold is production. Hey, if you do it for fun great, if you do it to save money or shoot more great if you want to buy your ammo great. If all you want to do is come here and talk about it, that is fine too. Some of us are different and some of us are the same.

Tim
Tim,

Isn't that like saying shooting isn't a hobby. If its with a semi automatic?

It's a hobby if you do it for fun.

If not then it's a chore.

I didn't mean to refer to your style of reloading or reloading equipment in whatever way. If your set up looks like a Camp Perry reloading operation, GREAT. When someone is really starting to ponder about getting into reloading simple tools can do the job when the ponderer only shoots 10 boxes a year of combined pistola/rifle.

When first reloading for his deer rifle after the chosen bullet types for the applications that might be addressed 3 or 4 powders or maybe a powder at a time could be gathered. "After finding the LOAD" for his rifle that load should last the rest of he ponderer's/rifle life. No more going to the store and Rems 180s aren't in stock, well I will pick up 3 boxes of Wins, and next year the only thing is available is 150 gr Feds. Along with different lots from year to year not being able to dial into that at least less than 2 MOA for the season.

With the pistola with a few different pounds of powder he/she will get in a little more trigger time and find a load that might make the pistola shine a bit more like keeping them in a 6" group a 25 yds instead of spraying a sheet of printer paper a 10 yd. This might bring the shooters box count up to 20 boxes for the year instead of a box for each of the 6 or 7 range trips for the year. Obviously it makes a difference if it is a hunting, target, or SD pistola.

After these types of scenarios are met it would be up to the shooter to really enjoy the hobby/sport of shooting and reloading or just stay in tuned with it, because of interest, economics, life time, etc. Or, really want to get competitive and proficient in shooting and reloading.

Sent from my LGLS991 using Tapatalk

OS OK

09-22-2016, 11:21 AM

dtknowles

09-22-2016, 11:39 AM

Tim,

Isn't that like saying shooting isn't a hobby. If its with a semi automatic?

It's a hobby if you do it for fun.

If not then it's a chore.

Sent from my LGLS991 using Tapatalk

Yep, sort of. Shooting automatics can be a hobby its not what you shoot with or reload with, it is why you do it. I don't consider you analogy really appropriate sort of apples to oranges.

If you do it for fun it is a hobby if you do it for money it's like a job.

I find running a progressive press more like a job.

I find shooting automatics fun and never like a job.

I find casting bullets satisfying but never fun. I do it for the feelings of self-sufficiency and to experiment which is something I like doing. I like the testing not the making. If I had a slave to cast my bullet to my orders that would be awesome.

I expect most people use progressives to make more ammo to save more money not because running a progressive is fun but maybe I am wrong and some people might find running a progressive press fun. I will admit it is quicker to make a thousand rounds on my progressive than to do it with my single stage press but it is also more stressful. I would rather spend a couple hours at the single stage press than a couple hours at the progressive but the progressive will make more ammo and I find the shooting more fun than the loading so I have a progressive press.

Like I said we are not all the same and that is ok.

Tim

dtknowles

09-22-2016, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by dtknowles http://castboolits.gunloads.com/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?p=3783506#post3783506)
In my mind handloading is a hobby, reloading is a financial enterprise.

Well sorta...actually, 'handloading' is done by a fella that manufacturers his own boolits and sometimes powder or repurposes the brass into other calibers, makes as much as he can master...whereas, 'reloading' is a fella that 'assembles' his rounds from store-bought components.
Both are hobbies and means of bartering for more necessities.

I think you can hand load with purchased powder and bullets. I think it is about the care and purpose that goes with the loading. Hand loaded ammo, every round it as crafted treasure, precision made to the highest standards, intended to perform to the highest levels of ballistics or accuracy. Might be made with bullets purchased but where each bullet alone cost more than regular factory ammo. Hand loaded ammo it customized to the firearm and maybe even the weather or range conditions.

Tim

B. Lumpkin

09-22-2016, 12:31 PM

FISH4BUGS

09-22-2016, 12:37 PM

Shooting automatics can be a hobby its not what you shoot with or reload with, it is why you do it.
Shooting machine guns almost FORCES us to cast and reload. We look for productivity - 4 to 10 cavity moulds, Star Sizers, progressive presses.
Hey....if you are going to shoot then SHOOT! Flip the happy switch and go trigger down until the magazine is empty.
But I think you are speaking of semi-automatics.

FISH4BUGS

09-22-2016, 12:40 PM

My progressive is fun, lol. I don't need to load 1,000 rds at a time. I set up the progressive for large runs, but I may only go pull the handle for an hour per night for a week. 300-400 rds a night over a week fills up the larders for the guns in an easy and non-stressful way.
There ya go. Perfect!
I hate set up time. I tend to cast in one or two hour sessions (unless I have a rainy Sunday then I might go all day), size for one or two hour sessions, set up the Dillon 550 and load for an hour or two. Pretty soon you have thousands of perfect cast bullet reloads capable of winning beauty contests!

dragon813gt

09-22-2016, 01:01 PM

All my purchases are itemized in Quicken. I can you tell how much I've spent on everything. Most here say I'm crazy for doing this. I like to know where every penny goes.

Could I have bought pallets of ammo w/ what I've spent, absolutely. Buying ammo is all well and good until it's not on the shelves anymore. I reload so I'm independent. Once you have a supply laid in you have lots of time to replace what you've used. If your dependent on stores for your ammo you're at their mercy. Can't exactly replace what you use if there is none to buy.

9w1911

09-22-2016, 01:02 PM

I look at it like this, I can sit down and load as many cartridges I want (within reason, so lets say a session for me is 400 cartridges), in any of the calibers I own.
So I just loaded about 400 and counting 7.62x54r, all brass cases, a myriad of boolits and powder configurations. When I look down and see 200 rounds of replicated Finnish ww2 ammo I ask myself how much these 200 rounds cost retail, and I think about how I get everything, mostly purchased here or on one other gun forum so I never paid retail.
Yes it is cheaper than the store but the act of just reloading is enough to make it worth it.

*I do buy powder retail, face to face, from people here in Reno, you name it. Primers I try to get on sale, and I am always looking for lead.

dtknowles

09-22-2016, 01:04 PM

Shooting machine guns almost FORCES us to cast and reload. We look for productivity - 4 to 10 cavity moulds, Star Sizers, progressive presses.
Hey....if you are going to shoot then SHOOT! Flip the happy switch and go trigger down until the magazine is empty.
But I think you are speaking of semi-automatics.

Not necesscarily but it does make the case that some people load to shoot not just because they enjoy the loading. If "Shooting machine guns almost FORCES us to cast and reload." then that is a money thing since with enough money you could feed machine guns factory ammo :-)

Tim

runfiverun

09-22-2016, 01:08 PM

hand loading is when you use new brass.
reloading is the second etc. time around on those cases.

I could buy an awful lot of ammo for the price of the tools I have in the metallic reloading room. [never mind the powder, cases, bullets, and primers]
I could buy a lot more for what's in the shot shell presses.
[never mind the hulls, shot, wads, primers]
and I could topple the shelves buying even more for what I have in casting gear.
[never mind the lead and tin]
not even gonna discuss the swaging tools, jackets, and presses.

it's just what I do and will continue doing so until I can't do it anymore.

OS OK

09-22-2016, 01:18 PM

R5R...wanna borrow a good 55 gallon drum for a Piggy Bank for savings?

tiger762

09-22-2016, 01:24 PM

It definitely gives one opportunity to expand into less-trafficked aspects of ammunition loading. Like, reloading Berdan-primed brass, powder coating, swaging, heck, even powder coating swaged lead. I use a Lee 223 WSSM sizer die to extrude 0.257" lead wire. Of one thing I am certain, being "cheap" is false economy in the long run. Spend the money. Live happy. Won't take any of it with you...

Shooting machine guns almost FORCES us to cast and reload.]

kmw1954

09-22-2016, 01:47 PM

If you do it for fun it is a hobby if you do it for money it's like a job.

I expect most people use progressives to make more ammo to save more money not because running a progressive is fun but maybe I am wrong and some people might find running a progressive press fun.

Like I said we are not all the same and that is ok.

Tim

Tim, Like you said we are Not all the same.

I have a few hobbies that I enjoy and have also enjoyed making some money from those hobbies. All it does is help offset the cost of me enjoying that or other hobbies. There is no clock to punch, no timeline to keep, no one breathing down my neck to get it done. Whether I made a dime or lost a dime makes no difference as I still enjoyed myself. Still had pride and sense of accomplishment when I was finished.

I am using a progressive and yes some of the reason was to save money but it wasn't on the finished product, bullets..
I bought this press used. Paid less for this press, complete with dies and powder measure, than I could find just a nice used single stage press w/o dies and measure. So yes my initial outlay was greatly reduced. If I could have found a single stage or turret press for the same money I would have bought it and would have been just as happy.

See I knew when I started this just a few months ago that I would only be loading small amounts at a time so any press would have worked for me. It just worked out that the progressive got me restarted for the least amount of investment. I have since also found a used RCBS JR3 press that I paid very little for and will use that to work up loads were I am only loading 10-15 test rounds.

In many of these topics I see the comment made, "pay once, cry once". I find that may work for some but not all. I believe many new loaders should look at it the way I did. Why? Because even in this thread there has been reference made of people that spent a lot of money on equipment and then never used it. Same goes that all one need do is look on ebay and all the used equipment listed that has hardly been used because people just lost interest.

NavyVet1959

09-22-2016, 02:23 PM

Shooting machine guns almost FORCES us to cast and reload. We look for productivity - 4 to 10 cavity moulds, Star Sizers, progressive presses.
Hey....if you are going to shoot then SHOOT! Flip the happy switch and go trigger down until the magazine is empty.
But I think you are speaking of semi-automatics.

Another way to look at it is that casting and reloading saves you money with machine guns since the time you spend casting and reloading is time that you are *not shooting*. :)

FISH4BUGS

09-22-2016, 02:33 PM

Not necesscarily but it does make the case that some people load to shoot not just because they enjoy the loading. If "Shooting machine guns almost FORCES us to cast and reload." then that is a money thing since with enough money you could feed machine guns factory ammo :-)
Tim

Well, that's a good point. 9mm used to be cheap. Less than $100 per case of 1000 rounds. Same with 762x39 and 223. No more.
If money were no object, I would have one hell of a machine gun collection (probably belt-feds) and pallets of ammo. I know people like that. They spend a ton of money on ammo and machine guns. I can't afford the hobby at that level.
I sought, and found the level I am comfortable with. I was lucky that I bought all my guns 30-40 years ago. i could not afford a $25,000 M16 today....or an $9000 S&W 76.....or a $6000 MAC......or a $40,000 m60.....or a $10,000 UZI.
I was lucky.

FISH4BUGS

09-22-2016, 02:36 PM

Another way to look at it is that casting and reloading saves you money with machine guns since the time you spend casting and reloading is time that you are *not shooting*. :)
The flip side of that is that the time spent casting and reloading ALLOWS me to shoot full auto.

NavyVet1959

09-22-2016, 02:52 PM

The flip side of that is that the time spent casting and reloading ALLOWS me to shoot full auto.

But, how many hours of casting and reloading does it take per minute of shooting? :)

NoZombies

09-22-2016, 03:26 PM

I shoot machine-guns as well. So let's say I reload to save money and I use progressive presses to save time while saving money.

OS OK

09-22-2016, 03:38 PM

But, how many hours of casting and reloading does it take per minute of shooting? :)

I don't think anyone wants to tackle that little equation there Navy!

tiger762

09-22-2016, 03:54 PM

Hmmm, 20 rounds per second (basic M11/9) versus 4 minutes to load those 20 rounds @ 300/hr. So, a ratio of 240:1 :o

But, how many hours of casting and reloading does it take per minute of shooting? :)

dtknowles

09-22-2016, 04:03 PM

But, how many hours of casting and reloading does it take per minute of shooting? :)

That's why some of us mostly shoot single shots and muzzleloaders.

Tim

floydboy

09-22-2016, 04:52 PM

I do it because I enjoy it. I can shot more than I would if I had to buy ammo. One of the biggest advantages for me is I don't like recoil. I like the small calibers more than the large ones. Guess what? Most women do to. My wife loves to shot but was afraid of recoil. I load my plinking rounds and shotgun shells pretty light and she loves to shot with me. That right there is worth it to me. I buy stuff at auctions and sell what I don't want to recoup my investment. I really do shot for near nothing. My lead stock pile is paid for by buying in bulk from the scrap yard and selling enough to pay for what I keep. If you work at it this doesn't have to be an expensive hobby. The guns are not cheap....ammo can be.

NavyVet1959

09-22-2016, 05:09 PM

That's why some of us mostly shoot single shots and muzzleloaders.

I guess it depends upon what you want to do. You can put 10 .22LRs (or .223s) down range or a single .45-70. :)

FISH4BUGS

09-22-2016, 07:46 PM

But, how many hours of casting and reloading does it take per minute of shooting? :)
Good question. I don't think I ever looked at it that way.
But it is all one big process to me. Scrounging lead, making ingots, casting, sizing and lubing, brass prep, tumbling, reloading, shooting, picking up more brass, sorting brass, and starting it all over again. There is never a lack of anything to do in the casting shed.
The M11A1 MAC (.380 subgun) has a rounds per minute of something like 1400. Loading the Zytels with only about 28 rounds it doesn't last long.
The M11/9 is about 1200. Ditto on the magazine round count.
The UZI is about 850. 32 rounds lasts a little longer.
The S&W 76 is about 700. 36 rounds goes quick too.
The M16 is about 800. 30 rounders go fast too.
Don't know what the others are.
But I think it is all just one big never ending circular process.
But you ask an interesting question.

FISH4BUGS

09-22-2016, 07:53 PM

I shoot machine-guns as well. So let's say I reload to save money and I use progressive presses to save time while saving money.
Ditto.
Typically 4 6 and 10 cavity moulds, Star Sizer and a Dillon 550. The only bottleneck in my reloading prcess is case prep. I just can't bring myself to spend $400 on the Dillon Motorized trimmer plus dies for the 308 and 223. Probably $500 by the time it is all said and done.....just to trim rifle brass.
Winters are long and cold here in NH and I usually do my brass prep over the winter on a Forster hand trimmer (works like a charm) with an electric drill adapter. Also switch to hand crank when my hands get tired.
But with no TV you would be surprised how much time you can give to your hobby.

tiger762

09-22-2016, 07:55 PM

I've never clocked it to be sure, but mine with MacJack rate accelerator has got to be hitting 1800. It short cycles the bolt to just barely enough to function. Sort of like firing 9mm in the shorter M11/380 frame. The reciprocating length is shorter. It's just a cube shaped block of what looks like nylon.

The M11/9 is about 1200. Ditto on the magazine round count.

taminsong

09-22-2016, 09:37 PM

I liked to tinker in my reloading room, and felt good about it. I think at first it started as a hobby, then it becomes a passion, and lately, they way I looked at myself, its worse, it's already an OBSESSION! LOL!

But I'm happy, there's something real good that I felt inside when I held in my hands shining bright ammo that performs well!

RogerDat

09-22-2016, 10:16 PM

Not sure if there is anything I like and find more pleasant than time spent casting or reloading. It is work, because I accomplish something but it is work I choose to do rather than work or tasks I have to do. Always plenty of those must do items on my to-do list so being able to make something I want with my efforts is nice change of pace.

09-22-2016, 11:06 PM

Looks to me a lot like we should have gotten a BOAT look at all the money we could save if we did not buy our fish.

Why do I reload because I can.

Why do I hunt because I can.

If you want to know what a man loves look where he spends his money they may tell you all kinds of reasons but with the time and money spent they love doing it.

OnHoPr

09-23-2016, 06:41 AM

Reloading increases deadliness which in turn increases ethics levels when hunting. It should be able to kill game more cleanly which would decrease tracking or looking and increase more palatable meat. Even though factory ammo has different loadings within a particular cartridge or gauge and can be quite good, reloading for a specific weapon whether it be pistola, shotgun, or rifle the reloader can tailor the load to the specific weapon for optimum results. Though, just like with factory ammo there maybe a trial and error period before settling on a load per weapon, but this might be due to the reloader's design plan, inexperience, misrepresentation of components, faulty components, range spectrums designed for but went out of those specifics on the shot, weight of animal designed for, angle of shot, the list goes on and on. The do all load is harder to achieve.

6bg6ga

09-23-2016, 06:54 AM

Reloading is an obsession!!! Took stock of my reloading equipment and added up all I have spent for every piece of equipment and it scared the **** out of me. Knowing what I spent puts a new light on things. In the bullet caster and molds alone I have costs in excess of 4K. Two bullet sizers with air cylinders, feeders, collators, dies and punches is around 3K. Two presses with reloading dies and conversion kits in excess of 3.5K. Now figure in two scales, two powder measures and assorted case prep equipment. Yup, reloading is a cost savings hobby. I do have enough loaded up for the zombie thing coming.

6bg6ga

09-23-2016, 07:23 AM

Lets see.... I could purchase 1050 boxes of ammunition at $10.00 a box. I could buy 583 boxes of 300 blackout at 18.00 @ box or 11,660 rounds. yup there are cost savings there its just going to take years and years to break even.

OS OK

09-23-2016, 08:01 AM

6bg6ba...There's another way to look at it..."Just be thankful that the funds were there for you to experience the hobby. The kids got fed, clothed and educated and the wife satisfied in life, none of the animals died for lack of care...you worked your butt off to assure all that, heck...can't you have a little something of what's left over?
Besides isn't it a mortal sin to walk by brass on the range without at least having a look at it and dragging it home with you...If you bought all your rounds, think of all the brass you would have left everywhere."

RogerDat

09-23-2016, 08:19 AM

Oh yeah reuse is the highest form of recycling. Doing my part to save the planet one brass case at a time.

I am not one of those reloading a caliber that is not available off the shelf but I have found that older mil-surp rifles are much happier when fed my moderate power loads. Bolts cycle smoothly without the harsh recoil of factory ammo pounding the bolt back and accuracy is enhanced because of bullet fit. So the "value" of those old rifles is enhanced by reloading. I would put that value on the savings side of the ledger.

castalott

09-23-2016, 09:52 AM

Boys I'll tellya...I save so much money by reloading and casting...well, I have to use a 55 gallon drum for a Piggy Bank!

When they get full I stack them out in the Barn!

:bigsmyl2:

I hear ya.... When the $100 bills pile up and block the view out the picture window, I just take 'em out and burn them... I hate that!....:roll:

NoZombies

09-23-2016, 10:26 AM

Ditto.
Typically 4 6 and 10 cavity moulds, Star Sizer and a Dillon 550. The only bottleneck in my reloading prcess is case prep. I just can't bring myself to spend $400 on the Dillon Motorized trimmer plus dies for the 308 and 223. Probably $500 by the time it is all said and done.....just to trim rifle brass.
Winters are long and cold here in NH and I usually do my brass prep over the winter on a Forster hand trimmer (works like a charm) with an electric drill adapter. Also switch to hand crank when my hands get tired.
But with no TV you would be surprised how much time you can give to your hobby.

Our setups sound very similar, Even some of the same sub-guns we're feeding. 4-6-10 cavity molds, Star Sizer and Dillon 550. For me, I'm shooting Subguns, so I avoid the rifle cartridge trimming issue that you have. I do shoot rifles, but none with giggle switches. With the way prices are these days, unless business picks up pretty substantially, I doubt I'll be shooting any rifle caliber MG's anytime soon.

6bg6ga

09-23-2016, 05:28 PM

OS OKThanks for the reply. You put it into a different light. Your right Idid work my butt off for what I have and I should be satisfied knowing that what I have is pretty good equipment and its paid for. Last thing... I should be thankful and I am. Leave an empty brass laying around? Hell NO!!!

TXGunNut

09-23-2016, 09:43 PM

When I got into reloading I calculated my break-even point, hit it and haven't taken a pencil to it since. Been reloading 35 years and it's been quite a ride! I can load for more cartridges than most folks can name. I can load ammo that you can't buy and/or load ammo better than you can buy. I've had a lot of fun and eliminated a lot of stress over the years as well.
Just had a nice little supper of breakfast tacos. I cooked the meal, I made the sausage, I processed the meat. I field dressed the deer, shot the deer, mounted the scope, maybe even assembled the rifle. I loaded the ammo, tested and developed the loads. I cast the boolits, smelted the lead, scrounged and sorted the wheelweights.
No idea how many thousands of dollars worth of equipment I used to go from used wheelweight to supper on the table but the experience was priceless and I get to do it most nights.
On top of all that I get to hang out here with all these good folks while my 38-40 cases are rattling around in the cleaner in another room.
Looks like this is my 10,000th post. I think I'll pour myself a little drink and relax with a good book. Good night, all! Bedtime for an old fat man coming up soon.

kmw1954

09-23-2016, 10:08 PM

TXGunNut, congrats on the 10k posts. Enjoy your book and drink!

Idaho45guy

09-24-2016, 05:03 AM

I shot all the full-auto I wanted to in the military. It was fun, but not THAT fun. I shot my brother's M16 a couple of weeks ago that his department issued him for a patrol rifle. It was fun, but not THAT fun...

Was at Ben Avery gun range in Phoenix a few years ago when the Dillon guy showed up with his hummer and the mounted machine gun and lit it off. THAT was cool... But it was win the lottery level of cool...

I don't dismiss those who enjoy their full autos; just not my thing...

FISH4BUGS

09-24-2016, 06:29 AM

I shot all the full-auto I wanted to in the military. It was fun, but not THAT fun. I don't dismiss those who enjoy their full autos; just not my thing...
....just as we don't dismiss those one-shot-at-a-time muzzle loader shooters. It is all about different strokes for different folks.
In any collecting fraternity there are those that like the exotic or different stuff. In this day and age collecting and shooting full auto is a rich man's sport. I was lucky that I got into it 30-40 years ago when full auto was relatively inexpensive. I couldn't afford to buy at today's prices.
The movement now is into SBR's (short barrel rifles) and suppressors. While the $200 tax is still applicable per transfer, the cost of the items are within reach....not that much different than a full size rifle.
But back to the OP's point. It DOES allow us to shoot more full auto by casting and reloading. With all the lead I have scrounged over the years, I think i will be set for some time. I bought brass when you could get 9mm for $10 per thousand and 308 and 223 was barely scrap value. By taking care, and not beating the daylights out of the reloads, I should be set for life on brass, plus I am an admitted scrounge at the range. I pick up whatever is good regardless. I trade what calibers I don't need for more brass that I use, or more lead or something else that I can use.
It is a great hobby and I enjoy it immensely. Casting opened up the other side of reloading many years ago and I haven't looked back since.

tiger762

09-24-2016, 11:47 AM

My first full-auto was an SWD M10/9 for $850 in 2000. I sent it off to Tactical Innovations (when he was still in Maryland) to get the Sten mag conversion. I bought 60(?) Sten mags from SARCO when they were blowing them out @ $2.50 each. Got a Lanchester from IMA-USA. Sent 20 Sten mags to US Machinegun who TIG welded them into 10 Lanchester equivalents. Have since gotten M11/9, M11/380 and M10/45. I checked on MAC prices lately. Seems the cheapest one is $7000 :o

Ever had someone at the range get all snide on you like "those things are a waste of ammo"? I reply "Yep, and it's my ammo to waste" :) I'm jealous of no one. I certainly wouldn't make insolent remarks to a stranger, so I don't tolerate it from others..

trebor44

09-24-2016, 02:01 PM

I started to reload because it did save me a bundle of money. I was living in a remote part of Montana and factory ammo was quite spendy, so cost wise you were limited to a box or two a year. My first reloading setup was well under $50 total. Fast forward about 50 years and I have more stuff than I care to list. I did not reload all the time, since I moved and traveled for work etc. I never gave up my setup though it has been upgraded and added to quite a bit. Reloading is about shooting and having the option to do so at your pleasure not what someone else dictates. To me it is cost effective, and I do it for me not the savings. It is a past necessity that became a hobby and then a craft!

roundabout

09-24-2016, 02:41 PM

I like tools and gadgets of all kind's. Although I have wanted to reload for a long time I couldn't justify the cost of the equipment. Then Bullet's became difficult to get so my wife was ok with a purchase at that time. I also could not find any 300 ACC black out bullet's when I purchased my rifle; only the 300 whisper. Lee didn't make the die's at that time even though they made a mold. I over spent, on gun's, but was afraid that the Government would do some kind of band. I'm still not sure what's the future will hold but I will be able to continue shooting for a while longer, by reloading. But when you can purchase bulk bullet's so cheap it will be a fun hobby rather than a saving's. That's my justification. I'm not smart enough to develop load's so I depend on you guy's for data. Thank you. I don't know if there is a post about lead bullets for the 230 grain blk out data. The only thing I can find from the power companies are copper jacked or plated bullets. A link will be appreciated. I'm attempting to do a search but I'm not very good at that either.

shoot-n-lead

09-24-2016, 02:44 PM

roundabout...you are in a good place to learn that forgiveness is easier to get than permission.

6bg6ga

09-25-2016, 06:42 AM

I hope most of the wives NEVER open this thread to read it. While their content to have anywhere from 30- 150+ pairs of shoes we the male are supposed to work come home from work do not pass go and do not collect the $200 unless it is handed over to them immediately. Well, most here may fall into that grouping. So, they can have a closet or two or three filled with dresses and assorted clothes plus the shoes and handbags we the male are supposed to get along with several pairs of blue jeans, a sunday suit, and two pairs of shoes. Revolt!!! Go to the nearest gun shop pull out your credit card and purchase any ammo station that fits your needs complete with all the bells. Added to that purchase a pile of a thousand or two of bullets, 5K of large and small primers and 3 or 4 8lb kegs of powder. This is savings the kind that you will never see again!.Reality check... How many rounds are you going to shoot in a years time? Probably several hundred but then again you have the Zombie appocolipse to worry about so load up. Now, consider the costs of the equipment and components. Yup, you saved money or better yet you assured yourself that you will have zombie rounds when the time comes. That in itself warrants the spending of that amount of money after all she has dresses ,shoes, and handbags, right? Keep telling yourself you have the right to do so after all there was enough money left to purchase groceries to put food on the table this week and maybe even next week either that or you could go hunting..thats right isn't squirrel season open soon? Makes sense....$10 worth of ammo for three tasty squirrels.Serously, pulling your leg hard for quite a while and a few posts now...... reloading provides relief in a sort of way. When the wife says no to a general question some here might pose several times a week and answers with a "I have a headache" you can always to to the man cave and reload as it takes your mind off other things. Its ok to have reloading equipment as she has shoes, purses, and closets full of clothes. If you don't figure the cost of the reloading equipment and your time reloading saves money. Reloading assures that you have a supply when the shelves at the gun store are empty. Reloading assures that when zombies come knocking at your door you can blow their heads off and still have an ample supply of ammo left. After all you can still send the wife to answr the front door to ask the zombies to wait 5-10 minutes until you load up a few rounds. Reloading is fun, gives a manly feeling is cost saving and provides ammo when there is none to be had. Last thing....I created a monster at home. I took the wife shooting many years ago and she loves it. The first 300 blackout I put together she put 6 rounds thru it turned around and looked at me with love in her eyes and said " Your going to make me one of these in OD green" I answered "YES" I will dear. I don't have to hide any guns, components, equipment or anything I buy because at todays count she is ahead of me with gun purchases and simply tells me if you want it either make it or buy it. God I love guns and reloading!!!

B. Lumpkin

09-25-2016, 01:13 PM

Just cracked open a fresh 8lb jug of BL-C(2). This one has a price tag of $122.99. Gotta get my stash stocked up for a couple carbine classes with the 308's this year, lol.

TXGunNut

09-25-2016, 01:51 PM

I suppose loading is a bit like woodworking, gardening, gourmet cooking, beer & wine making and a few other hobbies. Saving money is as good an excuse as any to get into it but for some folks the basic setup is only a starting point. A loading setup is only limited by space and funds available, otherwise the sky's the limit. I still use my old RCBS single stage press and Lee priming tool for most loading projects but hundreds of other "must have" tools have joined them over the years. ;-) I haven't been blessed with a "better half" so if I want it (and my credit card company doesn't object) it comes home with me.

dtknowles

09-25-2016, 03:19 PM

I hope most of the wives NEVER open this thread to read it. While their content to have anywhere from 30- 150+ pairs of shoes we the male are supposed to work come home from work do not pass go and do not collect the $200 unless it is handed over to them immediately. Well, most here may fall into that grouping. So, they can have a closet or two or three filled with dresses and assorted clothes plus the shoes and handbags we the male are supposed to get along with several pairs of blue jeans, a sunday suit, and two pairs of shoes. Revolt!!! Go to the nearest gun shop pull out your ..................................send the wife to answr the front door to ask the zombies to wait 5-10 minutes until you load up a few rounds. Reloading is fun, gives a manly feeling is cost saving and provides ammo when there is none to be had. Last thing....I created a monster at home. I took the wife shooting many years ago and she loves it. The first 300 blackout I put together she put 6 rounds thru it turned around and looked at me with love in her eyes and said " Your going to make me one of these in OD green" I answered "YES" I will dear. I don't have to hide any guns, components, equipment or anything I buy because at todays count she is ahead of me with gun purchases and simply tells me if you want it either make it or buy it. God I love guns and reloading!!!

Sorry for the big snip but the stuff in the middle as not really my point.

Yes, and No. Depends and not the undergarments.

We are not all in the same boat. Save money, that is a good thing. Shoot more that is a good thing. Go out to the shop for some peace and relaxation, good too.

I see people with $10's of thousands of dollars of guns here and people who put guns on layaway.

Some that figure if their is a roof over their wife's head and good food in the fridge and pantry then there is money for guns.

Someone who puts a gun on layaway, is that because they don't want to dip into the 6 months of pay they have saved for emergencies or is it on layaway because a check for the full price would bounce?

There have been times I have scrimped and saved and justified purchases based on overtime pay or such when money was tight but it was only tight in the sense that after the bills were paid, the retirement savings were funded the remaining disposable income was small so who's whims should be fulfilled, since not everyone could have everything they desired.

Funny now that I could go out and buy any toy I want (well maybe almost any) I don't seem to be so eager to get more toys. I was in a funk earlier this year and almost talked myself into an AR. Maybe something new will get me shooting more again. I did not buy the AR and I am shooting more again, taking stuff from the back of the safe and having a go at the range. I may still get the AR but now it will be for the right reason not just Retail Therapy.

Tim

OS OK

09-25-2016, 03:42 PM

Should have been blessed with a wife that has spent her life 'doting on the kids and me' as we have always 'doted' on her. A marriage made in Heaven and truly blessed!
Many times though she would try to dissuade me for a purchase but it was because she already had it wrapped up and in the 'Christmas and Birthday Closet' (a place you did not venture without taking your life in hand).
Now with Grandkids she has a new couple of recipients..."Ain't life Grand!"

mold maker

09-25-2016, 07:03 PM

I consider all the money I've spent on reloading supplies and tools as well spent. I have something to show for it.
I could have had fine cars instead of the "73 Suburban that I put 303,780 miles on and traded for the "03 Dodge crew cab I now have 70280 on. I considered them money well spent also.
There are many who tote a bag of expensive whackers and a hand full of little white eggs in the pursuit of the smallest number.
Many more leave much of their paycheck in the register and waitress pockets at a bar.
We all spend our money as we please.
If I had spent my coins elsewhere I would have missed the joys it provided, the pride in being able to swage, cast, make my own Black powder, gas checks, and 45 ACP shot shells. I would never have machined lowers, and built ARs.
It's a big part of my life that would likely have been wasted otherwise. It's memories I can now draw on with a measure of pride.
No I haven't saved a dime, but I wouldn't take a million for the experience. There is no way to put a $$$$ value on that.

Strtspdlx

09-25-2016, 08:12 PM

I initially started reloading because when my wife and I would go to the range it would cost $300 to shoot for an hour. So I started reloading. Now I do it so I can build the loads I'd prefer to shoot. I still won't buy factory ammo unless it's on sale. And I only buy it so I have a little bit of factory stuff laying around. It's the only hobby I can afford and I enjoy it. Unless I have to sort necked brass. I enjoy it. It's fun to see what I can change that will improve or decrease reliability or accuracy and so on.

Big Boomer

09-26-2016, 12:07 PM

The only ammo I used to buy was what I carried & what my wife carried. Now I reload what I carry and she still has plenty left over from earlier purchases. Got into reloading back in the 1970s for the sake of saving $. Rimfire was getting expensive (I thought) so I went to centerfire altogether. Gave all my rimfires to my son and grandson along with all the ammo accumulated. While components have gone up in price since I can still cast my own boolits and beat the price of either rimfire or centerfire. Along the way I lucked into a fellow who had purchased a new Dillon XL 650 and just couldn't make it work. All thumbs I guess. Bought him out for a fraction of what he had paid for all he had and he had a plenty. Multiple die-plates, dies, powder measures, etc. Same with a Hornady Pro-Jector I got second-hand. It is not nearly the machine that the XL 650 is but it takes care of some of my handgun reloading. I even use an extra Dillon powder measure on it. An old Lyman All American turret press takes care of all my rifle reloading chores which are loaded one at a time. While some think reloaders don't really save money, if you are enough of a penny-pincher you can save if you get your lead for free, cast your own boolits and don't count your time. You get to shoot more for the effort expended and that is worth something to me. Of course, there is the expense of propane for smelting, the electricity for the Lee 20 lb. bottom pour pot and the cost of the pot itself, but I still think I am ahead of the guy who buys all his ammo. I will be helping a friend who is a NRA instructor/trainer teach a big-wig politician in our state legislature how to reload soon. He is well off enough that he will only buy new brass and bullets (no boolits) for reloading and probably will never pick up a piece of brass that he has fired. Must be nice but I'm satisfied with the way things go in my world. Big Boomer

44man

09-27-2016, 09:04 AM

Everyone misses the most important thing. We learn our guns, how they work and what shoots. We know drop and all the important things.
I hate the hunters where I live, they never shoot until a deer is there. They buy ammo year to year and every box is different. Yes, they can use a full 20 shots per deer. Nothing to hear 6 shots fast up the hill. All I find is dead deer.
None are here and the rifle will stand in a corner until season opens. I invite them but they are too busy to bother.
We are a unique bunch from most shooters and you should be proud and I am proud to be a part.

kmw1954

09-27-2016, 09:52 AM

I hate the hunters where I live, they never shoot until a deer is there.

Takes all kinds to make the world go round.

Same as here there are those that pay big money once or twice a year to go jump on a charter boat, Caption takes them to the fish, they get their limit and pictures and they then call themselves fishermen.

44man

09-27-2016, 11:03 AM

Takes all kinds to make the world go round.

Same as here there are those that pay big money once or twice a year to go jump on a charter boat, Caption takes them to the fish, they get their limit and pictures and they then call themselves fishermen.
But we are the best with ethics and knowledge. To me a lost deer is pain I never get over. I have lost some and it hurts but some hunters don't care. If the deer does not fall, they keep hunting and never go look. My hunting is over until I expend the day to recover or can't find it.
I think you are one of us.

NavyVet1959

09-27-2016, 03:19 PM

I figure that with casting my own bullets and reloading, as long as I can recover my brass, I can reload for anywhere from $2.50 to $4.00 per 50-round box of ammo, depending upon caliber and how hot of a load it might be. For the most part though, the cost of the lead is more than the cost of the powder, so if I want to save money, the best way to do that usually is to shoot a lighter bullet.

Here's a quick and dirty ammo cost calculator that I wrote up.

Ammo Costs Calculator (images.spambob.net/navy-vet-1959/ammo-costs.htm)

A really heavy load .44 mag load of a 355 gr bullet with 10.5 gr of Longshot would end up costing me $5.17 per 50.
Whereas a 325 gr bullet with 11.8 gr of Longshot would end up costing me $5.11 per 50.

NavyVet1959

09-27-2016, 03:21 PM

But we are the best with ethics and knowledge. To me a lost deer is pain I never get over. I have lost some and it hurts but some hunters don't care. If the deer does not fall, they keep hunting and never go look. My hunting is over until I expend the day to recover or can't find it.
I think you are one of us.

The solution to that is to hunt hogs. They're a pest and breed faster than we can kill 'em, so no one is going to break a tear if you fail to recover one. :)

dverna

09-27-2016, 04:55 PM

Anyone can save if they reload unless they make poor decisions on equipment needed.

I started with a Lee Target Loader (48 years ago) for my .222. It loaded better ammunition than I could buy at far less cost. It was slow, but I could not afford to shoot much...so it fit my needs....not my wants.

Over the years, my needs increased and I was able to satisfy my wants. I do not need a Dillon 1050, but it is excellent at producing a lot of pistol ammo. It is a stupid investment for the two box a week shooter. Worth it if shooting 400 rounds per week and working long hours.

Our future may hold some unpleasant surprises. Having the means to produce ammunition could become important. I cannot put a "cost" or should I say value on that.

If a person cannot calculate the "cost of reloading", and decide if it makes sense for them, they do not have the mental capacity to reload safely. The value is different depending on each persons reasons and objectives.

For me, there are only two reasons.....savings.....self sufficiency. If I could buy ammunition for the cost of reloads, and be assured a constant supply, I would never cast another bullet or load another cartridge. The incremental performance advantages of reloads are not enough to justify the time invested, the space needed, or the equipment costs.

For many it is fun and relaxing. I envy them.

44man

09-27-2016, 05:17 PM

The solution to that is to hunt hogs. They're a pest and breed faster than we can kill 'em, so no one is going to break a tear if you fail to recover one. :)
We have none here and I agree. Like the snakes that got in. They take them to a place---stupid, SHOOT THEM! A chopper with a mini gun is not enough.
But deer are different, good meat. I don't know. I feel for them different. Not like trapping rats.
I ate wild hog meat and still prefer farm raised.

NavyVet1959

09-27-2016, 06:04 PM

Using the figures that I previously posted on .44 mag, let's compare that with a commercial .44 mag round... A quick web search seems to indicate that a basic .44 mag in the 300+ gr range goes for around $33 per 50. So, we're staving $27.83 per 50 rounds. If you had $1K in equipment, then you would break even after 1797 rounds.

If you start talking about the boutique ammo manufacturer rounds (e.g. Underwood), you would reach the break-even point even sooner. For example, Underwood's 340 gr LFN is $133.60 per 100, so you would break even after 749 rounds.

I suspect that if all I was shooting was .44 mag in a revolver, I could get by with a LOT less than $1K in equipment though.

Lee Classic 4-hole Turret Press -- $104
Lee .44 mag Deluxe 4-die set (includes FCD) -- $44
Lee 20 lb casting pot -- $53
Lee 430-310-RF 6-cavity bullet mold -- $38
Frankford Arsenal electronic powder scale -- $36
Hornady Powder Measure -- $74

Total of $349...

Most of us though tend to acquire a few more pieces of equipment though... :)

44man

09-27-2016, 06:20 PM

It is hard for a new guy because it is TIME. As years go by. It gets better. My .44's cost a dime a shot. My .500's are maybe 13 cents. Even a new gun has little outlay. You have the basics and do not need a progressive.

DerekP Houston

09-27-2016, 06:38 PM

I like being self sufficient and making better ammo than I can buy. I don't mind the added cost or the time outlay. If it lasts me another 20-30 years I can only imagine what it will save me over time. Some people go to bars, some chase women, some watch sports; I stay home enjoy a beer and pulling on the handle of my press. Going to the range and shooting tiny holes in targets is fun too ;).

I worried about the break even cost for the first year and then figured heck with it. I've spent more on the guns than I ever will on reloading gear.

dragon813gt

09-27-2016, 07:21 PM

$30,508.38. I was paying bills so I figured I'd run a report. This is everything reloading related including items like lead, tooling, manuals and storage boxes. I really don't need to buy any more molds. Reloading tools are outpacing them by a mere $332.61.

It appears it's a good thing I don't swage because the total would probably be close to double w/ how I buy things. Maybe it's time I sell all my molds and buy a master caster......

dverna

09-27-2016, 07:50 PM

fatelk

09-27-2016, 09:01 PM

I used to have seven, but at my age, woman tire me out more quickly.
You must be the guy from the song, you know: four that want to own me, two that want to stone me... :)

Markbo

09-27-2016, 10:33 PM

Reminds me of one of the old Rock and Rollers: "I spent most my money on booze, cocaine and women. The rest I just wasted." :D

Idaho45guy

09-27-2016, 11:56 PM

My brother got a Dillon 550 and about 6-8 sets of dies from a lady whose husband died and she just wanted his stuff gone. He's had it for three years now in his garage and has never touched it. He doesn't reload... I may have to offer him some beer for it...

mold maker

09-28-2016, 02:08 PM

As the saying goes. "From my cold hands" will my reloading stuff be removed. It's more than a hobby or a way to a means. It's part of a way of life that I've enjoyed for the last 52 of my 74 years.
As I feel the end approaching I have to hurry to experience the projects I put off, or just now thought of. So much to do with so little time and energy.
To all you younger folks, stop putting off what you want to do. Don't let opportunities pass you by. Living for tomorrow is wasting today. You may never have the chance to enjoy your dreams, if you continually put them off for a more opportune time.
There will always be an auto transmission or water heater that needs immediate attention. Education for your kids will always destroy your budget.
The only regrets I have, are the things I didn't go ahead and do, like the prospecting trip to Alaska. I saved the coins necessary several times, but a new roof or some such would always seem more important, and there was always tomorrow. Now my health and abilities will no longer permit such endeavors. Opportunity squandered, and dream lost forever.
My last life joy is finding range brass, berm lead, and a few cents to produce ammo that can't be bought, or that I refuse to buy off the shelf, if it's even there.

castalott

09-29-2016, 02:40 PM

[QUOTE=mold maker;3793107]As the saying goes. "From my cold hands" will my reloading stuff be removed. It's more than a hobby or a way to a means. It's part of a way of life that I've enjoyed for the last 52 of my 74 years.
As I feel the end approaching I have to hurry to experience the projects I put off, or just now thought of. So much to do with so little time and energy.
To all you younger folks, stop putting off what you want to do. Don't let opportunities pass you by. Living for tomorrow is wasting today. You may never have the chance to enjoy your dreams, if you continually put them off for a more opportune time.

I agree... I've always saved for the future.... this project or that one... fishing in Minnesota....
on and on...

What is life but the experiences you have had? If you had a billion dollars but had to live in dark closet all your life, would you say that was a great life?

My dad talked all his life what he would do when he retired. Died at 56....

I've felt a great need to downsize all this stuff... I want what I want but the 'less than stellar' stuff should go.... (not talking price but value)

I'm talking more to myself than you guys...

Dale

shdwlkr

10-02-2016, 05:08 PM

When I here someone talk about how expensive it is to reload. I think of some calibers I have had over the years. One is a .225 winchester today you buy some of the old loaded stuff for 50-100 for a box of twenty, .256 win mag, just the bras mind you for 50 a box of 50, or 375 winchester for around 40 maybe a box of 20.
If you are watching the price in the big box stores or even lgs prices are going up and I don't think they will come down to what they were just 8 years ago. Heck I look at the cost of the lowly 22lr and wonder how come the cost has gone so high, yes I know the cost to make has gone up, but that much?
If you like to shoot and like doing it often then you need to become a reloader and put the ability to have ammo back your control. Wouldn't hurt to learn how to cast bullets, powder coat them too. The more you can do yourself the more you are in control of your shooting. Just the thoughts of someone who used to do such things.