Henry 44-40 loads

[holdinsteady]

Just bought a new Henry Iron Frame 44-40. Looking for a 200gr plated bullet load in the 1300-1500 fps range.

[Wayne Smith]

I shoot mine with a caseful of BP - 200 gr big lube boolit though.

[Outpost75]

24-25 grains of IMR or H4198 with 200-grain bullet.

[holdinsteady]

Just got the rifle home tonight....shot a few factory 200gr cowboy loads.......all 15 rounds shot had primers backed out .0085" consistantly. Does the action flexing during firing cause this? Cannot determine if there is excessive headspace visually. Any ideas? What kind of velocity are you guys getting from your loads. Any barrel leading issues?

[Outpost75]

Primers backing out with light factory loads are common. Reload that brass with a proper "full charge load" and it won't happen.

[KCSO]

.008 is just about the right headspace for 44-40, you are shooting min rim thickness and the primer back out is right. Full loads will set back a little and the primers will be flush. You need this much room as a different brand of shells might have a rim thickness that will leave little or no headspace.

[holdinsteady]

I called Henry customer service and they want the rifle back for evaluation. I will chrono the factory loads to see how hot/mild they are. What kind of velocity are you guys getting with your "full" loads?

[Outpost75]

Here are what factory loads do and an equivalent handload matching pre-war ballistics using Alliant RL7 powder:

Load Description______Ruger 5-1/2"____Ruger 7-1/2"____H&R Single-Shot 19.5"

-------------------------------Cyl.Gap 0.003"---Cyl.Gap 0.002"-----Solid barrel

Rem-UMC 200 JSP_______n/f____________1017, 16 Sd_____1231, 19 Sd_Pre WW2 factory Balloon Head

R-P 200-gr. JSP_________872, 24 Sd______942, 21 Sd______1159, 29 Sd_1960s, Bridgeport, CT production

R-P 200-gr. JSP_________867, 13 Sd______920, 19 Sd______1106, 32 Sd_Current Lonoke, AR production

W-W 200-gr. JSP________856, 19 Sd______886, 29 Sd______1105, 25 Sd_Current East Alton, IL production

Rem 200JSP 24.5RL7_____902, 31 Sd_____1044, 24 Sd_____1232, 30 Sd__Safe in Winchester 1873

A "full" load with 200-grain bullet should give 1200-1300 fps in a rifle.

[holdinsteady]

I tried some Unique last night. 9.2 gr with Hornady 200gr XTP and CCI 300 primers gave me 1325 fps. Primers quit backing out and accuracy was good. Measured rim thickness and most were .0565". My manuals call for a rim thickness of .065". At this point all I have for brass is starline. Nothing else available right now. Thanx to you guys input I think the rifle is ok and will not send it back to Henry for now.

[Outpost75]

Starline brass is the best available for the .44-40, don't bother looking for anything else unless you stumble across a windfall. Your Unique is a full charge load, but sounds OK, if not exceeded.

With cast it wouldn't hurt to reduce it maybe a 1/2 grain or so...

[John Boy]

200 grain JSP (Jacketed Soft Point)
Bullseye 6.6 gr. 1,070 MAX. LOAD
2400 14.5 gr. 1,230 MAX. Load
Unique 8.0 gr. 1,090 MAX. LOAD
HS6 9.0 gr. 1,292 MAX. Load
HP38 6.5 gr. 1,140 MAX. Load
231 6.0 gr. ----- MAX. LOAD

[mack1]

I like old e 2f full case with 215 gr soft boolit the best I like 4227 with the same boolits so far and will be using it in a revolver also.

[holdinsteady]

Been a while but since the last post I was still experiencing fte with this rifle and the full loads. Henry wanted the rifle back for evaluation. Got the rifle back with a note saying the rifle functions fine.....must be an ammo problem. They did not tell me what kind of ammo or how many rounds they fired for testing.So I tried light loads, medium loads, and heavy loads (9.3 gr unique 200gr plated swaged lead at 1325 fps). FTE not as frequent but still occurring. As you may know, a fte in this rifle can only be cleared buy dismantling the action. I decided a $2000.00 rifle ought to be a little easier to live with so I called Henry and they are replacing the rifle with a new one. Can't complain about their cs but the headspace on this rifle seemed to be pretty excessive.....I hope it's not a design problem that I will see in the replacement rifle also. Will post with results from my experience with the new replacement.

[35 Whelen]

When you say FTE are you referring to a failure to eject or failure to extract? Either way I can't see why you'd have to disassemble the rifle to remove the fired case. If it's a failure to extract, I'd take a close look at the extractor hook.

I have a brass frame Uberti 1866 Sporting Rifle in 44-40, which would be very similar to your rifle, and it's been an absolute joy to shoot. I've had a lot of fun regulating the ladder sight and have fired it quite a lot out to a little over 300 yds and accuracy has been stellar, especially considering my over 50 years eyes. Set at 200, the ladder is spot on at 200 yds., but I have to run it just a smidge past 300 for 300 yd. shooting. 9.0 grs. of Unique and 9.5 grs. of Herco are my favorite smokeless loads each yielding right at 1300 fps with a 220 gr. RNFP cast from an NOE 44-200 mould. 2.2cc of Swiss 3Fg yields similar velocities and accuracy is just as good.

Here's a few sample targets all fired with one of the above loads.

200 yds.-

(This target was fired prone, no support)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/200%20yds.%20prone-1_zpsyfxip9nw.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/200%20yds.%20prone-1_zpsyfxip9nw.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/200%20yd.%20target_zpstwfahowv.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/200%20yd.%20target_zpstwfahowv.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/200%20yds._zpsgyhz345k.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/200%20yds._zpsgyhz345k.jpg.html)

300 yds.-

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/300%20yds.%20with%20Unique_zpshasgqca3.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/300%20yds.%20with%20Unique_zpshasgqca3.jpg.html)

The wind got me on this one:

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/300%20yds.%20with%20Swiss%203f_zpszd5cmyhv.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/1873%20Uberti%20Sporting%20Rifle/300%20yds.%20with%20Swiss%203f_zpszd5cmyhv.jpg.htm l)

Please keep us posted on how things are going with the functionality of your rifle.

35W

[holdinsteady]

Well, finally got a replacement rifle back. The new rifle has 150 rnds thru it without problems. I've tried 8.5 to 9.5 grains of Unique with 200gr copper plated swaged lead flat point bullets from Extreme Bullets.......no failure to exract at this point. Primers no longer back out causing extractor to jump over the rim. Accuracy is as good as I can shoot......it consistently puts 13 rounds into a little less than four inches at 114yds on steel. I can only speculate that the first rifle had too deep a chamber or the toggle link was out of spec causing an excessive headspace condition. On the Henry if you have a failure to extract and you open the lever the elevator puts another loaded round behind the round in the chamber.....at that point the round in the elevator cannot be removed from the top and the lever cannot be closed to lower the elevator to gain access to the round in the chamber.....at that point disassembly of the action is required to clear the jam. Any way, now I'm a happy man.....I think this iron frame 1860 may become my favorite plinker.

[georgerkahn]

35 Whelen -- you wrote, "220 gr. RNFP cast from an NOE 44-200 mould" which intrigues me. I have same gorgeous rifle as you do -- s/n 96,6xx which was made by Ubert ion 17 July 2003, and I cast with a RCBS 44-200 2-cav mould; I'd love to buy a NOE version, but see no listing per se of this clone. Might you provide me the NOE number of this mould? Thanks. geo

[35 Whelen]

35 Whelen -- you wrote, "220 gr. RNFP cast from an NOE 44-200 mould" which intrigues me. I have same gorgeous rifle as you do -- s/n 96,6xx which was made by Ubert ion 17 July 2003, and I cast with a RCBS 44-200 2-cav mould; I'd love to buy a NOE version, but see no listing per se of this clone. Might you provide me the NOE number of this mould? Thanks. geo

My apologies, I gave you the wrong name. It's an NOE (http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/product_info.php?cPath=37_209&products_id=233) 432-200-RF.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Cast%20bullets/N_O_E__Bullet_Moulds_432_200Gr__RF_zpsocricpna.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Cast%20bullets/N_O_E__Bullet_Moulds_432_200Gr__RF_zpsocricpna.jpg .html)

Mines drops from the mould right at 220 grs.

Hope this helps.

35W

[georgerkahn]

35 Whelen: Indeed it (your clarification) does! I, too, adore my Uberti 1866, and it is my favorite range rifle! Sadly, for ME, it is both too heavy and too pretty -- using Flitz brass polish mine shines like a mirror! -- to take in the woods ;)!
Thanks again -- I'll no doubt be in contact with Mr. Nelson at Night Owl Enterprises.
geo

[5:43PM EST -- Just placed an order for a 2-cav NOE 432-200 RF RG2! I'm excited! Thanks again! geo]