Odd Hepburn

[marlinman93]

Picked up a Remington Hepburn Match B rifle at the Denver gun show last weekend! I've looked for a B grade Match Rifle for some time, and happened to be standing at the seller's table when this one came out of the case. When it was set in the vertical racks, it was immediately obvious that something was very different! The barrel was much longer than any other gun in the rack! I asked the seller if I could look at it, and a quick check with a tape measure revealed a 34" half octagon barrel! I've never seen or heard of a Match B with a 34" barrel, and was suspicious it might have a Creedmoor barrel swapped on it. But the seller let me remove the forearm wood, and it had the matching numbers to confirm it was correct!
I happened to hear that Tom Rowe was at the show, and sinc ehe rote the book on Hepburns, I had him look it over. He had written in his book that the Match B came with 28"-30" barrels, and optional 32", but no 34". So Tom was quite interested in this variation. Only about 300-500 Match B Hepburns built, and this may be one of a kind, or one of very few with a 34" barrel!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/marlinguy/DSCF4898.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/marlinguy/media/DSCF4898.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/marlinguy/DSCF4897.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/marlinguy/media/DSCF4897.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/marlinguy/DSCF4896.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/marlinguy/media/DSCF4896.jpg.html)

[RPRNY]

Congratulations on this amazing find! What a gorgeous rifle.

[Doc Highwall]

What caliber is it chambered for?

[Crank]

Marlinman93,
I have one also and ran into the same thing. IIRC mine measures at 33", it also matches, it started life as a 32-20 and was period re-bored to .33-47. Thanks to your post, now I know that over 32" does exist in more than one rifle. Great shooters and quite the novelty at the range.

Mark

P.S. I'll try to remember to add some pictures tonight.

[northmn]

Didn't many of these companies at one time have a "custom" shop. I remember seeing options for Winchesters for barrel elngths and wonder if that one isn't one of them.

DP

[marlinman93]

What caliber is it chambered for?

It's marked "32 B&M" which is Remington's marking for the .32-40 Ballard and Marlin. Same .32-40 we all know today. Most Hepburns in .32-40 were the .32-40 Remington.

[marlinman93]

Marlinman93,
I have one also and ran into the same thing. IIRC mine measures at 33", it also matches, it started life as a 32-20 and was period re-bored to .33-47. Thanks to your post, now I know that over 32" does exist in more than one rifle. Great shooters and quite the novelty at the range.

Mark

P.S. I'll try to remember to add some pictures tonight.

From what I've been told (and nothing is for sure!) Remington barrels were even number inches. So a 33" would be even rarer than my 34"!

[marlinman93]

Didn't many of these companies at one time have a "custom" shop. I remember seeing options for Winchesters for barrel elngths and wonder if that one isn't one of them.

DP

All the early gun makers either had a custom shop, or did custom special orders in their factory. Most were very open to almost any special order. I've seen and owned Marlins with both Whitney, and Remington buttplates on them; serial numbered to the guns! Had an 1893 with a Whitney Kennedy trapdoor buttplate. And a #4 Ballard with a Remington buttplate.

[Chill Wills]

Nice Find! I skipped the Denver GunShow this year. Just too much scheduled ....plus I saved a lot of $$$ ;-) Bittersweet!

Of all the old singleshots, the Hepburn is the one I have the greatest affection for. I am on the 12 step program for Hepburns, I have too many. Naaa!

Two questions; I assume the sights pictured were with the rifle and are they correct?
OK, one more.... is the chamber and barrel shootable with good rifling?

Congratulations on the rare find! I'd love to see it in the flesh some day.

[marlinman93]

Nice Find! I skipped the Denver GunShow this year. Just too much scheduled ....plus I saved a lot of $$$ ;-) Bittersweet!

Of all the old singleshots, the Hepburn is the one I have the greatest affection for. I am on the 12 step program for Hepburns, I have too many. Naaa!

Two questions; I assume the sights pictured were with the rifle and are they correct?
OK, one more.... is the chamber and barrel shootable with good rifling?

Congratulations on the rare find! I'd love to see it in the flesh some day.

The rear tang sight is original Rem. vernier. Front appears to be a later globe, but not real new. The bore and chamber are perfect! I too love Rem. rifles, whether they are Hepburns, or Rolling Blocks; as long as they're sporting models. I only own 3 Hepburns, but have 7 or 8 Rollers.
I haven't been to CGCA show for 12 years, and didn't find anything in 2004. I picked up 5 single shots this time! The Rigby Ballard next to this Hepburn was another purchase there. Extremely cheap because triggers and hammer didn't work. Five minutes at my table with my screwdriver set, and it worked perfectly! Got really lucky, as I figured I'd be making parts to fix it!

[Bigslug]

A Rigby Ballard, a Ballard in a fuzzy case, and an exotic (more than usual) Hepburn, all caught in the same net cast. . .

M.M. . .you seem like a kindly, highly knowledgeable, gentlemanly sort, yet I'm finding it very hard to like you right now. :wink:

That is some legend-worthy scoring!

[dtknowles]

I am sure glad guns like that don't show up at gunshows around here!:-)

Tim

[SSGOldfart]

Picked up a Remington Hepburn Match B rifle at the Denver gun show last weekend! I've looked for a B grade Match Rifle for some time, and happened to be standing at the seller's table when this one came out of the case. When it was set in the vertical racks, it was immediately obvious that something was very different! The barrel was much longer than any other gun in the rack! I asked the seller if I could look at it, and a quick check with a tape measure revealed a 34" half octagon barrel! I've never seen or heard of a Match B with a 34" barrel, and was suspicious it might have a Creedmoor barrel swapped on it. But the seller let me remove the forearm wood, and it had the matching numbers to confirm it was correct!
I happened to hear that Tom Rowe was at the show, and sinc ehe rote the book on Hepburns, I had him look it over. He had written in his book that the Match B came with 28"-30" barrels, and optional 32", but no 34". So Tom was quite interested in this variation. Only about 300-500 Match B Hepburns built, and this may be one of a kind, or one of very few with a 34" barrel!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/marlinguy/DSCF4898.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/marlinguy/media/DSCF4898.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/marlinguy/DSCF4897.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/marlinguy/media/DSCF4897.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/marlinguy/DSCF4896.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/marlinguy/media/DSCF4896.jpg.html)
Awesome find if you don't mind how about a ball park on how much she set you back I think that's the second with a long barrel that I have seen in about 50years. Just think I thought I was ahead of the game with finding 8#'s of 2400powder to day.
Is that Hapburn cambered for 38-55

[marlinman93]

Awesome find if you don't mind how about a ball park on how much she set you back I think that's the second with a long barrel that I have seen in about 50years. Just think I thought I was ahead of the game with finding 8#'s of 2400powder to day.
Is that Hapburn cambered for 38-55

I don't mind. The Hepburn was under $4k. The Match B's I've seen generally run in the $5.5k-$6.5k range. It's marked .32 B&M (Ballard & Marlin) on the barrel, for the standard .32-40 we know so well. Glad it wasn't the .32-40 Re. &Hepburn, as I'd be buying brass and dies too!
I sold my two Stevens schuetzens at the show, so was able to go a little nuts!

[marlinman93]

The Rigby Ballard is unique in the fact it has set triggers (matching numbers!) and almost all Rigby's have single triggers. It also is a 3 line address, which was normally only used on cast frame Ballards with reversible firing pins.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/marlinguy/DSCF4892.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/marlinguy/media/DSCF4892.jpg.html)
I checked the frame when I dropped the breech block at the show, just to be sure it was forged and not cast. No idea why the 3 line address, but Dutcher guesses the 2 line die was broken, and they used the 3 line until the other was repaired?

[Bigslug]

A Rigby Ballard, a Ballard in a fuzzy case, and an exotic (more than usual) Hepburn, all caught in the same net cast. . .

M.M. . .you seem like a kindly, highly knowledgeable, gentlemanly sort, yet I'm finding it very hard to like you right now. :wink:


Evidently, Mr. Ringo's an educated man. Now I REALLY hate him.:mrgreen:

Seriously M.M., what kind of karmic favors are you calling in? That thing is stunning. . .and will probably shoot groups to match.

[marlinman93]

Seriously M.M., what kind of karmic favors are you calling in? That thing is stunning. . .and will probably shoot groups to match.

I really have no answer, as my luck doesn't run this way usually. I even mentioned to my 3 traveling buddies that I probably wouldn't sell my two Stevens schuetzens, and since I had extra funds with me this trip, I probably wouldn't find anything to buy either! I was wrong on both parts, as the Stevens must have been too cheaply priced. They sold at opening, and no argument on my tagged price. Then the snowball started rolling, and seemed to just keep going!

[No_1]

That is a beautiful rifle!

[Crank]

Marlinman93,
I apologize, I said I would post pics, but I forgot about it and realized I wasn't getting notifications for this thread. I will correct the settings and try to remember tonight. Sorry about that.

Mark

[marlinman93]

Marlinman93,
I apologize, I said I would post pics, but I forgot about it and realized I wasn't getting notifications for this thread. I will correct the settings and try to remember tonight. Sorry about that.

Mark

Looking forward to seeing your Hepburn! They were/are great shooting and great looking guns!

[Crank]

I'll make sure to have a tape measure handy to get a definite size.

Mark

[marlinman93]

I'll make sure to have a tape measure handy to get a definite size.

Mark

Great! Was kind of wondering if it might be a 34", and some of the barrel length was into the action? 33" (or any odd number length) is strange for a Remington. They seemed to run even digit lengths.

[Crank]

Okay, that was interesting. Having it in natural light I found two names faintly scratched on the barrel. John Phillips and Hardy Lash??? Either way, it's 33' to the breech face. Here are the pictures.

169751

169752

169753

169754

169755

169756

169757

169758

169759

169760

There's what I can load. Definitely an odd number barrel length. She's not mint, but the bore is perfect and it shoots great. However, I now realize that I haven't had it out for a few years. So I either need to shoot it or find it a new home. If the names ring any bells, please chime in. I would love to get more history about this rifle.
Thanks

Mark

[marlinman93]

That's a wonderful Hepburn Crank! Appears to be a Match A with the standard wood and checkering, and no cheekpiece. Unusual to see a Hepburn Match rifle in such a little caliber as .32-20; so not surprised somebody changed it to a better schuetzen caliber! That 33" barrel is very unique! Never seen or heard of one!

[Crank]

I doubt I would ever find an original spirit level for the second dovetail. If I ever get the motivation, I could make one without too much fuss as long as I can find a small enough vial. That second dovetail drove me nuts when I first got it, I couldn't understand why it was there. I agree, the original caliber was oddly small for the rifle. It's too bad that there aren't any records for the old Remingtons. This rifle fits right in with all of the weird stuff that I tend to wind up with. Thanks for the compliments.

Mark

[marlinman93]

Your rear barrel sight appears to be in a forward position, and the empty dovetail I would guess is where it used to be when it left the factory? Probably someone put the forward dovetail in to move the sight forward, and add a level behind it. Or possibly someone added the 2nd dovetail to use scope bases in the two dovetails, and a target scope when they became popular? The old external adjustment scopes usually used a 7.5" spacing, so it your two dovetail cuts are close to that measurement, that may answer the question. But they do look a bit closer than 7.5"?
I see a lot of old competitive rifles with all sorts of extra dovetails, and holes in the barrels! I'm in the process of fixing the mess of holes and dovetail cuts in the Schoyen Ballard's barrel I just purchased. It had two extra dovetails, 4 pairs of scope base holes, and a strange pair of cuts in the top sides of the barrel near the chamber area. The cuts look just like cuts I've seen on Pope barrels for Pope's scope rings. But why only one pair of cuts, and not two pair? It's like someone had jut the Pope rear ring, and used a typical base up front.
To make matters worse; whoever modified the barrel made one dovetail cut through Schoyen's rollstamp!! Fortunately they only cut out the "G" in "GEO." so I will have an engraver re-cut the "G" in the filler blank I put in that dovetail.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v691/marlinguy/DSCF4917.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/marlinguy/media/DSCF4917.jpg.html)

[Crank]

I have found images of 2 other Hepburn rifles with the spirit level and spacing. My best guess is that the spacing allowed enough distance to change focal points. Again, that is a guess.

Mark

[marlinman93]

The Schoyen Ballard had two extra dovetails that I'm guessing one might be for a spirit level. One is mid point down the barrel, and the other was between the two scope bases. The one halfway up the barrel was 7/16", and the one at the rear was 5/16". Both weird sizes for a bubble level, but guessing one of them was used that way. Front sight dovetail is also a weird 5/16" dovetail, and I'll open it up to 3/8" for a common size globe sight.