Trying my paper patched bullets once again.......hummmmmmm

[oldracer]

Went to the range on Friday and setup my home made shoot-n-see at 100 yards with a large white paper backer that pretty much covered the brown backer that we use at our range. This allows me to see where stray shots go as there are generally many old bullet holes, ETC. Anyways, I was shooting the under hammer again and after shooting 10 shots with the Pedersoli mold bullet, 5 with no wad and 5 with a wad I noticed that the wad gave a bit more velocity and those 5 shots were about 2 inches higher than those where the bullet sat right on the powder, like Pedersoli recommends. Spread was the same for both groups, nearly all touching which made me a happy boy!

So I decided to try a few of my 560 grain double wrapped paper patch bullets (Creedmoor nose) since I had not shot them for 6 months or more. The first shot was about 2 inches low and slightly to the left of the previously shot wad group and about what I expected. I asked one of the range officers to keep an eye on the target since they have had some issues with wild flight paths and such? Anyways shot #2 was aimed in the same area and when the smoke cleared I could not see a new hole so I figured a complete miss but the RO said it went into the same hole, just rubbing the right side? Whoa, I was surprised so I fired two more and he said #3 also went into the same hole and #4 made the hole a bit taller! I had trouble believing him so I looked at the target closely at quitting time and the hole was larger than one shot so I guess he was right? Now I just might have to work on those PP'd bullets again since I had put them on the back burner while building the new slug gun.

[koger]

Sounds good, keep us posted!

[daleraby]

This seems a more precise method of what I experienced using a pillow ticking patch on a .50 caliber conical bullet in a .54 caliber bore. Now i GOTTA try some paper patches!

[OverMax]

nearly all touching which made me a happy boy!
I guess so.
That's some pretty good shoot'in oldracer. Would like to try that PP. But I have no other bullet 4 calibers smaller to try in my 45 Hawken that I know of.. Closes I think is 40 cal but wrapping it to 45_? __Doing so would be at least 4 or 6 wraps of Green Bar and end up with a too light of a bullet in weight probably. Wouldn't see good 100 yard targeting results like'en your 50 into a 54. .

[oldracer]

I would suggest reading through the posts in the paper patched section of this forum to get an idea of what is required for bullet, patch, lube, ETC. Here is what I did a while ago and I got the info from here and a user named Johnson1942 who built a muzzle loader I have and he knows his stuff very well!

- Make a cast with Cerrosafe of the bore to get an accurate measurement of the bore (at the muzzle) and the lands. This is probably the most important step of all as the bullet with patch should just slide down the bore with little pressure.
- Find the paper you plan to use and how the bullet will be wrapped.
- Mic the paper and either decide on single or double wrap and then get total paper thickness.
- Subtract the paper thickness from bore measurement to get the bullet diameter.
- For my smooth sided paper patch bullets I went with a custom mold with 560 grain weight, flat bottom and Creedmoor nose shape.
- Mold up some bullets, pure lead and then mic them to be sure they are correct diameter.
- Wet the paper for a few minutes then wrap the bullets, folding the bottom in tight and put them into a bullets holder to fully dry, about two days or so.

I use some synthetic sperm oil, whatever the hell that is but it was given to me so I wipe the sides of the paper with a little bit and then load the powder, wad and bullet. Good luck.

[OverMax]

Make a cast with Cerrosafe of the bore
Just saying:
This whole PP procedure is appropriate for inline barrels than those considered traditional. A point of subject matter that should have been mentioned earlier.

[idahoron]

I am not following.Are you saying that PP is more appropriate for inlines than sidelocks?

[oldracer]

There are some that feel the in lines are the best for paper patched BUT if you check out the South African shooting website at http://bpsu.co.za/ and on the home page, there is a Pedersoli Gibbs. The world championships were held there are few years ago and all are side locks and most, but not all use paper patched bullets. That is what makes shooting these slug guns so interesting, use a .060 wad, 2x .030 wads, no wad, compress the powder, no compression, 4 grease grooves, 5 grease grooves, flat nose (Pedersoli), Creedmoor nose, Brooks nose, pure lead, 20:1 mix, wipe between shots, no wiping, 90 grains of FFG, 120 grains of FFG and the list goes on and on and on.

I did a slight correction to my post above and noted that you take the Cerrosafe cast at the MUZZLE. I apologize as I thought that would be obvious but I goofed.

[johnson1942]

a pp bullet is made for faster twist barrels. faster twist barrel can go on any kind of muzzle loader. as far as traditional go it where you want to start. if your talking 1776, then it is no but if your talking just before the civil war or the war of rebellion as some call it, yes then it traditional as then ,i think, is when it started. inlines are over the counter and not custom and most can be shot paperpatched. all my pp gun except one is a side lock. during the civil war northerners used shapshooters with cross paperpatched bullets. a southern soldier took out a union general at one mile with a heavy bench muzleloader and please correct me if im wrong it was a cross pp bullet. pp first came to sidelocks, then to inlines because now days they come fast twist over the counter. anyway you look at it, pp is a really really good way to shoot a gun. its a growing trend that is a very very good one.

[OverMax]

I am not following.


Cerrosafe of the bore. This is probably the most important step of all

(Please don't interpreter my comment as a critique Oldracer. Just a little clarity added to keep a few of those traditional side-lock owners from doing something to their rifle that will surely disappoint)

No. The technique of PPing is doable to both modern & traditional ~~Just the suggested procedure of slugging one's barrel with Cerrosafe requires both ends of a barrel being open as I recall.
Thus the slugging procedure Oldracer comment is best done to inline barreled/guns only.~~(when)~~ not having the luxury of removing one's breech plug on his or her traditional barrel.

[oldracer]

The way I do the checking of the bore of a muzzle loader was taught me by my mentor, Doug Knoell who has been working on guns for well over 40 years. He said to do the Cerrorsafe as follows:
- Clean the muzzle area inside and outside of all oil.
- Make a "plug" of several cleaning patches so it fits very tight in the bore with the smallest rod you can get. I use a .17 caliber rod with a slotted cleaning tip.
- I use a metal pot with the Cerrosafe in it and a propane torch to melt the metal.
- Stand barrel or gun if assembled so it is vertical and braced.
- Use a hot air gun and heat the end of the barrel very well so it is a bit to hot to touch.
- Quickly melt the Cerrosafe.
- Quickly push the cleaning rod several inches into the barrel.
- Pour the Cerrosafe into the barrel so there is a slight amount at the top.
- Wait until things cool slightly and pull the cleaning rod out. This may require some help, mine do so I hold the barrel and my daughter pulls the rod.

So far there has never been any Cerrosafe has gotten down into the barrel and there have no fires or any other issues. I usually get a pretty good cast as long as I heat the barrel well.

The alternative method is to pull the breech plug and use a lead bullet to slug the barrel in the other way by forcing the soft lead bullet of a close size down the barrel and out the breech end. Either will work although I really hate breaking the plug seal and then having to clean and reseal it.

[mazo kid]

John, so I take it you are happy with the barrel!? Very nice shooting, BTW.

[oldracer]

I would say I am happy would be an understatement!