1911 and hunting barrel length

[nekshot]

For a 1911 pistol what length (I prefer longer barrels) makes most sense between sight radius and cartridge performance? I am not wanting the hottest loads just common sense loads for job needed to kill deer about to 75 yards? What about the 45 acp, is 460 roland a good option on a 1911, how about 10mm and does the 40 S&W come into the play? If a thread is here about this please give me the link! Thanks

[gray wolf]

75 yards on Deer with a 1911 ?
What ever you choose you had better be a very good shot.
also I would want to be a very good tracker.

I would put caliber choice second on this one.

They will all kill, how fast the Deer will die is another matter.
IMHO a person would be behind the curve at that distance,
How far behind would depend on the individuals skill level.

However if a person is confident in there shooting skills,
and knows ( not thinks ) they can place a shot in the kill area,
Then I would choose the best performing cartridge I could handle and shoot well.

[nekshot]

trust me I can still do very good at 80 yards resting on something! I forgot a lot but I know my limitations with a handgun yet. This is a project I want to do over this winter and be ready with it next season, good Lord willing!

[35remington]

Limit it to 50 and call it good. Said by a guy who does just that.

[jcren]

Range is up to you, factory 45's gain very little (like 20 fps) going from a 5" to a long slide 6", so to me the inch of radius is not a huge benefit. Hot +p slinging 230 grains in the high 9's (some cast loads claiming 1000+, but I haven't pushed that far) will get the job done.

[lefty o]

if i were wanting to do what you want to try, it would be a 6" 10mm loaded smoking hot.

[str8wal]

You might want to take a look at the 45 Super, all that is usually needed is a spring change with a 45 ACP 1911. It is capable at 75 yards or more with a good bullet, provided the shooter is.

[Mk42gunner]

I've never played with any of the hotter versions of the .45, but between it and the 10mm for what you are wanting to do, I would choose the ten; and make sure I was using full power loads.

I don't think the 40S&W has any business being used on deer at anything over handshake distance.

I've also never shot any of the long slide 1911's, they may be useful here.

I see lots of practice in your future.

Robert

[Jupiter7]

if i were wanting to do what you want to try, it would be a 6" 10mm loaded smoking hot.

yup, this

460rowland requires some very specific stuff, brass, gun modifications,etc....10 can be had at most sporting goods stores, is a approved cartridge with major manufacturer support(yes 460 has a little) and 10mm has better sectional density and given same speed and weight, will penetrate better. Some videos of guys taking deer with single shots and 10mm with Glocks at the ranges your talking about, on YouTube. 45auto isn't even on my radar for deer hunting with a dedicated gun, as sidearm while rifle hunting, sure.

[9.3X62AL]

For my purposes, my handgun vs. deer hard limit is 50 yards irrespective of caliber--none of my sidearms wear glasses, and likely won't ever do so. 45 ACP loaded to any strength would not be my choice in any event, and the only conventional recoil-operated self-loading pistol I would consider for this tasking would be the 10mm/200 grain bullet/1200 FPS combination. The bullet would be cast as a BruceB Soft Point. I have fought several large fish on #5-weight fly tackle, and that sort of stunt sequence does not translate well to the hunting fields. As time goes on, I am less and less likely to use handguns for larger animals (75#+).

[nekshot]

A good friend I don't see anymore(distance factor) always tells me I need a 10 mm and I deeply respect his knowledge. I don't have anything for a 10mm so it will all need to be purchased. I feel a little queasy with trying to push the 45acp and I wanted to hear from you that are into handguns over your head what you would say. I am a wheel gun (44 mag) guy through and through but I want to do this with a 1911, makes me feel like a real American when I handle one. I use one of my kids so all I need is barrel, mag and maybe slide or so. Well, I will start looking for longer 10mm barrels, wish I could get a 7 or 8 incher!

[43PU]

the furthest i have ever killed a deer with a 1911 was right at 35 yards out of a tree stand and she was eating corn so i had plenty of time to line up and feel good, i used the lee 200 grn SWC over 5 grn of unique i believe i cant remember off hand, but she went down like a rock, didn't move or kick. I have killed around 12 deer with a 1911 and about 30 total with a pistol, i have killed deer with a 460 Rowland and I HIGHLY recommend it! i have the lee 452-255 RF and i can get it going around 1250 FPS easy and accurately. I see no reason why to change the 5 inch barrel on the 1911 however my glock 21 has a 6.5'' 460 Rowland barrel, the sight radius is the same because i use a red dot on my G21.

43pu

[nekshot]

A little snooping and plenty of 9 inch 10mm barrels for Glock!! Gunblast says the Glock is better on strong 10 mm loads than a 1911? What ignorance I have. 20 years or so I shot my first and last Glock. It was ok but I must have a sweet s a trigger! Can a Glock have a good trigger??

[mcdaniel.mac]

The original 10mm specs are weak, basically hot .40SW loads. Real 10mm loads will eat up Delta Elites real quick.

If I was going to handgun hunt with a semiauto, I'd look at a Coogan or the Sig 220 Hunter 10mm SAO, with a red dot on top. It'll eat the hot stuff just fine.

[OS OK]

I have a problem with you fellas that think you'll set up on a deer at these obscene distances and think you can shoot through brush and unexpected twigs and such and leaning beside a tree...and think you can shoot as well as you did off the sandbags at the range.

What about all the missed, so called missed shots that actually wounded the animal and you couldn't track it, it goes off and slowly bleeds to death or is tracked by a cat for an easy kill...I don't see you mighty hunters bragging on these shots.

When I started Bow Hunting I got this lecture from a friend. His motto was to 'learn to stalk'. If you want to be a mighty hunter, learn to stalk.
Are you out there to put meat in the freezer or pull off some shot you can brag about all winter...when I get around hunters of this caliber...I can't get away from them quick enough!

charlie

[lefty o]

A good friend I don't see anymore(distance factor) always tells me I need a 10 mm and I deeply respect his knowledge. I don't have anything for a 10mm so it will all need to be purchased. I feel a little queasy with trying to push the 45acp and I wanted to hear from you that are into handguns over your head what you would say. I am a wheel gun (44 mag) guy through and through but I want to do this with a 1911, makes me feel like a real American when I handle one. I use one of my kids so all I need is barrel, mag and maybe slide or so. Well, I will start looking for longer 10mm barrels, wish I could get a 7 or 8 incher!
b aware, its not just as easy as dropping a barrel and mag onto a .45acp 1911.

[Char-Gar]

I killed several Texas White Tail deer with a Colt Gold Cup (45 ACP) and cast bullets back in the late 60's. The longest range was about 30 yards and the deer were grave yard dead. I did this, because it was what I had with me at the time.

I certainly would not choose a 1911 of any stripe as my deer hunting handgun. It is the wrong platform for that job. There are way to many good revolvers on the market that are far better suited to the task. The bottom line is the deer deserves better.

[ole 5 hole group]

In my opinion, if you ever decide to go with the 460 Rowland - the Glock is probably the better platform. Glock does have different springs etc for the G21 that makes the trigger a whole lot better than "stock".

I think I would just purchase the Glock from Rowland and be done with it, if that's your future choice, as it will be set-up correctly and ready to go and I doubt you would save much doing it yourself, unless you have a good price source.

[bob208]

you do know one of the reasons for the army wanting a .45 was to stop horses. so I think if you can shoot a standard 1911 wound do just fine on a deer at 50yd.

[Ithaca Gunner]

You might want to take a look at the 45 Super, all that is usually needed is a spring change with a 45 ACP 1911. It is capable at 75 yards or more with a good bullet, provided the shooter is.

It's a bit more involved than that. A 416 stainless barrel, ramped is much preferred. Non beveled firing pin stop. 23# mainspring. Heavy firing pin spring. .45 Super, or at least +P rated brass. I also like a Fire Dragon dual recoil system in a +P or Super gun. And it all has to fit and time properly.

I'll stick with my 8 3/8" 629-3 for any handgun hunting I do.

From the OP's choices, I would go with the 10mm and hope for the best limiting my shots to under 50yds. But that's just me.

[cainttype]

... Well, I will start looking for longer 10mm barrels, wish I could get a 7 or 8 incher!

The AMT Javelina (1911 10MM) was offered in a 7" "Longslide" version. They are stainless, durable, and very accurate. They offered a similar 45 ACP.
You should be able to find them occasionally with an internet search, or browsing sites like Gunbroker.

This is not exactly what you're looking for, but the LAR Grizzly (45 Win Mag) is a beefy 1911-style auto with performance potential you could compare favorably to 44 Mag... They're also out of production, making spare parts a sometimes iffy thing... Extra mags aren't cheap, either.... But MAN! What a nice handgun.
The Grizzly also had conversion kits for 44 Mag, 357 Mag, 10MM "Magnum", 9MM Win Mag, and 357/45 Win Mag (always wanted that one), etc...

[DougGuy]

If you can keep a whole magazine full in a 6" paper saucer at X amount of yards, THAT is how much distance you should consider max. Unless you plan to hunt from a Ransom rest.

I find it fairly easy to load the .45 ACP to acceptable levels with 250gr boolits, but DO USE a good aftermarket barrel like 416R stainless which is good to 78,000psi or something close to that. Load it to .45 ACP+P or .45 Super and see if you can keep it on the saucer.

LBT WFN-PB 250gr or LBT OWC-PB 250gr would be interesting, I think it would feed in a 1911 if the barrel was throated for .452" would make an excellent hunting boolit.

DEER hunting. Not hogs, not bear, thin skinned Bambi animals.

[charlie b]

trust me I can still do very good at 80 yards resting on something! I forgot a lot but I know my limitations with a handgun yet. This is a project I want to do over this winter and be ready with it next season, good Lord willing!

Do you hunt where you can rest the gun on something? I guess if you shoot from stands then you have a good spot to rest the gun.

I am usually stalking so shooting is from standing, sitting, kneeling or prone, no rests. Stand and shoot when at the range. Like someone said prior, whatever range you can hit a 6" circle (I use clay pigeons). And it is ALL your shots, not 4 of 6 or even 5 of 6.

I'd find a longslide 1911 in 10mm and load up some hot rounds for it. Then practice with about 1000rds to find my limiting range, especially since it sounds like you haven't shot a 1911 before.

[Markbo]

if i were wanting to do what you want to try, it would be a 6" 10mm loaded smoking hot.

Yup. But what do I know? I use a .460 Rowland. :D

[Blackwater]

Nekshot, you ask a question that's been being asked for a long, long time. I have a freind who's shot multiple semi-truckloads of deer with handguns, most on permit for crop damage. He's used everything from a .22 LR pistol to .44 mag. and heavy loaded .45 LC. Not really sure I recall what his top end is on calibers, but he's shot a few with muzzle loading pistols, too. He's pretty much pressed into use whatever was handy at the time, and chose his ranges and shot placement accordingly. Only head shots with the .22's! He's the finest shot on both the range and in the woods I've ever seen.

Small differences in power really don't amount to a hill of beans when shooting deer. What matters 50X more than all other factors put together is shot placement. This requires good and very consistent loads, good sights properly adjusted and sighted in very precisely, and a gun capable of enough accuracy at the distance you intend to shoot. Knowledge of your game's anatomy is very significant also! You can't pick a spot unless you know why you picked that spot, and the proper answer to "why did you aim there" is "because name your organ is there. And understanding how the angles define your aiming spot to get to those organs. All this matters much more than even what to us seems to be a significant difference in "killing power." REAL "killing power," though, will ALWAYS depend on shot placement. And your max range will be whatever distance you can consistently put 95% of your shots in a 4 to at most 5" circle. That's how I figure it, anyway, and it's based on having skinned and autopsied well over 300 deer shot with all sorts of calibers. A little, low powered bullet does the job while fire breathers often don't if not placed well. And this has been very consistent through many years of hunting and trying to pay attention and find out what differences there really are. Folks used to think the .44/40 was a really fine deer killer, but its loads were more like a mid level .44 mag. or warmed up .44 Spec. in a pistol, as far as ballistics.

I doubt you'll find much difference on deer (whitetails) even between the .45 and the .460, but I probably wouldn't be able to convince many of that. I always have used more than adequate calibers, and was like Linus and his blanket about it. But now, though I still like "overkill," I know what I'm doing, at least, and why.

Put a good bullet from either of those calibers in the real stickin' place, and you'll eat venison, and shouldn't have a very long tracking job.

[nekshot]

Thanks for input, this is gonna cost more than I want to lay out. I will stick with my wheel guns!

[lar45]

Hi guys, I'm a little late to the discussion here, but...
I don't see anything wrong with hunting with a handgun as long as you can shoot it accurately and judge the distance that you'll be shooting at.
There are quite a few people that hunt with a bow also and do just fine. Using a pistol at bow ranges shouldn't be a problem.

I looked on Gunbroker and here is a great start into a 1911 hunting platform if you're still interested. It's an AMT Long Slide Hardballer in 45acp with scope already mounted. I have one and really like it, mine doesn't have the scope on it though.

http://www.gunbroker.com/item/581579021
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