How can you thicken case necks

[barrabruce]

I have some cases that have been formed from another calibre.
Unfortunately the necks are somewhat thinner than I would like.
It could be the makers brass but getting another brand is not on the cards, so looks like I stuck with it.

O.k. I can size them but it works the brass alot and I'd rather not size at all if I can get away with it.

I have used some shellac on some bullets to make them water proof and left a ring on the case mouth when I done it.

I am thinking of a paint or some such I could use to increase the thickness a thou or two on each side of the neck is all I need.

Any ideas as what to use ??
I'd rather not be trying to scrape brush and dissolve things out of my chamber neck area or have such come off the cases in a layer in the chamber and causing pressure problems because the necks can't expand enough because of a build up.

Any 'ol bench-rester tricks or some such any one know of.

Thanks
Bruce

[Bent Ramrod]

I remember one writer in Precision Shooting dunked the necks of his shells in a solution, hooked them up to a battery, put a brass rod (IIRC) in as the anode and plated the necks to thicken them.

They came out kind of lumpy and gnarly, but he turned the outside to size and reamed the inside and got the increased thickness he wanted (I guess). Don't recall the issue.

[dverna]

Powder coating may work. You would need a "mask" that sits above the shoulder of the case. Easy to make out of cardboard for example

[country gent]

expanding up thins the necks necking down thickens the necks. How thin are your cases necks now? (Measure a loded rounds neck dia subtract loaded bullet dia and divide by 2. or a ball michrometer or gage will also measure with out te math).There is a set amount of brass in a given case changing size brass has to come or go from some place. If this is a high intensity cartridge shoot them a few times and see if brass flow thickens the necks some, My swift with upper end loads does thicken the necks slightly in 6-7 loadings. Knowing how thick your modified case necks are would be good information. Most dies sized down to far and expand back up to actual size with the expander. Depending on case shape maybe only partially resizing the neck prt way down? rolling the case mouth would thicken the edge but also shorten the brass. Plating can be done to build up thickness, drawbacks would be getting good bond, an even coating around case neck, and only on the case necks surface. You could plate on the thick side and neck ream and turn for size concentricity and finish. 2 some what tedious steps to perform. I know you said buying new cases wasnt in the cards so a case that could be sized down thickening necks to allow turning or reaming or both isnt an option.

[rr2241tx]

Practically speaking, if rotating your outside neck turning cutter backwards doesn't do the trick, then new brass is the easiest way forward.

[runfiverun]

electroplating will add about a thou pretty easily but it will be soft copper.
I have done this before and it's pretty much like on the U-tube only I hooked a coffee pot up to heat and circulate the copper solution.

powder coating would probably get you .002 but you have to cook it at 400-f for like 20 minutes.

[Don Fischer]

I would think you could get somewhere or have made a smaller expander button. Or maybe go to a collet die with the smaller collet in it. Must be something special to go to all this trouble!

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I have some cases that have been formed from another calibre.
Unfortunately the necks are somewhat thinner than I would like.
It could be the makers brass but getting another brand is not on the cards, so looks like I stuck with it.

O.k. I can size them but it works the brass alot and I'd rather not size at all if I can get away with it.

I have used some shellac on some bullets to make them water proof and left a ring on the case mouth when I done it.

I am thinking of a paint or some such I could use to increase the thickness a thou or two on each side of the neck is all I need.

Any ideas as what to use ??
I'd rather not be trying to scrape brush and dissolve things out of my chamber neck area or have such come off the cases in a layer in the chamber and causing pressure problems because the necks can't expand enough because of a build up.

Any 'ol bench-rester tricks or some such any one know of.

Thanks
Bruce

If there was any easy method with no snags, they would all be doing it. I have some self-adhesive copper tape of the kind people use to make reproduction Tiffany lampshades, by folding it around the glass panels, then joining and reinforcing it with soft solder. It came in various widths, and there is a wider kind I use around my strawberry pots, because slugs won't cross copper. It could add thickness with less compression than other tapes, but it would need to be removed and replaced for each sizing, and perhaps the neck expander button adjusted so that after that, it can go in and out without sizing the neck.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I remember one writer in Precision Shooting dunked the necks of his shells in a solution, hooked them up to a battery, put a brass rod (IIRC) in as the anode and plated the necks to thicken them.

They came out kind of lumpy and gnarly, but he turned the outside to size and reamed the inside and got the increased thickness he wanted (I guess). Don't recall the issue.

The Wikipedia article on copper plating says "The plating seen in chemistry classes, often obtained with a coin and copper-sulphate bath, is in fact deposition, as opposed to plating. Subjecting the surface to any wear causes the deposit – which is not bonded – to spall. Running such a bath for longer periods, one can readily observe the grainy texture left by deposition, whereas plating results in a smooth surface." Proper copper plating involves cyanide salts and a nickel interplating. I don't see any way loosening copper deposition could be dangerous, but it is likely to be very thin indeed, and I thing brass would be even chancier.

If you do want to plate cases, nickel plating is probably better. Long ago I nickel plated a repro Remington cap and ball revolver with a kit bought from an ad in a classic motorcycle magazine. It worked, but it needs a considerable amperage related to the area being plated, and if it is interrupted, as the protection device in a hot car battery charger is liable to do, you get loose layers of plating.

[montana_charlie]

Practically speaking, if rotating your outside neck turning cutter backwards doesn't do the trick, then new brass is the easiest way forward.
That's my kind of thinking.
When they first came out with a reversible drill I had to get one. There is no other cure when you carefully drill a hole - then discover it's in the wrong place.
Just takes a second to throw the drill in reverse and 'undo' it.

[EDG]

The companies that do electroforming can grow copper parts on a mandrel. I have seen copper parts made that way that were 1/2" thick.
The process is not cheap but it is basically a process to make parts with plating. It is easy to plate a lot of copper.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Electroforming usually involves making parts which are meant to be detached from the mandrel, and that is the last thing you want. It still requires the salts and equipment you would use when it's called copper plating.

[Mica_Hiebert]

Shot them till they split and throw them away...

[gpidaho]

I've sized powder coated brass and the coating stays on. If .002 or so helps you out give it a try. Gp

[John Boy]

Aluminum foil tape

[gwpercle]

Paper patch or powder coat the boolit ? Seems like it would be easier to get the boolit bigger , just enough to hold tight in the case , than getting the case neck bigger.

[barrabruce]

I have loaded all my cases before I posted this but will check as soon as I can get away to shoot a few off.
Cases are only $2.00 each at the moment.

I already pp and this is for this rifle.

Some of my best loads are groove size and not filling the throat.

I could get some rattle can high temp paint and try that ......but would baking the paint anneal the brass as well???? or is it way below that point.

I may try some shellac in the inside of the case necks to see it that helps.

Last time I measure the brass it was a few thou thinner than normal brass.
Obviously a small neck size in the chamber would make a difference.

I was thinking of making a ring in the neck with a blunt pipe cutter like a cannalure to hold the bullet in position.
And fill it with solder so it wouldn't expand out again.

Thnx
Bruce


Thaz

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I
I was thinking of making a ring in the neck with a blunt pipe cutter like a cannalure to hold the bullet in position.
And fill it with solder so it wouldn't expand out again.

Thnx
Bruce





Well maybe... But for solders that flow and adhere well, it would be easy to overheat a case. I would make a hole in a
piece of sheet copper to fit on the shoulder as a heat sink, and use a large electric soldering iron with a copper bit turned down to enter the case neck. two or three cannelures would be best for bullet alignment, and you could use that soldering iron bit, cold, to make sure the pipe cutter doesn't skid off the end of the neck.

[EDG]

Electroforming is still just copper or nickel plating.
The old IBM Selectric font ball was nickel plated over a molded polymer ball. In that case the nickel was left in place on the substrate.


Electroforming usually involves making parts which are meant to be detached from the mandrel, and that is the last thing you want. It still requires the salts and equipment you would use when it's called copper plating.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

You can't get a ball out of a ball without breaking something, which is a very different situation from amateur copper deposition. Wikipedia says:

"The plating seen in chemistry classes, often obtained with a coin and copper-sulphate bath, is in fact deposition, as opposed to plating. Subjecting the surface to any wear causes the deposit – which is not bonded – to spall. Running such a bath for longer periods, one can readily observe the grainy texture left by deposition, whereas plating results in a smooth surface.
Commercial platers typically use a copper-cyanide solution, which retains a high concentration of copper. However, it is inherently dangerous, due to the highly toxic nature of cyanide."

[Frank46]

You didn't mention what cases you are referring to or what the parent brass was. But for thicker case neck walls I've made 30-30 cases from some old 375 win brass, 7.65x53 Argentine mauser from Israeli 8mm mauser cases, bell brass 577 nitro to 577/450 martini henry and a few others. the 375/30-30 cases would chamber in my 30-30 and release the bullets easily. The reformed argy cases needed neck reaming. Frank

[barrabruce]

38-55 long cases into 30 -30 with a long neck.
Starline brass.
Don't need to trim them much at all.
But they seem to come out thin on the neck thickness.
Used the 45 that turned out useable for a few years for pping.
Sized the cases 2x I think and the odd one every now and again when it becomes too formed into the chamber or gets dropped.

They do not show up over here in oz that often and seem to be priced as if they have gold in the brass alloy.
Most places have them listed but not in stock.

Don't know who else makes the 38-55 long brass.
375 Win brass is harder to find and I don't know if they would be long enough for my chamber.

I have read somewhere once that before all this old stuff became new again on making cases.
Some used tubing sleeved over the neck area which when fireformed made the junction/sealed joint.
The cases could be then used as normal once necked turned if necessary.

there were things on making semi rimed cases and all sorts of stuff.

But alas I lost it in a computer crash and CRAFT has its way of making info like that recede back into the abyss.

I can get usable accuracy with shorter brass and thinking of getting a new gun.

Probably a re-barrel job with a nice tight chamber and a nice leade and throat.

Give up on factory and sami specked stuff and get something decent and usable.

[blackthorn]

My fourth edition of "The Handloader's Manual of Cartridge Conversions" says to make 38-55 from .375 Win brass. Trim to length and f/l size. Hope this helps.