pistols for deer

[tdoyka]

while i'm sitting here waiting for a ruger super blackhawk, i was wondering what everybody else will use this year.

my sbh will have a 4 5/8" barrel in 44 mag that will use 250gr mihek hollow points(40:1) and unique that goes roughly 900-1000fps. my shots on deer will be 50 yards or less. i haven't decided on 44 mag or the 44 special yet. i'll see what they say when the sbh arrives.

[NSB]

S&W 686+ .357 158g JHP 16.4g WW296 @1350fps. Sometimes use a 180g JHP. 50+ whitetails with the .357mag and none got away. Shot several with the 44mag and had 1 loss due to a bad shot on my part. It's not what you shoot them with, it's where you shoot them. You're on the right track with you load, gun, and self-imposed distance. I think you'll do just fine this year....let us know when it happens.

[jhalcott]

My state has power and barrel limits for hunting. I rarely use a revolver for deer hunting, BUT I do use a T/C Contender or an XP for hunting. I barely remember the last time I took the .44 SBH out . Some say T/c's and XP's are NOT really pistols. Although they ARE listed as hand guns in the regs.!

[Montana Silver]

I use a Savage Striker 308 with 165gr no problem out to 100 yards.

[Tenbender]

Contender 357 Max for me.

[merlin101]

Contender in .35 Rem. with a 16" barrel trimmed down to 15&7/8 ( to meet state requirements) And I shoot a (plz forgive me) Hornady 180gr SSP and that's zero'd at 200yds I've taken deer farther but the bullet drops like a rock after 200.
For 100yds and less I use a SBH in .44 mag. this will be the first year I'll be using cast in her.

[Outpost75]

Your .44 load with soft bullet at about 1000 fps is exactly what I have used for 40 years. Whitetail deer are not difficult to kill and any bullet of caliber which starts with a "4" weighing about 1/2 oz. or more, with meplat not less than 1/2 of bullet diameter, ideally being 0.6-0.7 of bullet diameter, of soft alloy not harder than 10 BHN, at 900+ fps will do the job. At revolver ranges from 20-50 yards, supersonic velocities aren't needed. The blackpowder .44-40 rounds define the performance envelope and in your .44 Magnum you can do it easily with a medium velocity load which is accurate and not punishing to shoot. I like Accurate 43-230G cast 1:30 with 7.2 grains of Bullseye as my go-to revolver load.

168143

[dtknowles]

I read a Cooper article a long time ago and he said, more than .40 caliber, more than 1000 fps and more than 200 grains for deer. I am sure that will work out to what ever range it stays above 1000 fps and you can connect with the vitals.

Tim

[Smoke4320]

Contender in 45/70, 357 & 30 herrett

[quilbilly]

Your .44 load with soft bullet at about 1000 fps is exactly what I have used for 40 years. Whitetail deer are not difficult to kill and any bullet of caliber which starts with a "4" weighing about 1/2 oz. or more, with meplat not less than 1/2 of bullet diameter, ideally being 0.6-0.7 of bullet diameter, of soft alloy not harder than 10 BHN, at 900+ fps will do the job. At revolver ranges from 20-50 yards, supersonic velocities aren't needed. The blackpowder .44-40 rounds define the performance envelope and in your .44 Magnum you can do it easily with a medium velocity load which is accurate and not punishing to shoot. I like Accurate 43-230 cast 1:30 with 7.2 grains of Bullseye as my go-to revolver load.
Absolutely right!!!!! You can't go wrong with that load plus you don't have to beat yourself up with recoil. The are several areas in my state where only revolvers (not even TC's) and shotguns are allowed in modern firearm season for black-tail deer and Outpost75's load is a proven one.

[rking22]

6inch GP100 in 41 Special, or Contender 357Herrett 14inch, or 4 5/8 3screw BH ,,, or maybe all 3 :)

[BigMagShooter]

7-30 waters T/C :)

[rodwha]

Percussion .44 pistols did well enough it seems... It's where the .45 Colt was born...

[modified5]

T/C in either 7mm L&L or the .375 JDJ.
The L&L is a .444 Marlin necked down to 7mm. With a 139 gr bullet I get 2000+ fps from a 14 in bull barrel. It is a zinger! :-)
If I can draw a tag that is.

[DanWalker]

Ruger Blackhawk in 45LC. 320 gr LEE wfn cast at 12bhn and loaded over either 6.5 grains of Red dot or around 8-9 grains of Unique.

[Hickok]

S&W 29, and 629, T/C Super 14, all in .44 mag.

Ruger Vaquero's 4 5/8", and 7 1/2" in .45 Colt.

[6pt-sika]

To date the only deer I've killed with a hand held gun was done in with a Savage Stryker in 7mm-08 . Had two more in 260 and 300 WSM but never killed with them . Had a Ruger SRH twice in 44 MAG and twice in 480 Ruger as well as the S&W 460 MAG and a 629 in 4" and 6" . Almost forgot I had and old Contender with a 444 Marlin barrel well as I can remember the barrel was made by a guy in Idaho I think and it wasn't a rechamber .
Now I either wanna acquire another SRH 7 1/2" or a 629 6" or possibly a Contender with a 10" barrel or maybe even one of the Ruger SBH Hunters . I want something that's scoped not terribly huge and will fit nicely in a shoulder holster . And of course can use one of the 44 cal molds I already have on hand !!!!

[tdoyka]

To date the only deer I've killed with a hand held gun was done in with a Savage Stryker in 7mm-08 . Had two more in 260 and 300 WSM but never killed with them . Had a Ruger SRH twice in 44 MAG and twice in 480 Ruger as well as the S&W 460 MAG and a 629 in 4" and 6" . Almost forgot I had and old Contender with a 444 Marlin barrel well as I can remember the barrel was made by a guy in Idaho I think and it wasn't a rechamber .
Now I either wanna acquire another SRH 7 1/2" or a 629 6" or possibly a Contender with a 10" barrel or maybe even one of the Ruger SBH Hunters . I want something that's scoped not terribly huge and will fit nicely in a shoulder holster . And of course can use one of the 44 cal molds I already have on hand !!!!

i just got rid of a ruger super redhawk with a 7.5" barrel (44 mag) to a gun dealer. i'm gonna get the ruger super blackhawk with a 4 5/8" barrel(44 mag). i have a uncle mike's hip holster but i want to get a chest holster( Guides Choice Chest Holster, Original Alaskan Holster (http://www.diamonddcustomleather.com/Chest_Holsters.php#guides_choice) ) when i can get the money.

i've gotten 3 or 4 deer with the ruger super redhawk but they were 200-240 xtps with a over max load of win296. now i'll settle for a nice cast boolit and low-medium(900-1000fps) speed.

[DanWalker]

Ruger Blackhawk in 45LC. 320 gr LEE wfn cast at 12bhn and loaded over either 6.5 grains of Red dot or around 8-9 grains of Unique.

[hockeynick39]

S&W Model 27, .357 Rem. Mag., 6" barrel: Lyman 358156 (modified) 160 gr LSWCPB (COWW) or Lyman 358429 (modified) 170 gr LSWCHP (COWW), both with 15 gr A2400.
Ruger SBHBH, .41 Rem., Mag., 7 1/2" Barrel: Lyman 410610 (modified) 220 gr LSWCPB (COWW), 16.9 gr A2400 or Accurate 411250A (modified) 240 gr LFNHPPB (COWW), 17.9 gr A2400.
S&W Model 625 JM, .45 Auto-Rim/ ACP, 4" Barrel: Ideal 452460 (modified) 190 gr LSWCHPPB (COWW), 9.7 gr Unique or RCBS 45-200-SWC 210 gr (COWW), 8.9 gr Unique.

Haven't had the opportunity to use any of these on deer yet, but pretty sure any of them will do their job properly when used correctly.

[6pt-sika]

i just got rid of a ruger super redhawk with a 7.5" barrel (44 mag) to a gun dealer. i'm gonna get the ruger super blackhawk with a 4 5/8" barrel(44 mag). i have a uncle mike's hip holster but i want to get a chest holster( Guides Choice Chest Holster, Original Alaskan Holster (http://www.diamonddcustomleather.com/Chest_Holsters.php#guides_choice) ) when i can get the money.

i've gotten 3 or 4 deer with the ruger super redhawk but they were 200-240 xtps with a over max load of win296. now i'll settle for a nice cast boolit and low-medium(900-1000fps) speed.
A couple years back I had a circa 1957 Ruger Blackhawk in 44 MAG with a 6 1/2" barrel . With normal factory Riger grips and my kinda big hands it was a touch hard on my middle finger . Liked the gun plenty but a 629 or SRH just plain fit me better . I got a set of Pachmayer rubber grips for that old gun and it cured the cracking my middle finger issue , but I never thought that old gun looked "proper" shall we say with those grips . Now on one of the stainless SBH's with a scope mounted the rubber grips wouldn't bother me aesthetically .

[Motor]

500 S&W with Lee 440gr :)

The iron sight one is mine.

[white eagle]

I use a Ruger Super Blackhawk Supreme Hunter conversion done by
\DW and I also carry a 4 5/8 Ruger Blackhawk flat top in 44 special
320 gr in the mag and 250 Miha #503 in the special

[LUCKYDAWG13]

My Encore 454 13" barrel 168197 and my Ruger 41 magnum for back up

[Blanket]

I have shot deer with a 44mag, 44 spl, 357 , 45acp, 45 Colt and a 41 mag. they all worked about the same

[TXGunNut]

T/C Contender w/ 35 Rem 14" bbl and muzzle brake. Shoots like a rifle, handles like a pistol, hits like a ton of bricks. Mine's been in the safe for quite a few years, never seen a CB. That last part is fixin' to change. ;-)

[fastdadio]

A couple years back I had a circa 1957 Ruger Blackhawk in 44 MAG with a 6 1/2" barrel . With normal factory Riger grips and my kinda big hands it was a touch hard on my middle finger . Liked the gun plenty but a 629 or SRH just plain fit me better . I got a set of Pachmayer rubber grips for that old gun and it cured the cracking my middle finger issue , but I never thought that old gun looked "proper" shall we say with those grips . Now on one of the stainless SBH's with a scope mounted the rubber grips wouldn't bother me aesthetically .


This is my story also. The grips cured the bleeding middle finger problem but I just didn't bond with it. My solution was the Bisley in .44 mag. That was 20 some years ago. I still have it, still love it, and I'm still trying to wear it out. Some how I think it's going to get the best of me in that regard.

[44man]

Hard choice. All work and mostly I take another revolver for each deer. But times I will use the same one all season.

[Hickok]

T/C Contender w/ 35 Rem 14" bbl and muzzle brake. Shoots like a rifle, handles like a pistol, hits like a ton of bricks. Mine's been in the safe for quite a few years, never seen a CB. That last part is fixin' to change. ;-)Great caliber. Had one in T/C super 14, sure wish I had kept it!

[Moonie]

TC Encore 15" 270 or NMBH 45 Colt with 350gr HP from NOE over a large charge of H110. Although I do have a 7.5" threaded 300 BO Encore barrel arriving today from MGM. Already have supressor and scope to go on it.

[robinsroost]

I have killed deer with a 6" Colt Trooper MKIII, .357 and plan on using my 7 1/2" Ruger Super Black Hawk Hunter, .44 magnum next year in Indiana, or my 5 1/2" Ruger Black Hawk, .45 Colt. Still, I think that venison flavored with, (taken with), black powder has a better flavor........robin

[nockhunter]

168380

I am going to shoot my new last year .480 SBH with LEE 400g cast. I have killed a couple with my 10.5, .44 mag SBH with 300g XTP's. I don't have a pic of the .480.

Mike

Hey merlin, where you at in Roch, I live in N. CHili

[kir_kenix]

The last couple years I have used a 10" Contender in .30 Herrett with a variety of cast boolits. The Lee "soupcan" has been pretty successful for me, if a little on the light side.

This year I am going to use a s&w 69 (4.25" barrel, .44mag) with the RD265 in my tree stand and a heavily stoked .45 Blackhawk (5-5/8") with 265 gr wfn for the "long" shots.

I think using the longer barreled Contenders basically equate to hunting with a rifle without a shoulder stock. Nothing wrong with that, and I enjoy doubling my effective pistol range depending on where I'm set up. .357 mag, .41 Mag, .44 spcl/.44 mag, .45 colt, etc, etc are all deadly on deer at reasonable ranges. Most important thing I've found while handgun hunting is knowing when NOT to take a shot. It has made me a much better rifle hunter because there are so many more variables to consider.

[TXGunNut]

Great caliber. Had one in T/C super 14, sure wish I had kept it!


Pretty sure I know why you no longer have it, lol. I take mine to the range now and then and it reminds me why that 50-round box of hunting ammo has lasted so long, lol.

[roverboy]

I have killed deer with a 6" Colt Trooper MKIII, .357 and plan on using my 7 1/2" Ruger Super Black Hawk Hunter, .44 magnum next year in Indiana, or my 5 1/2" Ruger Black Hawk, .45 Colt. Still, I think that venison flavored with, (taken with), black powder has a better flavor........robin

What load did you use in the Colt Trooper .357?

[DougGuy]

I have shot and killed more Bambi with a 7 1/2" SBH than all my other arms added together. You'll have this when you hunt in where it is super thick and use a tree stand, if you are in a good area you will have deer walking right under your stand.

The best shot I made was on my birthday once, I took two with one shot from a 4 5/8" Vaquero in .45 Colt. I hollered "Happy Birthday Doug!" and my buddy who was 150yds over went to hollering about me running them off when he was getting ready to shoot, and I told him "Anybody that kills two on their birthday with just one shot can holler all they want to, now get over here and help me drag horns!"

Load was a 300gr XTP over 22.5gr W296 and I recovered it from behind the neck of the second deer, it was right under the skin. Flattened to the cannelure, the first deer soaked up a TON of energy, because it hit the second one in or near it's ear and barely penetrated the skin.

[Grendel99]

I love pistol hunting for anything, but especially deer and hogs. I don't use rifles too often anymore. Currently my two favorites are a Super Blackhawk Hunter in .44 Mag with an action job and magnaported by SSK and a TC Encore with assorted 15" barrels (with 257 Roberts and 30-06 being current favs). I have killed deer with both cast and jacketed in the Blackhawk Hunter and only used jacketed in the Encore though I now have a 30 caliber mold that should work well.

This is the first buck I ever shot with cast (and a revolver for that matter), the load was 2400 powder and the Lyman 429421. I shot five more deer that season with the same revolver. I used the 429421 and the big ol' Lyman hollow point 429640. The big hollow point was amazing on the three deer I shot it with. Two dropped and one went about 20 feet with a huge blood trail. I also have a HP version of the Ray Thompson 429244 SWC that I plan on trying out this season.

http://i790.photobucket.com/albums/yy182/Albatross926/photobucket-18832-1380666885041_zps45893204.jpg (http://s790.photobucket.com/user/Albatross926/media/photobucket-18832-1380666885041_zps45893204.jpg.html)

[modified5]

Ugh! I am so jealous of you guys that get to kill more than one deer a year!
If im fortunate here in Nevada and have payed off the correct "gambling gods" I will get to draw a single deer tag! :-(

[Smoke4320]

In central NC we get 2 buck tags, 4 doe tags and can buy more 2 doe tags for $10.00. All you want.
Might go down some this year as the coyote pop is growing. We are getting wild hogs and a blue tongue disease. All cutting into our deer pop.

[Paul D. Heppner]

I have taken deer with .41 Mag (210 JHC, 410429), 44 Mag (200 JHP, 240 JHP, 429421, Lee 310, LBT 280 WFN), 45 Colt (225 wadcutter), 45 AR (452423), and 357 Max (180 XTP). At present my go to guns are a pair of Redhawks in 44 and a 357 Max SBH.

168468

168469

My son with his first handgun deer (my 7 1/2 inch Redhawk.)

168470

[warboar_21]

Ugh! I am so jealous of you guys that get to kill more than one deer a year!
If im fortunate here in Nevada and have payed off the correct "gambling gods" I will get to draw a single deer tag! :-(

I feel the same way. I've lived here in Nevada for quite awhile now and have come up empty handed. IF i'm lucky enough to draw this year I will not use anything that will limit my ability to take game.

The only deer i've ever killed with a handgun was an smallish Indiana Whitetail buck. Shot him with a Model 66 357 Mag and used factory PMC 158gr soft point HV ammo. Would love to live in an area where I could hunt more though.

[TCLouis]

kr kenix

How hard were you pushing that soupcan out of the 30 Herrett?
Nebraska corn fed sized deer?

Complete pass through?

[Echale3]

As far as pistols go, I can't decide--a TC in either 35 Remington or 7 TCU, my FA 353, or my MOA in 300 WSM.

i know I'll also tote my High Wall in 45-70 (cast bullet I ver BP) some so maybe I'll get a pistol and rifle deer this year...

[Wolfer]

I rekin I'll just use my new vaquero in 45 colt. I shoot different 255 gr boolits with enough unique to push them around 1000 fps.
Im not sure how many deer I've shot with it but it's enough to know its all the gun I need.168598

[Hamish]

168619

XP100 in 30Bellm. Then I'll carry a Contender in .357 Max. and if I get the opportunity, a .300BO Striker.

[kir_kenix]

kr kenix

How hard were you pushing that soupcan out of the 30 Herrett?
Nebraska corn fed sized deer?

Complete pass through?

A few complete pass through, several have ended up under the hide on the far side. I wouldn't try to break the shoulder with this boolit for an anchoring shot. I don't push the range much either, just not the right tool for the job if a 150 lb doe is 250 yards away.

With a fairly warm load of 2400 it's not difficult to get around 2,150 fps or just north of that number depending on barrel length. A max load of H-110 (22.0) will push that boolit over 2,300 fps with the right alloy. That's still over 1,300 ft/lbs at the muzzle.

I mainly use this load to shoot medium sized doe for the freezer. We have some big bodied, corn fed deer around here but they aren't armor plated. It really irritates my friend who uses a .300 win mag for 50 yard shots in his grove lol. Double lung shots are pretty mandatory with this load, that boolit isn't going to penetrate like a heavy .44 or .45 will.

[murf205]

It has to be the "within reason" boolit and caliber but we have to stick the boolit in the right spot. A 300gr boolit going 1600fps in the gut of a deer is still a gut shot deer. I know there are some who say that they can shoot a bazooka just as well as a .22 but I have not seen it happen on a regular basis. If you stuff one of those 250gr Mihek's in a deers rib cage and out the other side at the speed you are talking about, all you will need next is a sharp knife! You just can't go wrong with a 44 for deer, whether it is a Spl or magnum. Personally I would load the magnum cases down to the velocity you are looking for just to keep the lube and powder fouling away from the area just forward of the cyl throat. I shot about a 140 lb buck in the chest with your load and it came out just in front of the ham, about 3' of penetration(250gr Lyman). You are very wise to put a 50yd limit on your shots if, for no other reason than the sights on the SBH. I use a SRH with a 2x Leupold 'cause I'm an old geezer and the blessing of 68 birthdays has my sight picture a little to fuzzy for really accurate shooting, but your rig is going to serve you well. Good luck and keep us posted on the progress.

[murf205]

168707
Here is a pic of my SBH with the scope off. I had to apply Duracote to the finish because somebody at Ruger evidently thinks that a 9" 44 needed a bright stainless finish and a 454 & 480 should have the grey finish...go figure. Here in Alabama, we hunt pretty close in the majority of the time, and the movement of that bright gun got me busted by deer from as far away as 75 yds.

[Moonie]

168707
Here is a pic of my SBH with the scope off. I had to apply Duracote to the finish because somebody at Ruger evidently thinks that a 9" 44 needed a bright stainless finish and a 454 & 480 should have the grey finish...go figure. Here in Alabama, we hunt pretty close in the majority of the time, and the movement of that bright gun got me busted by deer from as far away as 75 yds.


Looks more like a SRH than a SBH to me...

[44man]

Looks more like a SRH than a SBH to me...
Yes, but I have never had deer spook from my stainless guns, only a click and why I hate Colt actions.
Things like camo on arrows for extra cost is stupid. Camo on a bow??? Camo boots and DANG, you need camo shoestrings too. Best camo for deer is WHITE any time of year. Snow camo works with leaves on the trees. Little gun is so far from nothing all the new stainless rifles will never kill an animal.

[murf205]

OOps, I meant SRH, my bad

[murf205]

Yes, but I have never had deer spook from my stainless guns, only a click and why I hate Colt actions.
Things like camo on arrows for extra cost is stupid. Camo on a bow??? Camo boots and DANG, you need camo shoestrings too. Best camo for deer is WHITE any time of year. Snow camo works with leaves on the trees. Little gun is so far from nothing all the new stainless rifles will never kill an animal.

Well here's the deal on hunting in Alabama with a bright stainless gun. When I tell you that we have to hunt close, I mean CLOSE, as in 10 yds a lot of the time. The timber/paper companies have butchered all the tall hardwood and pine trees that would facilitate using a tree stand and replanted with seedling pines. Where I hunt, they are about 7-10 yrs old and thick as can be. There is a ton of deer in there but, as you can imagine,you have hunt them so close I have actually seen the wiskers on a deer. You cant move a bright finished gun or you are busted, period. I wear a Ghillie suit and face mask and gloves, and sit in a CAMO directors chair.
As far as the "click" when you cock the gun, well they aren't too fond of that. Anybody got a suggestion for that? I've tried to hold the trigger while I cock the gun and it works pretty good although it's not the safest thin to do.

[44man]

Well here's the deal on hunting in Alabama with a bright stainless gun. When I tell you that we have to hunt close, I mean CLOSE, as in 10 yds a lot of the time. The timber/paper companies have butchered all the tall hardwood and pine trees that would facilitate using a tree stand and replanted with seedling pines. Where I hunt, they are about 7-10 yrs old and thick as can be. There is a ton of deer in there but, as you can imagine,you have hunt them so close I have actually seen the wiskers on a deer. You cant move a bright finished gun or you are busted, period. I wear a Ghillie suit and face mask and gloves, and sit in a CAMO directors chair.
As far as the "click" when you cock the gun, well they aren't too fond of that. Anybody got a suggestion for that? I've tried to hold the trigger while I cock the gun and it works pretty good although it's not the safest thin to do.
I love close but deer have heard the hammer cock beyond 40 yards. I have no solution. None have seen the gun though. I don't know what you face. But in all my years it was movement or sound. Some sounds do not spook deer like a breaking branch. Metal can.
I love the videos where the jerk thumbs off the safety from a high house. Deer can hear that at over 100 yards.
Yes, cocking a revolver is tricky and the more clicks the worse it is. Just the cylinder stop falling into the slot can spook a deer. My BFR's are so quite it is crazy but still a deer can bolt.
Once I had deer bed close when archery hunting. Needed to move them so I shot a judo point into the air to land among them. Not a thing. Then the time I ate chili until I was a balloon. Deer came and bedded close while I blew the branches off trees. Noise and stink but they did not move.
How to explain? A deer has never spooked from a gun.

[taco650]

I agree with 44man, sound alerts deer more than sight. I was in a high box stand behind some trees this year when my deer came out about 120 yards away. I raised my 30-06 onto the ledge and it didn't see it even though it was looking in my general direction. However, when I slid the safety off as carefully as I could, its ears and eyes locked right onto my location. It still didn't see me but it took a few seconds for it to look away and get back to sniffing around.

[44man]

I hunted with bows for years and wore face masks. But then I had to wear glasses and it got hard. Nothing stinking fit so I stopped and went bare face with glasses. Never seen a difference.
Now a turkey or waterfowl has eyes like no other. Yes you must disappear.

[Wolfer]

My Ruger is very quiet. Still at least twice I felt I was too close to cock the hammer. I held the trigger back until the hammer was back then let it settle in the notch. You can't do anything about the bolt drop though and even though it's pretty quiet at least once I had one perk up when the bolt dropped.
Unless they run immediately it will be too late.

[murf205]

No matter what...you better be on top of your game when you hunt them this close. Now if I could figure out how to trick that darned nose!!.

[44man]

I had a lot of trouble with bows when I went to compounds. Shoot at a deer at 10 yards and it was GONE before the arrow hit the ground where it was. Bow was silent to me so I figured it was frequencies. Metal on metal is not good.
Once I was up a pine tree to try to place a stand and was breaking branches like crazy. Whole tree was shaking. I looked at the apple tree behind me to see deer eating apples. Now if a branch is in the way, I just break it off. I am not quiet when I stalk either. I can make deer come to me by being a deer. Movement and stamping my foot or a hand when kneeling.
Camo important, never too dark and Blaze orange best of all. Wore snow camo and had deer under me. I walked within 10 feet of a bedded deer with a white "T" shirt on. She jumped and I stamped my foot. She went back to her bed and never looked at me again as I searched for nuts and squirrels. I had to go to work so walked past her and she came out again so I laughed at her, told her "I fooled you." Cock a Colt? I don't think so.
Another time I tracked a herd in the snow and played with them. A young deer ran behind me and I heard the kid running all over. He came back to my side maybe 2' away. He was looking at the other deer. I could not shoot where I was and even though I had the SRH on a big doe, I let down. Safety first.

[GLynn41]

i hunt a WMA-- it is about 15000 acres it an oft flooded swamp-- walk in walk out--soo handguns are great
I carry a .41 4" Tracker with .41 specials in trimmed down .41 mag brass- using a group buy Miha mold --225 gr lfngc
I hunt with a .41/454.= 410GNR-- this year a Mountain Mold 257gr WLNGC made into a soft point-- at 1500 from a 5.5 Redhawk
The other is a 9'' TC.41/44=41GNR have not decided yet on the cast boolit to be used thinking about a 225 lfngc with a soft point
mv is 1700+ --I have the pins for three different HP with the Miha mold but think that at a close shot they would not hold up well enough?

[Texas by God]

So far (44yrs hunting) I've killed two deer with a handgun. The first was with a Lyman .54 plains pistol with rb and 60 grs fffg-DRT @44 FEET. The other was with a Ruger 6.5" .41 mag 210 Sierra hp 1400 fps DRT @65 yds. I want to try my .357 45/8" Blackhawk with 158 jhp this year. Lots of turkeys and feral hogs with handguns but those are my only deer/handgun kills. Best, Thomas.

[tdoyka]

most of you know that i'm a disabled hunter(stroke). so i had to give up my compound and take a crossbow. not to mention all the tree stands that i can no longer use:(. anyway, last year i was at a corner of an real old field. to get there i had to use my polaris ranger utv. the old guy that owns it, he took a couple of passes with his brush hog a couple of times for me. i get up to the corner and begin hunting. i have a 3 legged stand that i use for my crossbow, so i put it up. then i take the crossbow and crank it up so i can put the bolt on it. i put the crossbow on the 3 legger and put the shoulder on the utv. and then i crawl into the utv and sit sideways. i there sitting there for about 1 1/2 and i decide i HAVE to take a leak. i get off and go about 5 yards(boy its tuff to go that far without your cane:lol:) and i relieve myself. i go back to the utv and climb in again.

now i'm dressed up in a 1/2 camo shirt and 1/2 jeans. i used to use a earth type scent(little brother made it) that i don't use anymore. but i do wash my clothes in a no uv/no scent detergent. i'm a big believer in no uv. now i'm not saying you can wave your arms in the air when a deer comes, but you can do a little movement and not get caught by the deer. i used to have bucks and does that go under my tree stand using a no uv/ ne scent detergent. anyway back to my story...

about 10 or so minutes since i HAD to relieve myself, i'm sitting there and then i hear the bushes rattle. and then a buck steps out of woods, not ten yards from me, and 5 yards to the relief site:lol:. its there to my right, just standing around like he owns the place. i know the rut has not kicked in yet(it took about 3 weeks to kick in). he goes down the trail and then stops in front of me broadside, about 20 yards away. now i've had the crossbow up and the safety off, but my finger is not on the trigger. i count him up and discover he is a 8pt. anyone would have shot him. i should have shot him. but there is a 10pt that is out there('nother story). i let him go. if he survives bow and then gun season, this year i will definitly shoot him.

but the 8pt did not know that i was there. not once did he ever look at me. and i'm sitting there with a big old black utv, with a camo top and wearing jeans. and he never looked at me. well people say, "its private ground and your the only one that hunting, so what do you expect." the guy that owns it, lets everybody hunt it. not even a posted sign is up. there wasn't much wind that day, but it was coming, if at all, across his back to me. i don't know, but i'll take it.

[DougGuy]

I just had one of the medium framed Ruger Blackhawk Flattops in my hands and I gotta admit, I was VERY impressed with the build quality. .45 caliber of course. A 5 1/2" .45 Colt loaded to 23,000psi with almost any of the 250 to 270 grain boolits would sure keep meat in the freezer and not hurt your arms doing it nor hurt your shoulder packing it.

As far as the noise, once on stand I always hunt with the hammer back and 100% blocked with my hand.

[Greg]

TexasbyGd

tell me about turkey hunting with handguns, especially type of load/bullet used and amount of trauma ?



So far (44yrs hunting) I've killed two deer with a handgun. The first was with a Lyman .54 plains pistol with rb and 60 grs fffg-DRT @44 FEET. The other was with a Ruger 6.5" .41 mag 210 Sierra hp 1400 fps DRT @65 yds. I want to try my .357 45/8" Blackhawk with 158 jhp this year. Lots of turkeys and feral hogs with handguns but those are my only deer/handgun kills. Best, Thomas.

[Viper225]

I have lots of choices to hunt with. I have a 480 SRH with 9.5 Inch Barrel. It has a 30mm UltraDot on a Weigand Base. Load is a 375 WFN-GC cast from a custom Mountain Mold.

Next would be my 14" Contender in 35 Bullberry. That is basically a 35 Remington Rimmed made from 375 Winchester Brass. I have a good supply of 375 Winchester Brass, but I still picked up some Starline 38-55 Long brass to try out in it. The 35 Bullberry is a great cartridge, and if the 38-55 Long Starline Brass will work well in it. This will again be a good chambering to deer hunt with. It is only limited now by 375 brass being a little hard to come by. Bullets for 2016 will be 180 XTP's. My sight is a 30mm MatchDot.

Next would be my 13" MGM 357 Maximum Contender. At the moment I have a 2.5 - 7 Burris scope on it. It will probably have a 30mm MatchDot on it for Deer Season. My load will probably be a NOE 360-180 WFN-GC or a 180 XTP.

I took my buck a couple years back with a 6.5 X 30 JDJ contender with 14" barrel. The bullet was a 129 Hornady Spiral Point. The wife was not going out that evening, and a grabbed her Contender instead of getting mine out of the safe. It had a 30mm MatchDot for a sight.

I really like hunting with my 480 SRH. I have taken several deer with it.

My brother took a nice buck with his 44 magnum SRH last year at 135 yards. He hit him high behind the shoulder the first shot, and then put 3 more on him. The second shot was a text book double lung shot. He has a 30mm MatchDot Red Dot sight on it mounted on a Weigand Base. Bullets are 310 Grain cast from a custom Mountain Mold.

So many good choices to hunt with. I have not had a rifle in the woods in years.

Bob R

[Lonegun1894]

For deer handguns, I have mostly used a 4" Ruger Security Six .357, a 6" Ruger GP100 .357, a 7.5" Ruger BH .45 Colt, and a 5.5" Ruger SBH .44 Mag, but started using a TC Contender with a 10" .357 Mag and a 10" .44 Mag for hogs, and need to take a deer with this soon.

[44man]

It has gotten harder but I have not used a rifle for years. Can't hold a rifle or pull a bow anymore from shoulder injuries. I can hold a revolver but now prefer to rest at least my fore arms on knees or something. I shake more. It is why I show old targets because it is harder now and a cataract in my right eye is like looking through a blizzard.
The red dot on deer is still OK. Opens grew wings! Need to adjust with age.
Doug does different but I won't do that, not with my triggers or dozing off on stand. I use a sling so a gun can't fall if I doze. Deer don't bother me after so many and being an old archer, I still like under 20 yards. Yes, made crazy long shots too but to hold steady now is harder. Not good, they walk.
Maybe why I depend on accuracy so much, if I paint 6" at 100, the boolit must go where the dot was, not 6" farther. Many say 6" at 100 is good enough but your movement can make it a foot or more. You need to take it into account. If you had an expensive rifle you might gripe about 2" at 100 but 6" with a revolver is fine. I don't believe that.
Long ago, nobody shot 1" at 100 with a revolver but today it can be done. Not all the time but it is usually just you. We are the broken chain but who would ever think a cast could shoot like that? Working some revolvers I was out of sorts with 3/4". I actually got to 1/2" at 100. Easy to go over 6" with shakes.
Many use short barrels, OK until ranges get longer. Opens are fussy. You can't align sights as close as you want. I talk within thousandths. My SBH with a 10-1/2" barrel moved POI 1-2-3-4", 50 to 200 meters per click. A short barrel can take you one side of a target to the other with 1 click. Get real short and the light gap will be in 10 thousandths of an inch. Is the top of the front sight withing 10,000 inch above or below? Better to use a scope or dot with short barrels. They can work but a 2" snubby with opens is still a 7 yard gun.

[Texas by God]

Greg a PB swc is my preference in pistols and revolvers for turkey. .45acp 230 fmj is ok but I prefer a 200 swc as it tracks straight through. No meat damage unless bone splinters count. These are called in toms 50 yds max. Round balls in cap n ball and pistols are very effective also. Best, Thomas.

[Greg]

Thomas

thank you.

here it's all shot gun only, so the question.

[35 Whelen]

while i'm sitting here waiting for a ruger super blackhawk, i was wondering what everybody else will use this year.

my sbh will have a 4 5/8" barrel in 44 mag that will use 250gr mihek hollow points(40:1) and unique that goes roughly 900-1000fps. my shots on deer will be 50 yards or less. i haven't decided on 44 mag or the 44 special yet. i'll see what they say when the sbh arrives.

Hard to say what I'll use. Two years ago, my first try at handgun hunting, I used my very favorite Uberti 4 3/4" .44 Special running a 260 gr. SWC a little under 950 fps.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Buttonbuck_zps4be870ab.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Buttonbuck_zps4be870ab.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/GregsBuck-redmore_zpse2f5a792.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/GregsBuck-redmore_zpse2f5a792.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Doewithpistol1_zpsf93523e6.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Doewithpistol1_zpsf93523e6.jpg.html)

Year before last a New Vaquero 4 3/4" 45 Colt. That revolver was such a pain to shoot accurately and I missed a couple.

Last year I used a new Uberti 5 1/2" 45 Colt, such an accurate revolver! a 260-something gr. SWCHP running somewhere a little north of 1000 fps worked twice. The buck at 48 yds. and the javelina a couple of yards less.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Spike%20with%2045%20Colt-%20reduced_zpsqwppzshz.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Spike%20with%2045%20Colt-%20reduced_zpsqwppzshz.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Bullet%20from%20Spike_zps6m6ogv41.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Bullet%20from%20Spike_zps6m6ogv41.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Javelina_zpsxkim0uvo.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Javelina_zpsxkim0uvo.jpg.html)

A couple of months ago I was roaming the ranch next to my property and slipped up on a couple of sows. The old 4 3/4" Uberti .44 Special, loaded with a 247 gr.. SWCHP running 1000 fps, got the call again and poleaxed one of the ol' girls.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Sow%20with%20revolver_zps4mazox4v.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Sow%20with%20revolver_zps4mazox4v.jpg.html)

I have a 5 1/2" Flat Top Blackhawk .44 Special that's crazy accurate that I'd like to use, but I have a thing about fixed-sighted, utility type revolvers, so I'm not sure yet. I have a 5 1/2" Cimarron .44 Special that is likewise way, way more accurate than it should be that I may use. Either way, I'll probably use a .44 Special again.

35W

[harley45]

Probably my 10MM with cast 200gr WFN now that it is legal in Indiana!

[44man]

Nice pictures! Amazing how effective a handgun is. .44 special boolits shown are correct too, nothing I would use in the mag though, too destructive. Penetration is not enhanced with more speed either.
All you need is for the boolit to work.
I think a 10mm would make a fine hunter.
I never liked the .357 or .41 long ago because of bullet choices, people stuff. Had a friend that could not handle a .44 so he shot deer with a .357 and lost most of them. He used factory loads. He had a very accurate SRH but feared it. I shot it and it was deadly accurate. We had a group buy and his was the most accurate out of 5 guns. I shot them all.
Is the .357 or .41 bad? NO, not with what we know today. Is a .44 special too slow? Why 1500 fps? You can make it work but it will always be what you shoot and cast will do it all.

[oldcanadice]

Hey Viper225 (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/member.php?5426-Viper225) -- what speed are you pushing the hdy 180 XTP to?

[Texas by God]

Greg-You're welcome. Some counties in East Texas are shotgun or BP only- as is the National Grasslands. And if you are canoeing in any river its shotgun only regardless. We hunt pigs along the Trinity River this way. Get out of Illinois-Texas wants you anyway. Best, Thomas.

[rodwha]

Nice pictures! Amazing how effective a handgun is. .44 special boolits shown are correct too, nothing I would use in the mag though, too destructive. Penetration is not enhanced with more speed either.
All you need is for the boolit to work.
I think a 10mm would make a fine hunter.
I never liked the .357 or .41 long ago because of bullet choices, people stuff. Had a friend that could not handle a .44 so he shot deer with a .357 and lost most of them. He used factory loads. He had a very accurate SRH but feared it. I shot it and it was deadly accurate. We had a group buy and his was the most accurate out of 5 guns. I shot them all.
Is the .357 or .41 bad? NO, not with what we know today. Is a .44 special too slow? Why 1500 fps? You can make it work but it will always be what you shoot and cast will do it all.

I've seen the evidence on traditional muzzleloading forums where even a ball from a percussion revolver will give complete passthroughs or be found on the offside under the hide.

I had Accurate Molds create a few designs of mine with a wide meplat just for this. Haven't used them yet but want to give it a try once everything is worked out.

[tdoyka]

Hard to say what I'll use. Two years ago, my first try at handgun hunting, I used my very favorite Uberti 4 3/4" .44 Special running a 260 gr. SWC a little under 950 fps.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Buttonbuck_zps4be870ab.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Buttonbuck_zps4be870ab.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/GregsBuck-redmore_zpse2f5a792.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/GregsBuck-redmore_zpse2f5a792.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Doewithpistol1_zpsf93523e6.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Doewithpistol1_zpsf93523e6.jpg.html)

Year before last a New Vaquero 4 3/4" 45 Colt. That revolver was such a pain to shoot accurately and I missed a couple.

Last year I used a new Uberti 5 1/2" 45 Colt, such an accurate revolver! a 260-something gr. SWCHP running somewhere a little north of 1000 fps worked twice. The buck at 48 yds. and the javelina a couple of yards less.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Spike%20with%2045%20Colt-%20reduced_zpsqwppzshz.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Spike%20with%2045%20Colt-%20reduced_zpsqwppzshz.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Bullet%20from%20Spike_zps6m6ogv41.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Bullet%20from%20Spike_zps6m6ogv41.jpg.html)

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Javelina_zpsxkim0uvo.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Javelina_zpsxkim0uvo.jpg.html)

A couple of months ago I was roaming the ranch next to my property and slipped up on a couple of sows. The old 4 3/4" Uberti .44 Special, loaded with a 247 gr.. SWCHP running 1000 fps, got the call again and poleaxed one of the ol' girls.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Sow%20with%20revolver_zps4mazox4v.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Sow%20with%20revolver_zps4mazox4v.jpg.html)

I have a 5 1/2" Flat Top Blackhawk .44 Special that's crazy accurate that I'd like to use, but I have a thing about fixed-sighted, utility type revolvers, so I'm not sure yet. I have a 5 1/2" Cimarron .44 Special that is likewise way, way more accurate than it should be that I may use. Either way, I'll probably use a .44 Special again.

35W

i would def. use the 44 sp. what sort of alloy in the hp's did you use?

[35 Whelen]

The HP's were cast from 70/30 lead/COWW.

I'll probably use the .44 Special again if for no other reason than I'm very familiar with it and therefore tend to shoot it much better.

35W

[44man]

I can attest to the C&B. My friend has a .44 Rem and I have the Old Army. We have both shot more then a few deer with them and RB's.
After seeing results I wonder how anyone in the old west survived.

[rodwha]

I admit that once I became interested in BP arms and began seeking information such as the BC and SD along with typical velocities I didn't understand how these could perform well at all and so I asked a lot of questions. After seeing plenty of game with the typical complete passthroughs or found on the offside I quit doubting.

However I admit I still prefer the idea of a WFN boolit to a ball in my ROA or Remington NMA. And using Olde E or T7 my Ruger is likely producing around 500 ft/lbs and my Remington around 400. Not bad!

[BigMagShooter]

if you want a flat nose on a MZ loader, just keep pounding the ram rod a few more times with a hammer. You'll get your flat nose projectile. :)

[rodwha]

if you want a flat nose on a MZ loader, just keep pounding the ram rod a few more times with a hammer. You'll get your flat nose projectile. :)


Mine are for my percussion revolvers, but have thought about modifying my Lee REAL mold, but then I like knowing the BC value. But then pounding would be much easier and cheaper. :p

[44man]

I am from Ohio and only a shotgun or ML was legal. I used a home made .45 flinter, .50 and then my home made .54. Then after moving to where a revolver was legal I started with the .44 mag and up but used the OA with RB's and was kind of shocked. I have hundreds of deer in many states with RB's. If anyone thinks a flat nose can beat a pure RB, I don't know how.
I was told a thousand times a .45 flinter was not enough but I never lost a deer to over 100 yards off hand. Deer shot with the .54 all drop and some showed damage that a .300 mag could not do.
Use a boolit in a revolver drops powder capacity and speed so energy goes away. Our revolvers with RB's exceed 1100 fps. I get 1102 fps from the Ruger with 41 gr of Swiss FFFG. Going to a boolit means 35 gr of powder. I will stay with a RB.

[rodwha]

Typically you'd be right about a bullet reducing the powder charge. Not so with mine.

Many, many moons ago on another forum a fellow successfully loaded a ~160 grn .45 cal bullet in his percussion revolver and noted that it was about the length of a ball, which got me to thinking about that. I went to Tom at Accurate Molds and was trying to create a WFN bullet that was .460" long and about 165 grns.

Instead ad what we found was with my very wide meplat and smaller lube grooves (don't see the need for cavernous grooves for short barrels) a .460" boolit weighs 195 grns. And so we worked around with the lighter version and came up with a 170 grn boolit of the same basic design but at .400" long.

http://accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=45-195C-D.png

http://accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=45-170C-D.png

I talked to a knowledgeable fellow who created a twist rate calculator about it working in a 1:16" twist at .45 Colt type velocities and was assured it would do ok despite being a bit over stabilized. It works well in both guns out to 15 yds for sure.

Ive seen video in which a fellow has shot a RB into gel and the wound track is rather small like a FMJ bullet. I figured a WFN, if it doesn't expand, will cut no less than that. But a WFN also gives me a lot of mass without sacrificing powder capacity and will increase the BC value.

Shooting offhand at 15 yds (longest range for pistols) these projectiles group just as well as a ball. And that's all with the same powder load per gun. Max charges weren't as accurate.

I also created a 245 grn and 285 grn bullet that's a bit different but with the same meplat.

[44man]

I don't think the OA has the right twist because as I go up in velocity with a RB, accuracy does get worse. Boolits at times work better. My boolit is not that long but I do need to drop the powder to get them in. Shorten the boolit and twist still gives problems.
I just hunt closer and they will bust deer like crazy. I don't think a boolit will do worse, I just like a little more impact.
The OA is more accurate with 20 gr of powder and a filler but I want more energy.

[thadfz]

15" encore in 7-08 works great for me.
Just replicating the hornady 139 factory loads so far, but plan on experimenting in the future


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[omcforever]

Taurus Raging Bull 44 magnum with 8 3/4 barrel and 4X32 optics. 240 grain lead flat point gas checked. CVA Hunter in 44 magnum with same bullet and sometimes a 240 grain jacketed soft point. SW 586 and 158 grain cast flat point. I also try and keep shot 50 yards or less.:mrgreen:

[bbailey7821]

169717480 Ruger SBH, 325g slug.

[flyingrhino]

Kimber Gold Match with 460 Rowland conversion. 255 grain lead flat point.

[44man]

I have used everything you can shoot but a pistol or revolver will do it all. Within ranges, nothing is better. Why does a rifle need 3000 + fps to kill deer?

[BigMagShooter]

cause you're shooting a smaller bullet a longer distance, say 200yds or so.

[44man]

cause you're shooting a smaller bullet a longer distance, say 200yds or so.
That is true of course but most deer are shot a lot closer unless you live where distance is all you have. But we talk handguns for this post and although there are some that reach rifle distances, the norm is a revolver and even they can exceed what you want to do to a deer up close. Some of my revolvers are too fast at 50 or less. A .45 Colt will kill fast but a .454 can lose a deer or blow blood to the moon. Got to go to center.

[Lonegun1894]

cause you're shooting a smaller bullet a longer distance, say 200yds or so.

I was always told that regardless of weapon, from a BB gun on up to artillery, you have three things in your tool chest. They are bullet diameter, bullet weight, and velocity, --and of those three, the size and weight are the only constants. As in, regardless of weapon, your velocity starts dropping as soon as your bullet leaves the muzzle.

For example, a .22-250 obviously shoots much flatter than a .44 Mag, but the trajectory is easily flat enough in both for most hunting. Also, the light bullets used in most .22-250 loads are designed for varmint hunting instead of big game like the .44 (or any other big game caliber) is. Yes, there's times you want a bullet that breaks up, but those times are for varmints, and not for big game where you need to make sure you have enough penetration to reach the vitals. So now that we know the bigger and heavier bullet has advantages, the only advantage of the light and fast bullet is trajectory, and the slow and heavy bullets, even with the higher trajectory, are SCARY consistent out to ranges the light bullet runs out of steam before reaching. So it's a matter of figuring out the distance and your elevation.

[35 Whelen]

What you say is true, but we also have to ask how much we really need for the game we're hunting. As we all know by now, .22 centerfire are fine for deer. One must simply select the proper bullet; no different than when hunting with revolver cartridges. So if a .44 caliber bullet is better than a .22 caliber bullet, then a .62 caliber bullet is better than a .44 so we should a .62. Right?

Regarding trajectory, I think few realize how critical rangin is if one wants to shoot at long range. The last few months I've been fooling with a 44-40 rifle running a 220 RNFP around 1300 fps. When one shoots at these velocities much past 100 or 125 yds., misjudging the range by as little as 25 can easily cause a miss on deer size game. Thus the reason for using smaller bullets at higher velocity.

35W

[Lonegun1894]

35,
You're absolutely right. However, I was taught to use a .308Win for long range, and the same misjudgement of 25yds at 800-900yds+ can also cause a clean miss. This trajectory issue applies to ANY caliber at ANY velocity, and they are all limited. It's just a matter of looking at how and what you hunt, and definitely where. I mean, if you need the long range capability, by all means use it. Just make sure you match the caliber and bullet to the game as you said when you mentioned the .22 CF bullet selection. The vast majority of deer in my area are shot inside of 100 yards, but regardless of that, I started out thinking nothing less than a .30-06 was suitable. As I gained experience with guns and skill in getting closer (almost always inside 100yds, and usually inside 50yds for the last several years), I have expanded my list of acceptable weapons, and my slowest load I have used for hunting was a 400 fps load out of a .44 Mag rifle (sounds like a pellet gun) to take hogs when we had to be discreet cause a friends wife is a bit squeamish about anything getting shot on their land, regardless of how much damage it causes. Anyway, there is no need for 3,000 fps to hunt deer inside of 100 yards when my .357 mag, .44 Mag, .45 Colt, .54 flintlock, or .30-30 will all do equally well. Having said that, those are all about useless (at least with me shooting them) at 500 yards. So it's all in what we all want/need for our preferred hunting style.

Your .44-40 experiments sound like my .44 Mag and .45 Colt rifle experiments, and I know exactly what you mean. I still like playing at long range with various weapons on targets, but try to see how close I can get while hunting, regardless of weapon being used.

[rodwha]

35,
You're absolutely right. However, I was taught to use a .308Win for long range, and the same misjudgement of 25yds at 800-900yds+ can also cause a clean miss. This trajectory issue applies to ANY caliber at ANY velocity, and they are all limited. It's just a matter of looking at how and what you hunt, and definitely where. I mean, if you need the long range capability, by all means use it. Just make sure you match the caliber and bullet to the game as you said when you mentioned the .22 CF bullet selection. The vast majority of deer in my area are shot inside of 100 yards, but regardless of that, I started out thinking nothing less than a .30-06 was suitable. As I gained experience with guns and skill in getting closer (almost always inside 100yds, and usually inside 50yds for the last several years), I have expanded my list of acceptable weapons, and my slowest load I have used for hunting was a 400 fps load out of a .44 Mag rifle (sounds like a pellet gun) to take hogs when we had to be discreet cause a friends wife is a bit squeamish about anything getting shot on their land, regardless of how much damage it causes. Anyway, there is no need for 3,000 fps to hunt deer inside of 100 yards when my .357 mag, .44 Mag, .45 Colt, .54 flintlock, or .30-30 will all do equally well. Having said that, those are all about useless (at least with me shooting them) at 500 yards. So it's all in what we all want/need for our preferred hunting style.

Your .44-40 experiments sound like my .44 Mag and .45 Colt rifle experiments, and I know exactly what you mean. I still like playing at long range with various weapons on targets, but try to see how close I can get while hunting, regardless of weapon being used.


I must admit to being curious about your weak .44 loading for hogs and what you witnessed.

To be more clear I've seen how BP weapons with a meager ball have worked quite handsomely despite how some will claim 1000 ft/lbs is the absolute minimum for an ethical kill. I no longer believe (never did with his magic number) that there is an absolute, which is something I appreciate with the Taylor theory.

[Drm50]

I'm brand new member from SE Ohio. We've had pistol season since early 80s. So far I have killed deer with 44s and 45Colt. Ruger SBH with 240jhp and S&W m25 with cast 242 Wadcutter.
All deer shot 50yds or less. I shoot open sights and will not shoot at a deer over 75 yds. Now
we have limited rifle season I will alternate between rifle and pistol. Will be happy to never shoot
another shotgun slug! My main handgun for deer will be the 45colt / wadcutter combo, for the
distances I will shoot, the gun is bullseye accurate and that beer can wadcutter at 850fps will
lay them to rest.

[Lonegun1894]

Rodwha,
That weak loading is 3.0grs Unique under a Lee 240gr SWCTL and is fired from a H&R .44 Mag rifle with 22" barrel. The whole point of this was to kill some hogs on a friends place where he is all for killing them, but his wife thinks they are too cute too shoot, even though they cause property damage and harm to their pets and livestock. We have a feeder set up in a small clearing that the moon shines into, and we shoot from the brush line or a blind with shots being a max of 50 yds, but usually more around the 25-30 yd mark. The rifle was chosen due to the long barrel and large bore acting as it's own suppressor (due to internal volume), and the caliber/bullet just for the same of having a large diameter and heavy weight. Shots are taken up fairly close and on calm feeding hogs, and never against anything that is moving. POA is the head preferably, but I have taken a few heat shots and they performed just fine too. Wound looks like the "knife"-type wounds you read of from guys using subsonic .300BO except my bullet is shorter so not quite as dramatic when they tumble, but they still do. The friend does the same exact thing using a .30-30 Marlin 336, and fires my load of a Lyman 31141 or Lee 309-170-FP, both sized to .311" and both pushed by the same 3.0grs Unique. The .30-30 seems to remain stable out to 75-80yds, and my .44 does to about 60yds, but the clearing we are doing this in is barely 50yds, so both weapons are perfectly well suited.

If you decide to copy this, make sure you check the trajectory of this load because it is almost as bad as shooting a bow, and a miscalculation can result in a wounded animal or a clean miss. Think of this as hunting with a marginal caliber, because it is, and your placement has to be EXACT. For this, I figure any range where I can't maintain a 1.5" group is too far, and for me, with that iron sighted H&R, that is about 75-100yds with a normal full power load, but with these light loads, it is cut down to about 60yards max, but that may be due to the bullet yawing at 60-65yds. Remember, no room for error, so if any shot doesn't seem right, regardless if it is a reason I can explain or just a feeling, I don't take the shot.

[hoosierlogger]

I hunt with a SRH. I had a SBH that intended to hunt with, but k did t like the small trigger guard. It was to small for a gloved finger. 4 5/8" is too short for Indiana. Pistol makes an interesting challenge to the hunt. Good luck!

[randy_68]

I have a S&W 629-2 that I carried the last two years without a chance to shoot a deer. I just bought a used Ruger Super Blackhawk new model with a Burris 4x scope a couple days ago and will be trying my luck with it this year. My goal is to shoot a deer with a pistol using my own home cast boolits. I currently have Lee 240 swc , an RCBS 44-250-kt and a NOE 432-265wfngc molds and am thinking of buying a lee 310 to try out in the Blackhawk. Also have a Henry BB .44 that loves the NOE boolit. My Smith likes the RBCS better. Never had much luck with the Lee 240.
Love my 44's .

[Greg]

Drm50

can you post a picture of your .45 wad cutter ?

and the mould specs...

[44man]

I live in a funny place, development with rules that say no hunting or shooting but we all do. I am 1/2 mile from town and noise is never an issue. I can hunt all the properties and shoot big stuff. I rolled a couple out of bed once with my .475 and an old man on the other road fell off his porch chair when I touched off! :bigsmyl2::bigsmyl2: Nothing to hear shooting all around, even from town. Guy behind gets going with a pistol and must use $100 worth of ammo. We don't care.
But I do not believe in energy figures since a full metal jacket can have more then a hunting bullet.
Drop is real. I sight my .44 a little high at 50 and it is a few inches low at 100 and will kill to about 120 yards but after that it will not be used. Drop at 200 is 35" so even if you hit a deer, you can lose it. You need to make the boolit transmit energy to vitals. Holes alone don't work.
In my varmint days with a 220 Swift I shot crows to 410 yards and chicks to almost 700 yards but seen the bullet blow up on a blade of grass and spray the paper with shrapnel at 100. Would I shoot a deer at 20 yards? A 222 would not go through a 2X4.
In WWII a 30 would go through a tree and kill the enemy but then they gave our troops a .223 and it took 1000 rounds to kill one creep. Shoot in the jungle against the SKS with a superior round.
Can you kill deer with a 22-250? Sure but it is not my choice. Rifles start at 3 and revolvers at 4.

[tdoyka]

i kinda agree with you 44man, my own rifles/revolvers go a bit differently. using j-words anything over a .264" is good for a rifle(25-06 which i owned and 257 roberts which i want, are accepted). using a cast boolit, i would say anything over a .308" caliber('06, 30-30 etc) is also acceptable. using j-words and cast boolits i would start out with revolvers with a .44 caliber(44 sp, 44 mag etc).

i have shot a few deer with a 243 win and 100gr hornady rn and a 85gr x bullet(2 shoulder, 2-3 under shoulder) but i didn't have a "feel" for the rifle. the 2 shoulder shots were drt, while the others did run 40-60 yards away. they all were shot under 50 yards away. the 22 calibers aren't for deer. yes, they do shoot them and they do tag them, but a 22 caliber is nothing more than a varmint gun. i've got a tc encore 27" MGM barrel (22-250 ai/ 1in8"twist) that i might want to sell because i own and luv a 20 vartarg.

a 357 mag that i shot/killed a deer did not impress me either. i can't remember what round it was, but it was definitely a j-word. i was shooting my uncles 357 mag on a s&w m66(i think) when i got the doe. it was 35 or so yards away, hit both lungs and then it went about 150 +yards before it died. and boy it went thru mountain laurel so bad that i had to crawl on my hands and knees(one going without a doe, one with a deer) for about 100 or so yards. i more than likely would have shot another deer and it would have gone 30-40 yards, but i was p@#@!% off with the 357, that i got a 44 mag and never looked back. i know, i'm biased. a 357 or a 41 mag(just mention a caliber) is probably a good revolver, but a 44 mag is a great revolver;).

[rodwha]

Rodwha,
That weak loading is 3.0grs Unique under a Lee 240gr SWCTL and is fired from a H&R .44 Mag rifle with 22" barrel. The whole point of this was to kill some hogs on a friends place where he is all for killing them, but his wife thinks they are too cute too shoot, even though they cause property damage and harm to their pets and livestock. We have a feeder set up in a small clearing that the moon shines into, and we shoot from the brush line or a blind with shots being a max of 50 yds, but usually more around the 25-30 yd mark. The rifle was chosen due to the long barrel and large bore acting as it's own suppressor (due to internal volume), and the caliber/bullet just for the same of having a large diameter and heavy weight. Shots are taken up fairly close and on calm feeding hogs, and never against anything that is moving. POA is the head preferably, but I have taken a few heat shots and they performed just fine too. Wound looks like the "knife"-type wounds you read of from guys using subsonic .300BO except my bullet is shorter so not quite as dramatic when they tumble, but they still do. The friend does the same exact thing using a .30-30 Marlin 336, and fires my load of a Lyman 31141 or Lee 309-170-FP, both sized to .311" and both pushed by the same 3.0grs Unique. The .30-30 seems to remain stable out to 75-80yds, and my .44 does to about 60yds, but the clearing we are doing this in is barely 50yds, so both weapons are perfectly well suited.

If you decide to copy this, make sure you check the trajectory of this load because it is almost as bad as shooting a bow, and a miscalculation can result in a wounded animal or a clean miss. Think of this as hunting with a marginal caliber, because it is, and your placement has to be EXACT. For this, I figure any range where I can't maintain a 1.5" group is too far, and for me, with that iron sighted H&R, that is about 75-100yds with a normal full power load, but with these light loads, it is cut down to about 60yards max, but that may be due to the bullet yawing at 60-65yds. Remember, no room for error, so if any shot doesn't seem right, regardless if it is a reason I can explain or just a feeling, I don't take the shot.

I was curious about the wound channel mostly. Seems it was similar to a FMJ. I'm enamored with BP arms where the velocities are lower by today's standards.

But then there's a fella on another forum who touts the need for no less than 1000 ft/lbs of energy for it to be humane, which I know to be bogus.

What kind of penetration can you rely on?

[Lonegun1894]

The hogs I have taken with this were 150# at most, so not the bigger ones on this property that I've seen get to 275-300#. The H&R I use has 1:38" twist, which works great for full power loads, but is a major factor for limiting the stable range on these light loads. Wounds show the bullet to tumble end over end like what you read about the .300BO doing with subsonic loads, but the bullet being shorter makes it less dramatic. Penetration is sufficient for broadside shots to the heart to give a passthrough, but I've never tried taking a shot at any angle and don't believe there is enough power for anything but a perfect broadside shot. My placement has been to aim just a couple inches directly above the elbow to taoe the top of the heart and the bottom of both lungs. Now this works, but the hogs just keep feeding as if a mosquito or horse fly bit them and then drop in about 10 seconds. The head shots I have taken have been a couple side profile shots , and the rest were when the hogs were facing me and it was the classic hog butchering shot to the forehead. Neither of these exit, but they drop the hogs in their tracks. Performance varies between the hog twitching a few times and scaring the rest off, to just dropping in their tracks without a twitch and the rest of the hogs in the group just keep feeding, allowing you to take another hog. The friend I do this with and I always go out together, wait for the hogs to start feeding at the feeder and relax, and try to time our shots simultaneously so we take at least two hogs per outing, but never have taken more than 6 just because we do our own butchering and we don't want to take a chance of spoiling any meat. After last time we shot 6, we agreed to limit it to 4, and preferably 2 from now on.

Just please remember that this is done at what is basically a known distance range (further limited by that we do this with iron sights with just the light of the full moon), and a short one at that, and please don't trust it for longer or imperfect shots. When we hunt this same property (when his wife is away) or any other place, where we are actually hunting properly, we use full power loads that allow us to take longer range and angled shots. The only reason we use these light loads is to try to limit the damage done by the hogs without getting this friend divorced, and we would just use standard loads if it was an option.

[44man]

Penetration has never been an issue with the .44 or any other of my calibers since I got away from 240 XTP's. Problem came from loss of energy transfer with the hard 45-70 and heavy .500 boolits. They both zip through and those with the 45-70 would go well over 200 yards and when opened, lungs were still pink with just a hole. The .44 has lungs pour out.
The .500 JRH can't be stopped but deer would do 120 yards so I softened half the nose and now I dare not hit bones! If I do it goes from an instant drop to the wrath of GOD and I hate to grind meat in the field. I never seen the likes of it so I DO NOT want a .500 S&W or a .460.
Some will say there is no such thing as overkill but to drag out a rag does not sit well.
One day I had a buck facing me on a down slope at 76 yards. I shot him under the chin with the .475, took out the neck, boolit took a length of short ribs and went under the back straps to exit the ham. I did not lose any meat at all. Classic butcher to the hole. I missed all the guts.169889 This boolit weighs 420 gr with 26 gr of 296, Fed 155 for 1329 fps. 99% drop in their tracks and only a heart shot will make 30 yards.
I do not believe in energy figures but I believe in boolit function while inside an animal before exit. This boolit is just shy of a WFN and is 20-22 BHN but it does this to a heart. 169890
I fully believe the .44 with a heavy boolit can do more damage.
Another thing I don't believe in is just a flat meplat because if you shoot it too fast it will move tissue out of the way, secondary wound channel that will close back up. The pressure wave from the flat nose clears the way so you want to slow the boolit. One way is to have some expansion to slow the boolit in passage. NOT TOO much. Stay away from super fast expansion. A soft HP might ruin your day.

[44man]

You must adjust as you see results and only an animal you shoot can do it. Dirt, water or a crash dummy will lie to you. Fellas are so proud of flat boolits they dig out but the world does not work that way. Those can make you sick as you try to track a deer.
Even doing orchard and farm herd reductions in Ohio, I recovered every deer to donate. Farmers don't care and just shoot them and let them run off to die, they do not like to drop them in the fields so they want them to run into the woods. The norm is to gut shoot them. They shoot deer all year but they also hunt and complain when they can't find a deer. HEY, you killed them all year.
Had a pig farmer near here that killed over 200 a year and tossed them in a valley. Hunters were not allowed.
I was lucky to hunt and Ohio has good people, never had to ask, drive in and hunt, they knew me and all over the state, clear to the river. Here in WV is the same except the pig guy. PA had the worst as far as farmers shooting every deer they seen. I hunted MI long ago and there were strange people up there until I got to the UP where I felt at home. Cross the bridge to a different world!

[rodwha]

The hogs I have taken with this were 150# at most, so not the bigger ones on this property that I've seen get to 275-300#. The H&R I use has 1:38" twist, which works great for full power loads, but is a major factor for limiting the stable range on these light loads. Wounds show the bullet to tumble end over end like what you read about the .300BO doing with subsonic loads, but the bullet being shorter makes it less dramatic. Penetration is sufficient for broadside shots to the heart to give a passthrough, but I've never tried taking a shot at any angle and don't believe there is enough power for anything but a perfect broadside shot. My placement has been to aim just a couple inches directly above the elbow to taoe the top of the heart and the bottom of both lungs. Now this works, but the hogs just keep feeding as if a mosquito or horse fly bit them and then drop in about 10 seconds. The head shots I have taken have been a couple side profile shots , and the rest were when the hogs were facing me and it was the classic hog butchering shot to the forehead. Neither of these exit, but they drop the hogs in their tracks. Performance varies between the hog twitching a few times and scaring the rest off, to just dropping in their tracks without a twitch and the rest of the hogs in the group just keep feeding, allowing you to take another hog. The friend I do this with and I always go out together, wait for the hogs to start feeding at the feeder and relax, and try to time our shots simultaneously so we take at least two hogs per outing, but never have taken more than 6 just because we do our own butchering and we don't want to take a chance of spoiling any meat. After last time we shot 6, we agreed to limit it to 4, and preferably 2 from now on.

Just please remember that this is done at what is basically a known distance range (further limited by that we do this with iron sights with just the light of the full moon), and a short one at that, and please don't trust it for longer or imperfect shots. When we hunt this same property (when his wife is away) or any other place, where we are actually hunting properly, we use full power loads that allow us to take longer range and angled shots. The only reason we use these light loads is to try to limit the damage done by the hogs without getting this friend divorced, and we would just use standard loads if it was an option.


I have no desire to track down a wounded hog, especially in the dark! I'd prefer a standard load to a slow quiet one, though I could certainly see how, in that instance, it's helpful wanting to shoot several.

No way I'd want to field dress more than two, much less fully butcher them! A lot of work!

Are you using a hard alloy or soft lead? With them tumbling I'm curious about the bullets. When I got into casting for my BP guns I noticed expansion wasn't predictable. Asking about the typical velocity where expansion is more likely I was told around 800 fps. But I've seen far too many that were a couple hundred fps faster and still nearly pristine, which is why I decided on a WFN design for my cap n ball guns. I've also contemplated sending off both of my REAL molds to have them modified for a larger meplat.

[rodwha]

Penetration has never been an issue with the .44 or any other of my calibers since I got away from 240 XTP's. Problem came from loss of energy transfer with the hard 45-70 and heavy .500 boolits. They both zip through and those with the 45-70 would go well over 200 yards and when opened, lungs were still pink with just a hole. The .44 has lungs pour out.
The .500 JRH can't be stopped but deer would do 120 yards so I softened half the nose and now I dare not hit bones! If I do it goes from an instant drop to the wrath of GOD and I hate to grind meat in the field. I never seen the likes of it so I DO NOT want a .500 S&W or a .460.
Some will say there is no such thing as overkill but to drag out a rag does not sit well.
One day I had a buck facing me on a down slope at 76 yards. I shot him under the chin with the .475, took out the neck, boolit took a length of short ribs and went under the back straps to exit the ham. I did not lose any meat at all. Classic butcher to the hole. I missed all the guts.169889 This boolit weighs 420 gr with 26 gr of 296, Fed 155 for 1329 fps. 99% drop in their tracks and only a heart shot will make 30 yards.
I do not believe in energy figures but I believe in boolit function while inside an animal before exit. This boolit is just shy of a WFN and is 20-22 BHN but it does this to a heart. 169890
I fully believe the .44 with a heavy boolit can do more damage.
Another thing I don't believe in is just a flat meplat because if you shoot it too fast it will move tissue out of the way, secondary wound channel that will close back up. The pressure wave from the flat nose clears the way so you want to slow the boolit. One way is to have some expansion to slow the boolit in passage. NOT TOO much. Stay away from super fast expansion. A soft HP might ruin your day.


Hmmm... I wasn't aware that a very high velocity would kill the performance of a wide meplat. I need a Colt Walker but that still won't produce more than maybe .44 mag performance.

Funny you mention a bit of expansion as I have been contemplating ordering another mold or two from Accurate and having him send it/them to Erik at Hollow Point Molds along with a loading ram or two to have him thread it for a hollow point cavity so as not to deform it upon loading, and the depth is one thing I've been uncertain of.

One pistol produces roughly .45 ACP ballistics (~375-400 ft/lbs with a 170 or 195 grn bullet) and the other hotter .45 Colt ballistics (~475-525 ft/lbs), and so I wouldn't want to reduce my penetration too much but also don't need two feet or more of penetration. The other end of this is that the pin cannot be too long so as to get the projectile under the ram, which has me reconsidering my previous design by giving it a longer base so as to seat further in the chamber prior to seating with the ram.

[rodwha]

"I hunted MI long ago and there were strange people up there until I got to the UP where I felt at home. Cross the bridge to a different world!"

The Yoopers?

[Lonegun1894]

I have no desire to track down a wounded hog, especially in the dark! I'd prefer a standard load to a slow quiet one, though I could certainly see how, in that instance, it's helpful wanting to shoot several.

No way I'd want to field dress more than two, much less fully butcher them! A lot of work!

Are you using a hard alloy or soft lead? With them tumbling I'm curious about the bullets. When I got into casting for my BP guns I noticed expansion wasn't predictable. Asking about the typical velocity where expansion is more likely I was told around 800 fps. But I've seen far too many that were a couple hundred fps faster and still nearly pristine, which is why I decided on a WFN design for my cap n ball guns. I've also contemplated sending off both of my REAL molds to have them modified for a larger meplat.

I have tried both hard and soft, and just didn't see any difference with these low velocities. If they were any more pristine, you could pull them out of the hog and just reload them. So now I just use whatever I have the most of, which is usually range scrap.

As to butchering/dressing them, with two of us working, it is no problem to do 2-3, but our self-imposed limitation is partly due to being lazy, and partly because there's just so much room in the freezers and I refuse to shoot more than I can use, even when they are a (edible) pest.

[tdoyka]

I was curious about the wound channel mostly. Seems it was similar to a FMJ. I'm enamored with BP arms where the velocities are lower by today's standards.

But then there's a fella on another forum who touts the need for no less than 1000 ft/lbs of energy for it to be humane, which I know to be bogus.

What kind of penetration can you rely on?

i've run into him too over at cba, and i think 1000ft/lbs is bogus too.

i'm going to start with a ruger sbh with a 4 5/8" barrel in 44 mag. (i wish it would get here) i got a bunch of 250gr mihek hp that are cast from 40:1.
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj80/Dale53/MiHecCramerStyleBulletMould-3207-1.jpg
i took this one from another site, mine is fuzzy pix of the boolits
my hollow point goes .330" inside a .760" boolit. i think that firing a 40:1 cast with the hp(unique powder either a 44 sp or mag) will take a deer down at 50 or less yards.

[44man]

"I hunted MI long ago and there were strange people up there until I got to the UP where I felt at home. Cross the bridge to a different world!"

The Yoopers?
Yep, stop in any little place and get a pastie to warm you up.
I hated to drive the straits, go to pass and see lights coming but the other car was 5 miles away yet.
Now PA had great people too, we would stop to ask to hunt and they said "come in" to give us home made donuts and coffee. The PA hunters would steal a deer so all my friends that hunt there use Ballistic Tips.
They tried to steal mine one night but I had a rope on a leg, into the tent tied to a pile of pots and pans with silverware in them. You should have heard them beat feet!
Sad when you have to booby trap a deer.
Now here, I will shoot a deer and see a fella from up town and ask if he wants it but they never do, he wants to shoot his own.
When I see a guy dragging one, I give up most of my hunting to help him get it to his car. Even to carry his gun and pack helps. It is the right thing to do.

[35 Whelen]

i've run into him too over at cba, and i think 1000ft/lbs is bogus too.

i'm going to start with a ruger sbh with a 4 5/8" barrel in 44 mag. (i wish it would get here) i got a bunch of 250gr mihek hp that are cast from 40:1.
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj80/Dale53/MiHecCramerStyleBulletMould-3207-1.jpg
i took this one from another site, mine is fuzzy pix of the boolits
my hollow point goes .330" inside a .760" boolit. i think that firing a 40:1 cast with the hp(unique powder either a 44 sp or mag) will take a deer down at 50 or less yards.

I've shot that very bullet quite a bit in at least three different .44 Specials. In all of them, which are all very accurate revolvers, accuracy is ho-hum running around 6" at 50 yds. when fired from a seated back rested position.
I finally got to try the bullet a couple of months ago when I slipped up on a couple of sows. I had to take the shot offhand at what turned out to be about 42 yds., which is an easy shot as much of my practicing is done offhand at 50 yds. at a 10"x7"steel plate. Anyhow, I had a perfect sight picture and the front sight was solidly resting just behind the shoulder about 2/3 of the way up from the chest when the shot went off. The bullet (MV ~1000 fps) hit her low in the shoulder shattering the leg bone then penetrating to somewhere around the spine. I say somewhere because I never did find it despite cutting, hacking and prodding all through the neck area. Given that the sow dropped like a sack of taters, I'm guessing g the bullet came rest somewhere around the spine. She was able to get up on her hind legs and although she was dead on her feet, I put a 44-250KT through her temple from about 25 yds. out.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Sow%20with%20revolver_zps4mazox4v.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Sow%20with%20revolver_zps4mazox4v.jpg.html)

I'm just not sold on HP's especially if they encounter bone. Of course had the bullet gone where the sights were, things would've been different.

35W

[44man]

i've run into him too over at cba, and i think 1000ft/lbs is bogus too.

i'm going to start with a ruger sbh with a 4 5/8" barrel in 44 mag. (i wish it would get here) i got a bunch of 250gr mihek hp that are cast from 40:1.
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj80/Dale53/MiHecCramerStyleBulletMould-3207-1.jpg
i took this one from another site, mine is fuzzy pix of the boolits
my hollow point goes .330" inside a .760" boolit. i think that firing a 40:1 cast with the hp(unique powder either a 44 sp or mag) will take a deer down at 50 or less yards.
I think you might be sorry with your choice. Those are little BOMBS.
HOWEVER, you will run .44 SP ranges so I will not say more until you report back after season.
They just might be a good one at the lower velocities.
Need more to show results, not just a dead animal so we can work out the best since I have not solved it all the way either. I am close with each caliber, then get turned around badly.
Getting boolits perfect has driven me a little crazy. Seems to be a sheet of paper between failure and explosive. The drive to drop deer fast without a full blowup is proving hard.
The more all of you add the better.

[tdoyka]

Penetration has never been an issue with the .44 or any other of my calibers since I got away from 240 XTP's. Problem came from loss of energy transfer with the hard 45-70 and heavy .500 boolits. They both zip through and those with the 45-70 would go well over 200 yards and when opened, lungs were still pink with just a hole. The .44 has lungs pour out.
The .500 JRH can't be stopped but deer would do 120 yards so I softened half the nose and now I dare not hit bones! If I do it goes from an instant drop to the wrath of GOD and I hate to grind meat in the field. I never seen the likes of it so I DO NOT want a .500 S&W or a .460.
Some will say there is no such thing as overkill but to drag out a rag does not sit well.
One day I had a buck facing me on a down slope at 76 yards. I shot him under the chin with the .475, took out the neck, boolit took a length of short ribs and went under the back straps to exit the ham. I did not lose any meat at all. Classic butcher to the hole. I missed all the guts.169889 This boolit weighs 420 gr with 26 gr of 296, Fed 155 for 1329 fps. 99% drop in their tracks and only a heart shot will make 30 yards.
I do not believe in energy figures but I believe in boolit function while inside an animal before exit. This boolit is just shy of a WFN and is 20-22 BHN but it does this to a heart. 169890
I fully believe the .44 with a heavy boolit can do more damage.
Another thing I don't believe in is just a flat meplat because if you shoot it too fast it will move tissue out of the way, secondary wound channel that will close back up. The pressure wave from the flat nose clears the way so you want to slow the boolit. One way is to have some expansion to slow the boolit in passage. NOT TOO much. Stay away from super fast expansion. A soft HP might ruin your day.

these .429"'s are cast from ww(on the left) and lyman #2(on the right). both are recovered from a stack of wood railroad ties at 50 yards. boolits are for deer.
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h273/tdoyka/IMG_20160104_163347_zpsubiekqrz.jpg (http://s66.photobucket.com/user/tdoyka/media/IMG_20160104_163347_zpsubiekqrz.jpg.html)

the left ones are a 265gr ranch dog(act. wt. 278gr) fired out of a 444 marlin(2000fps) and the right are from a 44 mag(srh-7.5"barrel) going roughly 1000fps and are a 220gr wc. i do have a (444 marlin)280gr wfn gc that is cast from ww that i have to shoot at 100 yards. i plan on taking these out to around 1800-1900fps at the muzzle. i haven't heard that a wfn going at high velocity would kill the performance. i guess you learn somethin every day :smile:. since i don't plan on taking it out past 150 yards, the 280gr should be good.

i don't have a pix of my 250gr mihek hp because i'm still waiting for the gun(grrrrrrr!!!!:p). i want to shoot it into my 50 yard target and then see what it look like(unique powder from a 44 sp or mag).

its nice to use a .429", waaaaaay nice!!!!

[tdoyka]

I've shot that very bullet quite a bit in at least three different .44 Specials. In all of them, which are all very accurate revolvers, accuracy is ho-hum running around 6" at 50 yds. when fired from a seated back rested position.
I finally got to try the bullet a couple of months ago when I slipped up on a couple of sows. I had to take the shot offhand at what turned out to be about 42 yds., which is an easy shot as much of my practicing is done offhand at 50 yds. at a 10"x7"steel plate. Anyhow, I had a perfect sight picture and the front sight was solidly resting just behind the shoulder about 2/3 of the way up from the chest when the shot went off. The bullet (MV ~1000 fps) hit her low in the shoulder shattering the leg bone then penetrating to somewhere around the spine. I say somewhere because I never did find it despite cutting, hacking and prodding all through the neck area. Given that the sow dropped like a sack of taters, I'm guessing g the bullet came rest somewhere around the spine. She was able to get up on her hind legs and although she was dead on her feet, I put a 44-250KT through her temple from about 25 yds. out.

http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h6/308Scout/Hunting/Sow%20with%20revolver_zps4mazox4v.jpg (http://s60.photobucket.com/user/308Scout/media/Hunting/Sow%20with%20revolver_zps4mazox4v.jpg.html)

I'm just not sold on HP's especially if they encounter bone. Of course had the bullet gone where the sights were, things would've been different.

35W


i'm not sold on hp either(first one i'm about to try), but i figure if you take out a deer's lungs at no more than 50 yards(i got to remember don't do shoulder shots) it should only(drt is nice) about 40 yards or so to where it died. the only deer that i did shoot from cb was a doe at 93 yards(30-40 krag/165gr ranch dog) and it was drt.

i have shot 200-240gr xtp(44 mag about 1500-1600fps) before and i've gotten a couple of deer, but i want to try a cb hp on a deer. if it doesn't work well, then i'll take the 250gr kieth boolit.

[tdoyka]

I think you might be sorry with your choice. Those are little BOMBS.
HOWEVER, you will run .44 SP ranges so I will not say more until you report back after season.
They just might be a good one at the lower velocities.
Need more to show results, not just a dead animal so we can work out the best since I have not solved it all the way either. I am close with each caliber, then get turned around badly.
Getting boolits perfect has driven me a little crazy. Seems to be a sheet of paper between failure and explosive. The drive to drop deer fast without a full blowup is proving hard.
The more all of you add the better.

i was shooting them up to 1500-1600fps from my 444 marlin and they were bombs:-D. not what you would take out for deer. i've talked to another caster and he thinks(God, i wish he's right!) that going 900-1000fps with 40:1 will be the ticket. i've got 44sp and mag brass and unique powder to work with. i just have to wait until my new sbh shows up(grrrr:smile:).

but theres always a 250gr keith boolit with a 20:1 i can use. hopefully it don't come to that.

[44man]

I use a very hard water dropped boolit in the .44 and .475 both of which run just over 1300 fps.
As I speed up the hard boolit, they don't work anymore so a tad of expansion is the way to go.
In my 45-70 at 1632 fps I had a sharp stick so I used a 420 gr HP cast from 50-50 and oven hardened. Shot the wrong angle behind the shoulder and lost the entire shoulder on exit. I then made a WFN and it failed, lost 2 deer.
Now the hard .500 JRH is too heavy at 440 gr, sharp stick again. No blood trails at all. I shot a big doe and could not find her after hours, no blood. I sat down and seen a nice buck at 120 yards, busted him and he ran to me 100 yards, turned another 20 into the woods, no blood on the ground. I back track all deer. It got dark and as I gutted my light picked up white back in the woods, it was the first deer.
I cast half the nose softer with 1# of WW and 3# of pure, now I need more care placing shots but nothing stays on it's feet now.
I can show what a bone hit does now, this is the entrance, also destroyed the neck on exit.169940 I created a MONSTER so be careful with those HP's and the velocity. This boolit is 1350 fps. I went from a 1/2" hole to this right fast.
What you DON'T want is to stop your boolit inside.

[jaydub in wi]

i know, i'm biased. a 357 or a 41 mag(just mention a caliber) is probably a good revolver, but a 44 mag is a great revolver;).
You're right, the 44 mag is a great revolver, but in my limited experience the 41 mag gives up little if anything to the 44. It's a lot more like the 44 than the 357. Great thread BTW

[rking22]

44Man "What you DON'T want is to stop your boolit inside. " You are SO right, the only deer I have lost in over 40 years was a 340 Gould HP at 1600fps. It was too soft and did not exit, deer was in a corner of 3 overgrown fields. Took off at the shot and the only sign I could find was small amount of hair. Deer went only about 100 yards, found him next morning, after the coyotes had :( Looked till well after dark and at one point was probably within 35 yards of f him, did I mention it was thick! Problem was he instantly went out of sight and I had no blood trail. Boolit was in opposite ham, entrance just inside near shoulder. Never thought a 340 gr 45 cal boolit wouldn't exit!!! I slowed that load down to where the 340Gould was designed for, about 1450 and it works a charm. Don't kick as hard in that little low wall either!

[white eagle]

I like the 44 mag and I have taken some sage advice from
some of our more experienced handgun aficionados and use a
heavy for cal boolit and water drop for a slightly harder alloy
tried the hp but my results were not real good but I may have
had the alloy mix incorrect

[35 Whelen]

44Man "What you DON'T want is to stop your boolit inside. " You are SO right, the only deer I have lost in over 40 years was a 340 Gould HP at 1600fps. It was too soft and did not exit, deer was in a corner of 3 overgrown fields. Took off at the shot and the only sign I could find was small amount of hair. Deer went only about 100 yards, found him next morning, after the coyotes had :( Looked till well after dark and at one point was probably within 35 yards of f him, did I mention it was thick! Problem was he instantly went out of sight and I had no blood trail. Boolit was in opposite ham, entrance just inside near shoulder. Never thought a 340 gr 45 cal boolit wouldn't exit!!! I slowed that load down to where the 340Gould was designed for, about 1450 and it works a charm. Don't kick as hard in that little low wall either!

So you're saying if the bullet had exited the ham there'd have been more blood to follow??? Sounds to me as if the bullet did everything it was supposed to; it penetrated the vitals completely. I don't see how the bullet exiting the hindquarter would've made any difference.

35W

[35 Whelen]

44Man "What you DON'T want is to stop your boolit inside. " You are SO right, the only deer I have lost in over 40 years was a 340 Gould HP at 1600fps. It was too soft and did not exit, deer was in a corner of 3 overgrown fields. Took off at the shot and the only sign I could find was small amount of hair. Deer went only about 100 yards, found him next morning, after the coyotes had :( Looked till well after dark and at one point was probably within 35 yards of f him, did I mention it was thick! Problem was he instantly went out of sight and I had no blood trail. Boolit was in opposite ham, entrance just inside near shoulder. Never thought a 340 gr 45 cal boolit wouldn't exit!!! I slowed that load down to where the 340Gould was designed for, about 1450 and it works a charm. Don't kick as hard in that little low wall either!

So you're saying if the bullet had exited the ham there'd have been more blood to follow??? Sounds to me as if the bullet did everything it was supposed to; it penetrated the vitals completely. I don't see how the bullet exiting the hindquarter would've made any difference. I'd bet the farm you gut shot the deer.

35W

[tdoyka]

You're right, the 44 mag is a great revolver, but in my limited experience the 41 mag gives up little if anything to the 44. It's a lot more like the 44 than the 357. Great thread BTW


you're probably right. heck, you are right, even with a 357. my dad really wants to own a 41 mag, but for me, its a 44.
i can't remember what 357 bullet it was? i asked my uncle and he don't remember either. i think it was a remmy 158gr jacketed sp bullet, but i'm not sure. i believe if i would have kept myself with the 357, the 100 or so yards dash wouldn't have happened. boy, all it takes is one time for me or anybody else to say the 357 mag don't work.even tho its a great caliber and even better 41 mag.
i'm am a prejudiced son of a pollock[smilie=b: that knows everything:kidding:!!!

[rking22]

You are correct 35Whelen, I misread the angle but the lesson for me was that even a big bullet could fail given a poor combination of events/mistakes. I cast the boolit too soft for the intended velocity, I did not wait to verify the angle was what I thought it to be and result was a deer I did not get to eat. The primary problem was my shot placement, but I learned 2 things, there can be too much velocity for the boolit and alloy and reaffirmed that no matter how much "energy" is generated at the muzzle there best be a blood trail generated. I was amazed that little deer did not drop at the shot. An eariler, larger deer, with the same load,had broken the near shoulder and stopped under the skin on the far side , boolit was the size of a half dollar! But no exit no blood trail,I was lucky and the deer dropped almost instantly. I should have taken the hint with that one and made changes, but I didn't and lost the next one to learn my lesson. Boolit performance needs to have some "margin for error", I may have held off on the poor shot if I had not been overconfident about the apparent performance of the load, based on only one DRT shot. Really was just the event that triggered the "must have 2 holes per shot" mind set for me.But no, would still not have worked out well in that instance, bad shot placement is the root cause.
I still use HPs but in pistols at lower velocity and closer ranges with more restraint to be sure I have an angle that gets me an exit that leaks!

[35 Whelen]

The reason I "know" you gut shot the deer you lost is my Dad made an identical shot on a buck when I was a kid. He loaded a very hard cast 457191 but in his Ruger #1 45-70 to about 1500 fps. His shot, from an elevated stand, was a quartering shot on a little central Texas buck. The bullet entered behind the left shoulder, exited the belly, then went through the right hindquarter and exited. Fortunately he found the buck walking almost directLy away and slipped a.second bullet into his right flank that penetrated up into the neck.
That's how I knew what happened to your buck!

35W

[44man]

There is a difference between DRT and the need for a blood trail. It is thick here and a deer is out of sight in a jump.
The 3 deer I shot with 240 XTP's all bolted but I was in my woods where I could see farther and seen them crash, over 60 yards, no blood on the backtracks at all. I recovered those great mushrooms against the ribs, they did the job BUT. I went to the LBT 320 WLN and bought the Lee 310 mold, then made my own. Things turned around and you can be blind and follow the blood. My preferred shot is double lungs behind the shoulders. Holdover from archery.
Deer hit with the .44 seldom drop unless something is hit but I like shoulder meat. I see or hear them fall, close.
The .475 and the .500 JRH with the soft nose just dumps them 99% of the time, even double lungs.
If I had to use XTP's in the .44 I would use the 300 gr.

[tdoyka]

There is a difference between DRT and the need for a blood trail. It is thick here and a deer is out of sight in a jump.
The 3 deer I shot with 240 XTP's all bolted but I was in my woods where I could see farther and seen them crash, over 60 yards, no blood on the backtracks at all. I recovered those great mushrooms against the ribs, they did the job BUT. I went to the LBT 320 WLN and bought the Lee 310 mold, then made my own. Things turned around and you can be blind and follow the blood. My preferred shot is double lungs behind the shoulders. Holdover from archery.
Deer hit with the .44 seldom drop unless something is hit but I like shoulder meat. I see or hear them fall, close.
The .475 and the .500 JRH with the soft nose just dumps them 99% of the time, even double lungs.
If I had to use XTP's in the .44 I would use the 300 gr.

i've shot 4 deer(doe) with the 200-240gr xtp and everyone of them exited. 3 of them were under 40 yards while the other was 120+/- yards away. all the deer where double-lunged and say half of them ran about 40-50 yards, while the other half were drt, esp the 120+/- yards doe. i was real suprised with that one, both a exit wound and drt! all from a 200gr.

but the others that ran 40-50 yards didn't leave alot of blood on the ground. just a drop or two here and there. the lungs were basically destroyed and a double lung shot should of had blood all over the trees and ground, but it didn't.

my pistolero days were over(yeah, right!!! now i'm trying to find the best cb load for my revolver:-)), and i had a brand "new" '98 mauser to try. my revolver was a ruger super redhawk with a 7.5" barrel chambered for the 44 mag. i went overmax with the loads:cry:(i was young and dumb), so i won't tell anyone, but it did go 1600-1700fps.

[6pt-sika]

169717480 Ruger SBH, 325g slug.

I like that and wouldn't mind having one , just wish I still had the dies brass and molds I had before for the SRH's I had in 480 . But on the other hand I remember how that old circa 1957 Blackhawk 44 MAG I had would eat up the knuckle on my middle finger of my trigger hand , so if I ever get another 480 it's going to have to be in a double action .

[tdoyka]

but the others that ran 40-50 yards didn't leave alot of blood on the ground. just a drop or two here and there. the lungs were basically destroyed and a double lung shot should of had blood all over the trees and ground, but it didn't.


i have been thinking about the exit wounds on each doe with the 44 mag, and i think(this was 20+years ago) that it was the same coming in. i think? that the 200-240gr xtp hit the deer and started to expand, when it hit the on-side lung and maybe half of the exit lung, the bullet probably expanded so much that the lead started to come off and made secondary wound channels. by the time it exited there was a small amount(say 100 or so grains)of the bullet that was exited out the deer.

now i can't remember if the 200-240gr did or did not break the rib cage, either going in or out. that may have something to do with it or not. i don't remember if the jacketed parts of the bullet ever scraped my hands while i was gutting it. i do remember that a 130gr bt from a 270 does scrape the hands, esp when shot at under 30 yards!!! but that was 20 or so years ago, and i can't remember what the 44 mag did do.

[jaydub in wi]

while i'm sitting here waiting for a ruger super blackhawk, i was wondering what everybody else will use this year.

my sbh will have a 4 5/8" barrel in 44 mag that will use 250gr mihek hollow points(40:1) and unique that goes roughly 900-1000fps. my shots on deer will be 50 yards or less. i haven't decided on 44 mag or the 44 special yet. i'll see what they say when the sbh arrives.
I like your choice of a sbh. I have one with a 7.5" bbl. I took my first ever deer with it last hunting season. There's a thread somewhere around here about it. I used a 280 WFN boolit , and it worked fine. It was a 25 yd shot to the heart. Good luck hunting

[44man]

The 240 and lighter XTP's depend on velocity. Too fast and they balloon. .44 spec velocities will give more penetration.
I was running them with 24 gr of 296. Even though I use a Fed 150 I suppose I was around 1400 fps or a little more. I used that because it was where accuracy was.

[44man]

I still have the bullets and weighed them. They lost little weight, one is 228 gr, second is 223 and third is 213.170117 Here they are.

[tdoyka]

The 240 and lighter XTP's depend on velocity. Too fast and they balloon. .44 spec velocities will give more penetration.
I was running them with 24 gr of 296. Even though I use a Fed 150 I suppose I was around 1400 fps or a little more. I used that because it was where accuracy was.

i was using 296 too. back when i loaded them for pure speed(young and dumb), thats when i went from 240gr xtp to 200gr xtp. i killed the first two with a 240gr and the the two with a 200gr. i'm still suprised that the 200gr xtp went thru a doe, standing broadside, at 120+/- yards. i guess the bullet was going "a little too fast"( see young and dumb). now(a little bit older:p and a little bit wiser;)) the 200gr xtp with 296 would go around 1500fps(27.0gr most accurate). well, it used too too!!! since i'm one handed, that gun has been traded(7.5"srh to 4 5/8"sbh) and now a 250gr mihek hp with unique will likely go 900-1000fps. heck, i'd take 800fps if it can go thru a deer's lungs at no more than 50 yards.

one thing i have learned over the years(not much, but enough;)), that you don't need a high velocity cartridge to kill a deer. the 300 super dooper magnum with its 150gr all copper bullet that shoots to 1000yards(and the recoil kicks your a$#) at a minute of angle doesn't impress me. at 44 sp or a 45 colt that go around 800-1000fps kills the same deer at under 100 yards does. sorry bout the rant.

[CPL Lou]

The ONLY deer I have taken with a pistol was back in '84.
I was young and thought speed was the ticket as well.
I was shooting a scoped Ruger Redhawk using a Sierra 180 HP loaded over H110 at a near max load (forget what that load was now).
I had a handsome 8 point buck at about 50 yards and all I could make out was his neck and head. It's a good thing too !
Bullet struck that buck square in the neck and he vanished before I recovered from the recoil.
I found him right where he was standing, not a twitch !
Anyway, when I skinned that guy out, I found the bullet stuck in the skin of his neck on the opposite side of the entrance hole.
It was about as big as a quarter ! Almost perfectly flat !
After that, I switched to 240 HP !
Haven't been handgun hunting since, but I'm working on a load for my Bisley Blackhack 45 Colt for just that reason.
Still haven't decided between a 285gr RCBS (270 SAA) or a 255gr gas checked flat nose.

CPL Lou

[44man]

Tdoyka, not a rant but true, the 200 gr shed enough velocity at range. I imagine at 20 yards, things would be different.
The most deer lost here are shot with mag rifles at close range. I was the only hunter with a revolver until my friends now use them too.
Only enough velocity is needed to put a hurt on internals and too high brings in problems with boolit design. I would not go too slow though because you still need some energy.
But I admit, with work, you can change a boolit to work about anywhere.
Other then placement, I firmly believe your boolit is the most important.
My .44 is a good match with the heavy boolit cast hard from WD, WW's. Velocity is self limited from the weight.
Many fellas don't think hard works though but it is the velocity that fits the boolit or the other way around.170195 I shot this deer in the neck at 76 yards with my 330 gr at around 1300 fps. It does this to lungs too.
Some would cast it soft or HP it or try to shoot it at 1000-1100 fps that can't be done. I get over 2' patterns if I slow it. That would limit me to 20 yards and placement would be a joke. Accuracy really does count. I get accuracy first no matter the speed, then work on the boolit.

[jaysouth]

I had a friend who was a life long, very successful bowhunter. He killed hundreds of deer including some trophies. As age and arthritis set in, he put down the bow and started hunting deer with a Model 19 Smith using factory 158 JHPs. Several dozen deer later, I concluded that it aint the bow, or the arrow or the quiver, it's only the injun' that counts.

Using the skills he acquired as a lifelong bowhunter, he could have probably used a spear to good effect.

[tdoyka]

Tdoyka, not a rant but true, the 200 gr shed enough velocity at range. I imagine at 20 yards, things would be different.
The most deer lost here are shot with mag rifles at close range. I was the only hunter with a revolver until my friends now use them too.
Only enough velocity is needed to put a hurt on internals and too high brings in problems with boolit design. I would not go too slow though because you still need some energy.
But I admit, with work, you can change a boolit to work about anywhere.
Other then placement, I firmly believe your boolit is the most important.
My .44 is a good match with the heavy boolit cast hard from WD, WW's. Velocity is self limited from the weight.
Many fellas don't think hard works though but it is the velocity that fits the boolit or the other way around.170195 I shot this deer in the neck at 76 yards with my 330 gr at around 1300 fps. It does this to lungs too.
Some would cast it soft or HP it or try to shoot it at 1000-1100 fps that can't be done. I get over 2' patterns if I slow it. That would limit me to 20 yards and placement would be a joke. Accuracy really does count. I get accuracy first no matter the speed, then work on the boolit.

i got this one before i had a stroke. i got it with my ruger #1 in 270 with a 130gr nosler bt and 53.5gr of imr4350.
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h273/tdoyka/IMG_0012_zpszvnjudjf.jpg (http://s66.photobucket.com/user/tdoyka/media/IMG_0012_zpszvnjudjf.jpg.html)
i got it at 16-17 feet. yes, i did say feet. i was going thru some brush when i spotted him. the only thing that i had a good shot from was his onside shoulder. since he was broadside to me, i carefully placed a shot thru the twigs and brush, right thru the shoulder. he jumped straight up and then he took off thru the brush. i thought that i missed him, so i reloaded the gun, waited a few minutes and then i began looking for his trail. i found where he was at when i shot. he really messed up the leaves and i did find his trail. i was looking around but i could not find a speck of blood. at this point i really thought that i missed him. i mean he was 5 yards, how can i miss a deer at 5 yards!!! anyway, i got onto his trail looking for blood or hair, mumbling to myself. i was about 15 yards thru the brush when i dang near stepped on him. after my excitement, then i started to gut the deer. there the nosler bt goes right on the shoulder, there is no exit wound. there wasn't a drop of blood anywhere on the buck. i gutted him and then i dragged him back to the quad trail.
when i skinned him, your picture reminds me of him. the entrance wound was terrible, blood shot piece of deer burger. the inside of the buck's ribcage also had to be thrown away. the lungs and heart looked like soup when i gutted him. the nosler bt just went to pieces. it would do that at under 50 yards. i'd shoot them at 100+ yards and it would put an exit wound on the deer, at under 50 yards it was a entrance wound only.

i have seen a couple of videos using the 44 mag with cast boolits that are real hard(like 20-22bhn). these boolits are fired into ballistic gellatin(2-3' long). most of them are not caught, a few of them are(gellatin then plywood baffle). the wounds that they create are just awesome. the permant wound channels are equally awesome. but i(i'm stubborn:-)) want to prove that a 40:1 hp boolit(250gr) doing an unawesome(some might say unimagmitive, unglorious, un....) speed of 800-1000fps using a 44, will kill a deer(straight thru both lungs and exit) at under 50 yards. yes, it has been done before, but not by me(i'm really stubborn:-)). i really want to pick up a 300gr and some 296 and have a blast doing it. but having a stroke lets me use a 250gr and some unique puts me into a different catagory...50 yards, hp's and unique and doing quite a bit of fun!!!

[44man]

You will have no problems as long as you can hit good. Slower means expansion but for me to say how much you will get will take me where I have never been. Anything you do to stop penetration is not as good.
Shorter boolits can be shot slow but the heavy weights need spun up and recoil goes up too.
The Lee 310 has been a proven and fast killer but I use 21.5 gr of 296 and a Fed 150 primer.
Two things said over and over that disturbs me is "all you need is a big hole and a .45 never gets smaller" and "a boolit that goes through wastes energy."
I see what you are saying about the 270, Don always used one and he got sick of meat loss so I gave him my .44 last season with a sling and shoulder holster. I heard him shoot and he got a nice deer, of course work on my range got him ready. He just bought a new Ruger SB Hunter and Ultra Dot. He watched me year after year, stack up deer so now we have another convert.
We both have been life long archers so to apply that to revolvers makes it easy.
Now Dave can't hit a deer with anything unless I rope it and tape it to his muzzle but he can hit cardboard deer every time. :groner:
I have over 225 archery kills but can't pull the things anymore. I have around 180 revolver kills and my total is lost now but maybe over 550 since I did deer damage control in Ohio. Major amount shot with a .45 flinter. Throw in shotguns and rifles to the mix.
Sounds like a lot but a friend kills at least 17 a year in VA and donates a ton of meat. He will not buy meat of any kind and only eats game, rabbits to deer.

[tdoyka]

i started out hunting archery when i was 17-18 y.o. till i was 21-22y.o. and then i quit. it wasn't much fun and i didn't have the time. then about 10 years or so ago, my little brother got me back into it. (they make treestands and everything now, we had to haul lumber in when i was 18 y.o.) i would go every chance i could. then the stroke knocked me back, until i discovered a crossbow. barnett predator with a barnett crank cocking device(makes it draw the crossbow back with one hand) with a tripod is not the best thing in the world(its really heavy), but it lets me go out and have some fun.

the nosler bt(esp the light ones) are great for "deer burger" up close. i shot one with the 6.5 creedmoor with 120gr bt, its was about 35 yards away, and it did the same thing as my 270 did. over 100 yards, they do really good, under a 100, it just kills without an exit wound.

[6pt-sika]

the nosler bt(esp the light ones) are great for "deer burger" up close. i shot one with the 6.5 creedmoor with 120gr bt, its was about 35 yards away, and it did the same thing as my 270 did. over 100 yards, they do really good, under a 100, it just kills without an exit wound. When the 260 REM first came out I used the 120 BT and killed three bucks the first year with three shots . The following year I shot one and had to shoot it the second time . So for the third year I switched to the 125 Partition and never had anymore issues . I think over the years I've killed close to forty deer with the 260 REM . Meat loss was non existant using the 125 PT . But then again I've killed a pile of deer using a BT in the 7-08 , 280 , 7 Mag and the 25-06 without much meat loss if any . Incidentally the only deer to date I've shot at or killed with a handgun was done with a Savage Striker in 7-08 shooting a hand loaded 140 BT , one shot boom flop . But to be honest I don't really consider that a handgun but more of a hand rifle .

[CPL Lou]

I LOVE my 260 Remingtons.
I have 2, both Savages and both are deadly on deer !
\OT

CPL Lou

[6pt-sika]

I LOVE my 260 Remingtons.
I have 2, both Savages and both are deadly on deer !
\OT

CPL Lou

I still have dies and about 150 pieces of Lapua brass for the 260 . Hopefully this year or next I'll get a left handed Remington 700 SPS in 243 or 7-08 with the youth stock and rebarrel it with a stainless Shilen #3 1-8 chambered for the 260 . Should make a fine deer slayer for my wife ! I've still got my 6.5-06 and 26 Nosler for myself .

FWIW , when I used to hunt the Poconos with friends all but one of the deer I killed in PA were done in with the 260 REM , my original first year production Remington Model 7 stainless synthetic . Never shoulda sold that rifle , but I made a decent profit etc etc . Same can be said for the carbon copy of it I bought in December and sold two months ago . I had a Remington 700BDL DM stainless synthetic also in the 260 REM and killed a couple deer with it , but the 24" barrel of the BDL versus the 20" barrel of the Model 7 was not as convienent to handle in the tree stand generally . I had a Savage Stryker and a Remington XP-100R in 260 REM and like the three rifles I've owned chambered for the round they all shot very very well once I found the bullet they liked out of the three or four I liked and tried in them . Although that first Model 7 liked darn near everything I put in it , think I tried every jacketed bullet that was made back in 1996 85 grain to 160 grain !

[Jake70]

Handgun hunting is something Im wanting to try some day. I'd probably go with something in 44 mag.

[tdoyka]

When the 260 REM first came out I used the 120 BT and killed three bucks the first year with three shots . The following year I shot one and had to shoot it the second time . So for the third year I switched to the 125 Partition and never had anymore issues . I think over the years I've killed close to forty deer with the 260 REM . Meat loss was non existant using the 125 PT . But then again I've killed a pile of deer using a BT in the 7-08 , 280 , 7 Mag and the 25-06 without much meat loss if any . Incidentally the only deer to date I've shot at or killed with a handgun was done with a Savage Striker in 7-08 shooting a hand loaded 140 BT , one shot boom flop . But to be honest I don't really consider that a handgun but more of a hand rifle .

i think(sometimes it werks, other times, not so much:-)) that the starting point(around 2900fps) and most of the ending point(15' -50 yards) the bt becomes a bomb. at around 2600-2700fps(about 100 yards)it acts like a bullet should. i shot around 12-15 deer at under 50 yards(most of them were shot at 20-25 yards), a couple were at 150-200yards and the furthest i shot was 365 yards+/-. i don't know what a bt does to a deer 100+ yards, but at less than 50 yards there's a whole lotta scrap meat that has to be thrown away. i'm going to go with a 140gr sst for my 6.5 cm. it will start at 150+ yards. i've got a 444 marlin and (i hope) a 44 mag that i have to try first with cast boolits. :p

i've used a 139gr hornady fp with my and my dad's 7-08. they work beautifully. well almost beautifully. my dad shot a doe around 175+/- yards(i was there). when we walked up to it, we see a exit wound on the same side he shot the deer from. long story short, the bullet went into the shoulder of the deer and then it came apart. most of the bullet went straight up into the spine and then came out like a fist. the smaller pieces of the bullet went thru the lungs and the heart, killing it. the part that went thru the spine destroyed all kinds of backstraps. the hole was 4-5" . it was the only bullet that did it to us. last year, my dad shot a 6pt at 187 yards with the same bullet and same gun, and it went drt. there was next to nothin to be thrown away.:-)

[Drm50]

I have killed my share of deer with handgun. Mostly 44mg/240 gc cast SWC, a few with 41 mg.
The last 10 yrs or so, I have been using 45Colt / 242gr WC , cast fairly soft, at 800fps. Have no
trouble with the kill and little meat damage. I hunt open sights, in the woods, and limit the shots
to 40yds. When you think about it, that is about average range for eastern woods hunting for
rifle or slug too. I like the 45C, in fact I'm going to trade off my 41mg for another 45, if I can
find one to my liking. I have a bucket of magnum pistols, but find myself shooting the 45 most
of the time. You can only kill something so dead, 45 will get it done.

[35 Whelen]

I have killed my share of deer with handgun. Mostly 44mg/240 gc cast SWC, a few with 41 mg.
The last 10 yrs or so, I have been using 45Colt / 242gr WC , cast fairly soft, at 800fps. Have no
trouble with the kill and little meat damage. I hunt open sights, in the woods, and limit the shots
to 40yds. When you think about it, that is about average range for eastern woods hunting for
rifle or slug too. I like the 45C, in fact I'm going to trade off my 41mg for another 45, if I can
find one to my liking. I have a bucket of magnum pistols, but find myself shooting the 45 most
of the time. You can only kill something so dead, 45 will get it done.

This is all very true and to the point. No minutia about velocity lows and highs, specific bullet hardness, size/existence of blood trail, et al. Just a bullet through the lungs and a resultant dead deer.

35W

[Drm50]

35W, this is very true. I would classify two categories of "thought". (1) is Deer Hunting, and (2)
is Deer Shooting. White tails are not Cape buffalo, I have shot them with about everything you
can think of, and have had no trouble, except for one. Multiple hits on running deer with 30/06
Silver Tips. 75yds. All thru & thru, and all lousy hits. Moral of story, nothing will make up for bad
hit, and don't shoot unless you have a "Shot".

[ole 5 hole group]

There's always just one more thing to consider - usually, not always, when you make a lung/heart shot the deer bolts off at Mach III and will run from 5 yards to 150 yards before piling up. If you don't have snow (ya, what's that) or a height advantage to keep the deer in sight - I prefer the shoulder shot, which seldom fails to anchor the deer pretty close to where he was initially struck.

Unless you need all the meat, or you just like to put the bullet in the boiler room - the shoulder shot breaking one or both shoulders is the ticket for no tracking in heavy cover with no snow. Saving all the meat really is no big deal to me, as I've seen no deer to shoot some seasons and deer track stew has been served many times in my home.;)

There have been a time or two that I climbed down from a tree stand due to the cold blistering wind and laid down in a fire ditch and fell asleep for a bit - maybe those fresh tracks were made when I was serenading the surrounding area.:-) Always froze my **** off from 0 dark 30 to sunset on the 1st day but all bets were off starting the second day.

[35remington]

I will make a few simple observations.

Firstly, when velocity and power get too low, the death run of the deer gets uncomfortably long, and the observed wound channel through the deer's lungs, which is often much smaller than "deer rifle" cartridges, explains why this is so.

I'm a traditional pistol shooter by preference, meaning mostly revolvers in such things as a hotted up 45 Auto Rim at woods ranges. Yes I shoot Contenders but would rather fill a doe tag with a closer range shot from a wheel gun than any other way.

I am also leery of the guy that wants to use the lowest powered gun he can find for the job. I am trying to kill the deer at least reasonably quickly at the minimum.

I am not interested in increasing the probability of increased amounts of time for the poor herbivore to die. Observe the results of your shot in terms of effect and if it does not give satisfaction with a well placed shot switch to something else. Immediately.

[rodwha]

I will make a few simple observations.

Firstly, when velocity and power get too low, the death run of the deer gets uncomfortably long, and the observed wound channel through the deer's lungs, which is often much smaller than "deer rifle" cartridges, explains why this is so.

I'm a traditional pistol shooter by preference, meaning mostly revolvers in such things as a hotted up 45 Auto Rim at woods ranges. Yes I shoot Contenders but would rather fill a doe tag with a closer range shot from a wheel gun than any other way.

I am also leery of the guy that wants to use the lowest powered gun he can find for the job. I am trying to kill the deer at least reasonably quickly at the minimum.

I am not interested in increasing the probability of increased amounts of time for the poor herbivore to die. Observe the results of your shot in terms of effect and if it does not give satisfaction with a well placed shot switch to something else. Immediately.


Im curious about your .45 Auto Rim load. My understanding is this is merely a rimmed .45 ACP so I'm guessing, then, that your talking about +P levels producing maybe 450-500 ft/lbs. What is your bullet choice(s)?

That level of performance is what I expect from my Ruger Old Army percussion revolver and my WFN bullet of 195 grns, but am considering a new mold with the same meplat but increasing it to 220-245 grns. I base this off of chronographed results using the same powder and similar bullet weight but have sent some bullets up north to a fellow with the same guns and powder with a chronograph.

My reproduction Remington New Model Army likes a bit less powder, and judging by chronographed results figure it likely producing standard .45 ACP levels of power (350-425 ft/lbs) and have wondered about it as a sufficient sidearm as it has a more manageable barrel length. Again I'm waiting on his results.

[44man]

35W, this is very true. I would classify two categories of "thought". (1) is Deer Hunting, and (2)
is Deer Shooting. White tails are not Cape buffalo, I have shot them with about everything you
can think of, and have had no trouble, except for one. Multiple hits on running deer with 30/06
Silver Tips. 75yds. All thru & thru, and all lousy hits. Moral of story, nothing will make up for bad
hit, and don't shoot unless you have a "Shot".
Reminds of the time in PA. I helped a guy get his deer to his truck by carrying all his stuff and rifle. He dragged well over a mile but the deer, soaking wet would hardly make 100#. back then I would throw that kind over my shoulder and walk out.
Anyway he used a 30-06 with silver tips. he dropped the deer and it got up and ran, he tracked in the snow to shoot it again and the same happened. He finally stopped it with the sixth shot. I could cover all shots in the chest with my hand.
I told him the bullets were wrong. Moose bullets don't work on a tiny deer.

[44man]

Now the guy in PA had good hits but a guy in Ohio shot a doe about the same size with 12 ga slugs and made all bad hits. He shot her 11 times, I seen the rag left but with bad hits, she would not give it up.

[6pt-sika]

Reminds of the time in PA. I helped a guy get his deer to his truck by carrying all his stuff and rifle. He dragged well over a mile but the deer, soaking wet would hardly make 100#. back then I would throw that kind over my shoulder and walk out.
Anyway he used a 30-06 with silver tips. he dropped the deer and it got up and ran, he tracked in the snow to shoot it again and the same happened. He finally stopped it with the sixth shot. I could cover all shots in the chest with my hand.
I told him the bullets were wrong. Moose bullets don't work on a tiny deer.

When I hunted the Poconos a lot of those guys owned two rifles . One for bear and one for deer . Both would be Remington 760 Schuckamatic in 06 , they would all have a 3-9 Bushnell , Simmons or Tasco in high see thru mounts . The only difference would be the guys shot 165 Remington Core Lokts for deer and 180 or 200 grain Core Lokts for bear .

[44man]

Semi autos are not legal in PA. Maybe a change since.






























































































































































































































































































































tous are not legal in PA

[6pt-sika]

Semi autos are not legal in PA.


A REM 760 is a pump . The 742 was the semi auto .

[44man]

Net is screwed again, might have stupid stuff show up.

[44man]

OK, you are correct.

[tdoyka]

Now the guy in PA had good hits but a guy in Ohio shot a doe about the same size with 12 ga slugs and made all bad hits. He shot her 11 times, I seen the rag left but with bad hits, she would not give it up.


many moons ago, i was out hunting for doe(swPA had a 3 day season) when i heard BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG AND BANG. about 3 seconds later, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG AND BANG! 3 more seconds, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG AND BANG!. i said to myself "i'd better go and check it out in case somebody is hurt or something." i was about 75 or so yards away from the barrage of gun fire, so i went. i go about 50 yards and see a guy wearing orange pointing his rifle at the doe, who happens to be laying down over a pile of rocks. the last thing i thought was my God he's about to shoot and hopefully he doesn't hurt himself or me. i yelled out "No!" and then he looks at me. i go over to him and he a young kid with a m760(0?) which i find out later is a 243. i go and stand next to him and look at the doe. there are places and guts and whatever coming out of the doe. and it is really, really dead. i get the young fella calmed down some and i tell him to gut the doe. he just stares at me. i say oh boy, lets do this from the top and i start telling him what and how he is supposed to gut. i'm not doing it, basically because my was it gut shot, but its a learning experience, or what i told him it was:-). while he's gutting the doe(alot of gagging from the smell, i was up wind about 5-6feet from him) another hunter comes out the brush and introduces himself, who this young fella is his dad.

after the young fella is done, me and his dad start counting bullet entrance and exit wounds on the doe. we both come up with 11 bullet entrance/exit holes. they were in the lungs, neck, spine, guts, and legs of the poor doe. but when you looked at the young fella, he proud of himself because he got the deer(it was his first one). i did tell his dad(and he agreed) that he had the doe on the rocks and he was about to shoot it again(not to mention about the absymal shooting he did) and his dad said he would talk to him more about richochets and his poor shooting. but that doe, which probably weighed in at 120-130lbs, was the rag that everyone talks about. he's probably lucky that the was only 10-12lbs of burger left.

when somebody says its were the bullet hits, believe him!

[tdoyka]

There's always just one more thing to consider - usually, not always, when you make a lung/heart shot the deer bolts off at Mach III and will run from 5 yards to 150 yards before piling up. If you don't have snow (ya, what's that) or a height advantage to keep the deer in sight - I prefer the shoulder shot, which seldom fails to anchor the deer pretty close to where he was initially struck.

Unless you need all the meat, or you just like to put the bullet in the boiler room - the shoulder shot breaking one or both shoulders is the ticket for no tracking in heavy cover with no snow. Saving all the meat really is no big deal to me, as I've seen no deer to shoot some seasons and deer track stew has been served many times in my home.;)

There have been a time or two that I climbed down from a tree stand due to the cold blistering wind and laid down in a fire ditch and fell asleep for a bit - maybe those fresh tracks were made when I was serenading the surrounding area.:-) Always froze my **** off from 0 dark 30 to sunset on the 1st day but all bets were off starting the second day.

this i do agree with. since a was twentysomething i started shooting my deer in the shoulder(either going in or coming out). you do however lose a bit of meat. every deer reacts differently. about 1/2 fall at the shot, about 1/2 run about 20-30 yards. i've had one run about 50 yards thru one shoulder.

now hunting archery a behind the shoulder must be taken. my little brother took a shot behind the shoulder, but it ended up going into the deers shoulder. there was a little bit of blood and a few yards away we found the arrow. it went about a 1 or 2" and stopped. we tried tracking the deer, but the blood stopped (after 50 or so yards) and it disappeared. i hunt archery with a crossbow(stroke) and people say that it can go thru a deer's shoulder, but i don't take the chance.

[44man]

I shot a big buck once and my arm flung a little, hit him in the shoulder. I was using an 80# bow with 2419's and a Muzzy, can't remember the bow name. It only went in the depth of the head and pulled when he ran past a tree.
I changed bows to Brownings and the same hit on a large doe went through the shoulder, spine, cut the opposite shoulder joint in half and was sticking out half way on the other side. Actually knocked the deer over so the arrow stuck in the ground and she slid down the arrow. Bow was 82#.
I gave up Muzzy heads because every deer I shot through would break the heads in the ground. Got expensive.
The same bow company came out with a beautiful head but the tip would curl up like a tin can and it was so soft I could unwind the curl without breaking them. I gave that up fast.
You run into the same problems with archery.
Then I shot 3 deer in gun season that had 6" of arrow and a broad head healed up in the chests. So you see, even an arrow is best with penetration.
My first deer were shot with a 45# Red Wing Hunter and as the deer ran off I could see the arrow still trying to go in. 200 yard tracking jobs. I changed to a 62# Wing Presentation II and arrows zipped through for a quick drop. Deer hit with Bear 72# recurves never got full penetration.
Today velocity is stressed with super light arrows and it does not work as well. A 200 fps stick bow with a heavy arrow is better.
I wish I could still pull my bows!

[35remington]

My Auto Rim loads more closely approximate a 10mm, actually, with a 185 at around 1250 fps or a 246 grain 452438 not terribly far from 1000. The problem with the 185's is they are ribcage shooting loads, mostly, being 185 XTP's, but work well enough with good placement. Energies are more like in the 520-640 ft. lb. range.

The SWC's are less angle limited and have better penetration with a slightly smaller hole through the lungs than the HP's, but I don't get as nervous about angling shots with them. On broadside shots through the ribcage the 185's do completely penetrate, though.

Given my druthers and seeking to limit myself less on angling shots, the heavier SWC's like the Keith inspired 246 (a copy of the 452438) is my way to go. Accuracy falls off much beyond 60 yards or so, but about 60 yards is my limit with that combo and iron sights. I am talking about woods range hunting floating my boat.

With such placement don't expect to see the devastation of lung tissue that you would with a .270. The holes through the lungs admit maybe three fingers at most, and it takes somewhat longer for the critter to bleed out. Much lower than this I cannot prudently go as my conscience will not let me. The holes become too small and the critter takes too long to die.

I cannot figure the guys who always claim they get bang/flops with deer. I figure they are lying or haven't shot many deer. I've blown up their chest cavity with high velocity rifles at close range so nothing was recognizable inside and still had them run 40-50 yards.

[35 Whelen]

I had two bang/flops last season; a buck with my Uberti 45 Colt and a sow with my Uberti .44 Special. In both cases the bullets wound up near the spine so I'm certain that's the reason. The handful other game I've killed with revolvers have run a little ways as in 25-30 yds.

35W

[44man]

I have 3 guns that crumple deer almost every shot no matter where hit, good hits, no gut shots of course.
One is my .54 ML with a round ball, the .475 and the .500 JRH with a soft nose.
I admit to being amazed and set back a few steps when I started with the guns. Seen deer hit good with the .270 make over 100 yards with no lungs left and deer hit with a 7 mag make a mile.
NO, I don't know why the lower energy works like it does. Might be the distance it is applied in passage.
Most deer that are DRT have spine or CNS hits. If all the hits like that are removed from the equation you will find most shots that miss those spots are not DRT. But a big revolver has done it with double lung hits behind the shoulders.

[rodwha]

I never had bang flops until I took my old boss' advice and shot the neck. But then the ones that did run after a good vitals shot only ran ~25 yds or so.

[rodwha]

Sounds like some very hot Auto Rim loads. I'm not familiar with that round though, and thought it was essentially a rimmed ACP.

[tdoyka]

my dad has a tc contender with a 14" barrel in 7x30 waters. he shot a few deer with it and for all intents and purposes, his went down either drt or within 5 feet. he was loading a 115gr speer hp with a charge of imr4895?. there was one about 20 yards away from him and he shot thru both shoulders. every deer he gotten, had an entrance/exit wound.

since he can't see properly, he has taken off his 2 1/2x scope and put on a red/green dot scope. he's also going to try a 140gr sst with h322.

[rodwha]

Why change what has worked so well?

[tdoyka]

Why change what has worked so well?

i guess that its hard to get speers 115gr hp, i have never seen them at gun stores in my area and i always forget to buy them online.
also, his rem m7 in 7-08(i hooked him onto it:smile:) is running out of 139gr hornady fn(discontinued) so he'll try the 140gr sst in the 7-08 along with his 7x30 waters.

[tdoyka]

i just checked midway and midsouth for the speer 115gr hp in 7mm and it seems to be discontinued too. there is a speer 110gr tnt hp, but it says speer 115gr hp on the plastic box, i checked. it also has speer's handloading booklet(#12) and it shows both the 110gr tnt hp and the 115gr hp. i know that the speers #12 has been around for like 20 years or so, so its probably been discontinued(115gr hp).

[woodbutcher]

:smile: I have taken one deer(8pt)with a hand gun.An S&W mod10 stainless version 4" bbl.Load was Lyman 358-156 swc gc.Load was 3.5(?) grns W230.Anyway,whatever the dipper in the Lee Loader kit threw.Put one right behind his right ear.DRT.Range from muzzle to deer,3 ft.Made a great breakfast.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo

[rodwha]

Well, there you have it.

[MarkS]

Last year I hunted with a GP100 with 158 gr swc, this year it will be with a SBH and 240gr swc but the only DRT I've ever had was using my old M1 Garand with a 150gr. CoreLock bullet. It was doe day and she was running broadside to me and the round hit the left knee joint when her leg was up beside her chest, where it entered the chest cavity the hole was the size of a 50 cent piece and took most of the heart and a lung out of the fist sized exit hole

[44man]

I made many neck shots and see what they do. I showed the .44 exit but look at the .475 exit.170981 It has less damage but is still a thing to recon with.
Still a small target I don't recommend to the average revolver hunter.
Most deer are moving and not 3' to place a pipsqueak load behind the ear. This one was near 100 yards. Just what would 3.5 gr of 231 have done? I hunt with revolvers, not carry along with a rifle. 170982 This is the entrance. A pellet gun can go through the skull and I can kill a man with my slingshot in the head but would I hunt deer with either?
Why not a .22? Here is a deer I killed with a .22 bullet in the neck, starting to turn green. Just made it through the skin. 170985
Hey buy a soft gun with the little plastic balls.

[Kraschenbirn]

Haven't hunted deer for quite a few years but, when I did, I used the same gun/load as I used for IHMSA sillywhets: A 10" Dan Wesson 741 loaded with 238 gr. NEI TCs over a case-full of IMR4227. Load chrono'd just over 1250 fps and, off the bench, would print 2" groups a 100M. Don't recall taking a shot at more than 75 yards and never recovered a boolit...all straight-thru exits, even those that caught a rib or shoulder going in.

Bill

[rodwha]

My neck shots were at the first 3rd of the neck nearest the body because the head moves often enough and quickly. That part of the neck doesn't so much. And this is with a solid rest and a scoped .270 Win.

I'd not try that with a handgun unless, maybe, it was also scoped and with a great rest. I've not hunted with a handgun, but very well might.

[44man]

You will love it and as you have seen from my pictures, a revolver is so deadly it can set you back a few steps. Even the .475 boolit I use is 22 BHN, near WFN at 1329 FPS. Just WHY is it so effective?
Why is it not as good when shot faster or slower? It is ongoing all the time and you might need to alter in the middle of the season.
If you hit the spine, neck or head every shot you still don't know so us frail humans that need more to shoot at will find not everything works.

[tdoyka]

i've always gone for lungs/heart shots. i think twice(maybe more) i shot the deer in the neck(chest shot the 2nd was the neck) and it was a "coup de grace"(sp?) shot. my dad and my little brother both shot a deer in the neck(two different deer) in the neck. unfortunately, neither deer was spine hit. we've tracked both deer, ran out of blood and there was no snow, thru the brush and never found them. both shoot for the lungs now.

there are a few guys that go for the neck(spine) shot and they do kill alot of deer. i commend them for that, but a novice or an old guy(meaning my dad and brother) shouldn't go for such a small target(spine) when hunting for deer.

[44man]

It can be an inch like a jaw shot off a deer to die a horrible death. EXPERTS that make head shots when even the drop from a rested rifle can fail because of a few yards. I was always a good shot but make no claims like that. Neck shots can take the windpipe but not the spine. So is it a good shot? I knew where to aim but a 4" barrel, open sights at 50, 75 or 100 yards, should stay in bed!

[tdoyka]

It can be an inch like a jaw shot off a deer to die a horrible death. EXPERTS that make head shots when even the drop from a rested rifle can fail because of a few yards. I was always a good shot but make no claims like that. Neck shots can take the windpipe but not the spine. So is it a good shot? I knew where to aim but a 4" barrel, open sights at 50, 75 or 100 yards, should stay in bed!

you got that one there right! back when i used two hands, i was hunting in wv and i heard a shot pretty close to me. then about two or so minutes later a doe showed up and i shot it. i was like 100+/- yards, drt and i shot it with my 270, thru the shoulder and out the rib cage. i walked over to the doe and you could see where i hit it. you could also see a tear in its throat about the size of a golf ball. soon afterwards a guy and his kid showed up looking for his deer. he said he took a neck shot and he wondered why it didn't go down. i pointed at the neck and then i told him why. and then i told him he's better off shooting the lungs/heart because if its off by an inch its still a dead deer. if your off by an inch on a spine shot, more than likely your looking for a blood trail that will wind you thru the woods and never come up with the deer. i said it nicely, not looking to get into it with another hunter, but he insisted that a neck shot deer will always go drt. no ifs, ands or buts about it. i looked at him, then i looked at the dead doe and i just shrugged. he left and then i started to gut the doe out, mumbling to myself....

i use both(scopes/irons) on rifles. the 44 mag(still waiting) will be irons. i'm going to start at 15 yards, 25 yards, 35 yards and the 50 yards. and at each yardage i have to do a 6" group with one hand(because the right don't work). i'll have a 6"x6" steel plate to prove it to myself. this will be done after i find a good load. it will also be done off hand. i know a 6" group is bothersome to alot of people, i would be bothered by it too. i plan on shooting whatever kind of load at least 3" at 50 yards off hand. 6" is just what i'm looking for right now.

[jaydub in wi]

Here is my first handgun buck. Ruger sbh 44 with a 7.5" bbl . Load was 280 WFN over H110. 25 yards away heart shot. I agree with you guys about neck shots. I take a heart/lung shot every time.http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20160627/24f7c5d3e05a06fe4bfecd7c21e5d71f.jpg

Sent from my SCH-I545L using Tapatalk

[rodwha]

It's the hydrostatic shock. The exit wounds are generally 4-6" wide, enough to stick your fist into.

I nearly decapitated a doe one time as that time it had busted me, and being evening and my last day I shot higher up as it was staring at me about to stomp.

All of these shots were around 75 yds and with a scoped .270 Win.

[rodwha]

It's a pic of a pic, but you get the idea:

http://i68.tinypic.com/2q9vz2t.jpg

[44man]

One hand is tough let alone the left hand unless you are left handed. Your expectations are good enough though.
Most of my neck shots were taken with my elbows on my knees or some support. Again I am an accuracy nut anyway so I know where boolits hit at my ranges. I use Ultra Dots too but after getting my cataract out last week, opens might work again. However they are hard to see in dim light and a scope blacks out. I can see the deer but not through a scope and I hate to see the shaking. When the sun is up high enough, the deer have gone to bed.
Your eye in dim light needs a 5mm exit pupil but the pistol scope is so far from your eye, it disperses. I only use a scope from the bench to check loads but the red dot shoots almost as good.
I still have a problem with floaters in my left eye and see things move all the time. Looking at a tree in front of me looks like bugs crawling all over it! Doc says you are born with them, no cause known.
Life is a constant adjustment and I can't wait for season, back straps on the grill!
I hope the herd is up after the 42" of snow last winter. Now the floods in other counties, I hope all here are OK.

[rodwha]

Is resting your elbows on your knees more steady than resting your wrists?

[44man]

Is resting your elbows on your knees more steady than resting your wrists?
No but it works much better then waving around.

[tdoyka]

It's a pic of a pic, but you get the idea:

http://i68.tinypic.com/2q9vz2t.jpg

the doe i shot in wv had the hole(golf ball +/-) about 1/2 way from the head to chest and it was on the other side that you have shown me. the golf ball sized hole just took away the doe's skin, leaving its windpipe exposed.

[rodwha]

I was taught by my father to shoot the vitals. It was my old boss who told me about the neck. And the few I did so to each had very violent results on, often producing a cartwheel (our TX Hill Country deer are rather small).

I've become enamored with traditional styled muzzleloaders now. I'm hesitant to try the neck shot since the velocity is so much less, and so I'm not certain about hydrostatic shock being present.

Oh, and for me and my limited skills using a handgun would be out to about 25 yds as I'm just not that proficient yet, though I've not used any sort of rest (semi-Weaver).

[tdoyka]

Oh, and for me and my limited skills using a handgun would be out to about 25 yds as I'm just not that proficient yet, though I've not used any sort of rest (semi-Weaver).

:lol::lol::lol: you oughta try one-handed!!!:lol::lol::lol:

i was ok off of a rest at 25 yards, but i had a real hard time(one-hand, stroke got me!) using a ruger srh with a 7.5" barrel. now(i'm wishing) that a ruger sbh with a 4 5/8" barrel will make me better at 50 yards. i'll just have to practice when the ruger gets here.

[rodwha]

Hope you find it helps!

[44man]

:lol::lol::lol: you oughta try one-handed!!!:lol::lol::lol:

i was ok off of a rest at 25 yards, but i had a real hard time(one-hand, stroke got me!) using a ruger srh with a 7.5" barrel. now(i'm wishing) that a ruger sbh with a 4 5/8" barrel will make me better at 50 yards. i'll just have to practice when the ruger gets here.
That is why fellas talk about BALANCE, really takes two hands for long barrels unless your name is Earp! :kidding: Heavy guns with any optics are a bear with one hand. I used to hit a small bottle of water off hand at 100 with my 10" 45-70 BFR with two hands but I am getting to be an old derelict. Could not even lift it with one hand now. One HUGE gun!
But something to be said for some weight, after getting used to the big guns, I could not hold the little Ruger Mark II's still at all. Like holding paper in the wind.

[tdoyka]

i've finally gotten my 44 mag ruger sbh with a 4 5/8" barrel. i had to go blue because stainless steel was not available. i got it back in 20ish of july and i really didn't have the time to sight it in properly. but using a 6.5gr of unique under a 220gr wc with 44 sp brass, it is really (to me anyway) wonderfully accurate revolver. at 25 yards with 3 shots, it goes roughly 3/4". the best i have done so far is 3 shots at 25 yards , .248"(had to get a caliper for that one!). i'm still a little low and to left, but its been too hot or too rainy to adjust my sights. right now i'm using a 3 legged bog pod and a primos lift-n-lock to shoot with. (i'm stroke-abled so its one hand for me:razz:) after i get it sighted in properly, it will be only the bog pod until i can do 3 shots under 6" circle. then it will be unsupportive at 25 yards with a 6" circle(3 shots). then i can do it sitting down from my bench at 50 yards! alright, its underneath my porch roof, but i'll be able to to use my bog pod and revolver.

my hunting load will be a 250gr mihek hp(40:1) over unique(skeeter load, i wish) on a 44 sp(another i wish). i have been facing a problem, two of them. one i can correct by visiting altamount pistol grips. but #2 problem i think its more "i'm tired" because after 12 - 18 shots it tends to go anywhere on the target. i just put the revolver away and then the next day i'm doing 3/4" groups till i go 12-18 rounds and then i go back to everywhere on the target. i've never had this happen to me, i used to shoot the 44 mag 50+ times a day. or am i just getting old(i'm 43 y.o.). or do i have something i can fix? or do i shoot until it goes everywhere and put the gun away?

thanks,

its not real good but heres a picture of my sbh
http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h273/tdoyka/IMG_20160722_170814_zpssnlgaiqv.jpg (http://s66.photobucket.com/user/tdoyka/media/IMG_20160722_170814_zpssnlgaiqv.jpg.html)

[NSB]

tdoyka,
I wouldn't worry about getting shooter fatigue after twenty or thirty shots with the 44mag. I'm a lot older than you and I can tell you that if you can make that many GOOD shots before your groups open up, you are ready to go for hunting season. You'll probably make ONE good shot when the time comes and that's the one that counts. Looks to me like you're really prepared this year. I'd like to hear how you make out after all your efforts to get to this point. I'm rooting for you. I myself love handgun hunting and you've got a really nice handgun for the job. Best of luck to you with your fine looking new gun.

[white eagle]

I have the 4 3/4" flat top in 44 special
and it is special very accurate like you say
found an accurate hunting load for the 44 mag
and am now working on the special
I think it will be with the Mihec 250 hp as well
at around 1000 fps give or take

[44man]

Muscles just go away with age, my arms are half the size they were.
Look in the mirror and see wrinkles now.
But like said, only need one shot

[tdoyka]

thanks guys! i was wondering about that. i don't think i'll be entering any tournaments soon[smilie=l:!!!

it is a lot easier to balance with one hand over my old srh and 7 1/2" barrel. i really do like the sbh, i can't believe the accuracy that this one has. i know its only 25 yards, but when you 1 hole(3 shots) the target, its a really wonderful feeling. since it was raining here, i dry fired the sbh about 30 or so times and then i had to put it away. i got a couple of flinches early on, but i think i've corrected that. i was waiting to hear the click of the hammer coming down, when i shouldn't have been.

out of everything i have learned about shooting a pistol accurately, i owe to my old drill sergeant. but in the advent((hey i'm using a new word!!!) of you tube, this guy comes along with what you need to focus on the front sight, not to look at the front sight. the diagrams are truly great too. https://www.youtube.com/user/CenterMassGroup they are real great for teaching somebody new to handgunning. or old[smilie=l:!!!

[44man]

keep going, it will come to you. Once learned it never goes away, then you get old!