Range rod ?

[Boaz]

It's an old question but do you use a range rod to load at the range or in the field ?

[Outpost75]

I use a range rod in the shop when checking repairs and inspecting a used gun being taken in trade.

In the field or on the range a Brownell's squibb rod set gets the most use for clearing obstructions and stuck bullets.

[Hamish]

I've learned the hard way to NEVER go to the range without one.

[jhickdog]

ALWAYS use a brass range rod in the field and at the range. Mine is in four pieces threaded on all ends for multi purpose. The wooden rod is functional but is used more as decoration.


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[bob208]

all I have ever use is a mountain state wonder rod. it is a space age plastic. will not break will not wear the muzzle like a fiberglass rod. in the shop I have a solid steel rod if I need it.

[Outpost75]

I think you guys may be confused between a "range rod" and a knockout rod.

A range rod is used during factory assembly of a revolver, and by gunsmiths to check repairs, and consists of a sharp-edged carbide plug, typically 0.0005" under bore size, prior to rifling, which is either threaded or silver-soldered to a handle, being used to check for thread choke caused by over-tightening the barrel into the frame, which collapses the bore at the root of the thread.

The range rod is also used holding with the fingers only, with a light touch, lowering into the bore to check timing and indexing, as the edge of the plug will stop against the edge of the cylinder, if the cylinder stop, hand or pawl do not correctly align the chambers. It is normal in assembly for a new revolver to over-rotate the chambers about 5 degrees, to as to provide some built-in compensation for wear of the parts. This causes no problem, because that is what the forcing cone is for! But such over rotation should not cause a "ticker" in which you may hear or feel a slight resistance as the plug enters the "ball end" of the cylinder.

A knock-out rod, or squibb rod, is usually at least 0.0015" less than barrel BORE diameter (the tops of the lands) so as to enter freely of its own weight. Both ends are chamfered. Its purpose is to dislodge a stuck bullet or other obstruction only.

It has no value whatever for inspecting for thread choke, cylinder or crane alignment or timing. It is a handy item to use at the range for removing stuck bullets or cases, but it is NOT what they call "range rod" at the factory.

[n.h.schmidt]

I use a 5/16" steel range rod for my 45 and 50 cal rifles. it has a brass protector on the one end and a large oak ball on the other end. Concave on the protected end and threaded 10-32. Everyone I shoot with at the matches uses a range rod of some sort. Usually of S.S or brass. With the tight fitting patch and balls we use,you need that. Shooters who don't show up with a range rod ,often end up regretting it. You can pull a hard stuck ball with a range rod.
n.h.schmidt

[Fly]

I also use a range rod. I even made a quiver for mine.

Fly

[mooman76]

It (range rod) may not be what they call it at the factory but in muzzle loading we call it a range rod. It's a rod we take to the range. It has multiple uses.

I don't always take one with me. It depends on what I have for a ram rod. Some of my MLs have not so good wood rods that came from the factory and are not suitable for loading. I keep them with the gun though because they are wood and kind of keep things real. I do always have a shooting box with some small tools for problems that come up and it has a steel cleaning rod in it too.

[triggerhappy243]

I use one. it is 3/8 inch dia. aluminum. it has threaded tips on both ends to accomidate the different thread sizes. this one is 12 inches longer than the barrel.... so you have something to grab on to if needed.

[Boaz]

I have always had the tendency to 'over patch' . Easier to shove down a tight ball with a range rod . Plus over patching leads to a hung ball often which the range rod is much more effective in pulling than a threaded ramrod .
I have never carried one in the field , would be to awkward to tote around seems to me but many say they do .

[WRideout]

The factory ram rod that came with my CVA Buckhorn is very lightly constructed, and I expect it to fail sometime when I need it the most. For general use, I made a range rod out of birch dowel, with a 45ACP case on the pushing end, and a craft-store wooden ball on the other. I keep the factory one for extra. Birch is a bit brittle, so I have to be careful about pushing the rod sideways as the ball goes down the barrel, lest it crack.

Wayne

[bedbugbilly]

I pretty much aways use a range rod on RB rifles/fowlers - when at the range. I don't hunt anymore, but when I make a ramrod for a rifle, mine usually stick out at least a couple of inches further than the muzzle. On some rifles I've built, I've even made them about four inches longer so that I have a little extra grip on them when in the field. My range rods are usually about a foot longer than the barrel and as large a diameter as will fit in the bore. My range rod for my .60 smoothbore fissile-de-chasse was made out of a 5/8" straight hickory rod and probably 8 inches longer than the bore to get a good grip on it to ram the ball home.

Rifled muskets? I usually never use a range rod as the steel ramrod is adequate to get the minie ball down the bore. I do have a cleaning rod with me with a jag on it though to clean the fouling with a patch if necessary during a range session.

When I started shooting BP 50 + years ago . . . I never used a range rod. And, as already stated . . . you learn the hard way. Once you've broken a ramrod and been where you can't find one that ends your shooting, you learn real fast to take a spare or a range rod along! :-)

[Hdskip]

I use a stainless ( 5/16 dia.) Range rod with a delrin guide that fits the bore. this keeps the rod from wearing the muzzle. Got plenty of strength. Extra length if needed and a stainless knob for ease of use. I made it in the shop and cost was nearly nothing.

[waksupi]

Never. A properly fit ball and patch should not require a range rod.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I have never 'hunted' with muzzleloaders...just shoot 'em at the range. The day I broke a TC factory ramrod from my 50 cal Hawkin, that set into motion me making my own range rod...It's just a fiberglass ramrod with a handle from a old screwdriver epoxied on the end. That's what I use at the range. When I bought a TC Seneca in 36 cal, first thing I did was make a smaller range rod for that gun.

[KCSO]

I practice like I hunt so I just use my ram rod, but I take my rr and soak it in turpentine and linseed oil for a month or so before putting them into a gun. I can ususally bend them into a pretty good bow without cracking. I load a loose enough fit that I can push the ball in with little effort and I have a coned muzzle on my flinter. The only use I really have for the range rod is clean up in camp and pulling dry balls.

[Outpost75]

I finally realized we are talking about apples and prunes...

Muzzleloading rifles, not revolvers... Old senile wheelgun guy, my bad 8-(

[Boaz]

I'm in there with you on the old senile guy part .

[Geezer in NH]

I think you guys may be confused between a "range rod" and a knockout rod.

A range rod is used during factory assembly of a revolver, and by gunsmiths to check repairs, and consists of a sharp-edged carbide plug, typically 0.0005" under bore size, prior to rifling, which is either threaded or silver-soldered to a handle, being used to check for thread choke caused by over-tightening the barrel into the frame, which collapses the bore at the root of the thread.

The range rod is also used holding with the fingers only, with a light touch, lowering into the bore to check timing and indexing, as the edge of the plug will stop against the edge of the cylinder, if the cylinder stop, hand or pawl do not correctly align the chambers. It is normal in assembly for a new revolver to over-rotate the chambers about 5 degrees, to as to provide some built-in compensation for wear of the parts. This causes no problem, because that is what the forcing cone is for! But such over rotation should not cause a "ticker" in which you may hear or feel a slight resistance as the plug enters the "ball end" of the cylinder.

A knock-out rod, or squibb rod, is usually at least 0.0015" less than barrel BORE diameter (the tops of the lands) so as to enter freely of its own weight. Both ends are chamfered. Its purpose is to dislodge a stuck bullet or other obstruction only.

It has no value whatever for inspecting for thread choke, cylinder or crane alignment or timing. It is a handy item to use at the range for removing stuck bullets or cases, but it is NOT what they call "range rod" at the factory.
This is the muzzle loading forum. You speaking for MODERN firearms.

A range rod in muzzle loading is a 1 piece rod longer than the ramrod of the gun being shot. It usually has a muzzle protector and a good handle.

Mine are made from stainless steel and are up to 48 inches long.

And the correct terminology is "Range Rod"

This is from another senile coot!:bigsmyl2:

[mooman76]

I finally realized we are talking about apples and prunes...

Muzzleloading rifles, not revolvers... Old senile wheelgun guy, my bad 8-(

What was the question?

[pietro]

For general use, I made a range rod out of birch dowel, with a 45ACP case on the pushing end, and a craft-store wooden ball on the other.

Birch is a bit brittle, so I have to be careful about pushing the rod sideways as the ball goes down the barrel, lest it crack.




Ramrods should NEVER be made from a dowel, as a turned dowel WILL split out, sooner or later - usually piercing the rammer's hand in the process.

Proper wooden RR's should be made from split Hickory - Which, as KCSO pointed out, is best soaked for a month or so in kerosene, which will lubricate the wood fibers internally, thereby adding strength & flexibility. (the kero smell will disappear after awhile in clear air)


.

[dtknowles]

Ramrods should NEVER be made from a dowel, as a turned dowel WILL split out, sooner or later - usually piercing the rammer's hand in the process.

Proper wooden RR's should be made from split Hickory - Which, as KCSO pointed out, is best soaked for a month or so in kerosene, which will lubricate the wood fibers internally, thereby adding strength & flexibility. (the kero smell will disappear after awhile in clear air)


.

Thanks for that, it makes sense need to run with the grain. I will remember if I ever make a ramrod. I don't have a range rod and I did break the wood rod that came with my Hawken. I glued it back together and only use it for display. I have two other muzzle loaders with Plastic/Fiberglass rods. I am risking jinxing myself here but I have never had to pull a ball or load. Way, way back I did load a ball in a .45 cal. pistol without powder but I snapped a cap on it, removed the nipple, trickled in some powder, reseated the ball, replaced the nipple and shot it and it cleared the bore.

I load using the Plastic/Fiberglass ramrods and a short starter. I have what I think is called a worm and I have a screw that fit the ramrod but thinking about it, I am not sure I could get enough grip on the rod to pull anything very tight back out. I might go looking for a Range Rod.

Tim

[country gent]

For the range I use a brass range rod I made up. Its brass tubing 38" long with threaded inserts on each end. one end is 8-32 ( cleaning jages and brushes ) the other is 10-32 for the muzzle loader accesories. I made a stacked leather ball handle for it to slip over end and lock to the 8-32 threads. This allows any ball ends to screw into the 10-32 threads. The tubing was around .300 dia with an .125 hole thru it. For field use I use the short starter and rifles ram rod.

[rfd]

not me, never.

there are essentially two basic ways of shooting trad ml's - at range for top target scores, using tight patched balls, short starters, metal rods, and hammers ... and in the field for woods walks and hunting where yer wood rod should be more than enuf to load a patched ball and no fouling control required. if yer in the later group, constantly using a range rod is not a good idea if you want to simulate and prepare for field/woods shooting.

[triggerhappy243]

you guys are teasing. Making me think I need another muzzle loader...... just so I can make another range rod. LOL

[rfd]

i don't think anyone cares what kinda ml rod anyone uses, i sure don't. each rod type has its purpose, and since this is all subjective stuff, each of us will determine what's best for ... each of us, as it should be.

[triggerhappy243]

that does sound kinda harsh. I did not know soaking the wood rod in kreasote or kerosene would make it stronger.

[rfd]

kerosene soaked hickory ram/clean rods will be lots more flexible, not necessarily stronger. the flex allows them to bend more before shearing/breaking.

[Geezer in NH]

When you cannot go back and forth from using a range rod and the rifles ramrod you need to work on chewing gum and walking.

It is not hard unless you are not the least bit mechanically or coordinated type.

[rfd]

thank you for point that out, i would've never guessed i'm guilty of poor coordination or mechanically dysfunctional.

[country gent]

All my wood rods are hickory and soaked for a couple weeks in linseed oil then hung to drip for a few days. Wiped down several times and they are very flexable.An old timer at the club put me onto this. It does make it harder to glue ends on though. I use a piece of pvc tubing with a couple end caps for this. Its surprising how much oil the wood soaks up over this time span.

[pietro]

.

FWIW, I epoxy & pin the ends on every one of my RR's, and also on my range rod - which I first made from a ($1) orange fiberglas 48" driveway marker ( that's done zero harm to my barrels over the past 30 years).

The fiberglas range rod has done no harm to the bore because it's mostly used for pulling objects out of the barrel, which tends to straighten the range rod rather than flex it.

IME, a range rod is needed, as it's virtually impossible to obtain sufficient grasp on a normal RR for pulling a stuck boolit or patch from the barrel w/o grabbing the short end of the RR with a set of pliers - which (when grasped hard enough) will make short work of destroying the RR w/o pulling/removing the stuck object (even aided with either the barrel or the RR clamped in a bench vise).


.

[mooman76]

Pinning is a must or when you need it most the brass tip will come off. I have a fiberglass RR but only because it came with the gun. The Bevel Brothers actually did a test with different RR materials including fiberglass and found no measurable wear. I coated mine with a polymer so the little glass slivers wouldn't get my hand. I have about 6 different RRs of different materials.

[gnoahhh]

After god knows how many tens of thousands of shots I fired over the last 45 years or so with ML's, I have never dragged a range rod with me. Ever. I simply use the hickory rammers that are to be found under the barrels of all my rifles. I keep a modified army surplus .50 caliber MG rod in the shop for pulling charges sometimes. (I would never sluice a metal rod up and down the bore in the act of cleaning.) When I had to pull charges at the range or in the field I use the hickory rammer and one of those slick ramrod pulling handles. (I make my own brass accessory tips for on my rammers- extra long, epoxied and double pinned for strength.) But I can count on my fingers the number of times I had to do that. I do everything, including cleaning, with the guns rammer. And I always shoot from the bag. I never saw the sense in lugging a range rod and range box when everything I need for a day's shooting is either on the gun or in the bag.

[rfd]

i've used soaked rods, but see no real need for them. i make my rods from a 6' board of pignut hickory that i've had for nearly 20 years. just split off a 3/4" or so squared piece and scrape it down following the grain, as in making a longbow. some long guns, such as my chris walker .62 smoothbore, have tapered stock rod holes and require further rod tapering to fit not only the thimbles, but that stock hole. careful scraping does it. afterwards, the wood can be stained, and then i prefer doing a linseed oil "finish". some rods are left as is, with no tips, and their ends get wicked-in quality water thin CYA to harden and make the ramming ends more durable. sometimes i wrap the ball ramming end with fly tying thread before hardening.

careful use of a wood rod - where it's held during ramming, and how much effort to be used - is mandatory. lots will depend on how tight a patched ball will be used. if "target tight" and starters/hammers are needed, then it might be best to use a metal rod, i dunno, i see no need for tight balls and muzzleloaders. for all other looser loads, a good wood rod is a wonderful tool and all that's needed at the range or afield. ymmv.

[montana_charlie]

The factory ram rod that came with my CVA Buckhorn is very lightly constructed, and I expect it to fail sometime when I need it the most. For general use, I made a range rod out of birch dowel, with a 45ACP case on the pushing end, and a craft-store wooden ball on the other. I keep the factory one for extra. Birch is a bit brittle, so I have to be careful about pushing the rod sideways as the ball goes down the barrel, lest it crack.

Wayne
What you describe is the item I (we) used back when I shot in muzzleloading matches.
I broke the factory ramrod during a match, and suddenly understood why everybody else was using a
"fancy wipin' stick".

Mine has a cone-shaped end (rather than a big ball) and has a scalp brass nailed to the flat surface on top.

[waarp8nt]

I'm not sure if it should be called a range rod or not. My old man worked at a factory as a foreman in maintenance, he had several men working for him and some were good machinist. When he told the "good old boys" he worked with I was getting into muzzleloaders (before I could drive), they made me a nice solid all brass rod, brass tip, brass guide and brass handle. It sat in the corner by the loading bench for years before I actually used it. These days I take it anytime I shoot from a bench or go to the range, IMO its far too long, heavy and awkward for the field.

[waksupi]

I practice like I hunt so I just use my ram rod, but I take my rr and soak it in turpentine and linseed oil for a month or so before putting them into a gun. I can ususally bend them into a pretty good bow without cracking. I load a loose enough fit that I can push the ball in with little effort and I have a coned muzzle on my flinter. The only use I really have for the range rod is clean up in camp and pulling dry balls.

I used to do turpentine and diesel fuel, worked good, but seemed to dry out after a year or so. I now put a good coat of bear oil on them, and let it soak. The ramrods darn near turn into a noodle, they are so flexible. If no access to bear oil, oil from a road kill raccoon may be even better for a wood penetrate, followed by plain ol' lard. The old timers said that if you got one drop of racoon oil on a buffalo robe, it would soak the whole robe. Same kind of action on wood.

[Squeeze]

I Use a stainless "range" rod every time at the range, but I use the guns ramrod when/if a follow up shot is needed. when hunting something that usually takes a few shots daily (squirrel, birds with shot, etc) More often than not, ill use the usual guns rod, although sometimes use a handle just to make things more comfortable (usually just a piece of horn with a wallow in the center, used as a T bar type handle) depending on the typical force needed to load. I dont carry worms or puller jags afield, so a dryball or similar mishap requires a walk back to the truck anyhow.

[koehlerrk]

Range rod for range days, under barrel ramrod for hunting.

My range rod is a 7/16" coated fiberglass rod with a 2" hardwood knob pinned and epoxied to the end. Knob is also painted bright red, so I'm less likely to forget it while packing up. Brass fitting on the business end, and a brass bore guide.

For hunting I still use the plastic fantastic rod that TC saw fit to include on my Hawken. The only redeeming feature is ya can't break it easily.

Beyond that, short starter lives in my possible bag, and I do practice with the ramrod a few times because it does feel different. But my record number of muzzle loader shots during one days hunting was three. One miss, one doe, one buck. Miss was all my fault, guessed that buck was at 150 yards when he was closer to 225. At least that's where his tracks were. Other two were much closer.

Range rod wouldn't have helped me that day...

[dtknowles]

I think I have solved my ball pulling problem, not that I have ever had too, but since I might have jinxed myself I am prepared. I have a tee handle that will thread into my ramrod.

Tim

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

I have an all bras 4 piece with a aluminum handle and a stainless steel creedmoor from TOW https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/566/1/RAMROD-C-29-10

it is really good when paired with the TOW ball puller BP-50-10 TOW really got the geometry right on this ball puller , it also makes a great patch worm

[Standing Bear]

Range rod at the range and on first load when hunting. That first load is w a ball .005" under bore and a tight patch. Rod is SS w a Delrin muzzle guide/protector and about 4" longer than the barrel. All loads in the pouch are .010" under bore size and slightly thinner patch (.015 vs .020"). I would never use my hickory rods if carrying the range rod were convenient as I've seen barrels that were ruined using wood rods.
TC

[ogre]

When I go to the range I leave my ramrod at home and use my range rod exclusively.

[OverMax]

do you use a range rod to load at the range or in the field?

no.
My ram rods were changed to thick wall brass tubing. Custom made one's years ago. There proper Ends are lathe turned brass and all are recessed steel hollow pinned. Easy on the muzzle brass is. As wood rods are but thick walled brass is non-flexible and a whole lot stronger if having to pull a ball or projectile in the field or range. When I'm walking thru those woods on the scout "less is best."_ I see little benefit in sounding like a 150 year old peddlers horse drawn wagon or shuffling thing about to just take a shot. Game animals are known to smile as they walk away from such nosy individuals busy with their paraphernalia & trappings.

[scattershot]

Range rod, definitely for range use and cleaning in camp.​

[daschnoz]

Range rod, definitely for range use and cleaning in camp.​

^ ^ ^ This ^ ^ ^

I have a fancy nylon one that is good for cleaning. At the range to stuff the bore, I use a 7/16" dowel with a piece of 44MAG brass on one end (rim filed down to fit the 50cal bore).