Where ya' gonna' go?

[Blackwater]

Yeah, it's a play on the old Ghostbusters movie, but I can't help but wonder where lever fans are going to go now. Rem. seems unconcerned about putting out really good guns. Winchester doesn't seem terribly interested in truning out that many of theirs. So who ya' gonna' call? I can't help but wonder if Savage, who seems to be dedicated to putting out honestly good guns now, albeit at a price point, might be willing to give us a good lever gun? Does anyone know if they even have the ability?

I think if I were going to buy a bolt action hunting rifle now, it'd likely be a Savage. I do not like and won't pay my money for some of the cheap rifles put out to sell at a certain price point. Just too clunky and ugly for me. But Savage has some 110's at an attractive price, and their stocks can be replaced later to spruce them up.

I know Mossberg has had a lever gun, but there's something about it that I haven't been able to put my finger on that I just don't like. It's hard not to wonder if Savage might be able to come out with one. Were I in charge of the company, I have grave doubts I'd put the $$$ into R&D to develop one, though.

Probably just wishful thinking on my part. I wish C&C machines could produce M-99's again, too. Anyone got thoughts on this? If Hillary goes in, this will be the least of our and the gun companies' problems, for sure, but a man can hope and dream, can't he? So far, at least?

[runfiverun]

model 92's are made in other places.
even Taurus is starting to get their act together [sorta] but chiappa and 1-2 others turn out some super nice ones.
it'd be nice if Miroku went out on their own and figured out there is a market for a decent $700.00 lever gun.

[dragon813gt]

Remington is slowly getting their act together. I'm not happy w/ the prices but the quality is getting there. The final nail has not been put in the coffin of Marlin so there is no reason to lose hope. Plus there are tons on the used market.

[TXGunNut]

I'll go where I usually go, I'm more interested in used or antique leverguns anyway. Must admit I've been very happy with my recent production Remlin 1895 and Rossi R92. The new "price point" bolt guns apparently shoot quite well but leave me cold. Mossberg is pretty much the same way, it's muddled styling appears well-designed and well built but can't get past the looks. If I want a new "Winchester" I'll likely buy a Miroku or a Uberti.

[Scharfschuetze]

I guess I'm not going anywhere rifle or pistol wise. Over the years I've refined my shootin' irons to just what I want and they all provide top drawer accuracy and reliability, so... I guess I'm good to go in that category other than rebarreling a rifle now and then.

Now as far as top end double barrel shotguns for hunting and skeet... That's a different story.

[izzyjoe]

I hate to say it, but us lever gunners are a dying breed, the younger generation want semi autos. Its been awhile since I seen someone hunting with a lever gun, and I don't see many at the range either. The market seems to be a slow mover nowadays.

[shoot-n-lead]

Cost to produce reliable lever action's and a dwindling market does not bode well for the future of the design. But, quite honestly, I have predicted their demise, before.

[smokeywolf]

The market today is being driven by threats of "government" "gun control". This not only drives acquisition, but acquisition of firearms that are designed primarily for the purpose of defense as opposed to hunting and sport.

[shoot-n-lead]

The market today is being driven by threats of "government" "gun control". This not only drives acquisition, but acquisition of firearms that are designed primarily for the purpose of defense as opposed to hunting and sport.

Video games are probably more responsible for driving the auto market than politics. Most of these younger shooters (35 and under) are buying weapons of the type they have been using for years in these games. So, when the political atmosphere leans to talking about taking away their access to guns, they gravitate toward what they are familiar with...that just so happens to be the auto's.

[northmn]

Don't disagree with much of the above. Lever guns are getting pretty spendy as compared to bolt actions and bolt actions are good rifles. I have an inexpensive Mossberg 243 that shoots well and killed a deer. Gets hard for lever rifles to compete on that level.
Non Western styled levers like the 99 Savage, 88 Winchester and a Sako? never really went over. You have the BLR which has not taken the world by storm. Used to be dads would get their kids a lever 30-30 to start out with. They were inexpensive and a good "starter gun" Others would buy one as kind of a back up rifle or a walking rifle brush gun. They were then more inexpensive.
I think Texas Gunnut represents most of us. I like old lever guns and like to play with the old calibers or representative calibers. Even the tube magazine levers in "modern" calibers have not gone over well. Look at the flops of the Winchester developments like the 307, 356, and even the 7mm Waters. Are the 338 Marlin and 308 Marlin outstanding sucesses? Not saying that these are not good calibers or that the 99 or the 88 were not good rifles but they fell to the wayside on the market. This happened before the current tend toward semi autos.
Add to this the availability of the foreign classics like the 73 Winchsters etc and new companies like Henry. Often new companies can produce a product of new design more economically than an established company.

DP

[Scharfschuetze]

I hate to say it, but us lever gunners are a dying breed, the younger generation want semi autos. Its been awhile since I seen someone hunting with a lever gun, and I don't see many at the range either. The market seems to be a slow mover nowadays.

Sad, but probably true. As I noted in a previous post, I'm good to go with my lever guns. Unfortunately, that leaves the factories looking for customers other than me.

My brother is a collector of the Savage Model 99 lever gun and has some very nice ones. Given its design, it just can't be produced for a reasonable price anymore and the few out there will soon be in gun safes and off of the market.

How about showing us your levers? Here are mine. I don't have a picture of my Model 39 in 22LR, but the rest range in calibre from 32/20 to 45/70.

[starmac]

I have quite a few lever guns, started with a savage made in 1932. They were way ahead of their time, but sadly I doubt they will ever be produced again, at least not in my lifetime. I own several marlins and winchesters, most of them older, but one remlin, which is every bit as good as older marlins were, so I won't be discounting them yet.
I prefer older ones, just my preference, and the 92 knockoffs, just have never tripped my trigger, again personal preferance.
About the only reason I can forsee my buying a new one would be a 357 for my wife a plinker, and I her marlin (remlin) is bringing them back.
There is always henrys too, and I do actually like them, plus the fact they are U S made, and the company is second to none as far as standing behind their products.
I think while small, the market for lever guns will always be here, and we will have many good choices for years to come.

[Blackwater]

I think all of you have given good and insightful views. Lots of reasons seem to be at work, I think, and it saddens me greatly. I think I've done like so many now, and just waited too late to start "collecting" the "good stuff." Did the same with some old Ballards and Stevens single shots, too. Could have bought a good number at really good prices 40 years ago, but I just HAD to have the latest whiz-bang deer killers. Usually wound up shooting my deer at 100 yds. or less, though, even then, and an old Ballard would have really done that in style! But I let the glittery stuff catch my eye, and now ..... well, you know, doancha'?

Same with old Win. and Marlin leverguns. I DO at least have one pre-64 M-94 Win. in .30-30, though, circa '51. Had a M-64 .30-30 that shot like a house afire! It was made circa '39 according to ser. no. Loved that old gun. Had the "freckled" nickel steel receiver and that fast tapered 24" barrel. Got 2485 fps. with red box Fed. 150's and gee golly wow would that thing shoot! I put 4 of 4 (last 4 shots) in 13/16" at 60+ yds. with a peep sight, and I didn't even know I could still shoot that good wirh irons, even then! You bet those old guns can still shoot! I believe most of the pre-war Win.'s had hand lapped barrels, didn't they? I never had the heart to take that neat old M-64 out, and take a deer with it. Eyes were already getting dim in dim light. That old Whelen designed stock and long, tapered barrel made that gun handle like a "bird gun." I sold it and it's in the hands of a legitimate collector now, but I still miss it greatly. I'm just not a collector, and am never destined to be.

It's hard not to get wistful when you realize that you've left the good stuff behind you. Now that we have the capability of producing some really great guns, potentially, the economy and politics and the general decline of our education system seem to have made it unlikely some really great guns might see the light of day. And that saddens me, too. What we COULD do doesn't matter, I guess, if it's just not to be? I've had one M-99A levergun in .308 with the aluminum spool, and regret selling it, too. If I'd kept it, I'd have e-nickeled the receiver, and gotten some nice wood for it, with a roundish (pear shaped) forend and a stock for my dimensions. Also, it needed a little slicking up, which I did for a customer once. He was absolutely tickled with it when he got it back, and I did hear it was the talk of his deer camp too.

Love those leverguns, and really, they're probably the most practical rifles for my area, except maybe for the bean fields, and a few orchards I know of. But I've already got several rifles for that last scenario. Have only taken one deer with my Guide Gun, and hit it in the neck just behind the cranium. There was a whole vertebrae sticking out the exit wound! Leverguns are really great hunting tools, and not bad at all for defense or any other use, not to mention how great it is to just go out and plink or shoot targets with them. I love to see how far things have to be before I can't hit them any more. And cast and leverguns play together very well, too, which is a very good proposition - a LOT more shooting for the buck, which is a boon to us old timers on a fixed income now. Lots of answers to very relevant questions.

Unfortunately, in my area, those who have the nice old guns just don't let them go any more, and anyone who has an old, rusted post-64 think it's worth a king's ransom! As the wicked witch of the west said, "What a world!" And I guess that old saying "too soon old, too late smart" applies here too, sad to say. I've always loved the old leverguns from the '73's onward, but never thought they were "practical" for me. I THOUGHT I needed something that would take the deer I hunt out at 600 yds. when I was blindfolded! Such is the illusions of youth, I guess? 90+% of the deer I've ever taken could have fallen very easily to an old .32/40 single shot or lever gun and cast bullets.

I've had a lot of fun and enjoyed all the guns I've ever had, with few exceptions (the ones I couldn't get to shoot), but I surely could have been wiser along the way. I suspect many of us feel that way. Like people, the really great ones are rare, and it takes a lot of looking to really find a great one.

[021]

Where you're gonna go is the used levergun market. As a collector of Savage 99's I don't think you will see new ones, not that they couldn't be made--anything can be made, just that it would be so costly it would not sell. There are so many good used lever action rifles out there, that purchasing a new one at the price point it takes to make a profit vs. quality/price of the old ones makes it irrelevant. Witness the cost of the new Winchester/Miroku levers. This also takes into account gagging on rebounding hammers and safeties that aren't original to the guns.

[dragon813gt]

Someone said post pictures ;)

Remington made 1894C, they made a small run before shutting production down for years.
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa39/dragon813gt/Firearms/D4B74BE2-B90A-4EE6-A303-771740BE3987-8997-000006F3CC3D378F_zps8cfd886c.jpg (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/dragon813gt/media/Firearms/D4B74BE2-B90A-4EE6-A303-771740BE3987-8997-000006F3CC3D378F_zps8cfd886c.jpg.html)

JM Marlin 336 in 35 Remington. I forget what year it was made but it's pre crossbolt safety. Which I actually like on a hunting rifle.
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa39/dragon813gt/Firearms/001F0519-F1E9-4907-97E8-D3D0AB762944.jpg (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/dragon813gt/media/Firearms/001F0519-F1E9-4907-97E8-D3D0AB762944.jpg.html)

Savage 99E in 358 Winchester. I had to make this one :)
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa39/dragon813gt/Firearms/1CC79951-AC83-4BD2-A6EB-1595613772B3-5569-000005F2FC0B16B4_zpsb30ed834.jpg (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/dragon813gt/media/Firearms/1CC79951-AC83-4BD2-A6EB-1595613772B3-5569-000005F2FC0B16B4_zpsb30ed834.jpg.html)

I've posted the same pics many times so I will stop now.

I'd love to see a modern production Savage 99 if you could get it w/ the features you wanted. I'd want one in 35 Remington because I already have one in 358 and you always need more 35cal rifles :)

[021]

170083170085170086

An 1873 (1887 manufacture) 38-40 Winchester, a 22-250 Savage 99, and an 1894 (1902 manufacture) Winchester takedown. You said post pictures???

[6pt-sika]

I've owned over 100 Marlin levers , about a dozen pre 64 Winchesters and several Savage 99's . At the moment I own three Marlins all in 444 one from 1966 , one from 1967 and the third from 2001 . I also own one Winchester 1894TD in 30-30 from 1905 . As I see it those are more then enough lever actions for my own needs . I'll continue from time to time building myself a bolt action , matter of fact I think I need a nice semi lite 700 LH in 260 REM for my wife . I'll also continue to fool with Parker's SxS's , Browning Superposed O/U's and Remington/Krieghoff R-32 K-32 K-80 shotguns .

My circa 1966 Retro 444P with a Leupold Vari XII 1-4 on top . Chopped to 19"reblued and refinished .

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/444%20Marlins/IMG_7605_zps4mhqlued.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/444%20Marlins/IMG_7605_zps4mhqlued.jpg.html)

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/Deer/Deer11-10-12003_zps37ed861c.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/Deer/Deer11-10-12003_zps37ed861c.jpg.html)

My circa 1967 444 still at 24" also reblued and refinished .

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/444%20Marlins/Finished1967444001.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/444%20Marlins/Finished1967444001.jpg.html)

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/Deer/IMG_8945_zps1zckczww.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/Deer/IMG_8945_zps1zckczww.jpg.html)

And my circa 2001 444 restocked and the stupid crossbolt safety removed .

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/444%20Marlins/Newdesafetyon2001444003.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/444%20Marlins/Newdesafetyon2001444003.jpg.html)

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/444%20Marlins/Newdesafetyon2001444002.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/444%20Marlins/Newdesafetyon2001444002.jpg.html)

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/444%20Marlins/Newdesafetyon2001444001.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/444%20Marlins/Newdesafetyon2001444001.jpg.html)

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/Deer/11-23-11004.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/Deer/11-23-11004.jpg.html)

[Geezer in NH]

I have not bought a new manufactured rifle in the last 40 years for myself. I do not see a problem.

The newer guns have been a pain to me when sold from my shop and customers bring them back because the do not work. I do not miss this since I retired.

As far a I am concerned any now on the market lever guns are suspect of being carp.

I do not like any NY state based makers just for that reason and do not like 45/70 that load in a tube like a 22lr.

[blixen]

I hate to say it, but us lever gunners are a dying breed, the younger generation want semi autos. Its been awhile since I seen someone hunting with a lever gun, and I don't see many at the range either.
i never see another lever action at the range. It's all tactical weaponry. I usually have at least two levers--94, 336 or Sav.99.
FYI for the OP: I saw a used Rossi 92 in .454 that looked sweet. I don't know anything about them-- At least it's made in the Western Hemisphere.

[smoked turkey]

I have to confess that I am not "bent" toward lever actions as much as I am the bolt guns. I think it is because, in part at least, that triggers on the levers have made them difficult for me at least to shoot accurately. I have made myself hunt with lever actions some just to say I have. I have taken deer with the 444, and 35 Remington (Marlins), and without any problems. Even though I don't own any Henry lever rifles, I think if I were in the market for a lever rifle, Henry would get the nod. I really like the fact that it is USA made. It would be in steel and walnut. I can't do alloy or brass frames. I have a nice old Marlin 95 in 45-70 that I really need to hunt with so that is probably coming up next season. I like the 45-70 and have taken deer with it but in a No. 1 Ruger. I hate to see the lever action dwindle away because they certainly have their place in the shooting/hunting scheme of things. I say to Marlin, "come on and get your act together".

[Blackwater]

I think there's a lot of wisdom and insight in all the above. I wish I still had that really great old M-64. I wouldn't take it afield because it was such a great rifle, and I thought it simply should be preserved for posterity, so people could one day see what a really great rifle looks, operates and feels like one day (hopefully) far from now. Just like I love those old PA and Ky rifles of so long ago these days.

Today, if I still had it, I think it'd be one of if not my MAIN hunting rifle. Hunting with it just tastes different than hunting with a more "modern" bolt gun. And I just plain like that taste. Whatever its monetary value was would men little to me. I'd just maintain it well and care for it like it deserved to be treated, and simply use it, but not abuse it. Just like its makers intended.

I have a friend who has a really especially beautiful cusom #1 Ruger that he hunts with regularly, though it cost him over $5,000 all tolled. And yeah, it's got a few little dings and scars here and there. Not many, and not bad, but each one is a reminder of a memory of certain great hunts he's carried it on. And hunting with it has a different flavor than hunting with his other guns. In those times when he's alone in the woods with nothing but that rifle, he can simply look down at it, and get lost in its beauty and functionality, and those tiny "scars" remind him of prior hunts he can become wistful and appreciative about while he's waiting on ol' mossy horns to peek out of the brush. And when he takes one with that gun, it's the culmination of several years of planning and decision making and lots of talent in the 'smiths who made it up for him the way it is now. Any gun we truly have feelings for can accomplish this, of course, if we just get away from the "money rules everything" mentality. I'm really proud and more than a little jealous of those of you who have some really fine old leverguns, and still take them out for a nice walk in the woods. I've had my chance, and I'll take what I've got and really enjoy them, but some of the really fine old guns can't help but evoke some special respect and appreciation from me. The folks who made them put a little bit of their souls in them, and that's what separates the new, machine made guns, from the older, more finely crafted ones. If you can't feel and hear the difference between them, you're not looking closely enough, IMO. Our taste has gotten more plebian over time, and "whatever will work" has come to be the standard of the day, today. But there'll always be those who relish those older, more "spiritual" guns. They really are something special, whether many can see, feel or detect it now or not. There'll always be those who see the difference, even when they become rare. This, I think, is why those older leverguns continue to climb in value. It's the only real explanation that I have for it. Traditions are wounded easily, but they really die VERY hard!

[FergusonTO35]

I think it's going to be Henry. They are turning out quality guns at reasonable prices and they will take of you if you have problems. Also, I see no indication that they are planning to participate in the great race to the bottom at cheap mart price war that killed Marlin, Winchester, and H&R.

Remlin still has miles to go before they regain my trust. I bought a brand new turkey barrel with rifle sights for my 20 gauge 870 last week, part number 80062. It showed up yesterday and I discover that the front and rear sights are not aligned properly. When you shoulder the gun you are presented with the choice of front sight leaning to the left or rear sight leaning to the right. It's going back and somebody better make it right or give me my money back so I can purchase the same for my "inferior" Mossberg.

[wrench man]

I've got a whole slew of pre Remlin Marlins in my safe, one Winchester and one Pedersoli, the only Uberti I have is a wheel gun, but if they put the same effort into their rifles.
I have yet to see anything from south of the border that's worth a $%*&
The Henrys just don't do it for me?, they do stand behind their product.

[Shawlerbrook]

Got to agree with the "going used" crowd. I own 15 leverguns , and only 2 were bought new, both Henry's. I hope leverguns aren't popular, but don't agree that it is true. Good, used ones sell and are a good investment.

[FergusonTO35]

Used lever actions never stay on the shelf long around here, maybe a week at the very most.

[Kestrel4k]

I think there's a lot of wisdom and insight in all the above. [...]
+1 on this fine post above. :)

Am most likely going to pick up my new-to-me Rossi M92 in 44Mag this weekend, I do think that there's something about shooting a lever-action that I don't get from my other rifles.
This may be my 'fun' gun (long octagon bbl & tang sight), despite having scoped Win88 and Marlin .44Mag & .444's.

[Jake70]

Uberi, Marlin, and Rossi are still cranking out lever actions, and the Winchester Model 94 and Marlin Model 336 are still super popular. I don't think they're going anywhere.

[6pt-sika]

I like the 45-70 and have taken deer with it but in a No. 1 Ruger. I hate to see the lever action dwindle away because they certainly have their place in the shooting/hunting scheme of things. I say to Marlin, "come on and get your act together".

Here are a pair of eight pointers a got a couple years ago !

Did them in with a Ruger #1H in 375 H&H MAG shooting handloads using the no longer made Nosler 260 BT .

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/Deer/15_zpsf3d652ac.png (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/Deer/15_zpsf3d652ac.png.html)

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/Deer/14_zpsf8229927.png (http://s50.photobucket.com/user/6pt-sika/media/Deer/14_zpsf8229927.png.html)

[MostlyLeverGuns]

I will just keep buying used Savage 99's or older Marlin's when I think I 'NEED" another rifle. I have Browning BLR's - .223, .308, .22-250, &mm Mag, .300 Mag, .325 and .358. The Browning trigger and need to be oily to function means I really should unload them to a tree sitter or range ninja. When Henry's Long Range shows up I will give it a try. If Henry centerfire tube feeds had a side-loading gate I would probably have one. I do like my Henry .22 and .17. I like my beater Win 71, but it is heavy and I prefer a Savage 99 .358 with its 2.5 Leupold for timber elk. The .358 is much lighter than my Marlin .45-70, my .444, and the Winchester 71. I always hunt with some scope, usually 2.5 or 3 power so Winchesters get left behind. I do keep a receiver-sighted Savage 99 for hunting in rain or snow, also when packing meat. There are a lot of good-used rifles out there. Not many in Wyoming gun stores, but the Internet had changed much. I do keep looking at Winchester .32 Special's though, I might 'NEED" one yet.

[paul s]

Gunshows,auction,flea markets,estate sales,internet gun sites. Only interesting leverguns are older used ones, no?

[BAGTIC]

I bought a Howa.

[Drm50]

The last new factory built rifles I have bought were all Rugers. Bought 77 back in 60s when first
out, same with #1,#3,& 77/22. There is nothing new that I would buy or want. I will not by
foreign made replicas or anything that sounds like it comes with bread sticks. The old model guns
are still out there, you just have to look. I guess I'm lucky to live in rural area where almost every
house hold has a gun or two. And believe it or not everyone with a few guns are not gun collectors. I read a book a few years ago, Winchester Repeating Arms Co, this book was more
about the company than the guns themselves. A very dry read, but I forced myself to read it.
The demise of Winchester was strictly cost of production. Most people don't realize the amount of
had work that went into all pre 64 Winchesters. The point is guns of this quality, not just Wins,
will never be made again. Savage went down the tubes in late 80s, they were putting out junk.
They are lucky they survived reorganization, around the 110 rifle, which was a 3rd rate rifle.
The other story is Mossberg, another 3rd rate company, put full court press on 500 series. Who
would have thought these two would come out on top of heap. Remington who was always the
choice of guys who couldn't afford Wins or Brownings had the lead for a few years. Their expansion and quality control has hurt them. All the old companies are gone, ate up by the big
corporations. And the plastic and stainless steel guns of the video games is what is keeping them
in business. Ammo for these is were the market is at, so they are not going to make anything
they can't sell by the truck load. And that is the sad state of affairs in US gun & ammo manufacturing.

[Blackwater]

I think it's all about who's in charge and leading the companies, and the decisions they make. It one was, that the CEO's knew a thing or two about their wares, but not any more. And this, I think, more than anything else, has squelched any really good new developments. We know how to make a really ergonomic stock, but they're made (by decisions down from the top) to be cheaper to produce. The looks, feel and sound of a really nice rifle are just plain gone now. It's all about "cheap." It's one more reason I don't like shopping at Wal-Mart, who originated and popularized "cheaper is better." T'ain't necessarily so! But then, real thinking has pretty much gone out of style too, so .... I guess it really makes sense?

[6pt-sika]

I think it's all about who's in charge and leading the companies, and the decisions they make. It one was, that the CEO's knew a thing or two about their wares, but not any more. And this, I think, more than anything else, has squelched any really good new developments. We know how to make a really ergonomic stock, but they're made (by decisions down from the top) to be cheaper to produce. The looks, feel and sound of a really nice rifle are just plain gone now. It's all about "cheap." It's one more reason I don't like shopping at Wal-Mart, who originated and popularized "cheaper is better." T'ain't necessarily so! But then, real thinking has pretty much gone out of style too, so .... I guess it really makes sense?

This is nothing new I've preferred Marlin's made before 1980 for a long time . I've preferred Remington 700's made before 1990 for awhile as well . Actually prefer a Krieghoff K-32 over a K-80 , prefer the old Browning Belgian made Superposed over the Citori thats made in Japan . And of course it goes without saying original Parker's leaps and bounds over the Parker Reproductions . The fact that most of the shotguns I hunt with are over 100 years old might tell you something as well .

Now with that being said how much of the c..r..a..p being produced now do you think will still be functional and usable in 100 years .

[paraord]

After some work I am very happy with my Rossi 92 in 44 mag, 20" octagon barrel.
Again mind you I had to do some work but now it cycles 1.680" OAL very reliably and shoots great. A little action work and that 92 is mighty slick.

[quilbilly]

Just for the record, I have really enjoyed my Mossberg lever gun 30/30. Of course it is the one with the wood stock and I put a Skinner sight on it. It has been trouble free and has shot well anything I have fed it from the 130 gr plain base Lyman with Trail Boss at 1400 fps to gas checked 160's at 2000 fps. I got it on sale and it has been a lot more than I paid for.

[EllasPapa]

I find it really interesting to read about other people's interests, and where they came from. I'm the first "shooter" in my family; my Dad grew up on a farm in Western Canada, through the great Depression. They had a .22 single shot for any rabbit that might wander into the yard, and a .12ga single with 3 rounds of #4 shot in case of a coyote or wolf. My Dad didn't ever get a chance to fire the .12 ga. & couldn't remember it ever being shot in his lifetime.

When I got started shooting in the 70's, my career almost forced my decision to shoot handguns mostly, and compete in PPC & IPSC when it eventually came along. Rifles had little fascination for me, and I didn't even own one until my mid 20's. Eventually, things like raising kids, increasingly rigorous gun controls in Canada, i almost stopped shooting entirely for a decade. When I got back into it, the "tactical" thing was just beginning, and I fell victim to it too.

Although I shot thousands of rounds through a variety of revolvers, I had no interest in western style single actions. S&W, Colt wheelguns, sure, but those rounded out backstraps did nothing for me. Same thing with lever guns. Old designs, antiquated compared to the modern semi's...not my thing.

I got a good deal on a stainless Marlin guide gun a few years back, and learned to love lever guns. I never shot it a lot because of it's cost per round. It's really only been quite recently when I picked up the Rossi Ranch Hand and turned it itno a "Canuck SBR" that I really started to love the simplicity and strength of design. I'm looking for another lever gun before I say "enough"...Not sure what or when, but I think I'll know it when I see it

[starmac]

Where ya gonna go, well I'le just go up to the gun room and pick out another one. lol No more than I shoot, I will never wear them all out, and really have no need for another one. BUT when the right deal jumps up I will grab it, needed or not.
I was driving through the truckstop parking lot the other day and saw a guy checking out an octagon barrel something or other from an individual. I resisted the urge to stop and see if he bought it or not, but it was tough.

[Blackwater]

Starmac, you're a man after my own heart, but I'd have stopped! And really, you're right, but it's awfully hard not to "fall in love" with a gun when it just cries out your name and swivels its hips so alluringly. Call me easy, I guess?

[DonMountain]

I am not sure what is driving this discussion. Since bolt action rifles are within a few years of origination with the lever action rifles everyone here is describing. So its not an "age" thing. I have a Remington-Keene bolt action rifle in 45-70 that was built in the 1880's. The main reason I like and hunt with my lever action Winchester 94 rifles is because of how light they are in comparison to my Winchester Model 70. And the ease of handling them climbing up into a tree stand. But, when I am hunting over an open soy bean field I use my Model 70 in 338 Win Mag for its range and killing power. And my Model 94 in 356 Win for the shorter range woods gun. But I do find using the lever action more "fun" to shoot. So, for me its a "fun" thing because I grew up watching westerns on TV.

[Dimner]

I'm 39. I started small game hunting for the first time two years ago. I deer hunted for the first time last year. My first center fire rifle is was a marlin 336. Not sure if I'm the exception to the rule, but you wont find me owning anything with a synthetic stock. On top of that I always look at lever guns first before bolts.

Here's my 2nd deer I took last year (both deer taking with the 336) One shot kills. 30-30. Factory loads though, this was before I started casting.

171679
(i know i used a scope like a sissy. I was nervous about how little trigger time I had on my gun before my first season)

My son of 13 also likes levers better than anything, and my 31 year old hunting buddy as well.

If you want my opinion (not that you asked) levers are not being made because the used market is so saturated with them. I can pick up a 70's Win 94 or Marlin 336 in 30-30 for $250-400 bucks. My marlin cost me $375 and was made in 1957 or near that.

[Bigslug]

The Italian / Cowboy market is already there, and already making good guns on the old patterns. It's a simple matter to adjust the aesthetic from say, 1891 to 1934, if in fact the demand is there.

Miroku is ABSOLUTELY capable of turning out a Winchester to pretty amazing standards.

But there's A LOT of lever guns out there in the hands of the aging, or their descendants who want something else. The guns are out there.

With regard to the gun rights uncertainty - while the AR-15 may have an uncertain future, the truth is that it doesn't give up much tactical utility to a .357 lever gun. While it may be odd to those who's image of a lever action is based on a certain John Wayne aesthetic, we may start to see 1873 clones with Aimpoints and Streamlights in the new home defense market.

[6pt-sika]

The Italian / Cowboy market is already there, and already making good guns on the old patterns. It's a simple matter to adjust the aesthetic from say, 1891 to 1934, if in fact the demand is there.

Miroku is ABSOLUTELY capable of turning out something out a Winchester to pretty amazing standards.

But there's A LOT of lever guns out there in the hands of the aging, or their descendants who want something else. The guns are out there.

With regard to the gun rights uncertainty - while the AR-15 may have an uncertain future, the truth is that it doesn't give up much tactical utility to a .357 lever gun. While it may be odd to those who's image of a lever action is based on a certain John Wayne aesthetic, we may start to see 1873 clones with Aimpoints and Streamlights in the new home defense market.

The Italian market is good and fine if that's what a person wants . And if that is the case it's nothing wrong with that . I personally don't care for that type thing , but then I don't care for Winchesters made after 1963 or Marlin's much after 1980ish anymore . However I do own ONE Marlin that was made in 2001 .

I think for people like myself the ONLY option is buying used/collectible old Marlin's Winchesters and perhaps Savage 99's .

[rondog]

I currently have a 1994 Winchester 94AE Trapper in .44mag, and a 1990 Marlin 336SC in .30-30. Also have a new Rossi R92-52011 on layaway, have the cash to pick it up but the store is closed until Saturday the 9th. That one's stainless, 24" octagonal barrel, .45 Colt.

So that's my three levers, I'm lusting for more. Blows my mind what old beat-up Winchesters are going for these days! Used to be everywhere and cheap. Not any more.....

[45-70 Chevroner]

I hope I'm not the last one to post here as it's been 5 days since the last post. It's been a fun thread. I At present have 5 Lever guns still in my safe. I have given three others to three of my grandsons. The ones in the safe are a 1925 25" octagon barreled Winchester 94 30-30, two Marlins a model 36, 35 Rem. that was rebarreled to 38-55 with a new stock and forearm, and a 336, 30-30, rebarreled to 38-55 with new stock and forearm both done by Marlin back in 2003 and 2004 for $288.00 each including shipping too and from Marlin. I also have two Rossis one a 357 16" barrel and a 45 Colt 20" barrel. I truly love all of them but I wish the future looked brighter. I'm not a pessimist but if this next election goes bad, we are going to have one hell of a fight on our hands

[Blackwater]

Right now, I only have three: A Marlin Guide Gun .45/70, a pre-'64 M-94 Win. .30/30, and a Marlin 1894 .44 mag. I've got my eye out for a Marlin M-39M and a .357 levergun, preferably a Marlin with the "Ballard" rifling. They're scarce as hen's teeth around here. If I get just a little more disgusted with my local search, I'll reach out on the internet and do another long distance deal on both of those. My son's favorite all time .22 was the 39M he had when very young. I'm betting he'd really love to have another one! And I'm betting the grandboys will really, really love shooting the .357, even with mild loads in our back yard. Iron sights would make the .357 a real challenge and learning experience for them, too, I think. And I think it's good for the young today to envision themselves as "cowboys." All our pursuits have "unintended consequences," and the closer we keep to the "cowboy ethic," at least the ones that wore the white hats, the better they become as men and the stronger the nation becomes. I like that as a "side effect" of purchasing a gun.

[starmac]

Whai is on hand, starting with my first centerfire rifle.
M99 300 savage take down that was rechambered to 300 at some point.
pre 63 model 94 30/30 win, iirsc it is a 53 vintage
win in 44 mag, nice little carbine
Now for the marlins.
stainless 45/70 guide gun.
m 95 45/70 but with 22 in barrel
308 mx, just plain sweet
45 colt octagun cowboy, just plain fun.
39 A 22 rimfire, again just plain fun
M 57 (I think, too lazy to go check) in 22 mag.

Seems like I am forgetting some, but again, too lazy to go check.
In the last couple of years I have given several to the kids.

My order of preference is savage, win, marlin, but am not what a guy would call predujice when it comes to levers. The foreign copys haven't tripped my trigger yet, but who knows what the future holds.

[Geobru]

My dad had an 1886 Winchester that he bought as a youth at an auction. It sat in his closet all the while I was growing up. I used to sneak in and rack the action periodically, and thought it was the coolest gun ever.

When I started hunting in 1965, I bought a 30-06 Remington 731 for $65, a Model 12 Winchester for $69, and figured I had all the guns I would ever need. Then, just before I got married, my wife and I decided to buy something that we had always wanted. She bought a Bernina sewing machine that she used to make clothes for our children, and a wedding dress for our eldest daughter. I bought a Browning BLR which I used to feed the family for 30 plus years.

I thought that would be all the gun I would ever need until I got a serious case of levergun-itis. Added an 86, a 94, couple of 9422's, a BL-22, a 64, a 92, and Model 12s in all gauges.

Like others in this thread, I don't have a lot of interest in the new guns. You might have to look and be patient, but there are shooters out there that will make someone happy for a long time. Its just that the prices have gone up and you have to plan for making those investments.

[upr45]

Next lever I buy will be a used Marlin in 30-30. Have Marlins in 45-70's, 35 Rem, .44RM, & 357RM. Sad to say, but have nothing at present in 30-30. For me a good deal comes usually unexpectedly, so when it does I'll be ready for a 30-30, unless a 375 shows up or another 35 Rem.

[superc]

I believe SmokeyWolf put his thumb on much of the problem. Why would a manfacturer spend time and money to market a new lever gun if he can just pump out ARs for quick sale instead? A genuine problem for all gun owners is that less than about 4% of the US population still hunts. If we can't ban ARs for hunting while also knocking the percentage of hunters in the US back up to 6% then there probably simply won't be enough market pressure to make marketing a new lever gun for hunting profitable.

That being said, I hunt and my favorite brush rifle is a tuned Winchester Centennial Trapper 94 AE in .45 Colt with fiber optic front sight and a peep sight in the rear. 250 gr. XTP on top of over 20 grains of 2400. Out to 75 yards (maximum visibility here) a chest hit literally knocks them down and sprawling. They don't get up either. Have U ever missed the heart? Sure. Did it matter? No. Durn shell thinks it is a grenade and it is just juice inside when opened.

Before moving to land ruled by Kudzu and giant raspberry bushes (with 1 1/2"+ thorns) my favorite pine woods gun was a Savage 99C in 300 Savage (I miss that gun).

Yes, just find a used lever and give it a tune up.

[Drm50]

I only have 8 traditional levers left, and 2 Savage 99s. Have been thinning things down for two
years. I just traded off a 375 Marlin and sold a 71 Win. Will be 66 tomarrow and have decided
to start liquidating guns that I won't be using any more. Win 95/30-06, Mar 94/32-20, Mar 97
Win 53/25-20 and Mar 95/JM, Mar 336 Marauder 30-30, Mar 94/ 44 JM, Mar 39 JM.

[OverMax]

If Hilly gets in and cancels sales of all ARs to the public I'll see better hunting days in my local.
As far as new or old lever rifle ownership. If some other hasn't bought a lever of some sort by now they probably never will. On the other hand if no manufacture introduce yet lever to the market place. Mine will undoubtedly increase in collectors value and that sure as hell pleases me.

[izzyjoe]

Keep those pictures coming boys, I love those older leverguns!

[Petrol & Powder]

Lots of good stuff on this thread.

The first gun I ever shot was a Marlin Model 39.

Lever Actions (or Lee- ver action, as my more rural friends trend to say ;-)), are uniquely American firearms. The design allows for a compact repeater with very quick follow up shots. Unfortunately, I agree that the type is probably waning in popularity. I'm not convinced semi-auto's are the threat to the survival of lever actions but there does seem to be changing trends in rifles.

The real threat to lever actions is the cost of machining and fitting required to assemble them. I do think that with the right manufacturing methods, a good quality but inexpensive lever action could be made but there just doesn't seem to be the market to support that investment.

I'm not really a lever action guy but I am a gun guy and I've looked at a lot of lever actions. I think Remington is trying to hit that price point / quality intersection where they can make money. I think the window for profit in that type of design is very narrow.

There may be a market niche for a high quality lever action rifle that cost more than the current Remingtons but not so much that they are out of reach for the people that want that type of gun. Perhaps with just the right manufacturing techniques utilizing investment casting, CNC machining, EDM and other methods a high quality lever gun could be made. I'm not sure that market is there but if it is, someone will attempt to fill that need.

[rondog]

Next lever I buy will be a used Marlin in 30-30. Have Marlins in 45-70's, 35 Rem, .44RM, & 357RM. Sad to say, but have nothing at present in 30-30. For me a good deal comes usually unexpectedly, so when it does I'll be ready for a 30-30, unless a 375 shows up or another 35 Rem.

Don't turn up your nose at a .32 Win. Special either.....

[6pt-sika]

Don't turn up your nose at a .32 Win. Special either.....
I prefer the 32 Special over the 30-30 . Nothing's wrong with the 30-30 but I just like the 32 cal a bit more .

[TXGunNut]

I prefer the 32 Special over the 30-30 . Nothing's wrong with the 30-30 but I just like the 32 cal a bit more .


Agreed. It's certainly earned the moniker of "Special" even though the difference isn't apparent to most folks. Quite fond of the Thutty-thutty these days, tho. ;-)

[Bigslug]

If Hilly gets in and cancels sales of all ARs to the public I'll see better hunting days in my local.
As far as new or old lever rifle ownership. If some other hasn't bought a lever of some sort by now they probably never will. On the other hand if no manufacture introduce yet lever to the market place. Mine will undoubtedly increase in collectors value and that sure as hell pleases me.

Worth considering is that while a lot of us got exposed to "Weatherbyism" and got over it, there's still a lot of it out there - the mindset that you need a 2800+ FPS cartridge with long pointy bullets to kill deer at the national average of what? - 70 yards? The truth is that levers will usually get it done, and for most of us even with tired eyes iron sights will often get it done, but Madison Avenue or limited hunting opportunities convince us that they won't, and so the lever languishes in the eyes of the mainstream.

On top of that, they're harder to make, harder to maintain than a bolt gun that shoots flatter, has a less punishing stock geometry, and is easier to hang the "necessary" optic on. The "bottom line" of manufacturing has gotten us to the point of needing to go to the "high end" police or military pump shotguns to get a cast aluminum triggerguard instead of injection-molded plastic. Things keep going like that, "Pre-64" might as well read "Westley Richards" for what it's doing to the prices of stuff that was actually milled and blued.

[Petrol & Powder]

"Weatherbyism" - I haven't heard that term before but I like it.
What Bigslug said about the perceived need for speed is very true. I worked with a guy that pushed everything he shot to the maximum possible velocity. He was an excellent marksman and an ethical hunter but he evaluated every cartridge based on velocity.

While I understand the benefits of high velocity, I think a lot of people ignore the costs of high velocity.

I'm not really a lever action guy but I've owned a few. I've always considered the lever action to be a very useful tool in some circumstances. The .30-30 is not a 7mm Remington magnum or a 338 Lupua Mag, but seriously - why do you need that to kill a deer less than 100 yards away?

[Jack Stanley]

Some folks just seem to believe that cheaper is better , the makers will gladly step up to the plate for that . In the used market some still want it as cheap as they can get it . Like the guys that want to offer you less than half of what the current lever gun market is for rifles . I can sympathize with the older guys trying to scale back what they have . I've had to dispose of my brothers collection and now mine . It seems that around here older Marlins don't sell unless you price them at a third of what sales in other areas are .

That's alright , the ones I have are nice ones and I guess I don't really "need" to sell them .

Jack

[DerekP Houston]

There is a marlin 30-30 JM at the pawnshop across the street...if it is still there next month after the 15th I'll make him an offer. Just another wish list item at a good price.

Seems like a good candidate for me to start my rifle casting for, nice forgiving round.

[izzyjoe]

30-30 is a fun caliber to shot cast boolits in, slug the barrel, cause boolit sizing is key in microgrove bores.

[Kestrel4k]

Have been shooting bolt rifles almost exclusively this year; but this morning I took my Rossi M92 .44Mag out to the range - all sorts of nostalgia from loading my ammo into that side port for sure. :)

[starmac]

There is a marlin 30-30 JM at the pawnshop across the street...if it is still there next month after the 15th I'll make him an offer. Just another wish list item at a good price.

Seems like a good candidate for me to start my rifle casting for, nice forgiving round.

That 30/30 can and will do everything loaded with cast as jwords, and will also do anything a guy can do with one hunting wise in Texas, other than possibly fsr west Texas wide open country, where you might get some longer shots.

[shoot-n-lead]

that 30/30 can and will do everything loaded with cast as jwords, and will also do anything a guy can do with one hunting wise in texas, other than possibly fsr west texas wide open country, where you might get some longer shots.

x 2 ^^^^

[Brandi]

I'll agree with you about the Savage rifles. My first center fire bolt action rifle was a Savage 116 FCSS Weather Warrior .30-06. This was pre AccuTrigger and AccuStock but even then they were extremely accurate and easily the best buy anywhere. I'm now on my second Savage 116 FCSS, this time with the AccuTrigger and AccuStock, and they are even better. You just can't buy a more accurate rifle for the money.

As far as lever guns go I grew up shooting a Winchester 94 .44 magnum and love the guns but once Winchester started putting safeties on their lever guns I lost interest. Now that they are being built in Japan they would have to pay me to own one. I'd love to have another top eject pre-safety gun but they can keep the rest of them. My sister and I both have Henry Big Boy .45 Colt rifles and I can't recommend them enough. Absolutely beautiful, extremely accurate, butter smooth action and far easier to unload than my Winchester. Granted if I were going into battle I'd choose the side loading gate style but for everything else I definitely prefer the tube loading. The only downfall to the Henry is they are significantly heavier than the Winchester but that works out pretty well for everything except carrying it for long distances. They do have lighter models now though so that's an option.

I have no experience with other brands so that's all I have :)