peened metal on Remington Model 11

[Battis]

I just got a 12 ga Remington Model 11 (made in 1921). It's in great shape - even the fiber buffer in the rear of the receiver is intact. But, somewhere during its past life, the bolt slammed forward without the barrel in place, and the forward edge of the ejection port got a little peened from the operating handle. It doesn't interfere with anything, and there's no cracks in the metal. So, should I leave it alone or try to smooth it out somehow?

[Mk42gunner]

Can you post a picture of it? One person's little is another's major.

Whatever you decide to do, I would keep the Dremel tools far away from that shotgun.

Robert

[Battis]

It's right in front of the operating handle (1st pic) and at the tip of the pen in the 2nd.

http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m217/pohill/DSCF5270_zpsqghx6lif.jpg
http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m217/pohill/DSCF5277_zpsqnhmbpbx.jpg

[knifemaker]

I would leave it along since it is not causing any problems. You would have to remove too much metal to fully remove that indention and it would show like a sore swollen thumb.

[Battis]

Cosmetically, it doesn't bother me. I was wondering if it might cause a weak spot in the metal or some other unseen problem. I thought of gently peening it back into place but...I'll just leave it alone.
Thanks.

[Walter Laich]

As much as I hate a blemish like this I would let it be. Peening it back would also work the metal and could continue to weaken it.

[Mk42gunner]

It has been a long time since I last had a Remington Model 11 apart, but I don't think you will have any functional problems with that mostly cosmetic blemish.

Keep the friction rings set right and hold the shotgun firmly (it is recoil operated) and it should give you good service for decades.

Robert

[Battis]

I fired 10 or so rounds the other day and it worked fine with the (Walmart) Winchester Heavy Game and Target loads, though the plain Target Loads would not cycle the action. They worked fine with the rings in the Light Load arrangement. I also brought my newly acquired Remington Model 8 .35 Rem with ammo that I loaded - it works great. I bought them at the same store so I'm thinking that a family is selling off a collection.
Two great shooters.

[w5pv]

Remember that with a loaded round in the barrel the barrel can be shoved back in the receiver far enough to fire the round when it hits the back or hump of the gun.My father in law shot the lower part of his right lung trying to get an old paper hull out that had swollen in the chamber tight enough that it would not eject the round with bolt.He lived through the ordeal but toted most of the shot in his side and right arm for the rest of his life.So be careful and safe as always.

[Battis]

Before I bought the Model 11, I put it on hold and did some research. The model that I bought has a fiber buffer attached to the inside/rear of the receiver - the earlier models didn't have the buffer. Without a buffer in the earlier Model 11s, the bolts were prone to cracking when they slammed back. I wonder if they also accidently fired rounds as w5pv described...
When I went back to get the shotgun I asked the salesmen (a few of them) if I could check for the buffer - they looked at me like I was a little whacko. There was no buffer that they'd ever heard of. Now, the Browning Auto 5, basically the same gun, doesn't have a buffer, but from what I read the timing is a little different in that gun, so it's not needed. Anyways, they told me there was no buffer or a need for one - I asked if they'd take the gun back if I found that the bolt was cracked because there was no buffer (you really have to disassemble the gun to check the buffer). They said they would. I got it home, took it all apart, and sure enough there's a big fat buffer in the rear of the receiver (and in great shape). Did I march back to the store to show them? Tempting, but I'm too cheap to pay the $2.50 toll each way.

[gwpercle]

Remember that with a loaded round in the barrel the barrel can be shoved back in the receiver far enough to fire the round when it hits the back or hump of the gun.My father in law shot the lower part of his right lung trying to get an old paper hull out that had swollen in the chamber tight enough that it would not eject the round with bolt.He lived through the ordeal but toted most of the shot in his side and right arm for the rest of his life.So be careful and safe as always.

My first cousin nearly lost his right arm doing this with an old Browning, don't push the barrel down with a live round in there.

[farmersamm]

Peening causes metal to flow. Mostly used to "stretch" a piece of metal.

I'm no gunsmith, but I'm a fairly good welder. Peening only gets used when relieving stress, or heat shrinking. And only on mild steel (at least here in my neck of the woods). I wouldn't dream of messing around with any kind of high carbon steel in this manner.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but it's my take on the situation.

The area in question doesn't seem to directly relate to ultimate strength, but the stress induced by the metal working might migrate....dunno (big shrug)

That said:mrgreen: There's a notch failure there to consider. Metal is metal.........wonderful stuff

If it works, don't mess with it.

[Artful]

I'd leave it alone. Interesting about the danger's
- my boyhood friends dad had one that had a malfunction
in that if you fired it almost straight up it would hammer you by going full auto.
That was an eye opener. Worked fine most other angles. :p

[Battis]

The Remington Model 8 rifle and the Remington Model 11 shotgun both have the same long recoil action. In John Henwood's book The Great Remington 8, he says that "the most commonly seen damage to any of these rifles is a large burr on the receiver wall caused by releasing the bolt with the barrel removed." Luckily my Model 8 doesn't have this damage. Leaving the damage alone on the Model 11 is good advice.

[MtGun44]

CAREFULLY peening it back with a polished hard piece of flat steel held in position
and tapped with a small brass hammer (shiny lathe bit stock is good) can do a
surprisingly good job of pushing that metal back where it came from.

Hold the lathe bit just 1 degree from dead parallel to the outside and tap, tap, tap,
watching closely as you go. Use magnification, it helps a lot to see exactly what you
are doing.


Bill

[John 242]

I'm no gunsmith, but I'm a fairly good welder. Peening only gets used when relieving stress, or heat shrinking. And only on mild steel (at least here in my neck of the woods). I wouldn't dream of messing around with any kind of high carbon steel in this manner.

I thought peening was only done on cast iron in order to relieve stresses and prevent cracking, along with a pre and post heat. Something to do with the high carbon content of cast iron, its brittleness and differential cooling. I didn't realize it needs to be done on mild steel.

I've TIG welded quite a bit of mild steel, a few receivers and a rifle bolt or two and I've never heard of peening after welding those metals, but by no means am I an expert. A friend of mine welds bolt handles commercially and he doesn't peen those either. I guess we must be missing something. Learn something new everyday.

[John 242]

CAREFULLY peening it back with a polished hard piece of flat steel held in position
and tapped with a small brass hammer (shiny lathe bit stock is good) can do a
surprisingly good job of pushing that metal back where it came from.

Hold the lathe bit just 1 degree from dead parallel to the outside and tap, tap, tap,
watching closely as you go. Use magnification, it helps a lot to see exactly what you
are doing.
Bill

This is what I was taught to do, and what I have done in order to clean up small dings and gouges. I've used a highly polished punch, but the idea is still the same. I've never thought of using a lathe bit. Good stuff.

The goal is to push the metal back into the hole from which it came, rather than polishing it off. Done carefully, you can close up small gouges and dings. The key word is "carefully." I also use light taps to gently push the top (crest) of the gouge downwards. This method works great on screw heads, when followed up with a needle or slotting file.

Picture of a Remington Model 11 I polished and blued a few years ago.
171000

171035

[2152hq]

Peen it back into position. Done with care you won't even see the damage.
It won't bother a thing and would be the first thing done in any decent restoration shop if the shotgun was brought in for a do-over.
Simple little nicks, burrs, dents and scars are often pushed back into place by burnishing and punch work before polishing begins.
It avoids extra metal begin removed to bring the surrounding areas down to meet to damaged area.
Engraving cuts lines into the surfaces and even deeper ones with dovetail cuts so gold and silver wire can be inlayed into it,,usually right at the edges of the frame. No cracks and splits from that.

Heavy relief engraving work with extensive background removal and modeling work on the figures brings much more hammering force to the surface than this tiny fix-it job would.
The modeling of the figures in the heavy Germanic work is done with shaped punches to pound the metal into the desired forms.

If you'd have seen some of the cracked into pieces frames that were welded back together, re-engraved and refinished sporting rifles and shotguns that I've seen in the last 45yrs, this hang-nail of a burr certainly wouldn't bother you/