6.5 Oldfellers?

[waksupi]

I tried out some of the 6.5 Oldfeller design this week in one of my M38 Swedes. The best group I got was four in about an inch and a half, with one pulled out to three inches. not bad a t a hundred, with iron sights. Thiswas with 14 gr. of 2400, so it was just loafing along.

I had tried some with 31-32-33 gr. WC 860, and was getting bullet tipping on the targets, so I imagine the rear end was trying to pass the nose with them pushed up even this fast. Accuracy was non-existant. Well, they DID hit the backstop, I guess. I did get a couple hangfires, also, so that was enough of that. Should have used some filler, most likely.

Has anyone else wrung this bullet out, and what were your results?

[Oldfeller]

Go slow, young Luke Skywalker. The ways of the Cruise Missile are perfection in balance and slow speed. Take care when lubricising, least you bend your attentions or expand your nose. Yet the Cruise Missile can penetrate both trees and elk alike, if used correctly at a stately speed.

Do not give in to the Dark Side - speed is no answer for a young Jedi and his cruiser. You will tilt off camber and escape reality if you try to rush your education.

Beware she-who-dresses-in-red-leather and carries the riding crop of pain -- Karlina can be a harsh mistress should you attempt to rush her in her pleasures.

Posted speed limit in this portion of the galaxy is 1,650 fps.

Obiwan

[waksupi]

Oldfeller, I was figuring the 31 gr of WC 860 would put me somewhat below that level, with the heavier loads pretty near that. I didn't chrony the 14 gr. of 2400, but am guessing I was going maybe 12-1300 fps. They were loafing along pretty slow! No speed from Karlina required by me! I just wondered what other loads people have tried out with it.

[Scrounger]

I tried out some of the 6.5 Oldfeller design this week in one of my M38 Swedes. The best group I got was four in about an inch and a half, with one pulled out to three inches. not bad a t a hundred, with iron sights. Thiswas with 14 gr. of 2400, so it was just loafing along.

I had tried some with 31-32-33 gr. WC 860, and was getting bullet tipping on the targets, so I imagine the rear end was trying to pass the nose with them pushed up even this fast. Accuracy was non-existant. Well, they DID hit the backstop, I guess. I did get a couple hangfires, also, so that was enough of that. Should have used some filler, most likely.

Has anyone else wrung this bullet out, and what were your results?

Ignition problem, pressure and velocity too low. Add more WC860, one or two grains at a time to improve performance. WC 860 is slower than IMR 4831; find the starting load for 4831 in a reloading manual and work up from that.

[StarMetal]

AAaaah, but the old StarFighter StarMetal has streaked the galaxy at warp 2400 and lived to tell about it.

Joe

[The Nyack Kid]

whos this "Karlina" she sounds like my last 2 GFs she have a number?
or is it "if you have to ask, you're too young"

[waksupi]

Ignition problem, pressure and velocity too low. Add more WC860, one or two grains at a time to improve performance. WC 860 is slower than IMR 4831; find the starting load for 4831 in a reloading manual and work up from that.

Scrounger, I was already at the load point of the lighter Lyman 160. The 33 gr. load spread them over a foot. Do you really think pushing them faster would help, since I was already getting tipping? I guess for grins and giggles, I could push them until they keyholed. I did go up a couple grains with the 2400, and the groups were spreading about one inch per grain.

[Scrounger]

Just guessing, of course. You know what you're doing. My only other WAG is that the bore is bigger than the bullet. I'm outta here...

[Bret4207]

Nyack- "Karlina" is Kellys/Oldfeelers name for the 6.x55/ Swede Mauser combo. The military 1-7.5" ( or thereabouts) twist, in theory, overstabilizes the boolit and causes it to deform and turn into a corkscrew and not a particularly accurate corkscrew at that. Finding the optimum pressure/velocity cobo appears to be the problem. I've not yet delved into "the darkside" with the Swede, but my Dads re-barreled kar-98 has a much more cast freindly 1-9" twist and has had fair luck with the asst cruise missles up to aroung 1800fps in a ltd. test. Need more time/money/someone to do all my other work for me so I can do this important stuff.

[waksupi]

The Swedes aren't rifled, they're threaded!

[Oldfeller]

Joe, if you got 2400 fps and ACCURACY out of the 172 grain cruise missile in a Karlina then you won Dan's contest. Congratulations.

Even if it was the Kurtz variant, you still won. 2,040 fps (7 1/2 twist) in a Swede is 200,000 rpm.

Plus you did something I never could do -- I personally could never get 1,700 fps and any accuracy out of that 1.250" long skinny blonde haired red-leathered mistress of death ...... Karlina, bitch queen of cast bullet rifles.

I could speed things up, easily, to the mid-to-upper-20's and the bullets would start to ...... disappear ....... never to arrive at the backstop at all.

Oldfeller

[castshooter-too]

Waksupi ; Where did you come by the oldfeller mold? That sounds like an interesting boolit to use in my karlina longrifle w/29" bbl. What alloy were you casting from?Where can I purchase one of these moulds? THANKS, BRUCE IN N.Y.

[StarMetal]

No, no, no, Joe didn't get 2400 fps out of that long cruise missile. Hell I'd had to move my target out another 50 yards past 100 yards because if I didn't that long S.O.B. would be touching the target and part of it still be in the barrel. har har har.

I did get 2400 fps and accuracy out of the Kurtz...BUT I wouldn't say that I could shoot three 5 five shot groups one right after another and keep a one inch maximum groups at 100 yards. Probably easier to that with my 7mm-08 Sako.

Interesting note: After all this shooting and exprimentation with various bullets and getting 45 2.1's bullet and the Kurtz to shoot good, I went back and tried some of those 135 gr bullets I got off of Anthony. They are roundnose, kinda like the Lyman 30 caliber bullet the 3112284 except smaller. I'm not sure what mould they come from, I believe if I'm not mistaken Buckshot said he thought by their look they were an old Lyman. Anyways tried them again, wooooooo all over the target. With all I've learned and done with the 6.5 those buggers still won't shoot. Oldfellers cruise missile were ok, but if I went too slow they keyholed bad.

Joe

[waksupi]

Waksupi ; Where did you come by the oldfeller mold? That sounds like an interesting boolit to use in my karlina longrifle w/29" bbl. What alloy were you casting from?Where can I purchase one of these moulds? THANKS, BRUCE IN N.Y.

Bruce, sorry to tell you, but that horse has left the barn. It was one of the custom mold buys done by this group, designed by Oldfeller, with input from other Swede owners.
I shoot air cooled WW's in all my Swedes, they seem to prefer that to a harder bullet.
You may be able to beg someone out of thiers, here on the board. It would be the only source I am aware of.

[Buckshot]

.............I think you can get that mould through Mid-South. Leat I think Oldfeller said it was one of those besides the two 8mm's they have for special order.

............Buckshot

[Bret4207]

Catshooter-2- Where is "upstate", I'm in St Lawrence Co.

[junkbug]

Is this mould the same one Midsouth sells as their Reproduction 6.5mm Swedish 170gr. mold?

I recently purchased one of these, even though it is a single cavity. The plan is to use them in a M-91/41 Carcano. It too has a fast twist, something like 1 turn in 7.5 inches. Will probably try 12 to 13 grains of 2400. Don't have a chronograph, so ultimate speed will just be a guess.

The only thing holding me up is that I misplaced my carcano clips.

I'll keep everyone posted.

[swheeler]

Junkbug; I think your Carcano has a gain twist

[Oldfeller]

ooooh .... Karlina has an sweet little short Italian cousin called Mia Caracano who sometimes will do for you -- IF you are patient and go slowly with her and let her get used to things at her own pace.

Remember, the Swede is very big and VERY long and she has to seat it deep in her little Italian throat or else it gets pushed way way back in her little Italian chamber.

<g>

Don't say a word after all your sheep, barbed-wire & field-gaging rifles ......

Oldfeller

[junkbug]

Thanks for the advice and encouragement.

I'm pretty sure that the Italian military abandoned the gain twist in 1938 when they switched to 7.35mm. When they reverted back to 6.5mm in 1940, due to supply problems, new barrels had constant twist. I used to have a M-91 long rifle (1917), so I've seen the twist in the bore. The M-91/41 that I have is dated 1941. Also, every M-38 Short rifle I've looked at has had what looks like constant twist, both the 6.5mm and 7.35mm rifles.

I haven't done a chamber cast, so I'll just load one cartridge without a crimp and test chamber. Then adjust as necessary to keep it just off the rifling.

[castshooter-too]

Tpr. Bret; upstate for me is washington co. farm country! corn fed deer! swede territory. BRUCE IN N.Y.