380 neck tension, part II

[mjwcaster]

Can someone please measure the ID of your 380 cases after being sized?

Mine are running around .354 as best as I can measure.
Lee die says 380 auto, so it is marked right.

Sized in my lee 380 die, lee 9mm die and RCBS .223 die (I was trying everything last night).
Severe lack of case tension in all, with .355 jacketed.

Even without using the expander at all, just size and then seat.

9mm cases sized in the lee 9mm die were around .352 and had plenty of tension.
9mm cases seemed to be a thousandth or two thicker than my .380, letting the die size id down more.

I managed to get enough case tension when using my last batch of commercial cast hitek coated .356 bullets.

I just brought home 1K Freedom munitions .355 plated 100gr from the NRA show and am having case neck tension issues again, seat the bullets and you can push them in by hand.

I am going to order the dillion die set later (I prefer seat/crimp in separate steps anyway), just wondering what others are getting for sizing.

Also trying to gather data before contacting lee.
I would like to sell the die set off to offset some of the cost of the dillon set, but cannot sell it if it wont work.

Thanks,

Matt

[mjwcaster]

So the Dillon Dies showed up today.
Same results, not sizing down enough.

This is a simple device, screw it down until it touches the shell plate and go to town.
And even if it isn't adjusted correctly it should affect sizing of the base of the cartridge, not the neck.

I have tried seating bullets without expanding at all, lightly expanded, heavily expanded, no change.
Still not enough neck tension to safely hold a bullet.

And yes the bullets are .355".

Any suggestions, I am at a loss here.

Will try calling lee/dillon tomorrow if I get a chance at work.

What are the chances that I got 2 different dies from different manufacturers that will not size a piece of brass down enough to safely reload with commercial plated bullets?

And I have had the same issue with my original dillon 9mm sizer.

[DerekP Houston]

ok, please bear in mind I dont have the high $$$ tools some members have. According to my calipers my 380 brass is size .358 before sizing and .355 - .356 after (depending on how firmly I adjust the caliper)

This is with the lee 3 die set. i've been sizing my cast boolits with the .356 die (Its been mentioned to go larger...but it works so why mess with it).

[Mk42gunner]

I don't load .380, I don't even think there is a piece of that brass on the place, but I do have some ideas.

What brand of brass are you using, and how thick is it at the case mouth? If it is too thin, all the die adjustment in the world won't help.

Stupid question time. You are using a carbide sizing die right? If so, is the carbide ring still in the die?

Have you loaded this brass before?

Robert

[billyb]

I use the lee dies for 380. ID measurement on three different brands of cases is .350-.351. I load cast at .356 and Berry's and Rainier plated with no problem. I set my size die to touch the shell holder when sizing. The case's measured were RP, Win., PPU. Check your expander, you may need to chuck it in a drill and polish it a smaller dia.

[mjwcaster]

Brass is range pickup.
Probably most once fired, no way to tell.
Mixed brass, all sorts of headstamps.
Not the expander, I have tried without expanding, same results.

Haven't checked to see if the carbide rings are in place, both are new die sets.
Will double check tomorrow.

Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

[mjwcaster]

Brass thickness- seems to run
.008-.009, among the different brands I sized and measured.

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[runfiverun]

I just went and sized a couple of 380 cases in my 9mm die[s] they come out with 354 id.
the cases were .009 and are nickel plated.
tells me you got 9m and not 380 size dies.

[runfiverun]

oh the dies are LEE and Dillon.

[jcren]

9x18 instead of 9x17(380 acp) dies? I load a lot of 380 on Lee dies and will check my measurements tomorrow.

[DerekP Houston]

If it was just the lee dies not sizing them enough I'd believe something was wrong, but a brand new set of dillon dies not working either? That seems fishy! Does a cast boolit have neck tension?

[mjwcaster]

Dies are labeled correctly, for what it is worth.

R5R your measurements agree with what I found using my Lee 9mm sizing die, ~.354 ID on a mix of 380 brass.
Same as I am getting using the 380 dies, the dillons may be just a little tighter.
My 9mm brass measures a thousandth or two thicker than my 380 and sizes down to ~.350-.351.
Numbers work out perfect, 9mm brass a little thicker, sizes down smaller.

I had issues with a 9mm Dillon sizing die before, fixed by replacing with a lee die.

Seems I am cursed with large sizing dies.

[runfiverun]

or blessed.
most guy's have to work on them to get them to size larger.

354 would be too much tension for me.
you might could try working on the taper crimp and see if you can't press the brass down a bit more.

[mjwcaster]

Changing crimp does not help.
From just removing the flaring, to slightly crimped to crimping enough to size the bullet down, there is just not enough neck tension.
Again I am trying different brands of brass, the only one that works is GFL?, which has a cannelure.

R5R, .354 would be too much tension with .355 jacketed/plated, or too much tension with larger cast?

I am confused, I thought that we would want to size the brass down undersize and then rely on the expander to bring it back up to the size we want.
I get that we would not want to overwork the brass any more than we have too, but how is going an extra thousandth or 3 undersize, making sure that all brass gets sized enough and then expanding it back up to where we want it to be.

I already have a custom .357 expander, and switch between that and the stock 'F' (.354?) depending on what I need.

Very frustrating, long weekend, new 380 I want to shoot the snot out of, over 1K bullets and not able to load them.

[mjwcaster]

I also wonder if texture of the bullets is playing a role along with size.
The .001 difference between the Hi-Tek coated and the plated isn't much, but the plated bullets are very slick compared to the Hi-Tek coated.

[John J]

Greetings

I had the same problem loading 32acp using Redding dies I also tried the 32S&WL Dillon dies I have and the same thing was happening...so I went with a lee undersized sizeing die and all is good again so you might want to look into this

http://leeprecision.com/undersize-sizing-die-380-auto.html

hope this helps

John J

[runfiverun]

with the larger cast.
I generally run my 9's at 358 and .004 is too much tension.

your not be able to go that large with your boolits or bullets the only option you really have is to find a size die that will get your neck tension down to the 353-352 area.
I wonder if a steel die wouldn't work better they actually have an internal taper to them that the carbide rings don't have.

oh and GFL is Fiocchi.
so if they work you at least have a way to get more brass.