Basket Case 99

[Good Cheer]

.308 Savage 99. It's the pits (literally), looks like it was lost in the woods until the next deer season rolled around. Pitted action. Chunks missing from the rifling. Functions fine. Rotary magazine works.
Got a replacement butt stock for it. Shot Lee 170 grainers in it to make sure everything works. I'm good to go.

With a choice of the various calibers to choose from that would function ok, I started asking myself if there any unusual and extremely cast friendly cartridges to rebore or rebarrel to? A .40? 41? 44? Maybe an elongated .45 head spacing on the case mouth? I'm looking around.

So yeah, this is the opportunity to modify a 99 without guilt, without remorse.
If you know a big diameter cartridge that will work, by all means step right up and speak your piece.

[dragon813gt]

358 Winchester. I have a 99E that's been converted to it by JES. Couldn't be happier :)

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa39/dragon813gt/Firearms/E37AE768-808A-41D5-9461-C43AE9C08DF5-5569-000005F2EDAF2926_zpsc33b89bf.jpg (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/dragon813gt/media/Firearms/E37AE768-808A-41D5-9461-C43AE9C08DF5-5569-000005F2EDAF2926_zpsc33b89bf.jpg.html)

[Kestrel4k]

+1, I can't think of a better candidate than the .358Win. :)

[Prodigal Son]

Me either, you love his work! I have 3 rebored by him and it's perfect

[dverna]

Another vote for .358

[TXGunNut]

http://www.35caliber.com/index.html

[Mica_Hiebert]

Looks like they gotcha covered...

[Jedman]

One other to consider, The 375-08. A friend had a handi rifle rebored and chambered by JES and he really likes it.

Jedman

[OnHoPr]

Obviously both will kill deer. There would only be slight differences in the application of your general shot to your possible shots on game. How often will you shoot it, going to the range and shooting target with it all the time pass your first "getting to know her" process, or just for shootin game? To shoot all the time besides just fun or sighting in for the season the larger to bore the more lead you will use basically unless you format pistol style boolits for your just fun shootin. A couple of things to consider are with range, if you want your PBR to extend to the 250 yd mark then the smaller cal with the longer boolit will give you better BC for Drop and Windage making it more accurately lethal. If your general range is the 50 to 150 yd mark with only a few possibilities to shoot to the 200 mark then the general consensus is the larger cal might have the edge on the knock down issue. Properly made boolits should be able to handle most deer size game on any raking shots necessary, though the larger heavier will have the edge on plus 200 lb critters.

A couple of suggestions for the "I started asking myself if there any unusual and extremely cast friendly cartridges to rebore or rebarrel to?" comment.

Longer range good BC candidates in both the 308 case and the 284 case which both have short necks along with magazine restrictions on OAL. That's if the rotary clip is functional or could be made functional with the 284 case which would provide more room for the slower gentler pushing powders. The .323 or 8mm with that one Lyman boolit (can't remember the no.) with the right twist had a supreme BC for a cast boolit. The 338 Federal or the 358 win can still give PBR's out to 250 with either case mentioned. The 284 case with that lyman 8mm boolit would give the best ballistics in longer range shooting.

Shorter range considerations would be for the 308 case the 375 cal and upwards to the 40 or 41 cals. With these you still could probably shoot a longer pistol style boolit without having the base of the boolit go to far in the case while still fitting to the magazine OAL. The 40 or 41 cal in a 250 gr or so boolit should be pretty decent smack down for the 100 yd shots at decent speeds.

Shorter range considerations for the "any unusual" 284 case would be the same as just mentioned above at higher speeds, but you could go up to the 44, 45, 480 cals, and possibly even the 50 S&W cal. You would have to start considering ID barrel stock on these. The barrel would warm up pretty quick for target shooting, but for one or two shots at game a 350 or 400 gr 480 cal at real good speeds might provide real good smack down for the one of a kind rifles.

Ummmmm, I would have to really look a powder considerations for something like a 44/284. A full case of 4350 might be a bit to slow of powder so full cases of 4895 or faster might be more appropriate. One of those ballistic programs would be necessary maybe with load development. A Lee 44 310 @ 2000 fps should do wonders on a decent size buck from any angle.

Another thought popped up was that if the case necks are short and the magazine has a limited OAL would PCing the boolits protect their bases better for 1 MOA shooting?

[021]

Above 375 caliber more than likely wont feed in a 99, and even then you will need to know how to tweek the rotor to get it to work.

[MostlyLeverGuns]

358 Win is probably simplest and best. A factory carrier for .358 would solve feeding issues. Your .308 carrier will need modification to work with a full magazine. 375-08 would not be too much of a workup. A 2 inch 400 Whelan, (400-308) might work. I keep looking at the possibilities of getting a .444 to feed, but a new barrel would be needed, with a lot of work on the carrier. The 99C with the removable magazine can handle some .284 wildcats. The .284's with rotary magazines have quite a different set-up for the carrier than all other rotary 99's, Not a simple carrier swap. The 338 Federal and 358 Win are 'easy' conversions with dies, components, bullets, molds and plenty of information as to what works.

[Blackwater]

I haven't worked on them enough to know, but from what I've heard and read, 021's advice is probably a big consideration. Feeding from those rotary mags is great when they're set up right, but CAN be challenging when swapping calibers, at least from what I understand through the years reading about those who've dealt with them. I'd probably just go with .358, a great caliber for just about anything short of the "Big 5" in Africa, and similar nasties. Feeding would be my first consideration in modifying any M-99, I think. I'd just be leery, unless I could get definitive advice on the matter, of changing too much without really good input first. Just MHO, and from a less practiced perspective than some others can provide, but something to consider at least?

[Shawlerbrook]

Another vote for JES and the 358.

[Kestrel4k]

So that's ~9 votes for the .358Win - nearly unanimous - rather unusual to get that sort of agreement on any online forum. ;)

[richhodg66]

I have a factory 99 in .358. A better deer rifle doesn't exist, at least not for the way and conditions I hunt.

[SierraHunter]

The 358 is a dang good round. I am not real fond of the model 99, so I probably would not even mess with it. Another optio would be to rebarrel it, in which case i would go with 250 savage.

[Good Cheer]

Happened into a 25-08 trim die years ago and wondered about trying the cartridge. Never went further than wondering.
But, whatever this rascal ends up being it will be a cast cartridge that happens to also be able to use jacketed instead of the other way around. 28 Long Neck (with 7-08 dies) is something I have experience with.

Been threatening for a long time to try out an improved 338 Federal.

http://i791.photobucket.com/albums/yy192/SNARGLEFLERK/338%20Fed%201.6BD%20Neck_zps45guonpy.jpg (http://s791.photobucket.com/user/SNARGLEFLERK/media/338%20Fed%201.6BD%20Neck_zps45guonpy.jpg.html)

Could do the same thing with a .308. But, I'd rather rebore rather than replace the barrel.

[MostlyLeverGuns]

If reboring a .308, headspace is a consideration. Improved versions may require setting the barrel back or living with 'longer than standard' headspace. For the 338 Federal and 358 Win there is little ballistic gain with an improved shoulder 30, 35, 40 or even 45 degrees. The sharper shoulder would reduce case shortening. There is some evidence that a longer neck can improve barrel life in the high velocity rounds - 243, the hot .22's and .25's, again the 338 and 358 are not barrel burners. There is not much evidence that longer necks are more accurate, considering the .300 Win, .308, .284, even the .300 Savage can shoot with extreme accuracy. Cartridge length in the Savage 99 is pretty much limited to 2.78 or so. Unlike the Marlin's, there is not any way to gain any useful cartridge length by tinkering with the 99's rotary magazine.

[Good Cheer]

For cast boolits I wouldn't want to change the powder volume or the shoulder angle.
Having a cast boolit case neck configuration that will also work with jacketed (instead of the other way around) is the way to go. With the .338 Federal the ogive lengths of commercial jacketed bullets will be a limiting factor if the case is configured to be jacket friendly.

[beezapilot]

You know I learned something about 99's a while back- guy at the club had a set of barrels for a takedown, one was a .410 smoothbore- got a lot of attention shooting skeet with a lever action.... Pretty cool... If I ever find one with a problem barrel...

[MostlyLeverGuns]

The spare 410 barrel works as a single shot on the Savage 99. Marlin has made a repeater 336 and 36(?) for 2.5" on and off, maybe Winchester in the 94 also.

[Scharfschuetze]

maybe Winchester in the 94 also

Yes, at one time, Winchester made a 410 gauge Model 94. Haven't seen one in ages.

http://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-for-sale-online/shotguns/winchester-shotguns-model-9410/winchester-model-9410-packer.cfm?gun_id=100735152

[TXGunNut]

Yes, at one time, Winchester made a 410 gauge Model 94. Haven't seen one in ages.



Saw one a few months back, looks like I should have bought it.

[Suo Gan]

I had JES redo a 99 to 358 some years ago. It was $300 or so, and a few weeks turn around if memory serves. Traded the gun off after I shot it a bit. It seemed like a good deal all around. I believe I went with the four groove rifling.

[358 Win]

Here's another vote for conversion to .358 Win. I own three .358's. A 760 pump carbine orginally chambered to .35 Remington, a custom Remington 700 with ER Shaw barrel and tuned action, and a factory Ruger Hawkeye. So far I've shot 21 Whitetails with the .358 Win cartridge. Twenty with the rechambered 760 carbine and one with the custom Remington 700. Every deer shot with the 760 carbine was with a round nose 200 grain Remington Core-Lokt or Hornady 200 grain round nose. The one deer shot with custom model 700 was with a 200 grain Remington Spitzer. Our Pennsylvania Whitetails just crumble when hit with a 200 grain bullet at between 2400 fps and 2500 fps.

Just a few years ago I did a test using Ramshot Tac powder and my two bolt action .358's. With a 200 grain bullet I achieved 2650 fps. With 220/225 grain bullet I was able to get 2520 fps. Using the 250 grain Hornady Round Nose an honest 2400 fps was garnered. The above speeds all exceeded the speeds of my factory .35 Whelen loads I had on hand (200 and 250 grainers as loaded by Remington). Of course my Whelen handloads exceed the factory loads, but a valid comparison of .35 Whelen factory loads and my .358 handloads is viable.

358 Win

[MostlyLeverGuns]

+1 on TAC for the .358. I am also getting 2515+ with the 22" barrel in a Savage 99. Easy extraction, cases rechamber without resizing. Loaded Winchester .358 brass 4 times, so far. This will be my elk load. Recoil not pleasant in under 8 lb rifle, carries nice though.

[Artful]

My Savage 358 is a keeper - that's what I would do with your project.

[Beerd]

How come nobody suggested a .358 Win?
..

[Spooksar]

Had a couple of Model 88 Winchesters in the same shape, had one made into a 338 Federal and the other into a 260 Remington. I already had a couple of 358 Win